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This week we have the fierce new Tau piloted by challenger John Vs. the Grey Bush and some of the new sneaky Ravenguard in their Talon Strike Force detachment. Let’s see who will come out on top. Make sure to tune in live on Twitch 7:00 PM PST Tuesday the 3rd for your chance to win one of the new Tau Commanders. Subscribers get triple the entries into the give away so don’t miss out! http://www.twitch.tv/frontlinegaming_tv






First we have John and his Hunter Contingent:



Hunter Contingent

Hunter Cadre

Commander

– Command and Control

– Multi spectral suite

– Puretide engram chip

– Iridium armor

Strike Team x 5

Strike Team x 5

Strike Team x 5

XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team

– 3 suits

– double missile pod on each

XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team

– 2 suits

– double missile pod on each

XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team

– 2 suits

– double missile pod on each

Pathfinder Team x 5

Hammerhead

– Heavy Railgun w/ submunitions

– Smart Missile System

Firebase Support Cadre

XV104 Riptide

– Ion Accelerator

– Twin Linked Fusion Blasters

– Early Warning Override

XV88 Broadside Battlesuit Teams {x2}

– 3 Broadsides

– High Yield Missile Pods (each)

– Smart Missile Systems (each)

– Early warning override (each)

CAD

Commander Shadowsun

Strike Team x 5

Strike Team x 5

Tetras

– 2 tetras

(Frt) Void Shield Generator

– 3 shields

John’s list is going to have all the tools needed to bring the pain to the poor Ravenguard. John will need to go first so that he can kill some of those scouts from the Shadowstrike Kill Team. If he is not able to kill a couple of those units, Reece’s Vanguard will drop down with the Skyhammer and tie a lot of John’s army up in combat. The roll to go first will be important and will give John the edge he needs to beat the Ravenguard.

John should be able to intercept most of the Skyhammer when they drop in dealing a crushing blow to those assault squads. Unfortunately, the Devastators are just as scary to the poor Tau so we shall see what he plans to do to those units. The interceptor paired with the Voidshield should help to lessen the blow from Reece’s alpha/beta strike.

This is in no way going to be an easy game for the new Tau, but I believe they have the tools to light up the shadows and kill those pesky Space Marines. It will be interesting to see how John plans on taking objectives as that is really what Tau struggle with. I believe in the greater good and believe John will bring home the Victory.



Reece’s list:

Raven Guard 1850pts
Talon Strike Force Description Size Cost
Pinion Battle Demi-Company
Chaplain Raven’s Fury 1 105
Tactical Marines M.Gun, C.Melta 5 90
Tactical Marines M.Gun, C.Melta 5 90
Tactical Marines M.Gun, C.Melta 5 90
Assault Squad M.Bombs 5 90
Devstator Squad C.Melta 10 150
D.Pod – 1 35
Scouts M.Bombs 5 60
Scouts M.Bombs 5 60
Scouts M.Bombs 5 60
Shadowstrike Kill Team
Scouts – 5 55
Scouts – 5 55
Vanguard J.Packs, Fist x 2, L.Claws x 2 10 260
Skyhammer Annihilation Force
Assault Squad Vet Sarge, P.Axe 5 110
Assault Squad Vet Sarge, P.Axe 5 110
Devastator Squad H.Bolter x 4 10 180
Drop Pod – 1 35
Devastator Squad H.Bolter x 4 10 180
Drop Pod – 1 35
Totals 99 1850

Reece’s list is all about trickery, deployment flexibility and movement! It will depend on overwhelming target priority and attacking from multiple threat vectors. We’ll see if those sneaky Raven Guard can overcome Tau firepower!

Going to be a great game it sounds like, excited to watch it! Interesting take on a full devastator squad in the Pinion.

@Spacewolverine

Yeah, it should be good fun! I am playing the Devs a bit differently. Normally I think it would be better to take them with heavy weapons and a unit of Sniper Scouts to give them Ignores Cover, but I wanted to try out a tactic with them using them in a different role. We'll see how it pans out, may not be so clever after all, lol!

I'll be tuning in for this one. Raven guard are cool.

Glad you'll be joining us! Should be a fun show.

