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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





TN/AL/MS state line.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
How many Kickstarters have been done containing four factions?

Relic Knights had six(Cerci, Doctrine, Black Diamond, Noh, Shattered Sword, and the Space Pirates) plus two supplemental factions(avoid and Prismatic).

Bah, ninja'ed by Lord_Blackfang!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/10 20:49:48


Black Bases and Grey Plastic Forever:My quaint little hobby blog.

40k- The Kumunga Swarm (more)
Count Mortimer’s Private Security Force/Excavation Team (building)
Kabal of the Grieving Widow (less)

Plus other games- miniature and cardboard both. 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

How many models and novels per faction did they have?

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






Sacramento, CA

 Kilkrazy wrote:
How many models and novels per faction did they have?


I can't give you a concrete number on models, other than 'Enough'.

As for novels... Games Workshop, Privateer Press, and SAS are the only wargames I know of that have released Novels.

Maybe Mantic has too? Or was that just short stories?

-Emily Whitehouse| On The Lamb Games
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





TN/AL/MS state line.

 Cyporiean wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
How many models and novels per faction did they have?


I can't give you a concrete number on models, other than 'Enough'.

As for novels... Games Workshop, Privateer Press, and SAS are the only wargames I know of that have released Novels.

Maybe Mantic has too? Or was that just short stories?

Relic knights had a comic(not much to brag about), and it's rulebook was close to half filled with a story, and fluff details.

As for models, are we counting unique poses?
Overall per faction you have 9-17 in the base pledge, with addons 17-24ish models.
Unique sculpts are around 5ish at the minimum in the base pledge, and 9ish at the minimum with addons.

Also, this is all based on the assumption that novels per faction actually means anything. I'm sure it varies from person to person though.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/10 21:25:19


Black Bases and Grey Plastic Forever:My quaint little hobby blog.

40k- The Kumunga Swarm (more)
Count Mortimer’s Private Security Force/Excavation Team (building)
Kabal of the Grieving Widow (less)

Plus other games- miniature and cardboard both. 
   
Made in gr
Thermo-Optical Spekter





Greece

I should add mercs last saga and warzone resurection on the 4+ category.

Novels per side, not much, but its largely a non issue for most, a game must first grab you to want to read more about it, otherwise we talk about a really successful and established novels line becoming a wargame.

Edit warzone not FF it has already been mentioned.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/10 21:47:30


 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

wild west exodus had a comic (now canned) and novels which are ongoing

 
   
Made in si
Foxy Wildborne







The Wrath of Kings rulebook is essentially a compilation of short stories with some army lists in between, and it's a fantastic read.

The Relic Knights rulebook fluff... reads like a 12-year old's fanfic in both prose and grammar.

Posters on ignore list: 36

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





TN/AL/MS state line.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
The Wrath of Kings rulebook is essentially a compilation of short stories with some army lists in between, and it's a fantastic read.

The Relic Knights rulebook fluff... reads like a 12-year old's fanfic in both prose and grammar.

...can't deny that!

Of course that plays in to the setting.

Black Bases and Grey Plastic Forever:My quaint little hobby blog.

40k- The Kumunga Swarm (more)
Count Mortimer’s Private Security Force/Excavation Team (building)
Kabal of the Grieving Widow (less)

Plus other games- miniature and cardboard both. 
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut





Germany

Come to think about it, I'm quite sure the lack of factions DID hurt this kickstarter. More factions appeal to more people - bigger chance to find something you like. That's the trivial part. However, assuming I get 4+ factions with my pledge, I can recoup some of my costs by selling one or two factions to a friend, maintaining some degree of flexibility for me while reducing my investment. Matter of fact, as I am not really sold on the two existing factions so far, I have the strong feeling I might select another faction as my primary army later on, if ME stays afloat.

