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tyrannosaurus wrote: If this was the intention with the poses I'm not sure they'e nailed it yet, at least not with the O:I models. About 7 of the models have poses with guns close to their chest which make it difficult to paint pre-assembled, and two of them have guns angled down which covers most of the torso.
Akal, Aquila, Crockman all have open poses and have gained more flat areas with the scale increase. Fusiliers SWC and Bolts SWC too. Some poses still require you to paint and assemble, if you want top notch job. Now it's easier to do adequate job, if you aspire for somewhat standard/mediocre goal. If the gun is close to the torso, then for all practical purposes you don't need to paint the obstructed surface, simply black prime it and paint exposed areas. It's not my preferred way of doing things, but it's an option I keep in mind.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/08/09 07:16:08
RexInvictus wrote: Welp, I was gonna buy in but I'll just wait until they decide on what sort of scale they're gonna do.
Then you'll never start.
They seem to have a change of heart almost every book. First edition was GW type herioc 28mm. Second edition was a change to 28mm proper human proportions, but oversized guns. Human Sphere continued this. Paradiso saw a change properly scaled guns, but kept the body scaling the same. N3 seemingly saw a change to 32mm, properly scaled models, but guns randomly scaled to suit the model (hence why we now have females with lady sized rifles). Heavy Infantry seem to have swallowed gamma bombs as well. I'm guessing HSN3 will continue the N3 scaling, but you never know.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/17 04:20:47
Back in the old days, 2005-2010 when different Infinity sculptors were making manually their figures there was a lack of consistency due to different styles and artistic visions working for the same range. In the same year you could have Yannick Hennebo releasing figures fro Yu Jing and Jose Roig making the PanO figures. It was back then when scale creepyness was happening.
Now we have a new wave of people pointing at scale issues in INFINITY, but this is happening when Corvus Belli is making all their their models digitally. Now all sculptors are delivering more coherent figures than ever.
I can understand that the differences between new modles and old models, specially in a range with 10 years in the market, it becomes more obvious to everyone who looks at the gallery that the newest models and old models have scale issues.
Those issues have been always there, the quality gap is more obvious now because CB is delivering better miniatures.
Corregidor suffered a little bit on the crossfire because of this. The rest of the armies are receiving the benefits from this now or will get their moment later.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/18 14:42:46
ORC was the tallest of the cast, didn't really noticed anything else that would stand out. There wasn't such huge emphasis on the bulk, although I sort of approve of casting larger swords, although visually the older look nicer. The older generation swords had a nasty habit of bending, if the transport wasn't up to their liking.
Now all sculptors are delivering more coherent figures than ever.
Open file/export file.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/08/18 17:47:47
I like some of the bulk, but I don't like the inconsistency, especially that pic Loki showed last page - going smaller in 2nd edition, then back up lately.
The Chaksa from the Rasail Boarding team and the other Chaksa models are quite different... it is a bit discouraging to me from a coherent army perspective.
I can see the need to bulk up - some Infinity models involve two insanely tiny metal joints fitting together, and really keeps most people from being able to assemble, paint, and then game with them without fear of breakage. My jump troops for Tohaa never keep all their fins on...
In the end they just need to be more consistent, there's no mistaking that!
IJW wrote: Which Chaksas are the Rasail ones different from? As far as I'm aware they're all digital sculpts.
That there are THREE separate types, I think is what he was getting at.
Chaksa Auxiliars
Chaksa Perferical from the Rasail boarding teams
and the other chaksa with the support pack. .
[edit] and the slave attached to the gorgos. Although technically, there are only the two auxiliars - the other chaksa are either "servants" or "perfericals", so they aren't ALL meant to be the same thing, even if they are all from the same uplifted slave race. It's no different to having G:servant, G:sync and G:remote remote units, really. ALL three of those tend to be different, too, whilst sharing aspects (when it comes to the mech ones, anyway. Bakunin's freaks like to be different).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/21 04:02:21
I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.
That is not dead which can eternal lie ...
... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
IJW wrote: Which Chaksas are the Rasail ones different from? As far as I'm aware they're all digital sculpts.
