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The baleflamer becomes Str 6 AP -3 (that's negative 3). This actually grants the target a 3+ armor save if it doesn't already have one. If the target already has a 3+ or better it gains Feel No Pain instead. If it already has Feel No Pain the Heldrake gets frustrated and shoots the nearest friendly unit instead (resolved at Str D AP1) and then explodes. Chaos is fickle!

 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
The baleflamer becomes Str 6 AP -3 (that's negative 3). This actually grants the target a 3+ armor save if it doesn't already have one. If the target already has a 3+ or better it gains Feel No Pain instead. If it already has Feel No Pain the Heldrake gets frustrated and shoots the nearest friendly unit instead (resolved at Str D AP1) and then explodes. Chaos is fickle!

This is why you need to go sit in a corner

The Decurion-style special formations will have 2 max units of Mutilators as a mandatory choice.

This formation will be the only way to access Heldrakes, which must be bought together with 2 units of Warp Talons

Sorcerors can no longer get bikes.

Every time you fail a Reserve Roll you must roll on the Deep Strike Mishap table. 1-3 gives you a Lost in the Warp result.

GrafWattenburg wrote:
The Decurion-style special formations will have 2 max units of Mutilators as a mandatory choice.

This formation will be the only way to access Heldrakes, which must be bought together with 2 units of Warp Talons

Sorcerors can no longer get bikes.

Every time you fail a Reserve Roll you must roll on the Deep Strike Mishap table. 1-3 gives you a Lost in the Warp result.

Decurian style formation for real would be called a Cult horde.

1 Sorcerer or Dark Apostle (who now gets steeds, bikes and jump packs)
3 units of cultists
1 unit of Spawn
1 Defiler

Side add ons:

Hell-Command
1 lord (or named character)
2 units of Chosen
All get perferred enemy (something)

Warp Hunters
2 units of Raptors or Bikers (can be 1 unit of both)
1 Heldrake
0-1 Warp Talons (who are good now)

Feel free to keep including stuff

The new CSM dex gets the Tau treatment and a few bigger dino bots with zero utility or synergy get released. True story!

After seeing the unevitable success of the "new" Tau Codex, GW will decide to repeat the process with Chaos too. However, Chaos is indeed fickle, and thankfully to a series of weird accidents, the design team will rehash the 3.5 dex and not the 5.0 one.

BUT. The design team is a lazy bunch as we all know, so they won't really bother to bring the 3.5 dex up to 7th edition standards, and the new codex will be full with strange sh*t:
- The vehicles will lack a HP characteristic. There will be just an 'Err' instead of their HP value.
- The dinobots will be left out as they did not exist in the 3.5th dex. However, they will be present in the modelling section, causing quite a lot of confusion.
- Similarly, neither the Warp Talons nor the Vindicators will have datasheets, but they will have Legion-specific rules and from the sound of it, both the Night Lord Warp Talons and the Iron Warrior Vindicators would be super-cool... if they were actually in the codex.
- Daemons will be in, but their rules will be an incomprehensible mish-mash of 3.5 and DoC stuff.
- Both the Warpsmith and the Dark Apostle will find a way into the codex, but oddly enough, they won't have entries in their Legions... to the point where their rules will repeat themselves 1:1 at those legions as random upgrades.
- There will be two completely different Cultists entries: one normal and one for the Alpha Legion. Sever rules and wargear options will refer to the Cultists... but none will specify which Cultist unit can benefit from the rule/wargear.
- Daemons will be able to charge after DS, but thankfully to a badly worded Daemon Summoning special rule, they will also lose the ability to actually Deep Strike.
- The Champions of Chaos special rule will be in, but no model in the whole codex will have the rule.

Inspired by the fame and free press that Martin Shkreli received, GW does not change any of their old kits but raises the price in both points and money of everything by around 5000%. They claim this is for the development of new models.

If we're actually wishlisting:

Squadrons for predators and Helbrutes.

Plastic Dreadclaw Drop Pods. Or just give us regular drop pods!

Get rid of the god specific psychic powers. If I put a mark of Tzeentch on my sorceror or Daemon Prince, then I'm stuck with at least 1 gakky Psychic Power. Bleh.

Make CSM either Fearless or a variant of ATSKNF.

I'd be happy with just that, honestly. We'll see what the formations look like.

After seeing the unevitable success of the "new" Tau Codex, GW will decide to repeat the process with Chaos too. However, Chaos is indeed fickle, and thankfully to a series of weird accidents, the design team will rehash the 3.5 dex and not the 5.0 one.