Waaagh an' a 'alf
1500 Pts WIP 
   
Made in au
Incorporating Wet-Blending






Australia

 Kosake wrote:
Come to think about it, I'm quite sure the lack of factions DID hurt this kickstarter. More factions appeal to more people - bigger chance to find something you like. That's the trivial part. However, assuming I get 4+ factions with my pledge, I can recoup some of my costs by selling one or two factions to a friend, maintaining some degree of flexibility for me while reducing my investment.

You've got that backwards. Having twice as many factions means getting half as much for each of them - certainly half as many sprues tooled and generally half as many models. If you want to sell off half your models to a friend, you can already do that without making it a necessity by only letting any one player only use 1/4 of the models in the box.

If you want to run a 4+ faction Kickstarter, bundle each one and the rules as a separate module, and then make the starter pack the rules module and any two faction modules. Otherwise you're doubling the chance that people will find something they don't like that you're still expecting them to pay for.

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
-C.S. Lewis 
   
Made in si
Foxy Wildborne







 AlexHolker wrote:
If you want to run a 4+ faction Kickstarter, bundle each one and the rules as a separate module, and then make the starter pack the rules module and any two faction modules. Otherwise you're doubling the chance that people will find something they don't like that you're still expecting them to pay for.


Yup, this is the way to do it, and I think all the KS I listed did it that way.

On top of having just two factions, maybe it was a mistake for ME to so clearly point out that other factions will be coming (18+ months) later.

This sort of thing makes me think that I'm better off waiting until I see the complete lineup. I might like one of the later factions better. Sure, it's a long wait, but there will be other games in between to keep me occupied. Everyone with 5 minutes to spare and some CAD skills is making 28mm skirmish games these days.

Posters on ignore list: 36

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in se
Regular Dakkanaut




The far north

I have to join the choir and add that the models are the reason I did not join this kickstarter. While some of them are nice, like the Karist and some of the drones. There is nothing that grabs me and tells me to buy them instead of another Warzone force. There was no unique sellling point. And while the setting and fluff is important to me, it has to work together with exciting models. The models have to tell the story as well, and so far the ME minis do not really do that for me.

I like the minnows (am I the only one?) though. They are kind of cute, might grab a few.

geekandgarden.wordpress.com 
   
Made in gb
Courageous Grand Master




-

 jorny wrote:
I have to join the choir and add that the models are the reason I did not join this kickstarter. While some of them are nice, like the Karist and some of the drones. There is nothing that grabs me and tells me to buy them instead of another Warzone force. There was no unique sellling point. And while the setting and fluff is important to me, it has to work together with exciting models. The models have to tell the story as well, and so far the ME minis do not really do that for me.

I like the minnows (am I the only one?) though. They are kind of cute, might grab a few.


You're not the only one - I liked them as well.

"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd 
   
Made in de
Battlefield Tourist






Nuremberg

I know more factions might be a while off, but I hope we get some interesting ones coming along. For me a diversity of factions is a major aspect to any wargame.

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





TN/AL/MS state line.

 Da Boss wrote:
I know more factions might be a while off, but I hope we get some interesting ones coming along. For me a diversity of factions is a major aspect to any wargame.

Same here, hopefully at least one of them won't be Humans + Something Else. I'm always a big fan of interesting non-humanoid aliens.

Black Bases and Grey Plastic Forever:My quaint little hobby blog.

40k- The Kumunga Swarm (more)
Count Mortimer’s Private Security Force/Excavation Team (building)
Kabal of the Grieving Widow (less)

Plus other games- miniature and cardboard both. 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Really fascinating posts on the first page of this thread.

As a backer all I can say is that from my perspective it was a great Kickstarter, it was just a bit frustrating reading through the News and Rumours thread here when looking for new information because time and again it was the same small number of people repeating the same criticisms ad nauseum. Having to trawl through the same old, "But I don't like it, so I'm going to repost my dislikes over and over and over again" to get to the latest news became a bit of a downer and frankly stopped me posting in the thread at all.
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

 Kimchi Gamer wrote:
I'm admittedly not as up on my Kickstarter-Fu as I would like to be, but why are so many people calling this Kickstarter a failure? Did it not get 40k more than the minimum needed to fund the project? Even $1 more than the minimum would be a success, right? If they put the minimum at 20k but really needed 100k to get the project off the ground than why put such a low minimum? I ARE CONFUSE


As has been previously noted, I think this is in large part to the "ballpark" numbers people have thrown together to determine estimated costs to produce the items that were released in the MEdge KS. Simply put, the amount they brought in probably isn't enough to recoup the costs to create the product in the first place.

