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I recently bought 2 DV starter sets since I was interested in starting both CSM and DA, but I was wondering what you guys think would be the best loadout for them, and what are some critical units. My 'theme' for the army is mostly Deathwing, suddenly changing the tide of battle with a planned droppod/deepstrike force supplemented with bikers, that's the end result i'm hoping for eventually. Preferably also using that formation to allow me to fire overwatch at full BS (My meta is assault heavy)

Currently, since the DV has no customisation options, i have them kitted out stock as they come from the box, but will be proxing for 2 5man squads of TH/SS termies, gravgun tac squads and my 6 bikers have grav weapons.
Any advice on DA is appreciated, as this is my first main non-xenos army I may miss out on basic rules. Thanks!

You're about right with that.
Problem is DW Termies pay for twin-linked shots on the turn they DS, so getting a heavy weapon in there is nice. Especially if you can get them not to scatter - that heavy flamer can hurt stuff. Otherwise Tactical Terminators still suck, but we can mix 'em - still too expensive though.
Depending on what you want to do with them, Deathwing Knights are a "good" option too. Just be aware that ALL kinds of Terminators are on the low end of the power scale.

Ravenwing absolutely NEED a Darkshroud, better 2. That with Black Knights is your Deathstar of the Codex.
Otherwise - regular bikers are best of with Grav Guns as you said. If you can add some Land Speeders with heavy bolters and/or Assault Cannons you have a pretty potent "Do not assault within 24" while being able to assault with impunity.

Greenwing is all about the Lion's blade, the full overwatch and the free transports. Getting all 3 Wings together is very expensive points-wise, but the fast bulk should be Greenwing and Ravenwing. Deathwing got the shaft with this dex again.

For full BS overwatch, you'll need to have the Lion's Blade Detachment - which is a kind of super-formation, made by other formations.

FIrst, you'll need a Battle Demi-company. After that, you'll be able to field a Ravenwing Attack Squadron formation (up to 6 bikes in 1 unit, a single landspeeder in other unit) and a Deathwing Redemption force (1 HQ able to get terminator armour and 2 deathwing terminator units). Doing that, everyone will fire their ovewatch at bs full.

 Thairne wrote:
You're about right with that.
Problem is DW Termies pay for twin-linked shots on the turn they DS, so getting a heavy weapon in there is nice. Especially if you can get them not to scatter - that heavy flamer can hurt stuff. Otherwise Tactical Terminators still suck, but we can mix 'em - still too expensive though.
Depending on what you want to do with them, Deathwing Knights are a "good" option too. Just be aware that ALL kinds of Terminators are on the low end of the power scale.

Ravenwing absolutely NEED a Darkshroud, better 2. That with Black Knights is your Deathstar of the Codex.
Otherwise - regular bikers are best of with Grav Guns as you said. If you can add some Land Speeders with heavy bolters and/or Assault Cannons you have a pretty potent "Do not assault within 24" while being able to assault with impunity.

Greenwing is all about the Lion's blade, the full overwatch and the free transports. Getting all 3 Wings together is very expensive points-wise, but the fast bulk should be Greenwing and Ravenwing. Deathwing got the shaft with this dex again.

Isn't the twin linked after DS a formation bonus though? I have 2 assault cannons (i think thats the name) modeled on so maybe using those for some 4-shot-rending goodness might be useful. Also whats this 'greenwing' I keep hearing about it but I must be missing it in the codex?

How are the Deathwing knights, I love medieval stuff and something just makes me smile thinking about high-tech space dudes smashing people with maces.

Greenwing is a colloquial term for your Standard DA marines, which are green, unlike bone deathwing or black ravenwing.

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Isn't the twin linked after DS a formation bonus though?

It's a bonus built into DA Terminator Armour (page 154).

 Vector Strike wrote:
FIrst, you'll need a Battle Demi-company.

Isn't it two of those for full BS Overwatch and free DTs?

 CrashGordon94 wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:
FIrst, you'll need a Battle Demi-company.

Isn't it two of those for full BS Overwatch and free DTs?

Nope, the 'mega formation' gets you the full BS overwatch, if you take two demicompanys then you get the free transports

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
/quote]
How are the Deathwing knights, I love medieval stuff and something just makes me smile thinking about high-tech space dudes smashing people with maces.

They suffer from the same problem as all assault termies... very expensive delivery and high cost for what they do.
But if you, say, get the Warlord trait and the Interomancypower to give them Rage and Furious Charge they can and will wipe out pretty much anything with Ap3 or worse.
So overall, they're ok, but too expensive for what they do. Again.

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 CrashGordon94 wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:
FIrst, you'll need a Battle Demi-company.

Isn't it two of those for full BS Overwatch and free DTs?

Nope, the 'mega formation' gets you the full BS overwatch, if you take two demicompanys then you get the free transports

I thought it was only BS3 Overwatch with one Demi-Company?

Nope, Full BS Overwatch is a advantage of The Lion's Blade Detachment itself, not relevant on how or what it contains.
Demi Company gives you BS3 Overwatch if you take it alone.
For the price of a single Scout squad however...

 Thairne wrote:
Nope, Full BS Overwatch is a advantage of The Lion's Blade Detachment itself, not relevant on how or what it contains.
Demi Company gives you BS3 Overwatch if you take it alone.
For the price of a single Scout squad however...

Nope, you are wrong. It is BS3 for a BDC, full BS for a full Lion's Blade Strike Force.

To be specific, a Battle Demi-Company alone gains Fire Discipline. A full Lion's Blade gains Supreme Fire Discipline. It is the same thing with the the Gladius Strike Force giving you just the Tactical Doctrine for just a BDC, and the Tactical/Assault/Devastator Doctrines for the full Gladius Strike Force.

