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Happyjew wrote: Nilok, I was at work all day so was unable to respond to your earlier post.
The rule I was referring to is the one you quoted, including the bold section - transports can only carry Infantry.
This means if you are any of the following {Jump. Jet Pack, Artillery, Bike, Jetbike, Eldar Jetbike, Jet Pack, Monstrous Creature, Cavalry, Flying Monstrous Creature, Gargantuan Creature, Vehicle, Super-heavy Vehicle, Flying Gargantuan Creature} you need specific permission to be carried by a transport.
Thats fine, work has to been done.
I disagree with your list however, since the Unit Type for Jump and Jet Pack specifically state that there is no such thing as a pure Jump or Jet Pack unit, instead Jump and Jet Pack are modifiers to other unit types such as Infantry, Monstrous Creature, and Gargantuan Creature and as such, follow all rules governing their base Unit Type. If a rule references an Infantry Unit Type, it also applies to Jump Infantry and Jet Pack Infantry. The only time this isn't the case is when Jump and Jet Pack are specifically restricted in regards to Infantry, or their other base Unit Type.
Unlike most other unit type categories, 'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself, Instead, you'll find it occurs before another category - commonly Infantry, sometimes Monstrous Creatures and perhaps, rarely, other things. Jump units therefore share two sets of rules, the Jump unit rules, and those of their base type. Jump Infantry would, for example, follow the rules for Jump units and Infantry.
Happyjew wrote: Nilok, I was at work all day so was unable to respond to your earlier post.
The rule I was referring to is the one you quoted, including the bold section - transports can only carry Infantry.
This means if you are any of the following {Jump. Jet Pack, Artillery, Bike, Jetbike, Eldar Jetbike, Jet Pack, Monstrous Creature, Cavalry, Flying Monstrous Creature, Gargantuan Creature, Vehicle, Super-heavy Vehicle, Flying Gargantuan Creature} you need specific permission to be carried by a transport.
Thats fine, work has to been done.
I disagree with your list however, since the Unit Type for Jump and Jet Pack specifically state that there is no such thing as a pure Jump or Jet Pack unit, instead Jump and Jet Pack are modifiers to other unit types such as Infantry, Monstrous Creature, and Gargantuan Creature and as such, follow all rules governing their base Unit Type. If a rule references an Infantry Unit Type, it also applies to Jump Infantry and Jet Pack Infantry. The only time this isn't the case is when Jump and Jet Pack are specifically restricted in regards to Infantry, or their other base Unit Type.
Unlike most other unit type categories, 'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself, Instead, you'll find it occurs before another category - commonly Infantry, sometimes Monstrous Creatures and perhaps, rarely, other things. Jump units therefore share two sets of rules, the Jump unit rules, and those of their base type. Jump Infantry would, for example, follow the rules for Jump units and Infantry.
Right there is no such thing as pure Jump or pure Jet Pack, however, units with those unit types have to follow two sets of rules - those that govern Infantry and those that govern Jump/Jet Pack. Infantry has permission to be carried by a transport. Jump and Jet Pack do not. Therefore, Jump Infantry has one rule that allows them to be in transports and one rule that does not. As such in order to break no rules, Jump Infantry can not be carried by a transport (unless otherwise specified).
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
Happyjew wrote: Nilok, I was at work all day so was unable to respond to your earlier post.
The rule I was referring to is the one you quoted, including the bold section - transports can only carry Infantry.
This means if you are any of the following {Jump. Jet Pack, Artillery, Bike, Jetbike, Eldar Jetbike, Jet Pack, Monstrous Creature, Cavalry, Flying Monstrous Creature, Gargantuan Creature, Vehicle, Super-heavy Vehicle, Flying Gargantuan Creature} you need specific permission to be carried by a transport.
Thats fine, work has to been done.
I disagree with your list however, since the Unit Type for Jump and Jet Pack specifically state that there is no such thing as a pure Jump or Jet Pack unit, instead Jump and Jet Pack are modifiers to other unit types such as Infantry, Monstrous Creature, and Gargantuan Creature and as such, follow all rules governing their base Unit Type. If a rule references an Infantry Unit Type, it also applies to Jump Infantry and Jet Pack Infantry. The only time this isn't the case is when Jump and Jet Pack are specifically restricted in regards to Infantry, or their other base Unit Type.
Unlike most other unit type categories, 'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself, Instead, you'll find it occurs before another category - commonly Infantry, sometimes Monstrous Creatures and perhaps, rarely, other things. Jump units therefore share two sets of rules, the Jump unit rules, and those of their base type. Jump Infantry would, for example, follow the rules for Jump units and Infantry.
