Project: ELITE- Alien minis boardgame Kickstarter (Update - minis are no longer blob shapes!)

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**ced1106**

PsychoticStorm wrote:
None of these are hard and fast rules, of course. I didn't back P:E also because of the Greecian economy, but it was primarily the first, second, and fourth reasons.

You mention that at every time you can, will you please stop it and stop discriminate at countries, US has a bigger percentage of flopped KS projects, should we avoid any projects from there because of precedence?

How, exactly, is this discrimination?

Businesses rely upon banks, and I think it's safe to assume Greek businesses rely upon Greek banks.

Back in July, Greek citizens couldn't even make a cash withdrawl from an ATM. Ciizens weren't even allowed to transfer money IN or OUT of the country.

What if Artipia or Drawlabs needed a sudden short-term cash flow and didn't have the money? Many small companies use banks for cash. Maybe they had money stashed somewhere else, but I don't know or wish to speculate.

If ANY country was in financial crisis -- including America's -- I would avoid investing or loaning money to businesses in their country as much as possible. That's why many investors sell or build up cash during a recession.

By your reasoning, the American economy must be worse than Greece's. Pretty sure that ain't so. Must be the year before an election year.

**Piston Honda**

I've seen better looking toys at a Dollar Tree.

Condolences to anyone who backed this. I know that feeling but this is fahking hilarious.

**ArtIsGreat**

Personal favorite quote: 'They are going to do everything they can to make this right...no promises tho'

If SOMEONE, not necessarily me, were to go nuts and burn Drawlabs down to the ground, would they just dig up the minis and ship them out as-is? Who could tell the difference?!

**RiTides**

That's enough discussion of international economic factors, please. There is no evidence it played a role in the miniatures here, and there are a lot more relevant things to discuss.

If anyone wishes to continue or respond to that line of discussion, please take it to PM and do not post it in the thread. Thanks.

**Shieldwolf Miniatures**

Hmmm... they still haven't posted the update they promised. Maybe they are re-calculating costs?

@ArtIsGreat Lol, I can't see why you are complaining. Be honest, you are getting some kicks out of this after all, aren't you? See? Isn't this fun? :-p
Btw, exalted for repetitive good sense of humor.

**PsychoticStorm**

Maybe they listened? maybe it was drilled into their heads, no matter the cause this is an at least hopeful announcement.

Message from Drawlab: Houston, we had a problem

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Hey, everyone,
Essen Spiel ’15 is over and many people had the chance to visit both our booths, watch and play Project:ELITE and let us know of their opinion both in gameplay and in the main issue we have been discussing, the miniatures.

Feedback received

We always want to hear your feedback, and we had the chance to receive a lot of it during the past days and we really want to thank each one of you, personally, that spent your time expressing your opinion.
Before Essen, after reading your comments we decided that the boss miniatures had too much glare on them, making it harder to see all the detail on them and for that reason exactly we decided to run a super fast production of replacements and take them to Essen with us. That allowed us to give improved versions of the bosses, were all the detail was visible at the first glance. The detail was there all the time, but now it was easier to see.
With that in our luggage (literally), we were really looking forward to see your reactions to our miniatures in person. During the fair, there were some positive comments, but also many negative ones. The best part about it was that many people told us exactly what they thought was problematic and we took that into account.

The decision

And that was it. During the fair, we discussed with Artipia Games, and we both agreed that we will not deliver you a product you are not happy about.
We are going back to the lab, and we are going to change the miniatures, to make them better, with cleaner detail. We know ways to do it, but we will make some R&D first to ensure the best outcome. This very week, we have planned a business trip to test new raw materials and new technologies to apply in our manufacturing.

What happens now
We understand that many people have already received Project:ELITE from Essen. These will not be excluded from the new miniatures, we will try to find the best way for them to be able to upgrade to the new miniatures we are going to make, and we are going to announce exactly how this will work later on. We have also received some messages of people who prefer to receive their games as soon as possible and do not mind the current miniatures. For that reason, we want to take a poll and we will try to figure the best way to make it work for all you.

Communications

Communication has been slow for quite a while now. It was hard for Artipia to respond to some of your questions since Drawlab is responsible for the miniature part. For that exact reason, a new email account (ran from Drawlab) will be made so that you can send your questions there and staff of Drawlab will respond directly. We are going to let you know when it is up and running when we are going to be ready for your questions.

