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i was at OrcCon (each Strategicon event has a different name, the other two being Gamex and Gateway) on Sunday for the painting contest...
wandering through the miniature room where the contest was hosted, i saw Blood Bowl, Man-O-War, Guildball, AoS, 40K, Zombicide: Black Plague, Blood Rage, one other CMON box game, Dust Tactics, Star Wars: Armada, Imperial Assault, X-Wing, Sails of Glory, some Battlestar Galactica board/mini game, Team Yankee, Frostgrave, Infinity, and a few others...
no Robotech in sight...

in the dealer room, i didn't see any Robotech RPG Tactics boxed games or expansions for sale...
nothing on display anywhere, as far as i saw...
it would have been nice to see the minis in person, as i'm still on the fence about buying any...

nothing about Paladium or Robotech in the Program at all...
someone is taking crazy pills...

cheers
jah

 jah-joshua wrote:
i was at OrcCon (each Strategicon event has a different name, the other two being Gamex and Gateway) on Sunday for the painting contest...
wandering through the miniature room where the contest was hosted, i saw Blood Bowl, Man-O-War, Guildball, AoS, 40K, Zombicide: Black Plague, Blood Rage, one other CMON box game, Dust Tactics, Star Wars: Armada, Imperial Assault, X-Wing, Sails of Glory, some Battlestar Galactica board/mini game, Team Yankee, Frostgrave, Infinity, and a few others...
no Robotech in sight...

in the dealer room, i didn't see any Robotech RPG Tactics boxed games or expansions for sale...
nothing on display anywhere, as far as i saw...
it would have been nice to see the minis in person, as i'm still on the fence about buying any...

nothing about Paladium or Robotech in the Program at all...
someone is taking crazy pills...

cheers
jah

Thanks for the update. Do they get partial credit for dust tactics being there? I mean it has a word in common, right?!? Hopefully someone will post this update over on the official forums as a confirmation of the existing account that nothing about last few weekly murmurs pertaining to Robotech Tactics was true. If you want to buy any tactics, you're probably better off just getting it NOS second hand for a steep discount or waiting for the next 50% sale that pops up regularly instead of buying at retail. The kickstarter and convention "only" minis are also frequently available for weeks at a time on their webstore every month or two but you'll have to pay full price and inflated palladium shipping.

There's a bit of interesting news. The BSG fleet battles game is completely fan conceived, developed, and implemented...and has a presence when RRT doesn't.

Hmm...Google is not making finding that BSG game easy.

If the reply button isnt visible to me on facebook and I cant like any comments, does that mean Im banned?

Looks like alundra is getting protected.

evilsmurf wrote:
If the reply button isnt visible to me on facebook and I cant like any comments, does that mean Im banned?

Looks like alundra is getting protected.

Lol, looks like im banned as well, someone didnt like my comment about hoping they go bankrupt

At some point Nimmy will accidentally forget to logout of one of those accounts and find himself posting under the wrong one.

darkminstrel wrote:
There's a bit of interesting news. The BSG fleet battles game is completely fan conceived, developed, and implemented...and has a presence when RRT doesn't.

Are we sure that's what it was?

Because there's an existing BSG "board/mini" game (it's a boardgame, but it has minis for the Vipers and Raiders and whatnot).

I've played it, it's really tough to win as the Humans.

Frakkin' Toasters.

Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

And welcome to the Banned Club! I wonder how long before the True Believers give the banned folks a nickname like The Cabal Of Twelve or whatever gak that is that people allude to now and then.

Why isn't FFG making a BSG fleet game? They have Armada, they have the BSG boardgame ... seems like a shoe-in.

Forar -

Probably the one listed on this page: http://theminiaturespage.com/boards/msg.mv?id=331686

The regular board game is clearly a board game, and one really couldn't confuse it with a miniatures game.

Or it could have been someone running BSG using Full Thrust or some other generic rules.