Right there is no such thing as pure Jump or pure Jet Pack, however, units with those unit types have to follow two sets of rules - those that govern Infantry and those that govern Jump/Jet Pack. Infantry has permission to be carried by a transport. Jump and Jet Pack do not. Therefore, Jump Infantry has one rule that allows them to be in transports and one rule that does not. As such in order to break no rules, Jump Infantry can not be carried by a transport (unless otherwise specified).
Infantry have permission to be in Transports, however, Jump Infantry and Jet Pack Infantry have no restriction to being in Transports, but instead a specific restriction that they cannot embark. If this restriction was called in the first paragraph, I wouldn't have an argument to stand on since it would override their Infantry permissions for being carried in a Transport and wouldn't be able to also use the hole in deployment allowing models to be deployed in Transports without having them embark.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/07/03 19:51:13
Yes or no, can Jump units be carried by transports?
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
Nilok wrote:Charistoph, your argument seems to be highly based on "standard English" which has (sadly) little to do with the rule set of 40k.
Perhaps you could rewrite it to not rely on that so much.
I'm not the one who started using it as a reference. Please refer to Col_Impact for the one is started using it as a standard.
And well, how can we really ignore the rules for English when we're dealing with a game written in English by an English company, unless specifically directed to?
Nilok wrote:Other than that, it seem your only argument is that you cannot be Embarked without Embarking, which would make sense if you were trying to use rule world example, but in the context of the rules, that is not a requirement. If it was, it would say for instance "Embarking Units count as Embarked".
If that is resolved, then you rest of your concerns also get resolved.
Well, no one has actually shown me how a unit can be Embarked without using the standards for Embarking. We've seen how units can be deployed in to a Transport, and we've see a unit start the game being carried by a Transport, but unless they are actually connected together with Embarking, either by just following standards or just flat ignoring the Movement Phase for it (which actually happens a lot in 40K rules), they cannot be considered "Embarked".
Nilok wrote:Because being embarked does not carry any restrictions. The second paragraph that covers the actual act of embarking is the restriction for Jump and Jet Pack infantry given. Embark and embarking is then later defined as something that can only be done in the Movement Phase. Finally, units that start deployed or embarked in Transports prior to the start of the game do not go through the embarking process.
And where does it state that there is no relationship between embark, embarking, and embarked? This has not been presented as yet, just assumptions and a desire to ignore it to prove your point.
Nilok wrote:This is honesty a case of Games Workshop stupidly cutting rules from 7th edition and redefining terms as rules. If they did not foolishly define "embark" later on as an action that can only be done in the Movement Phase and instead called it something like "Load Up", it such a blatant hole would not form.
Or maybe there is a refusal for some to just make the proper connections, just to be able to create a state that you desire. Unfortunately, this state comes with its own problems, as I have taken the time to point out.
Nilok wrote:Regardless, I don't think Jump or Jet Pack Infantry should be deployed inside of transport at the start of the game save for the Preatorians and their Dedicated Transport which had a rule omitted from the previous codex, in my opinion, erroneously.
I agree that the Night Scythe should be errata'd to carry both Jump and Jet Pack Infantry. And if someone asked before a game, I would even allow it.
But that's for people I'm around and gaming with and can make those types of agreements with.
CaptainSuperglue wrote:Sigh.... more arguments about praetorians....
Just give up guys, its obvious that whoever wrote the praetorian rules has no idea how the game is played, their transport and close combat options are both utterly buggered. You can make a good argument that they can't get out of their flyer, can't fight in hand to hand combat and that they can't even deploy on the board at all.
There is no correct answer, other than the writer of the rules totally messed this unit up, work it out with whoever you are playing before the game, and ask to drop them from your list if you're not both on the same page with them.
Actually, the rules for the Praetorians are fine the way they are. What problems have been brought up either involve putting words in to the rules that do not actually exist, or with another unit's rules entirely. The Praetorians have zero problems with the Night Scythe. It's the Night Scythe that has a problem with Praetorians.
Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
I did not ask about Jump Infantry, Jump Monstrous Creatures, or Jump Gargantuan Creatures. I asked about Jump units.
Absent specific permission from a vehicle, can a Jump unit be carried by a transport?
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
I did not ask about Jump Infantry, Jump Monstrous Creatures, or Jump Gargantuan Creatures. I asked about Jump units.
Absent specific permission from a vehicle, can a Jump unit be carried by a transport?
Jump Units wrote:'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself.
