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2015/07/07 19:43:06
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Xyxox wrote: After much playtesting, Miniwargaming found that this game does not work, then they devise a points system that appears it may work:
Point system actually looks pretty descent.
However, the game still was essentially shuffling units forward and dicing it out. I fail to see where there is room for player-decisions, with the possible exception of which unit you pick in alternating cc.
Did you notice they reverted to measuring base to base? Piling minis on top of bases looks like garbage in video.
GW seems to have put a lit of thought into inventing this game, then went to sleep and forgot everything they thought of and quickly put together a piece of gak.
Yep, really a silly thing to go back to measuring from the models. We tried in the first game, didn't work well, and we started getting a list of odd problems and questions, and just went back to using the bases. I've just made it a house rule and explain it in the rules for the tournament on Sunday. At this point, i'm not too worried by the "unbalance" that might be caused by square vs round bases, not with all the other new factors.
Hummm... yeah, bases are a problem. The RAW are: "A model’s base isn’t considered part of the model – it’s just there to help the model stand up – so don’t include it when measuring distances."
If you can't overlap bases then you could just use an oversize base to prevent anybody from being in range for combat. This clearly isn't the intent, so the RAW require overlapping bases. Or you need a house rule that says all measurement is from the base.
It's a new page. Quick, someone post the pics of the new models on this page!
Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do
2015/07/07 19:51:42
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
2015/07/07 20:15:54
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do
2015/07/07 20:16:38
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Hit the little triangle or PM the original poster.
Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
2015/07/07 20:24:46
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
those guys remind me (although look nothing like) Uther Lightbringer and all the quotes he would say in the series.
I can hear it as they smash their hammers!
then again... I have not read much of the lore so they could be spirits inside the amours and maybe they just whisper like Tyriel from Diablo or something ....
one thing is for sure, I cleaned my desk of Orks last night and wiped all my Tomb Kings! and painting up my heroes! ready to roll some dice and raise Dead!
Udo wrote: Get it painted up though. It's a scientific fact that unpainted models die quicker than painted one's.
2015/07/07 20:30:43
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Crimson wrote: Am I imagining it or was there also a pic of the regular Eternals (not the hero) with halberds and swords floating in this thread at some point?
MalusCalibur wrote:Humour is fine, but it feels entirely forced in this context, and really does not have a place in the mechanical side of the game. You yourself acknowledge that you don't want there to be any more of these sort of rules, and plenty of others say to simply ignore them. So why even put them in? In the context of the release, they feel like an insult, an expression of the contempt GW has for veterans by making the old armies one big joke, a series of jibes at the 'manchildren' they believe those customers to be.
This is a good example of the behaviour I was talking about - the glee at the prospect of ousting 'competitive' players from the game because they don't play 'for fun', like you do. But fun is entirely subjective, and for some a fair competition where both sides are evenly matched is fun. Who are you to tell them that they're wrong? How can deliberately excluding people from the game, just because they don't play it the same way you do, ever be a good thing?
Very much this. Games can be decently-written, and balanced, and competitive, and narrative, and fun, all at the same time.
Jambles wrote:'Cause, it's a single symbol, like the single pip of the normal 1 on a die. My buddy has a bunch of Space Wolf dice he had custom made, put the faction symbols on the sixes, and it tricks me a lot more than I thought it would. It just looks like a one at a glance... and especially if you're not used to the dice. I could see it on a die where they usually just put the #, but most of my d6's are pips.
Xyxox wrote: After much playtesting, Miniwargaming found that this game does not work, then they devise a points system that appears it may work:
Point system actually looks pretty descent.
However, the game still was essentially shuffling units forward and dicing it out. I fail to see where there is room for player-decisions, with the possible exception of which unit you pick in alternating cc.
Did you notice they reverted to measuring base to base? Piling minis on top of bases looks like garbage in video.
GW seems to have put a lit of thought into inventing this game, then went to sleep and forgot everything they thought of and quickly put together a piece of gak.
Yep, really a silly thing to go back to measuring from the models. We tried in the first game, didn't work well, and we started getting a list of odd problems and questions, and just went back to using the bases. I've just made it a house rule and explain it in the rules for the tournament on Sunday. At this point, i'm not too worried by the "unbalance" that might be caused by square vs round bases, not with all the other new factors.
Hummm... yeah, bases are a problem. The RAW are: "A model’s base isn’t considered part of the model – it’s just there to help the model stand up – so don’t include it when measuring distances."
If you can't overlap bases then you could just use an oversize base to prevent anybody from being in range for combat. This clearly isn't the intent, so the RAW require overlapping bases. Or you need a house rule that says all measurement is from the base.
You could just mount your models on 1' x 1' tablescape tiles and make life miserable for your opponents. The solution in AoS is to tell your opponent that they're being a jackass and play with someone else
I think that people using reasonable bases for their models are fine measuring base-to-base, and not using overlap -- after all, anyone with a nicely based model won't want overlap.
2015/07/07 20:43:39
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Jambles wrote:'Cause, it's a single symbol, like the single pip of the normal 1 on a die. My buddy has a bunch of Space Wolf dice he had custom made, put the faction symbols on the sixes, and it tricks me a lot more than I thought it would. It just looks like a one at a glance... and especially if you're not used to the dice. I could see it on a die where they usually just put the #, but most of my d6's are pips.
Yeah! I've got a bunch of those, but they're still vastly outnumbered by the ones with pips, lol.
I fully acknowledge it's my own problem not recognizing them as sixes, and that it's not even a real problem - but I could see a dice manufacturer having the same reaction as me and going "you know what, let's just keep it consistent" or whatever.