Frankie did an unboxing of the Suit Commander we're giving away to a lucky watcher, tonight!

Hello everyone hopefully you tuned in last night to see the sneaky Ravenguard take on the greater good of Tau. It was a game of trickery and treachery! Make sure to watch the video and click follow if you like them! We also gave away a Tau Suit Commander to a lucky viewer, congratulations, Mako1971! Here are the post game write ups from the two players, enjoy. http://www.twitch.tv/frontlinegaming_tv/v/23892680



The Tau general, John:

So, I think I had the right list to do the job. Just, Reece had the dice and list to fight back. The Ravenguard ability to re-roll the dice for selecting sides and rolling to go first is awesome. Especially when Reece’s re-roll came up as a six both times to beat out my fives…Really set a great tone for the evening.

I think my biggest mistake was not using my last unit of fire warriors to wrap my right flank. I really over looked that weakness in my defensive line which gave the Ravenguard the chance to drop in and tie up my Crisis unit in combat. In hind sight I think that really hurt me and I would love a chance to replay the game and redeploy.

But the game wasn’t a matter of bad dice and horrible rules. I feel like each army was well balanced and well played. Just the mass pinning from Reece and his Heavy Bolters was crushing. Since it both crippled my shooting (broadsides always hitting on sixes isn’t super helpful) and simultaneously making it so I couldn’t withdrawal from his assaults. Overall a great strategy on his part.

My personal MVP was my Riptide. Who absolutely did amazing work in the back field, in close combat of all methods. I guess I might have committed to buying a Stormsurge to appease Frankie…so look for that in the near future.

Last night was a fantastic event and I look forward to getting a chance to come back for revenge. But for those of you who missed it, you missed some great moments. Heavy bolters against a void shield were the MVPs for Reece, and Tau winning massive amounts of close combat to keep me in that game. Who says Tau don’t know how to punch? Tell that to Reece and his army as they fall back from me…repeatedly.



The Raven Guard general, Reecius:

I think I’m in love with this new Raven Guard Detachment: the Talon Strike Force! Wow, it provides incredible flexibility a fun play style but best of all, it feels like a proper Raven Guard army should play. I loved it.

Highlights: The ability to have your entire army come out of reserves starting turn 1 is incredible as it allows you to fully null deploy, wait to see where your opponent puts his models, and then react. This gives the tactically minded general immense flexibility to put the right units in the right place to use them to maximum effect. The ability to reroll the die to determine deployment zones and first turn are also just stupid good and really came in handy this game as the reroll allowed me to win both the choice for deployment zone and first turn, beating John’s roll of a 5, twice! Lastly, being able to choose to fail morale checks to bug out of a bad situation is also very, very good.

My appropriately sneaky Raven Guard battle plan was to present John with few to no targets, and have everything come out of reserves from multiple threat angles, overloading the Tau ability to intercept every units due to target overload. With Skyhammer all coming in on the turn of my choice and the same for the Shadowstrike Kill Team (turn 1 in this case), I would present him with so many threats he’d be faced with a “damned if you do, damned if you don’t scenario” where he simply couldn’t take them all down. Plus, having Shrouding turn 1 due to the Raven Guard CTs, and the lack of Buffmander’s buffs, the Tau army would be shooting me at reduced efficacy. The incredibly powerful pinning ability of the Skyhammer Deavstators would be particularly devastating to low leadership Tau units. I was hoping to come in, lose only a few of my assault assets, then take away Overwatch from the most powerful units with my Skyhammer Devastators, and that is exactly what hapenned!



My turn 1 was just devastating. John left a gap in his bubble wrap on a flank, and I exploited it, overloading it with threats. None of my deep striking units misshaped thankfully (although the Skyhammer Assault Marine units tried to!) and due to Shrouding and blocked LoS I was able to minimize casualties from Interceptor. Then, with Skyhammer pinning the critical units, I was able to assault taking only minimal firepower from what is typically devastating Tau overwatch.