That there are THREE separate types, I think is what he was getting at.
Spoiler:
Chaksa Auxiliars
Chaksa Perferical from the Rasail boarding teams
and the other chaksa with the support pack.
.
[edit] and the slave attached to the gorgos.
Although technically, there are only the two auxiliars - the other chaksa are either "servants" or "perfericals", so they aren't ALL meant to be the same thing, even if they are all from the same uplifted slave race. It's no different to having G:servant, G:sync and G:remote remote units, really. ALL three of those tend to be different, too, whilst sharing aspects (when it comes to the mech ones, anyway. Bakunin's freaks like to be different).
Well yeah, that's kind of my point - they're not just different units but going by the Tohaa background they've been uplifted/engineered differently.
I'm not all that offended by the size disparity between entire factions, as it has the potential to give each one more distinct silhouettes. What bugs me more is the size difference between similar units within the same faction/sectorial. I'm still in the process of starting a collection, but the scale creep is definitely a factor in deciding whether to go vanilla Nomads or Bakunin.
Again - don't let this brew-ha-ha stop you buying models. CB go through scale changes regularly - see my early photo in this thread with the multiple generations of models and their ever changing boarding shotguns. The shotguns in that photo aren't the only issue, there's a Fiday, a light skirmisher, who is almost a head taller than a heavily armoured medium infantry.
Scale and proportion changes are just a part of Infinity models. CB never can make their mind up.
I think what should never happen is let these instances of scale changes put them off getting the minis. I've had guys at my local club who are getting into the game, practically shaking their heads in disbelief at the sculpting quality of CB minis and how good some of it is. And that's wargaming vets coming from 40k, Warmachine etc. who relish being able to treat each and every grunt in your army as a character piece.
If it bothers you that much, one way to rationalise it by imagining that as human beings we are of vastly disparate size. As for the tools, weaponry and armour being of different size? Well, right now we produce tools, sports equipment that is suitable for different sizes. You can imagine the advanced material design production facilities of the future 'printing' the armour components to fit each individual perfectly, even weapons. If myself and my 6'4" rugby-playing friend required a form-fitting armour it would be radically different, and I don't see any more than that really with any of the CB range. In that sense, it's a lot of the other games out there (that see 20-30 individuals with identically-sized individuals) that are in the wrong, and perhaps we need to lose that preconception
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/22 08:50:34
You bring up some good points. I'm now more concerned about the varying proportions than I am about the scales themselves. It seems that they went from heroic to semi-realistic and now to realistic with heroic weapons/equipment. That being said, I've decided to jump on in. It's just a matter of choice between the Nomads starter plus a little extra or Operation Icestorm.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/22 10:25:15
youidiotkid wrote: You bring up some good points. I'm now more concerned about the varying proportions than I am about the scales themselves. It seems that they went from heroic to semi-realistic and now to realistic with heroic weapons/equipment. That being said, I've decided to jump on in. It's just a matter of choice between the Nomads starter plus a little extra or Operation Icestorm.
Not quite.
They went from heroic (1st edition, start of second edition) to realistic with heroic guns(human sphere) to realistic and realistically proportioned guns (Paradiso) to realistic with randomly scaled guns and a slightly larger scale (3rd).
But again, with the digital era, expect a lot more consistency from now on.
I'm more than willing to trade some inconsistency with older inferior models for consistent and better looking future models, many of which are already released.
Now if only they would be more consistent in the actual design aesthetics(see female Grunts and their "boob ribbons" v. male Grunts and tactical vests).
If it bothers you that much, one way to rationalise it by imagining that as human beings we are of vastly disparate size. As for the tools, weaponry and armour being of different size?
Problem is that you need to ignore the knowledge that certain products were made in different era and empirically they fit in that era.
I don't think saying "Ignore it, it doesn't matter" helps any. Clearly for some people it does matter, for others it doesn't. The best you can do is line 'em up and show them, and let people decide how they want to go.
I annoys me; there's no great need for it. It doesn't (yet) annoy me so much that I don't buy a model, though.