To SAS's credit, they seem to be all in for the long game, but I have to admit that I'm not convinced they're going to have as much luck at retail as they think they will. Why do I say that?

Wild West Exodus.

Wild West Exodus KS #1 had just over 1000 backers (~200 more than ME), made ~$330,000 (~5 times more than ME), and almost certainly had a better retail and distribution plan in place due to the affiliation with BattleFoam. Additionally, and this is purely subjective, they had better miniatures in both very high quality resin and very high quality HIPS. They also had fiction.

Their second KS had 400 fewer backers and "only" made $180k. Anecdotally, it had a nice reception at our local stores, but eventually died in lieu of all of the usual suspects (PP, GW, and Infinity). Getting a new game to catch on en mass is not nearly as guaranteed as some people here seem to think, especially when your initial support base is only 800ish people worldwide.

I've stated it before, but I'm really surprised how little the campaign seemed to make use of the breadth of information and analysis here on dakka regarding 'what makes a KS successful."

That doesn't mean the KS wasn't "successful," but its not a stretch to say that it could have been more successful if the campaign had been run differently.

 
   
Made in gb
Courageous Grand Master




-

 cincydooley wrote:
 Kimchi Gamer wrote:
I'm admittedly not as up on my Kickstarter-Fu as I would like to be, but why are so many people calling this Kickstarter a failure? Did it not get 40k more than the minimum needed to fund the project? Even $1 more than the minimum would be a success, right? If they put the minimum at 20k but really needed 100k to get the project off the ground than why put such a low minimum? I ARE CONFUSE


As has been previously noted, I think this is in large part to the "ballpark" numbers people have thrown together to determine estimated costs to produce the items that were released in the MEdge KS. Simply put, the amount they brought in probably isn't enough to recoup the costs to create the product in the first place.

To SAS's credit, they seem to be all in for the long game, but I have to admit that I'm not convinced they're going to have as much luck at retail as they think they will. Why do I say that?

Wild West Exodus.

Wild West Exodus KS #1 had just over 1000 backers (~200 more than ME), made ~$330,000 (~5 times more than ME), and almost certainly had a better retail and distribution plan in place due to the affiliation with BattleFoam. Additionally, and this is purely subjective, they had better miniatures in both very high quality resin and very high quality HIPS. They also had fiction.

Their second KS had 400 fewer backers and "only" made $180k. Anecdotally, it had a nice reception at our local stores, but eventually died in lieu of all of the usual suspects (PP, GW, and Infinity). Getting a new game to catch on en mass is not nearly as guaranteed as some people here seem to think, especially when your initial support base is only 800ish people worldwide.

I've stated it before, but I'm really surprised how little the campaign seemed to make use of the breadth of information and analysis here on dakka regarding 'what makes a KS successful."

That doesn't mean the KS wasn't "successful," but its not a stretch to say that it could have been more successful if the campaign had been run differently.


Valid points, but maybe WWE failed because the whole steampunk wild west genre, doesn't inspire anymore. God knows we've had a few games like that over the years, Deadlands being a prime example. Ok, my view is just speculation, but I think ME will survive because it fills a niche, and because the loyalty of the backers will sustain it.

I also think the rules will keep it going, because some of the influences included epic 40k, and that was a damn good game.

"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd 
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:


Valid points, but maybe WWE failed because the whole steampunk wild west genre, doesn't inspire anymore. God knows we've had a few games like that over the years, Deadlands being a prime example. Ok, my view is just speculation, but I think ME will survive because it fills a niche, and because the loyalty of the backers will sustain it.