Once my assault units got into melee, the Tau forces started to crumble. However, the Riptide went ham and started to wrack up the Kill Points as I sacrificed units to keep it from shooting! In the end though, the Tau army deployment was what let me get into the vital units and chew them up before they could bring their crazy firepower to bear on my relatively squishy MSU infantry units. I had taken Buffmander out of play on turn 1 by locking him into melee unit with a combat squad portion of my Veterans, that was critical!

Men of the match: Heavy Bolter Devastators, baby! I love saying that, lol, but it is 100% true. They just kicked ass seven ways to Sunday. Despite the fact they never actually did a wound (due to the VSG), simply targeting a unit triggers their special rule. It took away John’s over watch and pinned 4 out of 4 units I targeted, every turn for all 5 turns with a single exception. That was absolutely devastating as powerful Crisis and Broadside suit teams were effectively taken out of play for the entire game, sitting stuck while assault units chopped them up. Brual!



In retrospect, I should have used the Wayfarer ability of the Scouts in the Pinion Battle Demi-Company to bring in the Tactical Marines in from Outflank to even further overload the Tau army’s target priority choices, but I was worried I would biff my reserve rolls. That was a mistake as they then spent the game running up the field and not doing much of anything.

I think the Tau list would have benefited tremendously from an Ethereal to help defend vs. leadership attacks like my Skyhammer Devastators. But, John played a good game, he just made a critical deployment error that really cost him. He fought his way back in though, as my MSU units started to falter when focused upon. My army had to strike a devastating blow in turn 1 to keep the advantage and luckily for me, that is what hapenned.

The weakness of my list is my lack of ability to pop transports. I may need to work in some shooting units or take a normal Demi Company (which you can do in the Talon Strike Force). I would also struggle with a true Deathstar, and would have to avoid it and play to the mission to win the game. However, I dig the army and will be playing it more in the future!

Great insight to a new and very exciting army for Ravenguard !!!

Makes me want to try out the Raven Guard formations! Will you be using the White Scar ones any time soon?

There's nothing new about that tau list except the fact that the formation is being used.

It's quite weaker than competitive 6th ed lists imo.

@Dozer

Thanks! Yeah, the Talon Strike Force is such a great detachment, I really dig it.

@Frozocrone

I am sure we will at some point, it also looks solid although I question if it is better than a Battle Company for them. It would be awesome for a Bike army, though. We'll see!

Sheit27

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, as they say. I think it was a solid army, he just got caught in the trap and wasn't able to recover.

Does John have a reason for a Buffmander, in a list with no AP2 to buff**? I skimmed through the batrep and didn't hear why it was there.

The Buffmander was attached to the Missile Pod suits, yes?

Like the HoneyBadger, Space Marines don't care about AP4.




**
I also didn't catch if the Coordinated Fire Power rule extended to the Buffer's MSS and C&CN toys.

Buffmander didn't come into play as he was locked in combat top of turn 1.

Maybe you're just waiting on some painted models to be done but I'd love to see some of the new stuff in action.

I'd love to see how an Optimized stealth formation or two will preform in an ITC scenario.

any plans for games that include ghostkeels etc?

Yeah, we will definitely be showcasing more of the new stuff! When we have a guest come on the show, we let them choose what they play and that was what John wanted to face me with. He said he wants to get a Stormsurge, though.

 Reecius wrote:
Buffmander didn't come into play as he was locked in combat top of turn 1.

I saw that. He failed to do any bubble wrapping (didn't have the kroot or enough FWs to do so), or Ninja-Tauing (more units in Reserve) that would have mitigated your Alpha Strike.

But if you hadn't locked it up Turn 1, what would John have done with it? Twin Linking the MP Crisis Team would be cool (with the BS+ bump for 3 units), bringing Twin Linked BS4 is nice. But nothing else in his army has anything worth giving Ignores Cover, so, why Ignores Cover?

Reece, I ask, knowing that you might not have the answer to that.

Next week, I'll try and show you what I'm talking about.

It's been awhile since I watched a Frontline video. Thanks for reposting the live videos as I just don't have the time (or ability to stay awake) to watch them live.

Locally, we are building a RG army with a Skyhammer detachment and this was a very interesting video. Using units to bolster the cover save for the assault elements was fairly interesting.

