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I heard a rumor there is a bugger on the end of krootman's finger in his avatar

"BOOGER" spelling dude, bugger is something you like to do in your bedroom.

 ChainswordHeretic wrote:

I heard a rumor there is a bugger on the end of krootman's finger in his avatar

"BOOGER" spelling dude, bugger is something you like to do in your bedroom.

I'm not sure if the other term is wrong tho, that was quite a night

I just love how everyone is talking about my list having a centurion star... I didn't know running three guys as a basic unit counted as a star. I think in all my games meph was with them maybe three times otherwise they were alone.

And I hate you Thomas...

BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

BTW II, congrats Darkwynn on a fine performance indeed.

I heard a rumor there is a bugger on the end of krootman's finger in his avatar


"BOOGER" spelling dude, bugger is something you like to do in your bedroom.
I'm not sure if the other term is wrong tho, that was quite a night.



HAHAHA, I guess, Vegas and all.

Requizen wrote:
Is there a place to see the lists other than the Top 8?

Here you go: http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2015/02/23/tits-tournaments-las-vegas-open-2015-top-lists/

Darkwynn wrote:
I just love how everyone is talking about my list having a centurion star... I didn't know running three guys as a basic unit counted as a star. I think in all my games meph was with them maybe three times otherwise they were alone.

And I hate you Thomas...

You totally joined a character to it once....so it's a star, duh!

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

 Blackmoor wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

Agreed, Restrict Leviathan to Nids only and leave CtA be. The ally matrix is completely fluff based and unfairly limits the options of the "evil" armies. The 12" deployment and keep one eye open restrictions are already pretty nasty.

OR, make all faction specific detachments that act as CAD count as a CAD as this would get rid of CAD + Leviathan

I really don't understand the fluff argument if Eldar can summon demons at a cheaper cost, but demons aren't allowed to have wraithguard friends?

Getting rid of CtA allies while keeping CtA demon summoning seems massively one-sided against certain armies.

Breazeal wrote:

OR, make all faction specific detachments that act as CAD count as a CAD as this would get rid of CAD + Leviathan

And that the only way to have a CAD + special detachement is if both are of the same faction. That way we don't kill Lictorshame.

Breazeal wrote:

 Blackmoor wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

Agreed, Restrict Leviathan to Nids only and leave CtA be. The ally matrix is completely fluff based and unfairly limits the options of the "evil" armies. The 12" deployment and keep one eye open restrictions are already pretty nasty.

OR, make all faction specific detachments that act as CAD count as a CAD as this would get rid of CAD + Leviathan

I really don't understand the fluff argument if Eldar can summon demons at a cheaper cost, but demons aren't allowed to have wraithguard friends?

Why would you ban nids plus levi. It won 2 events piloted by an excellent plAyer. It's a good list but far far from unbeatable...

 krootman. wrote:

Darkwynn wrote:
I just love how everyone is talking about my list having a centurion star... I didn't know running three guys as a basic unit counted as a star. I think in all my games meph was with them maybe three times otherwise they were alone.

And I hate you Thomas...

You totally joined a character to it once....so it's a star, duh!

When I played Dark it was only three alone, so its was a death-triangle.

Even with the character its only a death square/rhombus,

RAW is that you need at least 5 points before its a star, GW added this to the FAQ in one of their regular updates

Is death triangle the new death star?

only dakka can decide!

 easysauce wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

Darkwynn wrote:
I just love how everyone is talking about my list having a centurion star... I didn't know running three guys as a basic unit counted as a star. I think in all my games meph was with them maybe three times otherwise they were alone.

And I hate you Thomas...

You totally joined a character to it once....so it's a star, duh!

When I played Dark it was only three alone, so its was a death-triangle.

Even with the character its only a death square/rhombus,

RAW is that you need at least 5 points before its a star, GW added this to the FAQ in one of their regular updates

Is death triangle the new death star?

only dakka can decide!

Death rhombus I like it!

 krootman. wrote:

Darkwynn wrote:
I just love how everyone is talking about my list having a centurion star... I didn't know running three guys as a basic unit counted as a star. I think in all my games meph was with them maybe three times otherwise they were alone.

And I hate you Thomas...

You totally joined a character to it once....so it's a star, duh!

And obviously, because you ran a unit of centurions with an attached IC, you must have just took a netlist and kicked some baby seals with it and there's no actual skill involved in the game at all...

 krootman. wrote:

Breazeal wrote:

 Blackmoor wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

Agreed, Restrict Leviathan to Nids only and leave CtA be. The ally matrix is completely fluff based and unfairly limits the options of the "evil" armies. The 12" deployment and keep one eye open restrictions are already pretty nasty.