This is exactly what I said, isn't it?
Lions Blade = Full BS
BDC = BS + 1 and Grim Resolve

 Thairne wrote:
This is exactly what I said, isn't it?
Lions Blade = Full BS
BDC = BS + 1 and Grim Resolve

Durr, misread what you said. Sorry!

I don't see how that's countering what I said, all I was saying was the single BDC doesn't give full BS Overwatch, you need 2 (and the other stuff).

 CrashGordon94 wrote:
I don't see how that's countering what I said, all I was saying was the single BDC doesn't give full BS Overwatch, you need 2 (and the other stuff).

You don't need two BDC to get full ballistic overwatch, you need one plus one auxiliary. The BDC and an auxiliary constitutes a lions blade detachment which is what grants full BS overwatch. If you take two BDC, one lead by a company master and one lead by a chaplain, plus an auxiliary then you get free transports in addition to full BS overwatch. So if you take a BDC and like a unit of scouts you get the full BS overwatch. The only catch is that Inner Circle doesn't count as an auxiliary, the other formations do. See pages 94-95 of the DA codex.

It's pretty simple:

1. Any unit in the Dark Angels Faction with the Grim Resolve special rule overwatches at BS2 - no matter if it's in a formation, CAD, unbound, etc.

2. A Battle Demi-company allows all models from this formation to fire Overwatch at BS3. Any other formation, CAD or whatever outside it keeps overwatching at BS2.

3. If you field a Lion's Blade Detachment, you'll need at least 1 Battle Demi-company and 1 auxiliary option. If you do that, everyone inside the Lion's Blade will get Supreme Fire Discipline, which allows them to fire Overwatch at full BS. There is no need for 2 Battle Demi-companies, as Supreme Fire Discipline is a rule outside the Company Support rule.

So, an army composed of a CAD, a Lion's Blade Detachment, a separate Battle Demi-company and a Deathwing Strike Force will overwatch as follows:
1. CAD models: BS2
2. Lion's Blade: BS full
3. Separate Battle Demi-company: BS3
4. Deathwing Strike Force: BS2

 Thairne wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
/quote]
How are the Deathwing knights, I love medieval stuff and something just makes me smile thinking about high-tech space dudes smashing people with maces.

They suffer from the same problem as all assault termies... very expensive delivery and high cost for what they do.
But if you, say, get the Warlord trait and the Interomancypower to give them Rage and Furious Charge they can and will wipe out pretty much anything with Ap3 or worse.
So overall, they're ok, but too expensive for what they do. Again.

Deathwing Knights are awesome, but generally should only be run in a CAD or with Ravenwing support, as a bad scatter can ruin their day (they are slow since they are on foot). In a CAD, they can take a Land Raider as a DT (I think they may also be able to in a Deathwing Strike Force, but everything in that detachment must deep strike, which may mean Deep Striking Land Raiders, hmmm...), which makes a superb delivery vehicle for them. You can form a sort of deathstar with them if you put Ezekiel and an Interrogator-Chaplain with them. Zeke gives them +1 attack, and the Interrogator lets them reroll hits in the first round of combat. Nasty.

Very good tip! I just love the looks of them, and terminators in general. I have 6 bikers already and the plan is for me to have them on the board then have the deathwings drop in and hit them hard where I need them. land raider might be nice though for more on-board presence.... then again bikes + the skimmers DA have mean they are pretty tough!

If you are running green wing, take a lions blade detachment. Ravenwing is the RWSF, unless you want to do super speeders, then there is a formation for that. and if you want to run Deathwing, play Grey Knights.

 Crazyterran wrote:
If you are running green wing, take a lions blade detachment. Ravenwing is the RWSF, unless you want to do super speeders, then there is a formation for that. and if you want to run Deathwing, play Grey Knights.

Orrrrrr, I could play something I actually like the aesthetics and playstyle of instead.

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
If you are running green wing, take a lions blade detachment. Ravenwing is the RWSF, unless you want to do super speeders, then there is a formation for that. and if you want to run Deathwing, play Grey Knights.

Orrrrrr, I could play something I actually like the aesthetics and playstyle of instead.

You could always just play Grey Knights using the Deathwing models, but I doubt that would actually work.

Deathwing work best with either the Greenwing or Ravenwing spearheading, then the DW coming in like a boss on T2 and tearing stuff up. A CAD or LBSF with the Deathwing formation are probably the best way to get them on the board. Technically, one can null deploy a Deathwing Strike Force with some Deathwing Dreadnoughts in Drop Pods to ensure you don't auto-lose, but a Mixedwing army is a better option, IMO.

Plus those Teleport Homers come in REAL handy, it seems!

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
If you are running green wing, take a lions blade detachment. Ravenwing is the RWSF, unless you want to do super speeders, then there is a formation for that. and if you want to run Deathwing, play Grey Knights.

Orrrrrr, I could play something I actually like the aesthetics and playstyle of instead.

You could always just play Grey Knights using the Deathwing models, but I doubt that would actually work.

Deathwing work best with either the Greenwing or Ravenwing spearheading, then the DW coming in like a boss on T2 and tearing stuff up. A CAD or LBSF with the Deathwing formation are probably the best way to get them on the board. Technically, one can null deploy a Deathwing Strike Force with some Deathwing Dreadnoughts in Drop Pods to ensure you don't auto-lose, but a Mixedwing army is a better option, IMO.

Yeah that's what I have been saying, having my ravenguard bikes on table while my deathwing come in where needed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Plus, if I wanted to play GK's I would have boughten them. I already have a pretty dang good winrate with my other armys so I don't care too much if DA's are not the best, I love the theme.