2015/07/07 20:50:58
Subject: Age of Sigmar - Campaign/Fluff Book, Stormcast Archers, Unmounted Celestan Incoming
See I don't have a problem wih the few weird rules I've seen
In the warscrolls.
Hand of Dust brings a little bluff and deceit to what would other wise be just another 50:50 dice roll.
Old Grumblers is fine too as I'm very much from the old school of Pew-Pew, Chop-Chop wargaming where the odd sound effect is to be expected. This seems to be true of allot of people that I've met at clubs and tourneys. If people are enjoying a time they enthuse it ergo all the silly discussions that happen while gaming.
Naturally people are welcome to treat the whole spectacle of grown adults playing with toys as 'Serioz Bidnezz', me I like to tKe it as it is and have a laugh.
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
2015/07/07 20:52:24
Subject: Age of Sigmar - Campaign/Fluff Book, Stormcast Archers, Unmounted Celestan Incoming
Talys wrote: The solution in AoS is to tell your opponent that they're being a jackass and play with someone else
But that still didn't make 40K and WHFB any better, or turn the financial reports around...
Frankly, I think AoS is better than FB from my perspective because they could have gone another 20 years and I still wouldn't have played FB. I spend a lot of time on hobby, and WAY more time modelling than most, yet I can't imagine concurrently maintaining FB and 40k. In other words, the two games compete in the same, large model count space. I have lots of time/energy for a second/third/fourth game in the 40 model per army space, though.
Does it hurt the people who like FB instead of 40k for their big battle game? Of course.
IMO, 40k has never been better than it is now, in the post-Necron factions. Both the fun, flexibility, and balance factors are largely addressed (not perfectly, but better than they have been historically)
As to GW's financial reports, I don't own any shares and receive no dividends, and I am not employed by them or rely on them for a living, so I really don't care that much one way or the other
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/07 20:55:16
2015/07/07 20:57:32
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
I'd had said 40K has never been in a worse state than it is now, but I've completely given up trying to keep track of what's happening.
Talys wrote: Those are fantastic 15mm paintjobs, and they highlight my point exactly. If you said they were 28mm, they wouldn't even cone close to Golden Demon quality. They're also spectacularly hard to paint in 15mm, but would just be 'great' in 28mm, and not at all comparable to the 2 GD models in terms of visible intricacy.
I'm not entirely sure I get your point; they aren't meant to be as detailed as a (pretty big) 32mm mini, being under half the size (and a quarter of the bulk), and fill a largely different role. For one, they tend to suit the ground scale better (using 15mm mini's on a 6x4 table just seems better with most rule sets) and let you play bigger armies/games, all the way down to 3mm where you can host an entire 1:1 scale roman legion on a normal sized table, all 5448 of them, there's just no way you can do that in 28mm with any size of table.
That said, those 15mm mini's are painted better than the majority of us will paint 28mm's, it's better than my 54mms...
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/07/07 21:03:06
2015/07/07 21:00:40
Subject: Age of Sigmar - Campaign/Fluff Book, Stormcast Archers, Unmounted Celestan Incoming
notprop wrote: Old Grumblers is fine too as I'm very much from the old school of Pew-Pew, Chop-Chop wargaming where the odd sound effect is to be expected. This seems to be true of allot of people that I've met at clubs and tourneys. If people are enjoying a time they enthuse it ergo all the silly discussions that happen while gaming.
Nothing wrong with sound effects to your game, but they should be spontaneous rather than proscribed.
Even Old Grumblers will get old the 6th time you've had to grumble in a game (after looking up the sheet for what grumbles are allowed). I can't imagine how bad it'd be having to pretend to ride a horse for the umpeenth time against the same people or the 19th time I've challenged my moustacheless gaming buddy to a moustache competition in order to get a special move. If it was a bonus card in something inherently silly like Munchkin, that came up rarely then it's a different matter.
But then I guess it's partially my fault for trying to treat Warhammer as a more serious strategy game like I would with Flames Of War or DBA.
2015/07/07 21:16:37
Subject: Age of Sigmar - Campaign/Fluff Book, Stormcast Archers, Unmounted Celestan Incoming
notprop wrote: Old Grumblers is fine too as I'm very much from the old school of Pew-Pew, Chop-Chop wargaming where the odd sound effect is to be expected. This seems to be true of allot of people that I've met at clubs and tourneys. If people are enjoying a time they enthuse it ergo all the silly discussions that happen while gaming.
Nothing wrong with sound effects to your game, but they should be spontaneous rather than proscribed.
Even Old Grumblers will get old the 6th time you've had to grumble in a game (after looking up the sheet for what grumbles are allowed). I can't imagine how bad it'd be having to pretend to ride a horse for the umpeenth time against the same people or the 19th time I've challenged my moustacheless gaming buddy to a moustache competition in order to get a special move. If it was a bonus card in something inherently silly like Munchkin, that came up rarely then it's a different matter.
But then I guess it's partially my fault for trying to treat Warhammer as a more serious strategy game like I would with Flames Of War or DBA.
Yup. I'm all for a bit of silliness in my games. For example I recited Theoden's "Ride to ruin!" speech from ROTK when I was using my Vlad3 "Charge of the Horselords" theme list in a Warmachine game recently when I used his feat. I got some funny looks, but it was appropriate and had an air of spontanety to it.
When you make these things are part of the rules there's nothing like that other than an air of "mandatory fun!".
Games Workshop Delenda Est.
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If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them.
2015/07/07 21:18:33
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/07 21:19:17
Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
2015/07/07 21:23:43
Subject: Age of Sigmar - Campaign/Fluff Book, Stormcast Archers, Unmounted Celestan Incoming
Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do
