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I think that all the vehicles in roughly the same class will be certainly be the same final price if not all of them being the same price

(so Tunneller/FF tank/Asterian tank and enforcer dropship/plague dropship),

but if they decide to include some non plastic stuff in the boxes as to add options to the build for some/all (and I can see they might) that goes out the window

 lord_blackfang wrote:
At a glance, they seem to all require about the same amount of sprue space, so they should cost the same. Maybe the ones that are shared by several faction might cost a bit less because they'll sell more?

That's reasonable. In part I was asking because GW's prices are all over the place rather than logically determined by manufacturing cost per sprue, so I wondered if other factors might impact the final unit prices of Mantic's vehicles differently. It's not immediately obvious how they would, if so. You might price the Asterian Troop Transport higher because fewer people will buy them than will buy an Enforcer Dropship, for example, or you might price them the same or lower to encourage more people to pick up Asterian factions in the first place.

GW's pricing is only all over the place since they stopped (thank goodness) their annual price increased that used to make sure all comparable kits went up to the price of the new stuff

but you might well find the retailers discount stuff that doesn't move as well (eg the tunneller) more heavily than the stuff that does (dropship)

Vermonter they've said GCPS and Plague share vehicles it's also possible that the Rebs use these vehicles the Plague list has a Dropship that is not the same as the Enforcer one so it is possible to do a Dropship and a Tank kit in HIPS for GCPS/Plague/Rebs as it covers more than 1 army so technically it's still 1 vehicle per army it's just that they can be shared I guess it's all about how far they can push the funding

I went and took a look at KoW models, they seem to be costed by manufacturing cost, not by in-game effectiveness. 20 HIPS figures are 15 quid, be they Elf or Dwarf or Goblin.

 DaveC wrote:
Vermonter they've said GCPS and Plague share vehicles it's also possible that the Rebs use these vehicles the Plague list has a Dropship that is not the same as the Enforcer one so it is possible to do a Dropship and a Tank kit in HIPS for GCPS/Plague/Rebs as it covers more than 1 army so technically it's still 1 vehicle per army it's just that they can be shared I guess it's all about how far they can push the funding

Sounds good, then. If I were Mantic I'd seriously consider doing the GCPS tank and their military-styled dropship, just because there's likely to be a very large market for both. As MLaw said, here's to hoping!

Or to hoping that the final vehicle sculpts are terrible, so I won't be tempted to add them to my pledge and make my final tally even worse than Deadzone 1 was.

I like what I just heard. Plague get hp tank or drop ship, GCPS get hard plastic dropship or tank. Either initially or after another short stretch goal, each becomes compatible with the other force.. SYNERGY!

 lord_blackfang wrote:
At a glance, they seem to all require about the same amount of sprue space, so they should cost the same. Maybe the ones that are shared by several faction might cost a bit less because they'll sell more?

This is assuming they don't price them at retail based on power in game or popularity of kit.

EDIT: Making it Plague is essentially like making a GW kit Chaos or Dark Angel, it's just an upgrade sprue away really.

Any possibility that they might do a vehicle "sampler" bundle? Like, instead of 3 of a specific faction vehicle, they give you a choice of three vehicles? I wouldn't mind getting the dropship, FF tank, and Asterian tank, but as they are now, there's no real discount if you want a variety.

I'm hoping they do some kind of 'get em all' pledge, or bundle...or something. I don't need three of anything either. I mean... I could probably use three of several things, but I'm mostly interested in painting, and I'd prefer to paint one of each.

 Barzam wrote:
Any possibility that they might do a vehicle "sampler" bundle? Like, instead of 3 of a specific faction vehicle, they give you a choice of three vehicles? I wouldn't mind getting the dropship, FF tank, and Asterian tank, but as they are now, there's no real discount if you want a variety.

They keep getting asked this, as it is the obvious question to ask. So far they've always answered "no."