OR, make all faction specific detachments that act as CAD count as a CAD as this would get rid of CAD + Leviathan

I really don't understand the fluff argument if Eldar can summon demons at a cheaper cost, but demons aren't allowed to have wraithguard friends?

Why would you ban nids plus levi. It won 2 events piloted by an excellent plAyer. It's a good list but far far from unbeatable...

The idea being that everyone has an issue with leviathan plus cad and not come the apocalypse.

Breazeal wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

Breazeal wrote:

 Blackmoor wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

Agreed, Restrict Leviathan to Nids only and leave CtA be. The ally matrix is completely fluff based and unfairly limits the options of the "evil" armies. The 12" deployment and keep one eye open restrictions are already pretty nasty.

OR, make all faction specific detachments that act as CAD count as a CAD as this would get rid of CAD + Leviathan

I really don't understand the fluff argument if Eldar can summon demons at a cheaper cost, but demons aren't allowed to have wraithguard friends?

Why would you ban nids plus levi. It won 2 events piloted by an excellent plAyer. It's a good list but far far from unbeatable...

The idea being that everyone has an issue with leviathan plus cad and not come the apocalypse.

I don't understand why, it's no better or worse then any other good data slate, detchment, or formation That is out there.

Darkwynn wrote:

 easysauce wrote:
When I played Dark it was only three alone, so its was a death-triangle.

Even with the character its only a death square/rhombus,

RAW is that you need at least 5 points before its a star, GW added this to the FAQ in one of their regular updates

Is death triangle the new death star?

only dakka can decide!

Death rhombus I like it!

Agreed, that's well done

With limited detschments cta is balanced. If anything lVO showed that. There is absolutely no reason any tournsmrnt organizer needs to take any overreaching steps to nerf it. This isn't 5th edition grey Knights, 6th edition eldar dominance. People forget Sean lost at LVO and he was the only flyrant or tyranid list to even make thr championship and nicks Game was so close he probably should have won if he didn't nerf himself. If anything needed to be done with flyrants I'd say play fmc as the rules are written and just left skyfire blasts hit them. But even still I have a feeling that in another week after adepticon unless a chaos flying demon or tyranid list wins people will be crying about nerfing necrons or whatever lists wins that tourney. But in regards to LVO that tournament had a fairly balanced playing field.

gungo wrote:
With limited detschments cta is balanced. If anything lVO showed that. There is absolutely no reason any tournsmrnt organizer needs to take any overreaching steps to nerf it. This isn't 5th edition grey Knights, 6th edition eldar dominance. People forget Sean lost at LVO and he was the only flyrant or tyranid list to even make thr championship and nicks Game was so close he probably should have won if he didn't nerf himself. If anything needed to be done with flyrants I'd say play fmc as the rules are written and just left skyfire blasts hit them. But even still I have a feeling that in another week after adepticon unless a chaos flying demon or tyranid list wins people will be crying about nerfing necrons or whatever lists wins that tourney. But in regards to LVO that tournament had a fairly balanced playing field.

You can't take data at adepticon too seriously, their army construction is so far off the accepted gt norm (2 sources) that any 3-5 source crazy list you see at adepticon you will never see again this gt season, they are also allowing lords of war like the typhon which are banned at every other event for a reason.

So why not just allow unbound lists and be done with it ?

 krootman. wrote:

gungo wrote:
With limited detschments cta is balanced. If anything lVO showed that. There is absolutely no reason any tournsmrnt organizer needs to take any overreaching steps to nerf it. This isn't 5th edition grey Knights, 6th edition eldar dominance. People forget Sean lost at LVO and he was the only flyrant or tyranid list to even make thr championship and nicks Game was so close he probably should have won if he didn't nerf himself. If anything needed to be done with flyrants I'd say play fmc as the rules are written and just left skyfire blasts hit them. But even still I have a feeling that in another week after adepticon unless a chaos flying demon or tyranid list wins people will be crying about nerfing necrons or whatever lists wins that tourney. But in regards to LVO that tournament had a fairly balanced playing field.

You can't take data at adepticon too seriously, their army construction is so far off the accepted gt norm (2 sources) that any 3-5 source crazy list you see at adepticon you will never see again this gt season, they are also allowing lords of war like the typhon which are banned at every other event for a reason.