Our Attitude
We want to make a quick note that we love this project as much as you do. We are grateful for your support all along, since the project couldn't exist without you. Our intention is not to stop before we reach a quality that is not only acceptable, but one that you will be more than happy about. We want you to be proud of your choice to support Project:ELITE.

Thank you for your support.
~Drawlab Entertainment ~

**ArtIsGreat**

Haha, the GLARE was hiding all the detail, that level of denial is amazing. Doesn't look like refunds will ever be in the cards, but maybe some better minis sometime in the unspecified future.

Unless this is all a delaying tactic while they stuff my moneys into briefcases and make for the border. Yeah, that feels right, someone better alert whatever countries border Greece, stat.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They made a poll https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/20613786#20613786 Of course its on BGG, why go by the KS comments from people who actually have money riding on this when you could just open it up to any tool who feels like weighing in?

BGG poll wrote:
What is your preferred solution after reading the new Kickstarter update?
Receive the game with miniatures as-is, as soon as possible
Receive the game with re-cast miniatures, regardless of how long it takes
Receive the game with the current miniatures now and pay a shipping fee to get replacement miniatures later

'Send as-is' at a shocking 0.8 % of the vote, I don't understand this world or the people in it. Drawlab just gave a definitive answer to anyone looking for a refund in the KS comments, its not going to happen.

**PsychoticStorm**

I am guessing your post is a bad attempt at humor?

Now, what is your problem on someone on BGG making a pool? are people not allowed to make pools in forums now?

You realize its not made from Drawlabs?

**Shieldwolf Miniatures**

Drawlab wrote:
"Thanks for all the comments guys, we are going to have more frequent updates for you from now on"

As I said this was probably the major factor that led to all this. I think a lesson learned... :-)

Now I think it's just a matter of time they fix this and provide what was promised, I can understand the heat generated by @ArtIsGreat and from what I read most people share his opinion.
Let's see if the problem gets fixed in a reasonable timetable and results, my guess is 4 months from now.

**ArtIsGreat**

Yes, they couldn't be bothered to make their own poll, they did specifically point it out in the KS comments and urged people to participate, so close enough yeah?

**highlord tamburlaine**

Things are starting to look better. Here's the latest photos.

That's one of the newly sculpted figures covered in primer to help bring out the details.

Here's that figure minus the primer in the foreground, with the abysmal sculpt in the back that you can't make any detail out on.

Sad thing is this is probably going to be delayed until February or March, but I think that's a fair trade off for getting figures that actually look like what they are supposed to.

**RiTides**

For some reason, the parting / mold line along the edges of the talons / etc stands out a lot more in the primer'ed pic, I'm not sure why it isn't as visible in the bare pic?

Still, a vast improvement, and something they could be proud to deliver to their backers (imo). Good to see them addressing this!

**highlord tamburlaine**

I agree that the primed picture REALLY stands out looking a lot clearer detail- wise.

Then again, most of my figures have a lot more distinguishable features after I've primed them, especially if I use a light grey like they did (which I usually do).

Another thing to note is that the red color they used is not the final color, so hopefully whatever they do end up using isn't as glossy as lets the detail really come to the forefront.

Using games like Rum & Bones as an example, the figures looked very lackluster and soft when viewed in photos, while in person I thought they were really nice and sharp.

Sometimes those cameras can be tricky photographing plastics.

**PsychoticStorm**

Probably angle, that hides it in the comparison photo.

It is an improvement it could have been better, but still looks good.

Hopefully they learned a lot and will deliver a good product.

**ced1106**

Did they mention where the money's coming from to redo the miniatures? Did they have to make new molds, is the manufacturer swallowing part of the cost, etc.? TIA!

**insaniak**

RiTides wrote:
For some reason, the parting / mold line along the edges of the talons / etc stands out a lot more in the primer'ed pic,

Yeah, while the level of detail is certainly a massive improvement, that's an awful lot of flash for a new mould.

**ArtIsGreat**

They won't give me a refund so I'm rooting for them on this, that is a pretty acceptable mini.

Were I a cynic I would be raising an eyebrow over how they suddenly learned how to take a close-up, in focus, well lit picture...now that they have detail worth showing.