 Forar wrote:
Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

There was the one guy who two years ago ran the games at gencon. Of course the entire thing was a mess and iirc the head of the ambassadors (the infamous palladium mod Jeff "NMI" Ruiz) threw him under the bus afterwards. I don't recall any MA's really doing anything much after that other than at the open house the next year but honestly I stopped paying attention not long after. There didn't seem like there was a big wave of enthusiasm from the existing MA's nor was there an massive influx of new ones specifically for Robotech given the year long delay (at that point) and the already multiple broken promises. I would have demo'ed had the program been under Ninja Division and contacted them about it during the months following the funding but didn't have any pertinent information at the time and obviously later Palladium pretended to pick up the slack. There's no way with how I feel about Palladium that I'd put myself in a position as a rep for them where I'd be beholden to not speak my mind or even support their myriad of douche moves (both past, present, and future).

 Stormonu wrote:
Why isn't FFG making a BSG fleet game? They have Armada, they have the BSG boardgame ... seems like a shoe-in.

The biggest problem conceptually, is variety, or lack thereof.

For capital ships, you've got the various Battlestars for the humans, and that's pretty much it. For the Cylons you've got the Basestars, and the Ressurection Ship (which I'm not sure was armed). So, at that scale, like RRT, you don't have a whole lot of options unless you go outside the canon.

If you break it down to fighter level combat (ie, XWing as opposed Armada), there's still not a ton of variety. Humans get what, four craft, one of which is unique (blackbird?), another that I don't believe is armed, at least in a meaningful fashion (Raptor), and the remaining two are just two modes of the same class.

As a tactical board game, it could work. As a tabletop game, it'd stagnate pretty damn quick unless it had some kind of serious hook. That's part of the issue with promoting RRT. Until you know there's more than 12 Regults, or 9 Regults with Glaug, or 6 Regults with Glaug and Recon, with optional Artillery and that that's the extent of army creation for the foreseeable future, it's hard to generate enthusiasm. That's not to say they can't come up with a hook. A campaign structure, or a more detailed online campaign (GW did a couple, kind of), or something that seriously changes dynamic are potential ideas. But it'll be fighting against a pretty high level of inertia, that is tabletop gaming without expansion.

Merijeek wrote:
Forar -

Probably the one listed on this page: http://theminiaturespage.com/boards/msg.mv?id=331686

The regular board game is clearly a board game, and one really couldn't confuse it with a miniatures game.

Or it could have been someone running BSG using Full Thrust or some other generic rules.

it looks like it was the FFG board game...
i don't play any games, so seeing a game with a board, chits, cards, and little metal ships kinda throws me as to what i should call it...
i just thought, "Battlestar, cool!!!", and carried on...

anyway, i checked the rest of the program, and nothing Robotech under RPG's or any other category...
they actually should have shown up, because it was a very busy show...
four days of 2,000 nerds in heaven at the LAX Hilton...
they could have shifted a box or two...maybe three

cheers
jah

 warboss wrote:

 Forar wrote:
Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

There was the one guy who two years ago ran the games at gencon. Of course the entire thing was a mess and iirc the head of the ambassadors (the infamous palladium mod Jeff "NMI" Ruiz) threw him under the bus afterwards. I don't recall any MA's really doing anything much after that other than at the open house the next year but honestly I stopped paying attention not long after. There didn't seem like there was a big wave of enthusiasm from the existing MA's nor was there an massive influx of new ones specifically for Robotech given the year long delay (at that point) and the already multiple broken promises. I would have demo'ed had the program been under Ninja Division and contacted them about it during the months following the funding but didn't have any pertinent information at the time and obviously later Palladium pretended to pick up the slack. There's no way with how I feel about Palladium that I'd put myself in a position as a rep for them where I'd be beholden to not speak my mind or even support their myriad of douche moves (both past, present, and future).

Wasnt that the guy who was organizing everything for them? And when things didnt turn out well he got the blame for everything, over the complaints of the others there who referred to him as a real 'asset'? At which he point he went public about everything.
But then thats the palladium way; chew them up and spit them out.

