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That's one of the things that just kills me with Electro priests any time they referenced in fluff (not often but it's happened) they are noted as extremely quick and agile as opposed to other tech priests. I know that Dragoons, ruststalkers and infiltrators already cover fast assault for Admech but atleast do the guys with lightning coursing through them the justice of being faster than a guardsman..

Can Anyone do the math on how hard it would be to put a wound on robot with with the dominus formation + IWND vs S5, S6, S7, S8 and S9?

With AP- and AP2 would be awesome!

For example a unit of 5 jetbikes with scatters vs bots and dominus.

20 shots = 15 hits
15 hits vs T7= 5 wounds
5 wounds = 1.666 failed armour saves
1.666 = 1.2 wounds taken after FNP - it gets tricky from after here so not sure of the math*
0.9 wounds taken after IWND
+ the 2 plus chance to negate that wound.

So by that, it would take 15 scatter bikes to kill one robot before IWND / dominus 2+ restore a wound rolls? Thats pretty baller.
Especially as it doesnt take into account tanking wounds on the datasmith and dominus.

Now... SD on the other hand!

AP -
Strength: unsaved wounds per hit / after IWND / hits to kill in one turn

5: .0370 / .0247 / 81
6: .0741 / .0494 / 40.5
7: .1111 / .0741 / 27
8: .1481 / .0988 / 20.25
9: .1852 / .1235 / 16.2

AP 2
Strength: unsaved wounds per hit / after IWND / hits to kill in one turn

5: .0741 / .0494 / 40.5
6: .1481 / .0988 / 20.25
7: .2222 / .1481 / 13.5
8: .2963 / .1975 / 10.125
9: .3704 / .2469 / 8.1

**FIXED**

Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

It does open up some tactical considerations. If running Volkite, it will be favorable to give up one Kastellan's worth of split fire to instead utilize said Volkite against GEQ enemies. If running Eradication, use it when the enemy clumps in cover against the massed shooting of the Cohort.

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Do the characters have to give up all shooting or one shooting attack, as the Dominus can fire multiple weapons.

Fun little nugget: a Plasma Obliterator in the WD formation loses gets hot. As a blast weapon, you no longer run the possibility of having a 16% chance of not firing!

 obsidiankatana wrote:
AP -
Strength: unsaved wounds per hit / after IWND / hits to kill in one turn

5: .0370 / .0247 / 81
6: .0741 / .0494 / 40.5
7: .1111 / .0741 / 27
8: .1481 / .0988 / 20.25
9: .1852 / .1235 / 16.2

AP 2
Strength: unsaved wounds per hit / after IWND / hits to kill in one turn

5: .0741 / .0494 / 40.5
6: .1481 / .0988 / 20.25
7: .2222 / .1481 / 13.5
8: .2963 / .1975 / 10.125
9: .3704 / .2469 / 8.1

**FIXED**

It will not die only happens at the beginning of your turn right?

So only once per two combat phases and 1 shooting phase per model.

WrentheFaceless wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Do the characters have to give up all shooting or one shooting attack, as the Dominus can fire multiple weapons.

Dunno, leaks right now are all in German. I'd imagine he'd have to forgo all of his shooting, though.

Enigwolf wrote:Fun little nugget: a Plasma Obliterator in the WD formation loses gets hot. As a blast weapon, you no longer run the possibility of having a 16% chance of not firing!

Still not as good as Grav though.

Roughly how much is this bot formation?

Razerous wrote:
Roughly how much is this bot formation?

The base amount is exactly 685. To have Robots with all shooty guns, it's 745.

 Exergy wrote:
It will not die only happens at the beginning of your turn right?

So only once per two combat phases and 1 shooting phase per model.

Can't recall. Only included it because it was asked for. The hits to kill number is most important to me. That number, divided by %chance to hit dependent upon BS, gives an accurate threat assessment of enemy models. The IWND factors the value of any single wound per game turn.

IWND happens at the end of the controlling player's turn.

Im loving that bot formation, a definite auto include in my list as I feel it gives skitarii something they SORELY need...first game turn sustainability when going second, and long range anti jetbike/ heavy infantry.

Requizen wrote:

WrentheFaceless wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Do the characters have to give up all shooting or one shooting attack, as the Dominus can fire multiple weapons.

Dunno, leaks right now are all in German. I'd imagine he'd have to forgo all of his shooting, though.

I have my codex already - I believe the wording was "Instead of shooting"

 Enigwolf wrote:

Requizen wrote:

WrentheFaceless wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Do the characters have to give up all shooting or one shooting attack, as the Dominus can fire multiple weapons.

Dunno, leaks right now are all in German. I'd imagine he'd have to forgo all of his shooting, though.

I have my codex already - I believe the wording was "Instead of shooting"

Now then, the REAL question is - does this mean that the Dominus cannot use his Harness to heal a wound if he allows a Robot to split fire? It's not a shooting attack, but it's his "shooting action" so to speak.

Requizen wrote:

Enigwolf wrote:Fun little nugget: a Plasma Obliterator in the WD formation loses gets hot. As a blast weapon, you no longer run the possibility of having a 16% chance of not firing!

Still not as good as Grav though.

True, but grav doesn't have 72" or a Massive blast, nor is it a primary weapon to roll 2 dice for pen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:

Requizen wrote:

WrentheFaceless wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
Jesus. That formation is so tanky and painful...

Apparently the codex held a little nugget about it: in order to give a robot split fire, one of the Datasmiths or the Dominus has to give up shooting. So if you have a min formation, to shoot 4 different units with Robots none of the Characters can shoot.

Not a bad trade for the Datasmiths, since they're not really shooting powerhouses, but often you'll probably not want to give up the Volkite or Eradicator on the Dominus.