Asking just for Jump Unit rules is asking an incomplete question, as the rules never refer to a 'Jump Unit' outside the main description and telling us there is no such thing as a 'Jump' unit. This is shown when it clarifies that Jump [Infantry] and Jet Pack Infantry cannot embark on Transport.
In fact, a 'Jump' unit cannot even move, or be legally playing in 40k. However, a Jump Infantry unit, or Jump Monstrous Creature can.
Edit: Unless your argument is that since it says 'Jump' instead a completely writing 'Jump Infantry' that you can embark with Jump Infantry?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/03 21:03:03
I did not ask about Jump Infantry, Jump Monstrous Creatures, or Jump Gargantuan Creatures. I asked about Jump units.
Absent specific permission from a vehicle, can a Jump unit be carried by a transport?
Jump Units wrote:'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself.
Asking just for Jump Unit rules is asking an incomplete question, as the rules never refer to a 'Jump Unit' outside the main description and telling us there is no such thing as a 'Jump' unit. This is shown when it clarifies that Jump [Infantry] and Jet Pack Infantry cannot embark on Transport.
In fact, a 'Jump' unit cannot even move, or be legally playing in 40k. However, a Jump Infantry unit, or Jump Monstrous Creature can.
And what does the second to last sentence in the first paragraph for Jump units say? "Jump units therefore share two sets of rules, the Jump unit rules, and those of their base type."
As such, permission has been shown for Infantry units to be carried by transports. No permission has been shown for Jump units to be carried by transports. You must follow both rules. If A has permission and B does not have permission, then AB does not have permission.
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
I did not ask about Jump Infantry, Jump Monstrous Creatures, or Jump Gargantuan Creatures. I asked about Jump units.
Absent specific permission from a vehicle, can a Jump unit be carried by a transport?
Jump Units wrote:'Jump' is not a classification in and of itself.
Asking just for Jump Unit rules is asking an incomplete question, as the rules never refer to a 'Jump Unit' outside the main description and telling us there is no such thing as a 'Jump' unit. This is shown when it clarifies that Jump [Infantry] and Jet Pack Infantry cannot embark on Transport.
In fact, a 'Jump' unit cannot even move, or be legally playing in 40k. However, a Jump Infantry unit, or Jump Monstrous Creature can.
And what does the second to last sentence in the first paragraph for Jump units say? "Jump units therefore share two sets of rules, the Jump unit rules, and those of their base type."
As such, permission has been shown for Infantry units to be carried by transports. No permission has been shown for Jump units to be carried by transports. You must follow both rules. If A has permission and B does not have permission, then AB does not have permission.
Unfortunately, that is an incorrect assessment.
A more accurate statement is thus:
A has permission to be carried and embark.
B follows all rules of A if together
AB thus can be carried, but is restricted from being able to embark.
Infantry can be carried and embark, Jump units follow the rules of their base type, Jump Infantry can be carried but not embark.
If you are saying Jump Infantry cannot be carried because it has 'Jump' in it, you are not following the "Jump Infantry follow all rules of Jump units and Infantry".
Jump Units wrote:Jump Infantry would, for example, follow the rules for Jump units and Infantry.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2015/07/03 21:13:56
So why can Prats take a NS as a transport if they can't ride in it ? Is there any other such unit? Is there a walker with a dedicated transport besides dreadnaughts ?
It's the same people here trying to tell us what we can and can't do and they have no official capacity whatsoever.
A unit can be Embarked without ever Embarking even using standard English:
A baby begins its life embarked in its mother. The baby never undertook an embarking action.
Nonetheless, given the niche advantages of having a non-embarked Praetorian with a dedicated Nightscythe (e.g., a non-org fast attack choice, or tRget designated shenanigans in a Judicator Battalion), I have opted to not request permission in my games to have a Praetorian begin embarked until/unless errataed to allow it.
In fairness, however, it should be noted that with the expiry of prior errata, nothing can ever embark upon a Nightscythe, though Warriors and Immortals unequivocally may begin embarked at the start of the game.
nosferatu1001 wrote: Yes, but neither do you dozer. It's a discussion, do you understand that concept? It's in the tenets. Your remarks add nothing of any use.
Nilok - it states they follow the rules for Jump UNITS and for infantry
Dozer Blades wrote: So why can Prats take a NS as a transport if they can't ride in it ? Is there any other such unit? Is there a walker with a dedicated transport besides dreadnaughts ?
It's the same people here trying to tell us what we can and can't do and they have no official capacity whatsoever.
Command Squad upgraded to have Bikes or Jump Packs can still take a Dedicated Transport. Assault Marines I believe can purchase a Dedicated Transport even if they have Jump Packs.
