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 Tannhauser42 wrote:
You would think that, for that many points, and being a structure purpose built to house and fire the thing, that the plasma weapon wouldn't have the Gets Hot! rule. The Stormblade's gun doesn't have it, and it's even more powerful.

Always what I wanted to have, a 200+pt fortification with a big gun that will, invariably, fail to fire the first time I use it.

GW seems to have adopted since 6th the notion that all non-Tau plasma should get hot, fluff be damned. The original idea was the Imperium sucks at miniaturization: to make a stable plasma weapon, it needs to be huge to house all the cooling and such. In BFG, there's an entire popular class of cruisers armed with plasma weapons used to hunt escorts due to better range and accuracy (mostly a fluff distinction, generic "weapon batteries" don't specify munition type, in the Tyrant Class's case, it had fewer, longer range batteries, plasma being the explanation), and the Leman Russ Executioner didn't used to get hot because the tank's power plant could stabilize the main gun, which itself was an exceptionally advanced incarnation of plasma weapons, only produced on Ryza.

Then GW said "feth it" and slapped "Gets Hot!" on everything, but perhaps most amusingly, FW refuses that idea, as well as no small number of other GW ideas (in their publications, LR Executioners don't get hot, Hydras still ignore jinks even after the IG book got "updated").

This big gun looks to be another example. Why build a huge fixed fortification if it can't reliably cool itself? The whole advantage behind fortifications in reality is you can build bigger, stronger, more obscene weapons as space, in most cases, is no object unlike on a mobile platform, and giant bunkers tend to be difficult to destroy. Especially when inside a mountain or piece of natural terrain.

That being said, I still don't like the GW line of Imperial fortifications, and I play gods-damned Death Korps - they're over-gothic, moreso than they have any right being. Most of these, in theory, are planetary defenses built by the local PDF or airdropped by the Imperial Guard as part of ongoing campaigns on contested regions at some point in time. The Departmento Munitorm likes to build cheap and reliably, not with giant golden symbols on every surface covered in spikes, scrollwork and the like. Hell, the gods-damned trenches have giant sculpted books and aquilas on them! They break with the established aesthetic (by FW, the video games and the art) in favour of super-bling which feels cartoonish when applied to such mundane things. Most of their fortification range only make sense as part of the inherent defenses of some wealthy governor's palace, on a Shrine World or some other place where form supercedes function, not as part of commonplace frontline defenses.

In other words, I want FW to handle the terrain. If they didn't charge a bajillion more dollars than GW for them, they'd outsell these things easily. Lord knows whenever one of their trenchlines pops up on eBay it sells for serious cash.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
You would think that, for that many points, and being a structure purpose built to house and fire the thing, that the plasma weapon wouldn't have the Gets Hot! rule. The Stormblade's gun doesn't have it, and it's even more powerful.

Do you think the person who wrote these rules either knows and/or cares about that?

I think the Gets Hot rule was put in for the fun of rolling D3 randomly allocated wounds to units inside the building.

Or its a relic built aeons ago and nobody really knows how to work it, and some smuck bumped into the on switch but not the coolant.

anything goes in this universe.

Yeah, the "fun" of rolling random wounds. Uh-huh.

 MajorStoffer wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
You would think that, for that many points, and being a structure purpose built to house and fire the thing, that the plasma weapon wouldn't have the Gets Hot! rule. The Stormblade's gun doesn't have it, and it's even more powerful.

Always what I wanted to have, a 200+pt fortification with a big gun that will, invariably, fail to fire the first time I use it.

GW seems to have adopted since 6th the notion that all non-Tau plasma should get hot, fluff be damned. The original idea was the Imperium sucks at miniaturization: to make a stable plasma weapon, it needs to be huge to house all the cooling and such. In BFG, there's an entire popular class of cruisers armed with plasma weapons used to hunt escorts due to better range and accuracy (mostly a fluff distinction, generic "weapon batteries" don't specify munition type, in the Tyrant Class's case, it had fewer, longer range batteries, plasma being the explanation), and the Leman Russ Executioner didn't used to get hot because the tank's power plant could stabilize the main gun, which itself was an exceptionally advanced incarnation of plasma weapons, only produced on Ryza.

Then GW said "feth it" and slapped "Gets Hot!" on everything, but perhaps most amusingly, FW refuses that idea, as well as no small number of other GW ideas (in their publications, LR Executioners don't get hot, Hydras still ignore jinks even after the IG book got "updated").

This big gun looks to be another example. Why build a huge fixed fortification if it can't reliably cool itself? The whole advantage behind fortifications in reality is you can build bigger, stronger, more obscene weapons as space, in most cases, is no object unlike on a mobile platform, and giant bunkers tend to be difficult to destroy. Especially when inside a mountain or piece of natural terrain.

That being said, I still don't like the GW line of Imperial fortifications, and I play gods-damned Death Korps - they're over-gothic, moreso than they have any right being. Most of these, in theory, are planetary defenses built by the local PDF or airdropped by the Imperial Guard as part of ongoing campaigns on contested regions at some point in time. The Departmento Munitorm likes to build cheap and reliably, not with giant golden symbols on every surface covered in spikes, scrollwork and the like. Hell, the gods-damned trenches have giant sculpted books and aquilas on them! They break with the established aesthetic (by FW, the video games and the art) in favour of super-bling which feels cartoonish when applied to such mundane things. Most of their fortification range only make sense as part of the inherent defenses of some wealthy governor's palace, on a Shrine World or some other place where form supercedes function, not as part of commonplace frontline defenses.

In other words, I want FW to handle the terrain. If they didn't charge a bajillion more dollars than GW for them, they'd outsell these things easily. Lord knows whenever one of their trenchlines pops up on eBay it sells for serious cash.