Depends on the result. I have a feeling that crazy 5 source lists won't win the tournament and at best you see a 3 source list win. And even that 3 source list I doubt would be much worse then two full detachments and a single model detachment. The loWs allowed list is entirely another matter. A major tournament like this is good to see how detrimental to balance it will be to increase the amount of detschments from 2-3, which I believe is the next logical progression for tournaments.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
So why not just allow unbound lists and be done with it ?

Detachment limits are more about making people make trade offs in list building than anything else. 2 detachments means I have to choose between having an allied/2nd detachment OR a Knight OR an assassin in an army. The higher you set the limit, the less trade offs there are to make and the more frustrating an event gets to manage. With 3 deachments, the servo-skull inquisitor becomes an auto-add for me. At 2 detachments, I tend to value my allied AM more highly.

That said, I used to allow unbound lists with pre-approval at RTTs I used to run. The idea was to allow people with thematic lists to bring their cool stuff (i.e. something like greggle's Ork walkers or a locals all-jump pack Night Lords) while preventing people from using unbound to bypass the detachment limitations.

Let's be real - I don't think most people here advocating CtA want it to build themed armies - in fact just the opposite .

 CoteazRox wrote:

Requizen wrote:
Is there a place to see the lists other than the Top 8?

Here you go: http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2015/02/23/tits-tournaments-las-vegas-open-2015-top-lists/

I meant seeing lists that didn't make it into the top 8, I've already seen those top lists a couple times and wanted to see what else had a showing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krootman. wrote:

gungo wrote:
With limited detschments cta is balanced. If anything lVO showed that. There is absolutely no reason any tournsmrnt organizer needs to take any overreaching steps to nerf it. This isn't 5th edition grey Knights, 6th edition eldar dominance. People forget Sean lost at LVO and he was the only flyrant or tyranid list to even make thr championship and nicks Game was so close he probably should have won if he didn't nerf himself. If anything needed to be done with flyrants I'd say play fmc as the rules are written and just left skyfire blasts hit them. But even still I have a feeling that in another week after adepticon unless a chaos flying demon or tyranid list wins people will be crying about nerfing necrons or whatever lists wins that tourney. But in regards to LVO that tournament had a fairly balanced playing field.

You can't take data at adepticon too seriously, their army construction is so far off the accepted gt norm (2 sources) that any 3-5 source crazy list you see at adepticon you will never see again this gt season, they are also allowing lords of war like the typhon which are banned at every other event for a reason.

LVO allowed the Lynx, which placed third and ruined a lot of people's days from the sound of it. What makes the Typhon so much worse?

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Let's be real - I don't think most people here advocating CtA want it to build themed armies - in fact just the opposite .

To be fair the only cta in the championship at LVO was technically a themed list. An inqusitor with demons can be and is kinda fluffy according to lore.
I also feel Knights in chaos lists are fliffy as well. Mostly because there should be chaos Knights and it's taking forever for gw to make them.
However you are correct most people at that level in a tournament are there to make the best list possible to win. However the rules for allies tend to promote certain builds more then others as battle brothers are infinitely better for allying then cta. I do feel that the 12in deployment hinderence was to weak for cta. Should of added something else such as negative leadership modifiers when within 12in or something.

Like I said everyone has an opinion and it's not like Chaos must have a Knight with the Lord of Skulls. Some people might try to make a case for Nids and AM as BB so they field stealer cult armies (rolls eyes).

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Like I said everyone has an opinion and it's not like Chaos must have a Knight with the Lord of Skulls. Some people might try to make a case for Nids and AM as BB so they field stealer cult armies (rolls eyes).

Well according to hasting rumours genestealer cults aren't far off.

 Blackmoor wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, the question with regards to banning CtA allies - I'm pretty sure they are referring only to building your list with CtA allies and not to CtA allies through daemon summoning.

What would be the point of banning CtA allies? Is it just to get rid of the Leviathan Formation?

From a competitive perspective, there is no point. CtA allies will never be as good as BB allies in terms of synergy and combos. It's more of a fluff ban than anything else.

If you consider the background of the LVO/BAO/ITC, daemon summoning was never in question. It has always been allowed in all of their tournaments and without issues (other than a warning that you probably won't finish your game in time). However, what is new is the Come the Apocalyse allies that was allowed for the very first time in the ITC tournaments with the LVO. That is the issue that they are looking for input.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Like I said everyone has an opinion and it's not like Chaos must have a Knight with the Lord of Skulls. Some people might try to make a case for Nids and AM as BB so they field stealer cult armies (rolls eyes).

I can run my Nids with a Warlord Titan, it is in the fluff!!! (Nids actually infested and used a Warlord Titan in the fluff).