BUT. The design team is a lazy bunch as we all know, so they won't really bother to bring the 3.5 dex up to 7th edition standards, and the new codex will be full with strange sh*t:
- The vehicles will lack a HP characteristic. There will be just an 'Err' instead of their HP value.
- The dinobots will be left out as they did not exist in the 3.5th dex. However, they will be present in the modelling section, causing quite a lot of confusion.
- Similarly, neither the Warp Talons nor the Vindicators will have datasheets, but they will have Legion-specific rules and from the sound of it, both the Night Lord Warp Talons and the Iron Warrior Vindicators would be super-cool... if they were actually in the codex.
- Daemons will be in, but their rules will be an incomprehensible mish-mash of 3.5 and DoC stuff.
- Both the Warpsmith and the Dark Apostle will find a way into the codex, but oddly enough, they won't have entries in their Legions... to the point where their rules will repeat themselves 1:1 at those legions as random upgrades.
- There will be two completely different Cultists entries: one normal and one for the Alpha Legion. Sever rules and wargear options will refer to the Cultists... but none will specify which Cultist unit can benefit from the rule/wargear.
- Daemons will be able to charge after DS, but thankfully to a badly worded Daemon Summoning special rule, they will also lose the ability to actually Deep Strike.
- The Champions of Chaos special rule will be in, but no model in the whole codex will have the rule.

Exalted. Of everything posted so far, the above quote is probably one of the more likely scenarios.

On a more serious note, my guess:

The Decurion formation will be based around the Black Legion and require the Black Legion supplement to use.
Their will be an additional formation requiring about 100-150 cultists that will give you access to something completely off the wall (like a Chaos Warhound)
Mutilators, Warp Talons, 'Smiths and Apostles will still suck
Possible smaller formations that grant something akin to the "Legion Rules" we've been asking for

 kronk wrote:
If we're actually wishlisting:

Squadrons for predators and Helbrutes.

Plastic Dreadclaw Drop Pods. Or just give us regular drop pods!

Get rid of the god specific psychic powers. If I put a mark of Tzeentch on my sorceror or Daemon Prince, then I'm stuck with at least 1 gakky Psychic Power. Bleh.

Make CSM either Fearless or a variant of ATSKNF.

I'd be happy with just that, honestly. We'll see what the formations look like.

Roite, ima show you how wishlisting is done m8:

Chaos Lords become useful. how?

-Take SM captain
-Rename everything to something chaos-y
-add special rule

The special rule is as follows:

Totally seriously you guys. The CSM decurion will require Possessed. Mark my words. And their rules will be the exact same garbarge they are now.

 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
The baleflamer becomes Str 6 AP -3 (that's negative 3). This actually grants the target a 3+ armor save if it doesn't already have one. If the target already has a 3+ or better it gains Feel No Pain instead. If it already has Feel No Pain the Heldrake gets frustrated and shoots the nearest friendly unit instead (resolved at Str D AP1) and then explodes. Chaos is fickle!

Ummm... AP-3 would ignore all Armor Saves and confer a +6 on the vehicle damage table...
Pen something and it's guaranteed to kaboom!

 Selym wrote:
Roite, ima show you how wishlisting is done m8:

Was that English? What does that mean?

As to your spoilered text, I thought I was clear that I was moving way from silly/stupid comments and into reasonable wishlisting to make the CSM competitive.

Perhaps I wasn't clear and the fault was mine.

 kronk wrote:

 Selym wrote:
Roite, ima show you how wishlisting is done m8:

Was that English? What does that mean?

As to your spoilered text, I thought I was clear that I was moving way from silly/stupid comments and into reasonable wishlisting to make the CSM competitive.

Perhaps I wasn't clear and the fault was mine.

Reasonable no longer works in 40k. Still, I didn't think my idea was too OTT.

What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

Make Obliterators 60 points and they choose their range and melee weapons each turn?
That'd be something cool I guess.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

Make Obliterators 60 points and they choose their range and melee weapons each turn?
That'd be something cool I guess.

And can choose the same weapon within consecutive turns as well.

Experiment 626 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

Make Obliterators 60 points and they choose their range and melee weapons each turn?
That'd be something cool I guess.

And can choose the same weapon within consecutive turns as well.

Does your guy want double chainfists and TL meltaguns? You can do it! Do you want him to have fleet? WE WILL GIVE YOU THAT TOO!!!!!

The Formation will probably be based off the Black Crusade.
1-3 HQS
1-8 CSM or Cult troops
0-8 Cultists
1-4 Elites
0-4 Fast
0-3 Heavy ( just because)

Benefits? The old Mark of Chaos Undivided, for LD rerolls, maybe Hatred (Imperium), gives a reliable Deepstrike

The Chaos Apocalypse formations are pretty cool actually, and is a step in the right direction.

