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Please just remove Champikn if Chaos and Boon table, and Possessed table and Spawn table. Just remove all the random rolls.

 Filch wrote:
Please just remove Champikn if Chaos and Boon table, and Possessed table and Spawn table. Just remove all the random rolls.

But it's super fun when Abaddon and Typhus get spawndom!

#FethThat

 GoliothOnline wrote:
Daemons had nowhere to go but up... They found a way to feth us Daemon players too..

Let's remove EW from all our models stave for Skull Taker whom no one takes, make our DPs cost as much as a cheap LoW at 350 points, and still die to smash attacks from WS2 Riptides.

Remove the ability to have good elite, flexible high toughness elites and need our troops into utter WC batteries and that's all.

While we're at it, don't forget to bend over those faithful Daemon players by introducing Daemon Factory in the BRB so that in order to compete with subpar highly expensive models they need to invest in MORE of said expensive modles that are high costed

GW doesn't care.

Daemons are still pretty solid vs. the pre-Necron age books. I can compete just fine with mono-Tzeentch vs. non-Decurion and/or formation heavy armies fine, without resorting to clown car or obnoxious gak like re-rolled 2++.
The Lord of Change is easily the single best combat beast in the book, bar the Str.D 'Thirster.

Agreed that our Princes are now on the level of fecal matter... But then, they were costed for an edition that was super friendly to FMC's. 7th alone nerfed the crap out of them, and the newer books from Necron and on just laugh at how overcosted these guys are.

Daemonettes are amazing for their cost - they make Tyranid & Wych Cult players jealous. Plaguebearers are still decent Obsec units, though Horrors are probably slightly better now with the insanity that is the new Tau.
Even Bloodletters aren't so bad... Deep Strike them off some Icons and let them rip apart all those foolish Marine players who've gone Grav-happy.

Flamers are gross in large numbers. Fiends with Herald support aren't too shabby either, especially if you've used your FA slots on Hounds and/or Screamers.

Both the FA & Heavy sections are still gold mines... Seekers, Hounds, Screamers, Drones, Grinders... Even the Khannon is useful in the right list.


For a 6th edition book, it's still holding its own on the whole. Something that cannot ever be said about our poor CSM's, who were "competitive" (and I use that word loosely), for all of maybe 5 months before Daemons & especially Tau got their 6th ed books.

Well, I hope that CSM players will not get disappointed.
In the past, CSM had a marvellous codex during the 3rd edition.
The next one was absolutely disappointing and the latest is just a bit better but still not convincing.
Hope for the best.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I hope that CSM players will not get disappointed.
In the past, CSM had a marvellous codex during the 3rd edition.
The next one was absolutely disappointing and the latest is just a bit better but still not convincing.
Hope for the best.

3.5 was an accident. One that apparently we're still paying for, simply for having the sheer audacity to compete with and actually beat Loyalist Marine players.

 Selym wrote:

 Filch wrote:
Please just remove Champikn if Chaos and Boon table, and Possessed table and Spawn table. Just remove all the random rolls.

But it's super fun when Abaddon and Typhus get spawndom!

#FethThat

That's cool and all but it is a lot better when they get Daemonhood, the greatest gift of chaos... to strip them from their armor, weapons, invul saves, and throw them out of their units.

Abandon is immune to spawn and daemonhood results...

Not anymore!

Intercessor wrote:
Abandon is immune to spawn and daemonhood results...

6E had an FAQ that made him immune. It no longer exists, however.

New army wide special rule: 'And They Shall Know No Fairness'

Units with this special rule are never meant to play against any opponent on anything resembling an even level. Before the first game turn, your opponent may simply choose which units they feel could potentially inflict any form of damage against their own army, and remove those unit(s) from the game & claim D6 VP's for each removed in this fashion.

Just to throw this out there:

Honestly there has been rumours of a new Chaos codex either of tzeentch or csm for over 8 months now.

With the success of the kdk codex which in all honesty barely tried, I think gw finally noticed how desperate csm players are for new stuff, and maybe they decided to pull the next release and put a serious effort into the line once again.

At least I hope that this is what happened.

In big corps like gw its not uncommon to push projects that need more time and attention back and to push easier ones forward like tau.

Rule wise who knows what they are cooking up but after the leaked tzeentch formation for sorcerers came out and how everyone bashed how bad the formation was maybe gw decided to go back to the drawing board.

All the Warlord Traits are Fear!

> Leaked Tzeentch formation. When + where? I need to see that

> GW listening to feedback. Nah. I doubt it. They probably made it worse.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
All the Warlord Traits are Fear!

Yaaaaay!

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
All the Warlord Traits are Fear!

Nope, even better; All Traits are Fear AND -2Ld to all friendly models because it's super-duper extra scary Fear!

There'll be all this horribad stuff, and then one rule that makes everyone hate us, just to piss us off.

Daemon Princes gain:

Master Of Chaos
This unit has EW, IWND(2+), FnP(2+), 2++ Inv save, causes all enemy units to take a -5 Ld modifier, and is immune to Grav. May also make 2D6 extra attacks in assault, and all non-khorne DP's get an extra 4 Mastery Levels for free.

In all seriousness I'd expect that it'd probably be like Dark Angels, who apparently sucked for ages too.
Things get viable and heavily boosted, likely with some things getting cheesy special and big boosts.
On the other hand some of the fun stuff would be lost, some of the struggling units wouldn't be saved and some rules would be horribly written.

Alternatively it's Tzeentch Daemonkin which works fine like its Khorne counterpart but still leaves Slaanesh, Nurgle and Undivided players in the dust.