Do the characters have to give up all shooting or one shooting attack, as the Dominus can fire multiple weapons.

Dunno, leaks right now are all in German. I'd imagine he'd have to forgo all of his shooting, though.

I have my codex already - I believe the wording was "Instead of shooting"

Now then, the REAL question is - does this mean that the Dominus cannot use his Harness to heal a wound if he allows a Robot to split fire? It's not a shooting attack, but it's his "shooting action" so to speak.

I would assume not. To use his harness, he has to trade one shooting attack. Redirecting shots replaces your ability to even shoot.

Well to be fair if every other bot is split firing, one can fire at the original target and still free up the Dominus to repair and shoot one of his guns if needed

 WrentheFaceless wrote:
Well to be fair if every other bot is split firing, one can fire at the original target and still free up the Dominus to repair and shoot one of his guns if needed

Depends on how many bots and how many characters you have. The base loadout is 4 bots, 2 Datasmiths, and 1 Dominus. If you want all of the Robots to fire at different targets each, you need to have all of the Characters forgo their shooting. If you only want half, then the Dominus is fine to do his thing.

Requizen wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:
Well to be fair if every other bot is split firing, one can fire at the original target and still free up the Dominus to repair and shoot one of his guns if needed

Depends on how many bots and how many characters you have. The base loadout is 4 bots, 2 Datasmiths, and 1 Dominus. If you want all of the Robots to fire at different targets each, you need to have all of the Characters forgo their shooting. If you only want half, then the Dominus is fine to do his thing.

4 bots is only 12 TL shots and 12 non TL shots. Splitting it is valuable, but quartering it will often be too much.

Now if you maxed the bots but did not add more datasmiths.... you could have 12?! bots, and that would vaporize just about anything. Require lots of split fire.

Query, what would be more valuable... x2 icarus array dunecrawlers or 20 omnispec stock vanguard? The Icarus crawlers would be my only dedicated source of AA, aside from maybe cognis robots, but 20 vanguard puts out A LOT of hurt...

 gameandwatch wrote:
Query, what would be more valuable... x2 icarus array dunecrawlers or 20 omnispec stock vanguard? The Icarus crawlers would be my only dedicated source of AA, aside from maybe cognis robots, but 20 vanguard puts out A LOT of hurt...

That ENTIRELY depends on the rest of the army composition. Very different units.

This is what I have currently, it's all over the place I know, but I wanna kind of dip into everything

Troops
x5 skitarii vanguard, x2 arc rifles, arc pistol, omnispex 105
x5 skitarii vanguard, x2 arc rifles, arc pistol, omnispex 105

Fast Attack
x3 sydonian dragoons 135

Elites
x5 sicarian infiltrators, flechette blasters and tazer goads, phase tazer, phosphoenix, pater radium 245
x5 sicarian ruststalkers, chordclaws, transonic razors and mindscrambler grenades 160

Heavy Support
x2 dunecrawlers, x2 icarus array, x2 extra stubbers 260

Cohort Cybernetica
Dominus, autocadeus of arkhan land, raiment of the technomartyr (cost TBD)
x2 kastelan robots, x2 twin linked heavy phosphur, x2 phosphur, datasmith 320
x2 kastelan robots, x2 twin linked heavy phosphur, x2 phosphur, datasmith 320

to be 1850 (currently 1650 as written, costs may be incorrect)

I'd front your next additions into further Vanguard. Your bodycount is sorely lacking. You may find yourself suffering somewhat against hordes, so ten man teams with no specials may be the way to go.

 gameandwatch wrote:
This is what I have currently, it's all over the place I know, but I wanna kind of dip into everything

Troops
x5 skitarii vanguard, x2 arc rifles, arc pistol, omnispex 105
x5 skitarii vanguard, x2 arc rifles, arc pistol, omnispex 105

Fast Attack
x3 sydonian dragoons 135

Elites
x5 sicarian infiltrators, flechette blasters and tazer goads, phase tazer, phosphoenix, pater radium 245
x5 sicarian ruststalkers, chordclaws, transonic razors and mindscrambler grenades 160

Heavy Support
x2 dunecrawlers, x2 icarus array, x2 extra stubbers 260

Cohort Cybernetica
Dominus, autocadeus of arkhan land, raiment of the technomartyr (cost TBD)
x2 kastelan robots, x2 twin linked heavy phosphur, x2 phosphur, datasmith 320
x2 kastelan robots, x2 twin linked heavy phosphur, x2 phosphur, datasmith 320

to be 1850 (currently 1650 as written, costs may be incorrect)

Vanguard

save some points on the arc pistols and give the third unit of vanguard more arc rifles.

Get rid of the infiltrators and ruststalkers. Get a second squad of 3 dragoons and bulk up your Vanguards.

 Enigwolf wrote:
Get rid of the infiltrators and ruststalkers. Get a second squad of 3 dragoons and bulk up your Vanguards.

Unfortunately, I cannot see myself parting with my favorite little robot space ninjas, even though they aren't the best, I love the models. Really it is for me just whether or not to take the dunecrawlers. I have never really had much AA in any of my lists, has never been a big problem. But just last tournament there were a number of flyrant spam and FMC lists. And now with eldar and the crimson hunter formation, Im thinking the dunecrawlers are necessary...

So the destroyers getting heavy flamers for 5 points might actually be worth it. That over watch kills a lot of things that would assault them, even marines have to worry about that level of wounds.

Also definitely want to run them in units of 3, not having split fire kills the ability to take advantage of larger sizes and you it buffs. Also keeps them pod sized when you throw in one character

I just thought of this but for arcguard would it be worth it to stick two arc pistols on the alpha?