I really hope that's not the case, but it could explain the delay. After all, it must take a lot of time for Kev to put that much saliva and teeth marks onto EVERY sprue!

And of course it helps him with his claim of "Mouth-watering Detail" too!

evilsmurf wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 Forar wrote:
Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

There was the one guy who two years ago ran the games at gencon. Of course the entire thing was a mess and iirc the head of the ambassadors (the infamous palladium mod Jeff "NMI" Ruiz) threw him under the bus afterwards. I don't recall any MA's really doing anything much after that other than at the open house the next year but honestly I stopped paying attention not long after. There didn't seem like there was a big wave of enthusiasm from the existing MA's nor was there an massive influx of new ones specifically for Robotech given the year long delay (at that point) and the already multiple broken promises. I would have demo'ed had the program been under Ninja Division and contacted them about it during the months following the funding but didn't have any pertinent information at the time and obviously later Palladium pretended to pick up the slack. There's no way with how I feel about Palladium that I'd put myself in a position as a rep for them where I'd be beholden to not speak my mind or even support their myriad of douche moves (both past, present, and future).

Wasnt that the guy who was organizing everything for them? And when things didnt turn out well he got the blame for everything, over the complaints of the others there who referred to him as a real 'asset'? At which he point he went public about everything.
But then thats the palladium way; chew them up and spit them out.

I sent that person, and I can't remember his name, a lot of stuff before the convention. Rules, stat sheets, tips, a guide on the abilities and some key definitions. He ran the games. He was doing great from what I hear. Then he needed help getting the prizes and during this whole time Kevin and Jeff NMI were elsewhere patting themselves on the backs and signing autographs and such and could not be deemed worthy to help. He called NMI a few times and did not get a response. He was upset that both Kevin and NMI were more concerned about themselves than the going ons at the playtests and contests and was basically thrown under the bus. After that he quit and got a good (and Paid) job somewhere else for another company as a promoter. It's been a long time so I might be off on some detail but Jaymz has a better memory than I do and could fill in the details a lot better.

evilsmurf wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 Forar wrote:
Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

There was the one guy who two years ago ran the games at gencon. Of course the entire thing was a mess and iirc the head of the ambassadors (the infamous palladium mod Jeff "NMI" Ruiz) threw him under the bus afterwards. I don't recall any MA's really doing anything much after that other than at the open house the next year but honestly I stopped paying attention not long after. There didn't seem like there was a big wave of enthusiasm from the existing MA's nor was there an massive influx of new ones specifically for Robotech given the year long delay (at that point) and the already multiple broken promises. I would have demo'ed had the program been under Ninja Division and contacted them about it during the months following the funding but didn't have any pertinent information at the time and obviously later Palladium pretended to pick up the slack. There's no way with how I feel about Palladium that I'd put myself in a position as a rep for them where I'd be beholden to not speak my mind or even support their myriad of douche moves (both past, present, and future).

Wasnt that the guy who was organizing everything for them? And when things didnt turn out well he got the blame for everything, over the complaints of the others there who referred to him as a real 'asset'? At which he point he went public about everything.
But then thats the palladium way; chew them up and spit them out.

That's the way I heard it went down.

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/40227/battlestar-galactica-colonial-battlefleet

Is the BSG fleet battles game if you've not found it yet. Minis can be had via Shapeways or a couple commercial sources. Fairly economical with more ship variety than you'd believe.

 Mike1975 wrote:

evilsmurf wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 Forar wrote:
Edit: also, what happened to the "Megaversal Ambassadors" taking over organized play? Oh, right, like PB themselves, I haven't seen much movement or interest from the MA crew. Guess the apple hasn't fallen far there.