I won't be upgrading to any mega pledges that involve getting more army forces or "3 of the same kind" vehicles, myself. I'm not even sure I'll keep the early bird pledge I currently have, because as a Deadzone veteran and skirmish shopper, I can't really justify getting any of the army forces or vehicle deals. Too much repetition, not enough application unless you're going in for Warpath itself. A resin Blaine doing whatever won't sway me, either.

Not quite the same thing as saying "I'll pull my pledge" in my case, as I'll stay in regardless to get the add-on deals on new HIPs troops. With no deals in sight, vehicles are a question mark in terms of how many I'll buy individually. I'd only want one of each, tops.

 GrimDork wrote:
I'm hoping they do some kind of 'get em all' pledge, or bundle...or something. I don't need three of anything either. I mean... I could probably use three of several things, but I'm mostly interested in painting, and I'd prefer to paint one of each.

yeah, I want my Lockdown.

I'm kinda at the point of wanting Avengers/Iron Man vs Ultron (see my Deadzone paint schemes)...and I'm considering now an Asterian battle group (Ultron), an Enforcer drop ship group, and an Asterian vehicle group when it hits. So...at $300 in wants now.

The thing that puts me of the Asterians is the round circular 'eye' - I would have been up for something more Cylon-ey myself.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I went and took a look at KoW models, they seem to be costed by manufacturing cost, not by in-game effectiveness. 20 HIPS figures are 15 quid, be they Elf or Dwarf or Goblin.

Manufacturing cost of the mould, rather than the sprue, hard plastic sprues come in at a few cents difference no matter the size or density, because the plastic itself is cheap, the production is entirely automated, and the machines can spit out tens of thousands of sprues a day. The cost comes from working out how many you anticipate selling versus how much the mould cost to create - the larger and more complicated the mould, the more costly machine and specialist time is required to carve it out of the block of steel.

I really like those Asterian drones compared to the butt-ugly Cyphers. So far Mantics HIPS kits, space rats aside, have been really great design wise. Way better than the restic stuff.

I haven't really been paying close attention to this one because it is all rather underwhelming for me.

I'd love a Space Dwarf army, but something about what's offered so far...

Still, it is still hard to believe that this one is performing at the pace it is:




Many of us really did envision this as a serious contender for 40K and GW.

9 days in (12 to go), I thought we'd be WAY past $250K.

I'm not even sure a Brian Blessed miniature could get this thing moving faster now!

Yeah it's been pretty stagnant.

Tomorrow's add-on wednesday is supposed to be terrain heavy, maybe that will help.

I think a big part of the problem is Mantic's timing. People have been asking for this for years, and when they finally get around to it, they took so long that interest has waned significantly. on top of that, they just kind of threw this campaign out without any real promotional support. Then there's the fact that most of what they're offering, people already purchased in DZ2. had they done this campaign before DZ2, I think there would have been significantly more interest and it would be doing wat better.

I think a lot of us also expected that Mantic would at least know what the rules for Warpath were going to look like before they jumped into its Kickstarter. WP: Firefight is supposed to be the best 40k equivalent, and at best it is a giant question mark right now. Warpath proper is also still in a quantum state of "TLOS/No-TLOS" and "Multibasing/Hubs" to figure out.

This Kickstarter is still outperforming the WHFB-killing KoW2, but that was part opportunity and part rule iteration and balance. Warpath doesn't have the latter, and if they get the former again then I'm letting Ronnie buy all my lottery tickets from here on out. Combine people being burned by Mantic in various ways in the past on various things (some of which have been fixed, but that doesn't change the trust dynamic), a lack of solid rules to say "This is the 40k-killer!", and the place that Kickstarter has seemingly established for board gaming audiences and not wargaming audiences and I'm not sure anything is going to make this a million dollar kickstarter. I also don't think it seems like Mantic expected it to be, and with the rumors that this could be the last core Mantic line on kickstarter maybe they just wanted to fund what they could now and get Warpath out in some real form to let it gain traction there as opposed to trying to create the biggest Kickstarter of all time.

 Alpharius wrote:


Many of us really did envision this as a serious contender for 40K and GW.

Are you kidding?