Pacific wrote: I think what should never happen is let these instances of scale changes put them off getting the minis.
For some people that is important; the visual appeal is just as important as the rules, so if they don't like a miniature, it won't get bought.
AndrewGPaul wrote: I don't think saying "Ignore it, it doesn't matter" helps any. Clearly for some people it does matter, for others it doesn't. The best you can do is line 'em up and show them, and let people decide how they want to go.
I annoys me; there's no great need for it. It doesn't (yet) annoy me so much that I don't buy a model, though.
Pacific wrote: I think what should never happen is let these instances of scale changes put them off getting the minis.
For some people that is important; the visual appeal is just as important as the rules, so if they don't like a miniature, it won't get bought.
Yes, although being put off by the visual aesthetic is not the same as being put off by the scaling issues.
Someone will either like the visual style of Infinity or not; the manga-esque, robots, aliens, sexy assassins etc. But, I doubt very much if you would like all of those things and then say "But, the scaling issues! OMG!" and then not buy the miniatures because of it.
As I've said before, in my opinion it's the equivalent of being put off by the pimple on the ass of the Victoria's Secret underwear modelm, if it bothers you that much then you probably don't deserve it
Well ... I was in the army (as a lot of wargamers were / are)
I'm 190 cm tall, some colleagues were 160cm tall
Wow, that's a big difference !
Guess what ? No one cared !
You guys need to unwind a bit and realize we're not playing with an army of clones here, plus no one sees the difference once the dudes are on the table, going pew pew at each other
Pacific wrote: Yes, although being put off by the visual aesthetic is not the same as being put off by the scaling issues.
Someone will either like the visual style of Infinity or not; the manga-esque, robots, aliens, sexy assassins etc. But, I doubt very much if you would like all of those things and then say "But, the scaling issues! OMG!" and then not buy the miniatures because of it.
Why? Having inconsistent scale across the range is an aesthetic issue, albeit one of the range as a whole, not of individual models. I't not just a matter of having short and tall soldiers, either. It's things like the female Hac Tao apparently being anorexic by comparison to the male (and less bulky than contempary LI models!), or the Ph14, ARM 5 armour being (scale) 18" shorter than the PH13 ARM 4 suit, or having weaponry in different scales. Like I said, it hasn't stopped me, but it seems clear from this thread that there are people wno are sufficiently bothered by it. You can't just dismiss it because it's not important to you.
TanKoL wrote: Well ... I was in the army (as a lot of wargamers were / are)
I'm 190 cm tall, some colleagues were 160cm tall
Wow, that's a big difference !
Guess what ? No one cared !
You guys need to unwind a bit and realize we're not playing with an army of clones here, plus no one sees the difference once the dudes are on the table, going pew pew at each other
Telling people they need to 'unwind' for having issues with the differing scales (because it's not just that some models are taller than others, they are different scales. The wildcats from the CJC box could probably fit inside the Alguaciles from Op:Ice, with their armour on, and they're meant to be MI; for example) isn't really the right attitude. It might not matter to you but to some it clearly does.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/26 13:13:09
I don't care what edition they came from. We were informed as to the reasons for differences in scaling, production, and also due to sales (when sales drop, models are likely going to get an update).
Having purchased a Cutter and placed it next to the new 2nd Squalo, I'm pleased with both.
The Regulars with their one foot on the ground next to a present day Croc Man? Yep, Croc's bigger, but same base size, and I have Silhouettes from Warsenal to deal with LOS issues if they ever come up (which, in my first tournament, didn't happen).
I'm new to infinity but have to say the newly scaled models seem a ton better in quality and detail.... these new minis are what drew me to the range. So CB keep the new minis coming!!!
I have models old and new, and they're all so beautiful the scale thing doesn't bother me atall, despite me owning some of the more extreme examples.
I think its only really noticeable when the models are lined up, and even then, as with fist-pumping, smaller guns for girls and the other issues discussed in such depth in the N&R thread, the Infinity range is just too pretty for me to care
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/27 20:47:01
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