There was the one guy who two years ago ran the games at gencon. Of course the entire thing was a mess and iirc the head of the ambassadors (the infamous palladium mod Jeff "NMI" Ruiz) threw him under the bus afterwards. I don't recall any MA's really doing anything much after that other than at the open house the next year but honestly I stopped paying attention not long after. There didn't seem like there was a big wave of enthusiasm from the existing MA's nor was there an massive influx of new ones specifically for Robotech given the year long delay (at that point) and the already multiple broken promises. I would have demo'ed had the program been under Ninja Division and contacted them about it during the months following the funding but didn't have any pertinent information at the time and obviously later Palladium pretended to pick up the slack. There's no way with how I feel about Palladium that I'd put myself in a position as a rep for them where I'd be beholden to not speak my mind or even support their myriad of douche moves (both past, present, and future).

Wasnt that the guy who was organizing everything for them? And when things didnt turn out well he got the blame for everything, over the complaints of the others there who referred to him as a real 'asset'? At which he point he went public about everything.
But then thats the palladium way; chew them up and spit them out.

I sent that person, and I can't remember his name, a lot of stuff before the convention. Rules, stat sheets, tips, a guide on the abilities and some key definitions. He ran the games. He was doing great from what I hear. Then he needed help getting the prizes and during this whole time Kevin and Jeff NMI were elsewhere patting themselves on the backs and signing autographs and such and could not be deemed worthy to help. He called NMI a few times and did not get a response. He was upset that both Kevin and NMI were more concerned about themselves than the going ons at the playtests and contests and was basically thrown under the bus. After that he quit and got a good (and Paid) job somewhere else for another company as a promoter. It's been a long time so I might be off on some detail but Jaymz has a better memory than I do and could fill in the details a lot better.

Yep. He also got given a lot of crap from Kevin and NMI for his flight getting into Indianapolis late....and NMI, who is SUPPOSED to be an MA Coordinator essentially refused to leave the dealer area or Palladium's booth for ANYTHING for "reasons", one of which was to run "demos" that could be run by a couple of others that were at the booth like Carmen. Mind you from what I heard from more than a few people of THAT particular GenCon was that Carmen was more interested in shilling his own product than giving two craps about the demos he was running or trying to sell RRT at all. I have my own opinions of Carmen and his "demos". So a lot of the problems involved with prizes, reports, and player review sheets had a TON to do with those at the Palladium Dealer booth not giving enough of a damn to get the stuff to the people who needed it and they threw Gary under the bus for it rather than let themselves look bad for being too lazy to do anything but hang out at the dealer booth. Unfortunately, a couple of the helpers in the game room did not hear about any of these things as Gary was the go between so when crap hit the fan they only got the Palladium side of the story and seeing as, IIRC, the helpers were closely tied to palladium (at least one freelancer was helping), they of course took Palladium's side of the story at face value.

Mind you, having to deal first hand with the MA program, it is hit an miss to get anything for anyone locally and there is no official support of any kind whatsoever. You have to email them directly and ask for specific things you want for prizes as they have no guideline or kits or anything and even then they can and have (according to others) deny items as prizes. Even for advertising events there is NOTHING. The closest they have is one of of the freelancers (Carl Gleba I think) did up a couple of GM kits (one for Fantasy and one for Rifts). These kits cost 5 dollars on Drive Thru RPG and have one page printable ads you can put up and such. They did give out the Rifts one for free, I cannot recall if they offered the Fantasy one for free. That is it. They have NOTHING else for official support of the MA program. No adventures. No Encounters. No actual rules Every single MA is essentially on their own to set up and run any event they do.

Now personally I was able to get decent prizes for my last RRT Event at a local con. Still, I had to print off my own advertisements and flyers, which I including their website and facebook page URLs for people to go to.

Even on social media they do nothing beyond posting bird pics, Kevin's murmurs, and company weekly updates. ANY and ALL social media support, on Facebook specifically, if strictly fan run.

I personally ran 3 different Facebook Groups (Robotech, Macross II, and a general one). as well as 2 Proboard forums (General Palladium and RRT, and an RRT wiki. I also helped Mike and was involved in official vetting of rules to get proper errata and/or changes made for RRT. In addition to al that I was recruited by one of the MA coordinators to head up a major Fantasy project called Living Palladium which is to be sort of a Palladium version of Pathfinder Society.