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
nosferatu1001 wrote: Yes, but neither do you dozer. It's a discussion, do you understand that concept? It's in the tenets. Your remarks add nothing of any use.
Nilok - it states they follow the rules for Jump UNITS and for infantry
Jump
Units
Jump units have no permission to be carried.
Proven.
The rules for Jump are a modifier to the base type and follow all the rules of said type. As such, Jump Infantry follow all the rules for Infantry, including being carried.
Unless you are saying Jump Units without a base type, in which case they do not even have the rule for movement, and you would be correct. That said, I don't know of any Jump Units without a base type. If you find one, please tell me where to find it.
The codex allows them to take Night Scythes. It's a dedicated transport option for the unit. We're not really disputing or even talking about that, though. And Battlescribe carries no real weight in a discussion about what the rules say.
Dozer Blades wrote:So why can Prats take a NS as a transport if they can't ride in it ?
I can think of two. Both involve including a slotless Flyer. The first is just being able to include one more Flyer for AA in to the army. The other involves the Judicator Battalion, which then becomes a member of the Formation, and gaining all the benefits thereof.
Those are in game reasons. Developmental reasons, I cannot say anything other than what I said before: Praetorians used to be able to take the Night Scythe as a Dedicated Transport back when the Night Scythe could carry Jump Infantry and Jet Bikes as part of its Transport Capacity rules.
Dozer Blades wrote:Is there any other such unit? Is there a walker with a dedicated transport besides dreadnaughts ?
None that I am aware of, though there could be some Forgeworld units that qualify.
Dozer Blades wrote:It's the same people here trying to tell us what we can and can't do and they have no official capacity whatsoever.
True enough. What we can do (and stick to) is quote the rules and precedents from other rules. Not everyone sticks to that, though, and some like to think their view are the rules and try to push them as such.
sieGermans wrote:A unit can be Embarked without ever Embarking even using standard English:
Really? Not that I have ever heard. Usually in those cases, it involves "starts the scene/game/etc" in such a situation. In those cases, they do not ever try to bypass the normal restrictions for the action, except in this specific situation.
sieGermans wrote:A baby begins its life embarked in its mother. The baby never undertook an embarking action.
I have never heard it told that way, to be honest. I can tell you that my wife never considered our child as "embarked". My wife considered herself pregnant and carrying our child, but never really embarked. I'm not sure she'd like to be considered a boat or a plane...
It's not like "embarked" in real life means the exact same thing in the game, either.
sieGermans wrote:In fairness, however, it should be noted that with the expiry of prior errata, nothing can ever embark upon a Nightscythe, though Warriors and Immortals unequivocally may begin embarked at the start of the game.
Dozer Blades wrote:It's been shown already for specific conditions.
Not according to some, and that's part of the issues.
Either the units can be embarked, which means they still have to follow the restrictions to embark in the first place, or they just start in the Transport, at which point, they are not actually embarked, so cannot get off, and can only get out when the Vehicle explodes.
duffster240 wrote:Battlescribe allows them to take Night Scythes
And we all know that Battlescribe is the beginning and end of authority of 40K... [/sarcasm]
The codex allows them to take Night Scythes. That is not under discussion. What is under discussion is if Praetorians can start the game embarked on the Night Scythe.
Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
Point to the rules for embarking that are used during deployment.
There are none.
We cannot follow rules that do not exist.
There is a hole in the rules.
So every unit that starts the game embarked upon their dedicated transport is in the same boat as the praetorians on the night scythe - embarked upon the dedicated transport without having to go through the process of embarking. Technically, all units are deployed 'in' their dedicated transport at the start of the game and none of them go through an actual process of embarking to get there.
Point to the rules for embarking that are used during deployment.
There are none.
We cannot follow rules that do not exist.
There is a hole in the rules.
So every unit that starts the game embarked upon their dedicated transport is in the same boat as the praetorians on the night scythe - embarked upon the dedicated transport without having to go through the process of embarking. Technically, all units are deployed 'in' their dedicated transport at the start of the game and none of them go through an actual process of embarking to get there.
So you've said. We've also seen them allow you to ignore certain timing aspects of the rules when the timing doesn't work, such as being able to be repositioned via Deep Strike rules with Gate of Infinity without having permission to ignore the fact that one has to be in Deep Strike Reserves to actually use the Deep Strike Rule.
So, either a unit can be embarked on a Transport while ignoring the Movement Phase stipulation, but still follow the other rules for embarking.
OR
They do not really embark at all, and are just "deployed in" or "carried by" their Transport, at which point, they not really Embarked at all, so cannot get out short of the Transport blowing up around them.
