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 insaniak wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Just because he is bald doesnt mean he is Plaguis

Indeed. And, again, Abrahms has said he isn't, Kasdan didn't even know who Plagueis is, and Andy Serkis has also confirmed that he's a new character.

Well they're not exactly gonna confirm a key plot twist are they? They're going to lie and mislead people to keep the plot a surprise.

The actual character of Snoke was supposedly one of the last to be developed for the movie, and they were for a time considering making him a woman... so if he is Plagueis, that would also have to have been a last-minute decision. Serkis says that he's someone who has been watching from the sidelines for a long time, but was not actually a part of any previous story.

Again...of course hes going to say that. Hes under contract to not spoil the next movie, and if that means lying, so be it.

Its the same thing with Game of Thrones. Kit Harrington insists that Jon Snow is dead, and definitely won't be coming back next season. We cannot take him at his word, because Contracts.


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 Frazzled wrote:

The 'resurrected Vader' theory that I saw on reddit or wherever posited that only the evil half of Anakin was resurrected. Snoke represents a manifestation of Vader, the Dark Side personality of Anakin Skywalker. The Light Side of Anakin is still one with the Force.

I hope not, because if so, the Dark Side is lame.

(it does fit a little bit though, although he wouldn't need Ren to go somewhere would he?)

I agree. But this one actually has a precedent in current Canonical Disney Lore. One of the Disney cartoons, Clone Wars I think, had Obi Wan and Anakin visit a planet where they met sentient creatures who were the literal manifestations of the Light and Dark Sides of the force.

So, in my opinion. Snoke is a cloned replica of the emperor.

The single line that Kylo Ren utters about a clone army being better than an indoctrinated one gives validity to this, and the fact that JJ pretty much ripped off the New empire stories...yeah

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Well they're not exactly gonna confirm a key plot twist are they? They're going to lie and mislead people to keep the plot a surprise..

It wouldn't be much of a plot twist, though, because the vast majority of people aren't even going to know who Pagueis is. It would be an even less surprising 'reveal' than that Darth Sidius was Palpatine because nobody would care.

'Wait, so this bad guy I've never heard of before this movie is actually some other bad guy whose name was mentioned once in the prequels? Er... ok... When's the next space battle?'


There is simply no point in keeping it a secret.

I don't care if he is or isn't. What he is, is lame. I didn't get the "this is a Bad Guy" vibe. I got a "this is a douche" vibe.

My theory that I just thought up right now is that he is Grand Moff Tarkin, resurrected after being found floating through space after the destruction of the Death Star.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
My theory that I just thought up right now is that he is Grand Moff Tarkin, resurrected after being found floating through space after the destruction of the Death Star.

That would require some retconning to make Tarkin a force sensitive. And you think they'd be trumpeting that fact too as Tarkin was the Star Wars equivalent of Sun Tzu.

Nope, it's Cornelius Evazan, not so dead after all... or something.

Kaiser Souze?

Personally, I think the part on Han's Freighter was the best part of the movie because it wasn't a complete rip off of ANH.

However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

 Easy E wrote:
However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

No.

It's quite a few pages back, but the theme for Snoke and the theme for Darth Grevious is really really similar.

*General Grievous

You're thinking of Darth Plagueis. Grievous wasn't a Sith, so he was no Darth.

God these names are confusing.


Play both of those videos simultaneously. Its freaky.

 Easy E wrote:

However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

It's closer than you think.... There are no Ewoks in TFA

 Easy E wrote:
However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

Yes.

Return of the Jedi had some awesome stuff (The Battle of Endor) and some really terrible stuff (also the Battle of Endor). It had some really awesome lines, too ("You failed, Your Highness. I am a Jedi, like my father before me."). However, that emotional and intense scene is juxtaposed with the corniness of stormtroopers fighting teddy bears, so it's awesomeness is diminished.

It's a good movie and I love it, but is the clear weakest link in the original trilogy. If given the choice between watching The Force Awakens and Return of the Jedi, I'd take The Force Awakens every time.

But those teddy bears are fething vicious man! Did you see all the severed heads of Imperial Stormtroopers in the Ewok camp at the end?

(My headcanon says all those Stormtrooper helmets the Ewoks collected contained heads).

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
*General Grievous

You're thinking of Darth Plagueis. Grievous wasn't a Sith, so he was no Darth.

God these names are confusing.


Play both of those videos simultaneously. Its freaky.

Brainfart.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
But those teddy bears are fething vicious man! Did you see all the severed heads of Imperial Stormtroopers in the Ewok camp at the end?

(My headcanon says all those Stormtrooper helmets the Ewoks collected contained heads).

Your headcannon only fits the Special Edition. The original musical scene made it quite clear they were empty...

 Easy E wrote:
However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

Better acted and directed. Easily. EASILY. I want to see TFA again before I give it the nod for a better script. I'm strongly leaning that way, though. Story...well, a lot of big stuff happens in ROTJ but then I think there's a lot of interesting stuff going on in TFA. And people can carp about this or that in TFA, but ROTJ has the giant Ewok anchor that drags that whole movie down. TFA is definitely in the lead, IMO.