I gave the Robotech and Macross II Facebook groups over to someone else.
I rebranded the General one to be more of a general gaming/personal group.
I gave the RRT Proboard to someone else.
I closed and locked the General Palladium one. (Readable only).
I gave the RRT wiki over to someone else.
I stopped vetting a damned thing and have not really given much help to Mike on much of anything.
I walked away from the Fantasy project, which has since all but crashed and burned into stillbirth.

All because I had had enough of the crap dished out by Wayne in the name of Palladium.

(my personal wiki and proboard while it has mostly Palladium material but it also has material for other games is not included above)

And they consider ME the bad guy in all of it. LOL THAT should tell you a lot in how they think.


Now WHY did I all the above? I though I could do SOMETHING if I were someone tied to and involved. Same as Mike. You will notice we both have all but given up on this crap. Driving away those that could help you a great deal if you would just LISTEN is the Palladium way. No one could possibly be able to help them if their name is not Kevin Siembieda.

Merijeek wrote:
The regular board game is clearly a board game, and one really couldn't confuse it with a miniatures game.

 jah-joshua wrote:
it looks like it was the FFG board game...

CALLED IT!

:-P

darkminstrel wrote:
https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/40227/battlestar-galactica-colonial-battlefleet

Is the BSG fleet battles game if you've not found it yet. Minis can be had via Shapeways or a couple commercial sources. Fairly economical with more ship variety than you'd believe.

Looks like it, thanks.

jaymz wrote:
Mind you from what I heard from more than a few people of THAT particular GenCon was that Carmen was more interested in shilling his own product than giving two craps about the demos he was running or trying to sell RRT at all. I have my own opinions of Carmen and his "demos".

I believe one of the demos made it to youtube that year although I'm not sure if it was Carmen or Jeff at this point. In it, whoever it was asks the player if he should be a jerk or an ass or somesuch which I thought was thoughtful and very out of character. Usually Palladium doesn't give you a choice and just assumes it's ok.

To be fair, if someone is demo'ing a game for me, they probably have a wealth of experience that I lack, so some question as to how hard I want them to be on me would be appreciated.

I recall that standing out as well, but I can't consider it entirely a bad thing, but then I like learning in steps, so someone roffle-stomping me because they've spent the last 2 weeks prepping for this and I just picked up the quick reference card 5 minutes ago is a bit of a disparity.

Though that's just about the nature of the question itself, I don't recall exactly how it was asked either.

That said, as someone who has worked a few conventions now, there definitely comes a point when you've refined your spiel and then begin playing with it a bit to try out something new. Maybe that got a big laugh with some previous players?

 warboss wrote:

jaymz wrote:
Mind you from what I heard from more than a few people of THAT particular GenCon was that Carmen was more interested in shilling his own product than giving two craps about the demos he was running or trying to sell RRT at all. I have my own opinions of Carmen and his "demos".

I believe one of the demos made it to youtube that year although I'm not sure if it was Carmen or Jeff at this point. In it, whoever it was asks the player if he should be a jerk or an ass or somesuch which I thought was thoughtful and very out of character. Usually Palladium doesn't give you a choice and just assumes it's ok.

That was Carmen


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Forar wrote:
To be fair, if someone is demo'ing a game for me, they probably have a wealth of experience that I lack, so some question as to how hard I want them to be on me would be appreciated.

I recall that standing out as well, but I can't consider it entirely a bad thing, but then I like learning in steps, so someone roffle-stomping me because they've spent the last 2 weeks prepping for this and I just picked up the quick reference card 5 minutes ago is a bit of a disparity.

Though that's just about the nature of the question itself, I don't recall exactly how it was asked either.

That said, as someone who has worked a few conventions now, there definitely comes a point when you've refined your spiel and then begin playing with it a bit to try out something new. Maybe that got a big laugh with some previous players?