I guess I'm curious what you think that niche is? Disaffected 40k players?


I also think the rules will keep it going, because some of the influences included epic 40k, and that was a damn good game.


I agree. I think this is one of the strongest aspects. I don't, personally, find the suppression counters to be fiddly at all.

 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Don't forget WWE is also much more expensive than ME, so not necessarily the best comparison (cost was always the issue that put me off that game, no matter how nice the models were).
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

Fascinating read all round

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in gb
Courageous Grand Master




-

 cincydooley wrote:
 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:


Valid points, but maybe WWE failed because the whole steampunk wild west genre, doesn't inspire anymore. God knows we've had a few games like that over the years, Deadlands being a prime example. Ok, my view is just speculation, but I think ME will survive because it fills a niche, and because the loyalty of the backers will sustain it.


I guess I'm curious what you think that niche is? Disaffected 40k players?


I also think the rules will keep it going, because some of the influences included epic 40k, and that was a damn good game.


I agree. I think this is one of the strongest aspects. I don't, personally, find the suppression counters to be fiddly at all.


I wouldn't say disaffected 40k players, but players looking for a more 'modern' game system. I was impressed with what Yakface was saying about the style they wanted - small unit tactics, vicious close range firefights etc etc which IMO accurately reflects the nature of real-life combat.

Also, their engagement with the community, and their willingness to accept feedback, will stand them in good stead.

"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd 
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:


I wouldn't say disaffected 40k players, but players looking for a more 'modern' game system. I was impressed with what Yakface was saying about the style they wanted - small unit tactics, vicious close range firefights etc etc which IMO accurately reflects the nature of real-life combat.


The talk of "modern" here is very curious to me.

It's a rules system based on a 15-20 year old rules system (Epic 40k) with an aesthetic that (as Buzzsaw showed) is being moved away from by much of the industry...

In regards to the pricing as compared to WWX, I think that's a fair thing when looking at the game at retail costs.

But in the KS, $115 (with free shipping) got you:

22 HIPS infantry
8 Resin "hero" models
1 Hardback Rulebook
4 Exclusive Resin Models
6 Resin terrain pieces
1 acrylic template set
7 HIPS base inserts
$40 of extra "stuff"

The more I look at it, the more I see WWX as a very good comparison to ME.

 
   
Made in us
Stoic Grail Knight





Raleigh, NC

I thought the niche was supposed to be a mid-size skirmish scifi game. In that way, it attracts ex-40k players who quit 40k due to game glut, but at the same time it draws in all sorts of customers who may enjoy the "20-30 miniatures per side" subset that MEdge would cater to. It doesn't seem to be just about catching the disillusioned with 40k, but perhaps hitting that niche that 40k used to hit.

I feel that I'm in a good category for this game size, which probably helped attract me to the game in the first place. For me personally, 40k has become to large and convoluted. On the opposite end of the scale, infinity has amazing models but the game itself seems (from the outside) very complicated and perhaps not as visually impressive. 40k feels impressive for the most part, but I think the same effect of visual enjoyment can be achieved with many less models.

Anyway, just my take on it.

EDIT: it would seem MEdge might be going up against the likes of Warzone and Gates of Antares. In that regard, I think the quality and range of miniatures will be very important to the success of the game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 17:13:17


 
   
Made in gb
Courageous Grand Master




-

 Accolade wrote:
I thought the niche was supposed to be a mid-size skirmish scifi game. In that way, it attracts ex-40k players who quit 40k due to game glut, but at the same time it draws in all sorts of customers who may enjoy the "20-30 miniatures per side" subset that MEdge would cater to. It doesn't seem to be just about catching the disillusioned with 40k, but perhaps hitting that niche that 40k used to hit.

I feel that I'm in a good category for this game size, which probably helped attract me to the game in the first place. For me personally, 40k has become to large and convoluted. On the opposite end of the scale, infinity has amazing models but the game itself seems (from the outside) very complicated and perhaps not as visually impressive. 40k feels impressive for the most part, but I think the same effect of visual enjoyment can be achieved with many less models.