Yeah man this is how I feel so much so that I spent way more than I probably should have on oop Forgeworld scenary, I love the old defence line network you cant beat the simplicity. I am still considering purchasing the GW stuff but I will have to convert the hell out of it and I have to many projects on the go right now.

I think the tower could be fixed by removing the iconorgraphy so it is a lot more bare bones.. hopefully the kit will facilitate this, also making the turret on top more tank like with a hatch and maybe a balcony so men can climb down for maintainance and gameplay purposes (I suppose ). It could make an interesting AA tower also with a Hydra turret sat up top.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
I think the Gets Hot rule was put in for the fun of rolling D3 randomly allocated wounds to units inside the building.

Random wounds are the Devil's wounds.

Do we know if these are plastic?

$80+ for the plasma thingy seems a bit much.

But this is GW we're talking abut.

They have not really done anything for general release that was not plastic in terms of terrain.

$83 sounds about right(at least in terms of GW pricing, if not logical pricing) if the size of this thing is what I'm thinking it is.

The void shield things was resin so there is some precident.

Yeah, but they weren't really "general release".

Hell those things didn't even really make it out into the wild.

I know it isn't optimal, per se... but I REALLY want a set of the Promethium Pipes, to stick my four Heavy Incinerator Purifiers behind. :-p

My wife play Orks, and my best friend Tyranids... so it would be the troll of the century. :-p

I really like the idea of making flamers Heavy Torrents if in range of the pipes. I think thats really cool and a nice buff to infantry flamers.

 flukezor wrote:
I really like the idea of making flamers Heavy Torrents if in range of the pipes. I think thats really cool and a nice buff to infantry flamers.

Then silly things like those grotesks that shoot blood suddenly gets a range boost too it.

or the cald assassin some how boosting her neuro disruptor from a distance

 Desubot wrote:

 flukezor wrote:
I really like the idea of making flamers Heavy Torrents if in range of the pipes. I think thats really cool and a nice buff to infantry flamers.

Then silly things like those grotesks that shoot blood suddenly gets a range boost too it.

or the cald assassin some how boosting her neuro disruptor from a distance

The rules look to just boost flamers, as defined in the rulebook. That’s a pretty short list.

 Nevelon wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 flukezor wrote:
I really like the idea of making flamers Heavy Torrents if in range of the pipes. I think thats really cool and a nice buff to infantry flamers.

Then silly things like those grotesks that shoot blood suddenly gets a range boost too it.

or the cald assassin some how boosting her neuro disruptor from a distance

The rules look to just boost flamers, as defined in the rulebook. That’s a pretty short list.

Woops i though it was based off it just being template for some reason..
Disregard my post

Bring back cool stuff like WFB houses and such, that would be nice. This release is very boring and kind of pointless.

It doesn't make sense though - why would flamers being used near a fuel pipeline work better? Surely if there was any interaction with the pipeline it'd result in an enormous explosion?

You link the flamer not to your tank, but to the pipe. Larger pressure and more fuel in reserve leads to a higher output, but reduces your mobility.

promethium pipe rules were in the terrain book GW released a while ago, there was just no models.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Yeah, but they weren't really "general release".

Hell those things didn't even really make it out into the wild.

I've been told these aren't "general release" either. We're not being limited to a specific number, (like the void shield debacle, where there was only 1000 for the entire world) but once they're gone, they're gone.

The pipes will be stocked like the rest of the terrain.

Herzlos wrote:
It doesn't make sense though - why would flamers being used near a fuel pipeline work better? Surely if there was any interaction with the pipeline it'd result in an enormous explosion?

For the same reason that a unit on the other side of the table can be wounded after taking a cover save from it... Because they didn't think the rules through before hitting 'print'...

 insaniak wrote:

Herzlos wrote:
It doesn't make sense though - why would flamers being used near a fuel pipeline work better? Surely if there was any interaction with the pipeline it'd result in an enormous explosion?

For the same reason that a unit on the other side of the table can be wounded after taking a cover save from it... Because they didn't think the rules through before hitting 'print'...

A “within 6 inches” would not be out of place for that explosion rule. You know RAI was for people to be cowering behind the pipes, but RAW if it obscures you anywhere...

I wonder if the promethium pipes are also available to Horus Heresy army lists.

 Nevelon wrote:
A “within 6 inches” would not be out of place for that explosion rule.

It should also affect any unit in that range, not just the unit taking the cover save.

You know RAI was for people to be cowering behind the pipes, but RAW if it obscures you anywhere...

Indeed.

 insaniak wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
A “within 6 inches” would not be out of place for that explosion rule.

It should also affect any unit in that range, not just the unit taking the cover save.

You know RAI was for people to be cowering behind the pipes, but RAW if it obscures you anywhere...

Indeed.

Honestly the piece or section of the terrain should just explode like a vehicle and be removed.

The void shield was polystone not resin. Probably the best material to make minatures out of for quality if weight wasn't a problem. Rumours are it's being rerelease in plastic.

Personally the best kit Gw ever made for terraib was the cities of death kits because they allowed for so many varients and unique ways to build them. I don't particular care for the static terrain kits they are releasing right now even if they do make a nice fortified terrain set.

Hmm, using my leftover Manufactorium bits from Cities of Death and some plain PVC pipe, I could make a very nice counts-as Promethium Pipes of the 'official' size, that would still look GrimDark(TM) enough to appease purists.

At NZD$75, there's no way I'd buy the kit :(

Yeah, seems excessive for such a mundane kit.

*pre-orders 4*

a 12' long piece of PVC pipe doesn't cost a lot.


Just saying.....