 Selym wrote:
> Leaked Tzeentch formation. When + where? I need to see that

> GW listening to feedback. Nah. I doubt it. They probably made it worse.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
All the Warlord Traits are Fear!

Yaaaaay!

Thought that was just a rumour. I'd like to see that as well.

CSM need more than KDK fix. I play KDK and we still have the same high points cost weak units with old weapons you do and no psychic powers (which is cool for fluff but don't help win). yea the blood table is fun with FNP or throwing around a free model But I have not found it to be enough to make it competitive. Things need reworked to keep up. IMO

Grimlineman wrote:
CSM need more than KDK fix. I play KDK and we still have the same high points cost weak units with old weapons you do and no psychic powers (which is cool for fluff but don't help win). yea the blood table is fun with FNP or throwing around a free model But I have not found it to be enough to make it competitive. Things need reworked to keep up. IMO

The only thing that will 'fix' Chaos Marines is a full blown Dark Eldar level re-boot...

The biggest issue is that models drive the rules. Our models are still for the most part 3rd edition hold overs and/or just terrible kits with no viable upgrades to them.

Well unless the codex changes from Nurgle and friends il be sticking with KDK lol. As much as khorne isn't my favorite way to play I'd rather play khorne daemonkin than a book which basically is spam Sorcerors nurgle biker Lords nurgle spawn 5 man plague marine squads in rhinos and nurgle oblits or maulerfiends

Guys I'm probably going to get my friend fired, but he leaked me a picture of the new Abaddon, who is a Lord of War:



In seriousness:

1.) No new weapon options whatsoever, for any unit.
2.) No point reductions whatsoever, for any unit or wargear.
3.) Axe of Blind Fury and the Black Mace removed completely.
4.) Burning Brand of Skalathrax becomes AP: 5 or loses torrent
5.) Spell Familiar removed completely
6.) No more cult units as troops
7.) Heldrake erratum-nerf enshrined in the codex, along with a point increase
8.) Cultists become 6 ppm, Plague Zombies are no longer a thing

Champion of Slaanesh wrote:
Well unless the codex changes from Nurgle and friends il be sticking with KDK lol. As much as khorne isn't my favorite way to play I'd rather play khorne daemonkin than a book which basically is spam Sorcerors, nurgle biker Lords, nurgle spawn, 5 man plague marine squads in rhinos and nurgle oblits or maulerfiends.

Champ, meet the comma. Comma, meet Champ.

 Wolf_in_Human_Shape wrote:
Guys I'm probably going to get my friend fired, but he leaked me a picture of the new Abaddon, who is a Lord of War:

Oh wow! He's going to be so OP with those rules, we're going to have everyone and their Eldar mothers begging TO's to ban all CSM armies from events now!

 Wolf_in_Human_Shape wrote:
In seriousness:

1.) No new weapon options whatsoever, for any unit.
2.) No point reductions whatsoever, for any unit or wargear.
3.) Axe of Blind Fury and the Black Mace removed completely.
4.) Burning Brand of Skalathrax becomes AP: 5 or loses torrent
5.) Spell Familiar removed completely
6.) No more cult units as troops
7.) Heldrake erratum-nerf enshrined in the codex, along with a point increase
8.) Cultists become 6 ppm, Plague Zombies are no longer a thing

I also have a sinking feeling that like always, we'll be the first codex of the design shift that will do away with Decurion/Formation styled army list building.

The pessimist in me fears that GW will look back at our abysmal 4th ed 'dex and use it as the template for our "new" codex, with the big change being to move the Cult units into the Elites slot with no way to make them Troops...
Instead, we'll get "Cult Formations" that force us to take the relevant named character + 6/7/8/9 units of 6/7/8/9 models respectively, because Sacred Numbers are cool & fluffy and should do nothing but overly restrict any kind of playability of our units.

 Wolf_in_Human_Shape wrote:
Guys I'm probably going to get my friend fired, but he leaked me a picture of the new Abaddon, who is a Lord of War:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Oh wow! He's going to be so OP with those rules, we're going to have everyone and their Eldar mothers begging TO's to ban all CSM armies from events now!

Nah Just look at the picture, it say's it all. He's harmless.

It will turn out that abaddons only attack will be six stomps a turn.

One handy buff: You'll get a powerful new Khornate psychic discipline called Bloodomancy!

Champion of Slaanesh wrote:
Well unless the codex changes from Nurgle and friends il be sticking with KDK lol. As much as khorne isn't my favorite way to play I'd rather play khorne daemonkin than a book which basically is spam Sorcerors nurgle biker Lords nurgle spawn 5 man plague marine squads in rhinos and nurgle oblits or maulerfiends

If the rumors are true and Tzeentch book comes out, I'm switching to Tzeentch Daemonkin. Nurgle and Khorne have their own books and no one loves Slaanesh.

The upcoming CSM codex itself connected to the Warp. This might randomly turn you, the owning player, into a Spawn, who will then proceed to devour his or her minatures and be forced to buy new ones.

Beat that!

Yoyoyo wrote:
The upcoming CSM codex itself connected to the Warp. This might randomly turn you, the owning player, into a Spawn, who will then proceed to devour his or her minatures and be forced to buy new ones.

Beat that!

Totally worth the new asking price of $100 for such an outstanding codex!

Experiment 626 wrote:

Yoyoyo wrote:
The upcoming CSM codex itself connected to the Warp. This might randomly turn you, the owning player, into a Spawn, who will then proceed to devour his or her minatures and be forced to buy new ones.

Beat that!

Totally worth the new asking price of $100 for such an outstanding codex!

Spawndom is less painful than the current CSM codex