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Hi guy's,

I'm new to the forum and pretty much new to 40K although I'm learning as much as I can!! I'm currently building up a Dark Angels army and have just purchased a Veteran Squad but I'm confused on what the best load out for each vet will be and I understandably want to get It right before assembling them?

I have the DA Codex but am still not sure as I want to have one vet with the assault cannon and a power fist on the other arm but is that even allowed? Also I want to have one vet with a storm shield but what will be best to put on the other arm?

I'm aware that a 5 man vet squad can have one special weapon and one heavy weapon, but is a power sword a heavy weapon or special weapon? If i have a power sword can i have a storm shield on the other arm or just a pistol?

Sorry for the noob questions but If someone could give me some advice it would be very much appreciated!!

Thanks in advance!!

For starters, a lot of the time you will probably want to run your Veteran Squad as a Command Squad, in terms of unit entries. This is because a Command Squad is also composed of veterans, but is a lot more flexible in terms of what it can do (including taking a standard and an apothecary -- both significant boosts). Do at least take a look at the two entries and have a think about your best options.

You can't take an assault cannon, unfortunately! There is no option for an assault cannon on a power-armoured character in the codex -- only on Terminators.

You can find lists of the points costs and classifications of heavy weapons, special weapons, melee weapons, etc. in the codex. The table is just before the pages of unit entries (don't have my codex handy to say a page number), and just after the 2-page spread on the Lion's Blade force.

A power sword is a melee weapon. In theory you could take a storm shield on the other hand, but in practice, that means you are one attack down, because if you have a power sword in one hand and a pistol in the other, you get an extra attack. So, most people will pair a storm shield with one of the following:

Power fist
Lightning claw
Special weapon (melta, flamer, grav, or plasma; usually a melta or flamer, since you seem to expect the squad to be close-combat oriented).
Combi-weapon
Bolter (this is the cheapest option)

That way you don't lose out on the extra attack in close combat for having a power sword + bolt pistol.

Hope that helps.

Hi Ian,

Many thanks for your reply mate, that was very informative and has shed some light on what I can and can't do!! By the look of It the storm shield is meant for a terminator's arm as there is no spare arm I have that I can attach it too as It's much chunkier leading me to think It's a terminator arm and the same goes for the assault cannon as I can now tell It is much broader and chunkier than the other arms so you were right mate.

Come to think of It the arm with the power sword is a deathwing terminator arm too so I can't use that either ha ha!! So the next option is can I have a vet with a power fist on one arm and a pistol on the other?

Thanks again Ian!!

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
For starters, a lot of the time you will probably want to run your Veteran Squad as a Command Squad, in terms of unit entries. This is because a Command Squad is also composed of veterans, but is a lot more flexible in terms of what it can do (including taking a standard and an apothecary -- both significant boosts). Do at least take a look at the two entries and have a think about your best options.

You can't take an assault cannon, unfortunately! There is no option for an assault cannon on a power-armoured character in the codex -- only on Terminators.

You can find lists of the points costs and classifications of heavy weapons, special weapons, melee weapons, etc. in the codex. The table is just before the pages of unit entries (don't have my codex handy to say a page number), and just after the 2-page spread on the Lion's Blade force.

A power sword is a melee weapon. In theory you could take a storm shield on the other hand, but in practice, that means you are one attack down, because if you have a power sword in one hand and a pistol in the other, you get an extra attack. So, most people will pair a storm shield with one of the following:

Power fist
Lightning claw
Special weapon (melta, flamer, grav, or plasma; usually a melta or flamer, since you seem to expect the squad to be close-combat oriented).
Combi-weapon
Bolter (this is the cheapest option)

That way you don't lose out on the extra attack in close combat for having a power sword + bolt pistol.