GW in its currently diminished state is 120 Million GBP in Revenue per year, or about 180 Million USD. That is half a million dollar every single day of the year, sundays, christmas, everything.

All Mantic Kickstarters in the history of the company since 2012, maybe about 5 Million USD, don't add up to a even 2 weeks of GW, and thus probably to less than a week of a big seller like a Knight or a big Tau suit. When GW releases the Tau starting next week for 3-4 weeks, they'll make more money of that than Mantic in its entire history.

A "serious contender" to 40K at a Kickstarter-launch would be high triple-figure millions minimum.

 Barzam wrote:
Then there's the fact that most of what they're offering, people already purchased in DZ2. had they done this campaign before DZ2, I think there would have been significantly more interest and it would be doing wat better.

I think this aspect is really hurting them. I know they'd like to run this like KOW 2 with army deals alone and are resistant to adding value to the base pledges a la Deadzone, but I think slowing interest is going to back them into a corner. Hard sells like limiting ship bundles to 3 of the same kind, or refusing to do any pledges based on new stuff alone, may make the KS pledges easier to pack and ship, but there is zero benefit to the customer, and right now customers are voting with their money. If it's supposed to encourage skirmish players uninterested in Warpath to spend more and pick it up anyway to get better deals, how is that strategy working out?

Wonderwolf wrote:

GW in its currently diminished state is 120 Million GBP in Revenue per year, or about 180 Million USD. That is half a million dollar every single day of the year, sundays, christmas, everything.

And once upon a time, it wasn't.

Everyone starts somewhere.

 insaniak wrote:

Wonderwolf wrote:

GW in its currently diminished state is 120 Million GBP in Revenue per year, or about 180 Million USD. That is half a million dollar every single day of the year, sundays, christmas, everything.

And once upon a time, it wasn't.

Everyone starts somewhere.

Sure.

5-10 years down the road, it may be. But to believe this Warpath-Kickstarter would make it that contender is foolish.

 insaniak wrote:

Wonderwolf wrote:

GW in its currently diminished state is 120 Million GBP in Revenue per year, or about 180 Million USD. That is half a million dollar every single day of the year, sundays, christmas, everything.

And once upon a time, it wasn't.

Everyone starts somewhere.

And not only that, but I was speaking more of in the 'game to replace 40K for many' sense, not the "it was going to make $180 Million in this Kickstarter" sense...

 Alpharius wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Wonderwolf wrote:

GW in its currently diminished state is 120 Million GBP in Revenue per year, or about 180 Million USD. That is half a million dollar every single day of the year, sundays, christmas, everything.

And once upon a time, it wasn't.

Everyone starts somewhere.

And not only that, but I was speaking more of in the 'game to replace 40K for many' sense, not the "it was going to make $180 Million in this Kickstarter" sense...

But your earlier post suggested that the current performance somehow dashed that hope? What would you have expected this Kickstarter to achieve, to be that replacement in the sense you were speaking of?

You posted Kicktraq stats, so clearly we were talking money, no?

200.000 USD or 20.000.000 USD don't really make any difference against that particular benchmark.

Really?

Because the more people that back this would mean it would be easier to find a game of WARPATH somewhere near me.

Also, why so aggressive?

I know it is the Internet and all, but maybe dial back the aggression a bit?

 Alpharius wrote:
Really?

Because the more people that back this would mean it would be easier to find a game of WARPATH somewhere near me.

Also, why so aggressive?

I know it is the Internet and all, but maybe dial back the aggression a bit?

Well, I am just asking. 250.000 is pretty successful.

Why (if) is it a "failure" in your eyes?

If it is a failure because it somehow didn't achieve the "serious contender"-status, what would've been necessary to achieve that?

I don't think he's saying it's a failure. Simply that he expected it to be bigger.

I guess one question is, why do people need to back it to play Warpath? If it's the 40K alternative, and you already have a 40K army, then you don't need to buy a Warpath army. If Mantic is going to post the rules online for free eventually, then you don't need to buy the rules, either. So why would the average disillusioned 40K player need to back the project?