That's basically what it boils down to.
You can do what you want, but which one sounds less like a cheating cheese-fest and actually violating the fewest rules and still allow everything to work practically?
Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
You can do what you want, but which one sounds less like a cheating cheese-fest and actually violating the fewest rules and still allow everything to work practically?
It's fairly obvious RAI that the praetorians do indeed get to ride in their dedicated transport that is on their Army List Entry. GW is clearly endorsing praetorians riding in night scythes by providing that option on the Army List Entry. Duh!
The cheating cheese-fest comes in when non-Necron players want to derail the ability of the praetorians to ride in their dedicated transport based on some technicality.
Luckily, strictest RAW reading of all rules considered do allow the praetorians to indeed ride in their dedicated transport. Yay for loopholes!
I think the cheesiness is on your side. Obviously praetorians can ride in the dedicated transport on their army list entry. It's silly to think otherwise and cheese-mongering to deny a Necron player from doing that. Luckily RAW is on the side of the Necron player who would straightforwardly deploy the praetorians inside the night scythe and play according to GW endorsement.
So yeah, I am pointing my finger at you and saying you are the cheese-mongerer in this debate.
If GW is providing an option for praetorians to have a dedicated transport I do indeed think it is RAI that praetorians can ride along in their dedicated transport. Luckily RAW supports that interpretation as well.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/04 08:12:57
nosferatu1001 wrote: Yes, but neither do you dozer. It's a discussion, do you understand that concept? It's in the tenets. Your remarks add nothing of any use.
Nilok - it states they follow the rules for Jump UNITS and for infantry
Jump
Units
Jump units have no permission to be carried.
Proven.
The rules for Jump are a modifier to the base type and follow all the rules of said type. As such, Jump Infantry follow all the rules for Infantry, including being carried.
Unless you are saying Jump Units without a base type, in which case they do not even have the rule for movement, and you would be correct. That said, I don't know of any Jump Units without a base type. If you find one, please tell me where to find it.
Again, you're being deliberately obtuse it seems
The rules you even quoted state that jump infantry follow the rules for both jumpUNITS as well as Infantry.
Meaning they follow two sets of rules
I have permission to carry infantry
I do not have permission to carry jump units.
Proven, again. Stop ignoring this section of the rules, it's pretty clear that you don't get to ignore jump as a distinction in and of itself
You can do what you want, but which one sounds less like a cheating cheese-fest and actually violating the fewest rules and still allow everything to work practically?
It's fairly obvious RAI that the praetorians do indeed get to ride in their dedicated transport that is on their Army List Entry. GW is clearly endorsing praetorians riding in night scythes by providing that option on the Army List Entry. Duh!
If it was obvious, than it would be RAW, and this wouldn't be brought up every other month.
The cheating cheese-fest comes in when non-Necron players want to derail the ability of the praetorians to ride in their dedicated transport based on some technicality.
Only by ignoring the Transport Capacity rules or:
Luckily, strictest RAW reading of all rules considered do allow the praetorians to indeed ride in their dedicated transport. Yay for loopholes!
Putting yourself in a position so that you cannot get cannot out of the Scythe without it crashing.
If you really want to get picky, those are the results.
I think the cheesiness is on your side. Obviously praetorians can ride in the dedicated transport on their army list entry. It's silly to think otherwise and cheese-mongering to deny a Necron player from doing that. Luckily RAW is on the side of the Necron player who would straightforwardly deploy the praetorians inside the night scythe and play according to GW endorsement.
So yeah, I am pointing my finger at you and saying you are the cheese-mongerer in this debate.
If GW is providing an option for praetorians to have a dedicated transport I do indeed think it is RAI that praetorians can ride along in their dedicated transport. Luckily RAW supports that interpretation as well.
I can field a unit of 20 Warriors. They can have a Ghost Ark as a Dedicated Transport. By your interpretation, I can put all 20 in there.
But let's get more fun, I used to run Templars, so a Crusader Squad of 20, and they can take a Razorback as a Dedicated Transport. I could fit all 20 if them, plus the Chaplain, in to a Transport that can only carry 6. Or, hey, Guard Infantry blob squads in a Chimera.
Now tell me it is not a cheesefest to ignore embarking and transport restrictions when deploying in to a Dedicated Transport.
Part of the English language is to substitute words to not be repetitive. In this case, I do firmly believe that the concept of "deploying in to" a Transport is a way for them to say "embark outside of movement". I also believe they made a copying error when bringing the Night Scythe over, and that is the true RAI.
Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.