Hope that helps.

company veterans lose nothing for buying a storm shield though (the text literally says any veteran may buy a storm shield....), in reality the RAW is that he has (In your example) a power sword, a storm shield and a bolt pistol costing him nothing.

as for what weapons to give them, veterans are a funny old unit they can be kitted for just about anything you want to do. their good at basically everything though their real calling is close combat and short ranged work. they synergize incredibly well with commanders especially when you can pair them with a transport with assault vehicle like a land raider.

an interesting idea here:

hammer of caliban:
land raider redeemer
three standard predators with heavy bolter sponsons (maybe)
techmarine with servo harness

10 veterans with 5 power fists then join this formation from say a CAD or a lions blade

you now have a very strong any infantry team that costs 900 points yea thats true, but it can steamroll through infantry really really quickly and them the veterans can charge in and crush the armor behind them. you could even throw in a heavy weapon or a special weapon to give tham a little more kick.

but if your not going to be doing that or sticking them in a drop pod with an interrogator chaplain /w the eye of the unseen (or ezekiel because he has magic and gives them +1 attack in close combat) and plasma weapons/grav weapons chances are your probably just going to leave them very bare or use them as a slightly more costly but better are all jobs tactical marine/assault marine so bolters or pistols and chainswords are just fine.

Personally, i have a 5-man squad who have a plasma gun and a bunch of combi-plasma's. Stick them in a rhino and dump them, next to something important with either no or a bad invul save (carnifexes beware) and watch it die. After they do that they are a 2 attack combat squad with a plasma gun, so they can either keep shooting or assault some squishy units and usually kill them off.

I love my veteran squads

 ionusx wrote:

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
That way you don't lose out on the extra attack in close combat for having a power sword + bolt pistol.

company veterans lose nothing for buying a storm shield though (the text literally says any veteran may buy a storm shield....), in reality the RAW is that he has (In your example) a power sword, a storm shield and a bolt pistol costing him nothing.

Ian means that the rules text for a Storm Shield states you never gain a bonus attack for having 2 CCW's (page 153 of the codex).

@ Skyborn, The wargear list that Ian mentioned is on page 97 of the codex, and defines what counts as a Melee Weapon, Ranged Weapon, Special Weapon and Heavy Weapon in terms of buying upgrades (and gives the points values too). I've picked up a spare veteran sprue that I had and yes, there's a set of terminator legs, terminator storm bolter, terminator power sword, terminator assault cannon, terminator storm shield and three terminator shoulder pads - these were from before there was a specific Deathwing box. There is a power armour power sword (right-handed, near the assault cannon and other power sword).
It's important to note that you can use any bits from other space marine kits too - as long as the unit is allowed it from the army list entry, you're not limited to only the contents of the box. Also, you could probably convert the storm shield using the combat shield arm.

My friend used to run a squad of veterans with plasma pistols and bolt pistols. (Yes, a pricey unit). He would place them in a drop pod and insert them wherever they could do a ton of damage. He usually stuck Azrael in this squad as well.

I know the internets will instantly say this is awful. However, this squad would always kill something. And, as it always landed in my backfield, it forced me to deal with it immediately.

You can often slice off the blade of a power sword carefully to put on in place of a chainsaw blade if you have a good sharp scalpel...

Alternatively, the nicest DA power swords right now, I think, come with the Black Knights box. There's at least a couple in there, with power armour hands, and you need at most one per box for the actual Black Knights (probably none). Really nice powerful unit too, the BKs.

Awesome advice and information, thanks guy's!! One more quick question which I've been wanting to know the answer too for a while now - Does a sergeant have to have no helmet or can i ave my sergeant with a hooded cowl and helmet on?

You can have any helmet or head on your sergeant. You usually just want an easy way to identified them (I paint a shoulder pad a different color, or paint his helmet another color usualy.)

Skyborn wrote:
So the next option is can I have a vet with a power fist on one arm and a pistol on the other?

You can, but you shouldn't. The Power Fist is a Specialist Weapon so it only gets the +1 Attack if you have another Specialist Weapon (Those are the Power Fist, Chainfist, Lightning Claw and Thunder Hammer).
If you plan on giving someone a Fist/Claw and a gun, it's better if you pick a Combi/Special because you're not getting the Pistol bonus (the supply of Special Weapons in the Company Veterans Squad is limited to 1 per 5 guys but there's nothing saying that you can't have those on people with Fists/Claws since every single model has access to the Melee Weapons and Ranged Weapons lists. The Command Squad lets you go nuts with all three so you could have 5 guys who all have a Plasma Gun and a Power Fist if you really wanted).