Anyway, just my take on it.

EDIT: it would seem MEdge might be going up against the likes of Warzone and Gates of Antares. In that regard, I think the quality and range of miniatures will be very important to the success of the game.


The quality of the minis is no big deal to me. I'm over 6 feet tall, my eyesight's not good, so looking down at small models on the table means I'm not going to be noticing a lot of detail!

I know what you're saying. For me, it's all about the rules.

"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd 
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut





Germany

 jorny wrote:

I like the minnows (am I the only one?) though. They are kind of cute, might grab a few.

Oddly enough, I started to like them once I saw the top-down pictures. The ones that were there at release (taken from the front) were totally meh.

Waaagh an' a 'alf
1500 Pts WIP 
   
Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN (Currently in WY)

Honestly, disaffected 40K players is a GREAT market right now! If that is their target audience, there is a lot of potential.

Just ask Bolt Action!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:38:57


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Made in us
Stoic Grail Knight





Raleigh, NC

 Easy E wrote:
Honestly, disaffected 40K players is a GREAT market right now! If that is their target audience, there is a lot of potential.

Just ask Bolt Action!


That's a good point too!
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Houston, TX

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
 cincydooley wrote:
 Kimchi Gamer wrote:
I'm admittedly not as up on my Kickstarter-Fu as I would like to be, but why are so many people calling this Kickstarter a failure? Did it not get 40k more than the minimum needed to fund the project? Even $1 more than the minimum would be a success, right? If they put the minimum at 20k but really needed 100k to get the project off the ground than why put such a low minimum? I ARE CONFUSE


As has been previously noted, I think this is in large part to the "ballpark" numbers people have thrown together to determine estimated costs to produce the items that were released in the MEdge KS. Simply put, the amount they brought in probably isn't enough to recoup the costs to create the product in the first place.

To SAS's credit, they seem to be all in for the long game, but I have to admit that I'm not convinced they're going to have as much luck at retail as they think they will. Why do I say that?

Wild West Exodus.

Wild West Exodus KS #1 had just over 1000 backers (~200 more than ME), made ~$330,000 (~5 times more than ME), and almost certainly had a better retail and distribution plan in place due to the affiliation with BattleFoam. Additionally, and this is purely subjective, they had better miniatures in both very high quality resin and very high quality HIPS. They also had fiction.

Their second KS had 400 fewer backers and "only" made $180k. Anecdotally, it had a nice reception at our local stores, but eventually died in lieu of all of the usual suspects (PP, GW, and Infinity). Getting a new game to catch on en mass is not nearly as guaranteed as some people here seem to think, especially when your initial support base is only 800ish people worldwide.

I've stated it before, but I'm really surprised how little the campaign seemed to make use of the breadth of information and analysis here on dakka regarding 'what makes a KS successful."

That doesn't mean the KS wasn't "successful," but its not a stretch to say that it could have been more successful if the campaign had been run differently.


Valid points, but maybe WWE failed because the whole steampunk wild west genre, doesn't inspire anymore. God knows we've had a few games like that over the years, Deadlands being a prime example. Ok, my view is just speculation, but I think ME will survive because it fills a niche, and because the loyalty of the backers will sustain it.

I also think the rules will keep it going, because some of the influences included epic 40k, and that was a damn good game.


Part of the lower numbers on the 2nd kickstarter was that if you already played one of the 6 factions, there wasn't a reward level that was a good deal for you. There were a few add ons, but at $15 shipping, you'd be about as well off waiting for release.

I'd also point out that due to WWX's distribution policy, they are only in a few stores. They're mostly direct only - I understand that get's them a bigger % of each sale, but why tool for HIPS if you want to be a boutique direct only game? They could likely grow the game more if they actually sold it through the usual online discounters. I'd get more of their stuff if I could throw in the occasional new release with my monthly orders from the warstore or something.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 19:08:55


 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

Is the second Kickstarter of MMX relevant to MEdge?

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
 
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