A Spawn tide, Heldrake Fear squad, Obliterator formations, some Uber expensive One of Each God aligned Super Deathstar, hopefully a Sorcerer Conclave.

 CrashGordon94 wrote:

 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
The baleflamer becomes Str 6 AP -3 (that's negative 3). This actually grants the target a 3+ armor save if it doesn't already have one. If the target already has a 3+ or better it gains Feel No Pain instead. If it already has Feel No Pain the Heldrake gets frustrated and shoots the nearest friendly unit instead (resolved at Str D AP1) and then explodes. Chaos is fickle!

Ummm... AP-3 would ignore all Armor Saves and confer a +6 on the vehicle damage table...
Pen something and it's guaranteed to kaboom!

OK wiseguy now it's AP 3i! Ya like that? That's 3 times the square root of negative 1! And not only does it do all that stuff I said before, now it makes your whole army suffer Perils of the Warp and Kaldor Draigo deep strikes and immediately assaults your warlord! Happy now? That's what you get for making me do maths! This is GW - GW don't do maths!

Codex-wide nerfs. Cult troops become worse somehow. Hellturkey changed to fast skimmer instead of flying. 5-10 pt increase throughout the board.

We are not living in the post-eldar slump. Can't have eldar players thinking too hard to table you.

 Tactical_Spam wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

Make Obliterators 60 points and they choose their range and melee weapons each turn?
That'd be something cool I guess.

And can choose the same weapon within consecutive turns as well.

Does your guy want double chainfists and TL meltaguns? You can do it! Do you want him to have fleet? WE WILL GIVE YOU THAT TOO!!!!!

Fleet doesn't make much sense.

I think the Daemonhood/Spawnhood should be changed.

What if when you lose your last wound in
a Challenge, that's when you can roll (a d6) to see if you've become a Spawn.

Which would actually make turning into a Spawn (still non-scoring, counts as a casualty) kind if a fun reward/punishment.

Daemonhood would be earned by "Bloodlust" which increases with unsaved wounds earned throughout the game. Something like after 10 wounds, you can roll a d6.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tactical_Spam wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
What if they combined Mutilators and Obliterators into one model?

Make Obliterators 60 points and they choose their range and melee weapons each turn?
That'd be something cool I guess.

And can choose the same weapon within consecutive turns as well.

Does your guy want double chainfists and TL meltaguns? You can do it! Do you want him to have fleet? WE WILL GIVE YOU THAT TOO!!!!!

Fleet doesn't make much sense.

Neither did the Gargantuant creatures like the KX139 Tau'nar Supremacy Armour.
, but alas, the rule monkeys at GW are bad at life

Daemons had nowhere to go but up... They found a way to feth us Daemon players too..

Let's remove EW from all our models stave for Skull Taker whom no one takes, make our DPs cost as much as a cheap LoW at 350 points, and still die to smash attacks from WS2 Riptides.

Remove the ability to have good elite, flexible high toughness elites and need our troops into utter WC batteries and that's all.

While we're at it, don't forget to bend over those faithful Daemon players by introducing Daemon Factory in the BRB so that in order to compete with subpar highly expensive models they need to invest in MORE of said expensive modles that are high costed

GW doesn't care.

We will get items or units that are expensive, rather fancy, but but ultimately superfluous in every way.

That is it.

I suspect the LoS is due a debuff, due to being overpowered.

One sentence would fix the lot.

Page 32 reads "All vehicles, fliers, units and army lists available in Imperial Armour 13 are hereby incorporated into this codex mutatis mutandis."

Now shush whingeing and get back to beating yourself with a cat of nine tails like any self respecting CSM player! Or is that just me

I'm hoping they give us something similar to Blood Points. Not sure if killing things is the appropriate way to gain them, but let's suppose it is for now.

We murder things, get Chaos Points, trade them for boons from the Chaos gods. It could be a giant table of stuff to pick from like that Khorne Daemonkin list... or it can be...

Spend a Chaos Point = Roll on the Chaos Boon list

Now it's a game of Chaos Roulette. How far will you test your luck? Will you give that Cultist Champion 6 chances to roll for a Daemon Prince transformation? Will you risk Abaddon the Despoiler becoming a Chaos Spawn for the chance to get re-rollable armor saves? Will you pray to Tzeentch that your Sorcerer gets lucky 64 and emerges a god among men?

That would be very fun

CSM Blood Points, Chaos Lord army buffs and full access to IA:13 would be a great start to a new codex