If you take the fanboy glasses off when watching ROTJ, it's pretty clear that it previewed what the prequels would be like. Given that Lucas apparently ghost-directed that film, I guess it's not a surprise. Just watch how Ford mails in that performance. Getting mediocre performances from good actors...it's the Lucas touch!

Also interesting to note how no directors wanted to touch SW as long as Lucas was involved. Then once he was out of the picture, they had no trouble lining them up. VERY telling.

 insaniak wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
But those teddy bears are fething vicious man! Did you see all the severed heads of Imperial Stormtroopers in the Ewok camp at the end?

(My headcanon says all those Stormtrooper helmets the Ewoks collected contained heads).

Your headcannon only fits the Special Edition. The original musical scene made it quite clear they were empty...

I guess I'm showing my age then.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
*General Grievous

You're thinking of Darth Plagueis. Grievous wasn't a Sith, so he was no Darth.

God these names are confusing.


Play both of those videos simultaneously. Its freaky.

I think the music thing is definitely compelling. But I've warmed to the idea that he's someone new. If he's not a Sith but more of a wild card Dark Side user, I think that almost makes him more dangerous. And only the big SW fans are really going to get it if he turns out to be Plagueis.

The whole hologram thing had a *very* Wizard of Oz feel to it. I think it's very possible that Snoke isn't quite what he seems, even beyond the size.

Might not even have been a technological hologram. It could have been something similar to a force ghost. If Snoke is Plagueis, and Plagueis is dead, he could be directing Kylo Ren and the First Order from the grave.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
But those teddy bears are fething vicious man! Did you see all the severed heads of Imperial Stormtroopers in the Ewok camp at the end?

(My headcanon says all those Stormtrooper helmets the Ewoks collected contained heads).

Someone mentioned this on another forum, but Ewoks are pretty vicious and skilled predators when you look at what they do.

First, they were laying a trap for a very heavy carnivore (meat bait, counterweight for several adult humans and droids). They then hid 6 feet away from said group, which included a droid that specialised in sensor equipment and Luke fething Skywalker without being detected. Then when they caught this immense carnivore, their plan was to poke it with stone spears. When it turned out they had a bunch of humans, well gak, we gotta eat. Fire up the BBQ.

Then, they happily agree to involve themselves in warfare with clearly technologically superior forces, and systematically lead them into pre-prepared traps involving squashing things with giant logs. Which, by the way, they wouldn't have had time to prepare, so those were set up to kill something about the size of an AT-ST. Then, they casually appropriated blasters from the killed stormtroopers.

Ewoks are pretty terrifying.

The ewok AT-ST traps actually make a level of sense as there are on Endor, predators about the size of rancor beasts that roam into the forests to eat ewoks.

Ewoks also eat everything they kill... everything.

This knowledge brought to you by the Ewok Adventure movie and the MMO Old Republic companion Treek.

Well, to be fair, the Empire had been on the moon of Endor for a while, so maybe the Ewoks had been planning to take them out anyway, but the rebels just happened along at the right time?


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 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 Easy E wrote:

And more seriously.... i think he could be one of these guys from the 2nd Death Stars Throne Room in ROTJ....

Wtf? I don't ever recall them.

You may not recall them, but they were there. They were the Emperor's advisers and he quickly dismisses them with a nod.

 Easy E wrote:

You may not recall them, but they were there. They were the Emperor's advisers and he quickly dismisses them with a nod.

I recall them.... and the positive of that appearance, is that there is no indication either way, that ANY of them are or are not force users. If one were to view the Darth Plagueis book as canon (I know, I know... it's EU so it isn't), then it would make sense that Palpatine/Sidious has more than one apprentice at the same time, he does have a bit of a track record of not following the rule of two

Plagueis planned to break the Rule of Two cycle by making himself and Sidious immortal. Plagueis would forever be Master, and Sidious would forever be apprentice. The cycle of Apprentice overthrowing the Master, and taking an apprentice of his own until he is in turn overthrown would have been ended.

Sidious didn't agree.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Easy E wrote:

However, I am open to discussing if TFA is better than ROTJ.

It's closer than you think.... There are no Ewoks in TFA

Not seen the TFA awakens yet - might wait till it comes on TV - however don't people just watch the first bit of ROTJ for Princess Leia etc - thats the bit i remember from my long ago youth. The rest is ok - Ewoks are bad, space ships blowing up is good

One can fast forward through the Ewok parts. ROTJ's pretty good once you do that.

 Frazzled wrote:
One can fast forward through the Ewok parts. ROTJ's pretty good once you do that.

Fast forward through the ewoks but before that make sure to freeze frame for a bit on Leia's nipple slip.

I happen to love the original Ewok celebration song and hate that it was removed.

Yub Yub!

 Frazzled wrote:
One can fast forward through the Ewok parts. ROTJ's pretty good once you do that.

I fast forward through the phantom menace it was brilliant.

The only thing good that came out of Endor was Johnnie Cochran Chuwbacca Defense " If Chewbacca lives on Endor you must acquit"