That was the problem and why I passed information to Gary on the rules and so much more. PB was expecting MA's to Demo a game they had never played before or barely knew the rules on. They had no clue what abilities did what. They just wanted to support PB and that is support PB much more than support RRT and THEN PB hamstrings things even more by not giving them rules beforehand.

 warboss wrote:

jaymz wrote:
Mind you from what I heard from more than a few people of THAT particular GenCon was that Carmen was more interested in shilling his own product than giving two craps about the demos he was running or trying to sell RRT at all. I have my own opinions of Carmen and his "demos".

I believe one of the demos made it to youtube that year although I'm not sure if it was Carmen or Jeff at this point. In it, whoever it was asks the player if he should be a jerk or an ass or somesuch which I thought was thoughtful and very out of character. Usually Palladium doesn't give you a choice and just assumes it's ok.

Oh i dont mind the host playing to win. However when the host "forgets" rules on my turn then "remembers" them on his turn, rules HE supposedly wrote, that I had never played before, then I take umbrage. I suicided my army after two rounds of that just to get the hell away from it.

 Forar wrote:
To be fair, if someone is demo'ing a game for me, they probably have a wealth of experience that I lack, so some question as to how hard I want them to be on me would be appreciated.

I recall that standing out as well, but I can't consider it entirely a bad thing, but then I like learning in steps, so someone roffle-stomping me because they've spent the last 2 weeks prepping for this and I just picked up the quick reference card 5 minutes ago is a bit of a disparity.

Though that's just about the nature of the question itself, I don't recall exactly how it was asked either.

I disagree. It was a demo for a new yet to be released (at that time) game... The purpose is always to teach the basic mechanics in a fun and friendly manner unless it's someone you've repeatedly demoed for already who specifically asks for no holds barred. You especially don't act like a smug ass when doing an on camera demo at the biggest tabletop gaming convention in North America. You don't "offer" smugly to go easy on them if they so choose. It's a symptom and visual representation of the paternalistic and condescending bad attitude towards the customer that is systematic at Palladium for decades. That smug demo and NMI's clueless make the rules up as you go demo are the only two "official" company let's play videos we have post release. YMMV but IMO it matches the tone and effort put forth by the rest of the company post funding as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

jaymz wrote:


Oh i dont mind the host playing to win. However when the host "forgets" rules on my turn then "remembers" them on his turn, rules HE supposedly wrote, that I had never played before, then I take umbrage. I suicided my army after two rounds of that just to get the hell away from it.

Playing to win =\= being an ass.

Precisely

I was speaking more generally. I don't think I ever watched the full video, so 'smugness' and other aspects that might be present would obviously change things up.

Like tone of voice not coming across well in text unless you know the person very well (and even then..).

 Forar wrote:
I was speaking more generally. I don't think I ever watched the full video, so 'smugness' and other aspects that might be present would obviously change things up.

Like tone of voice not coming across well in text unless you know the person very well (and even then..).

I was hoping no one responded yet because I wanted to edit the phone post with a bit more explanation but real life got in the way of dakka posting (*shakes ragefist at the world!*). I wanted to clarify that I mildly disagree with your post in general but strongly in THIS particular case. If it were some other company like Reaper with a better rep and the demo guy said that, I'd raise a Vulcan eyebrow and think to myself that the guy probably shouldn't be doing demos and then promptly forget all about it. In the case of a known white knight smugly offering to be an ass by abusing an unbalanced and badly written combo of rules (ridiculously low MDC buildings blown up by blast weapons and iirc chorus line zentraedi soccer team swarming the demo player) who works for a company famous for decades for being a collective sack of buttholes who only write incoherent rules, it's just a symptom of a larger systemic attitude problem. Even if the ruleset does include that kind of stuff, you don't "offer" to use it for the only on camera demo at the biggest con you go to during the grand premiere year of your new game.

@Warboss: I figured a while ago that the only way Robotech would have any future is the fanbase managing the rules and support material and pretty much ignore PB (while avoiding their IP protective ways). As Mike has demonstrated, it can all be done for them and it still takes an eternity before they are roused by the smell of possible money before they do anything.