The one option we seriously considered was to utilize Scout Bikers with a Locator Beacon taken from the Pinion Demi Company. This helped immensely as it works for the Skyhammer as well as the Vanguard Vets (in the event you can't get two Scout squads in a position to give the Vanguard Vets a no scatter deep strike).

Lots of options with the Ravenguard and watching the amount of Interceptor come from the Tau definitely is good food for thought.

Thanks for sharing.

@BrotherE

I'm picking up what you're putting down, bruh! Yeah, the +1BS and Twin Link would have been nice, but it wouldn't bypass power armor, I feel you.

If I had vehicles besides Drop Pods though, those weapons would have been very scary. I was just running all infantry. A non 3+ save army would have been in deep doo doo though, like Orks. That would have been an extremely unpleasant game for poor Orks

@Sarigar

Yeah, a locator beacon would be clutch in this army if you had first turn, I totally agree. Coteaz would help a lot too, to reduce the odds of getting seized on if you do deploy for that big first turn alpha strike.

Hindsight is 20/20 but a lack of a unit buffer like Kroot or a reserve "Hammer" unit like deep strike Crisis Suits seemed to have put the Tau army in an easy position to get tied up in close combat. Despite potentially giving up an extra VP I think the Ethereal is a vital part of any gunline style Tau army for the moral aura alone. Ld 10 bubble with the option to make everyone stubborn is incredibly good when your up against armies that want to hurt your moral. Put him behind LoS blockers, Devilfish, or even attach him to a Broadside unit to keep him relatively safe. An Ethereal also makes utilizing drones in suit units more reliable as the moral check is less of a concern with Ld 10 plus can be used to make majority armor 4+ on riptides and broadsides.

I like that the Raven Guard rules worked well although I really am not a huge fan of this Space Marine deep strike charging on turn 1 shenanigans when GW decided that Zadstrukk's deep strike assault needed to be removed. Would be interesting to see how this Raven Guard list does against armies who aren't push overs in close combat like Wolves or even Orks

There's not a lot of spare points for things like Coteaz.

@Dozer

Yeah, there isn't a lot of room to spare for anything else.

@Vankraken

Yeah, that would be a challenge. A Wolfstar would just eat the whole army if I tried to actually fight them toe to toe.

I felt that was a super lopsided fight that didn't do a good job showcasing anything new. We knew from the beginning skyhammer is a giant finger to shooty armies, that's the whole reason its taken. It doesn't show off the raven guards ability to handle anything that dosent just fall over in meelee, and it showed NOTHING about the tau everyone dosent already know-punch them in the face.

Overall while it was fun because those involved are good and fun guys, it was a very boring, predictable match where rock absolutely smashed scissors.

And so far tau are 0 for 3 in front line demos. They are no where near tier 1 like they claimed. I'd put them 5 the or 6th in power behind eldar, marines, necrons, ect. I feel the army wide bbuff sharing bogeyman is way overblown, as actual games show that its never 12 rhinos across from you with no cover in optimum range of everything in your army. Further nerfs are hardly justified.

@Orock

We've only played two games with Tau on camera so far, so it's 0-2 not 0-3, just FYI.

And this game was boring? Eh, I guess. I thought it was really cool to see what the new Raven Guard could do, if you look at it from that perspective it was very cool. You were looking at it form the Tau army perspective so yeah, it didn't provide much as they didn't get to do much.

He was playing the maximum strength rule and you guys would have been able to see how it worked but I had Buffmander locked in melee top of turn 1, which is exactly what this type of army should do given the opportunity. It would have been silly to not take that charge just to show off what Tau could do as then all the people that tuned in to see Raven Guard in action would have been disappointed.

The best we can do is play a game honestly and see what happens. Sorry if you didn't like it, but it was a real game of 40k that just so hapenned to go the Raven Guard's way as their battle plan worked out pretty much perfectly. Had we played a rematch, I am sure it would have gone very differently as the Tau player wouldn't have fallen for the same trick.

Sorry if I gave the idea I didn't enjoy it. You guys are always a blast to watch, its why I subscribed to your twitch a few weeks back. I was just stating criticism from another viewpoint because I feel sometimes people just reply back to you guys with "love your stuff keep it up" like talking nervously to a celebrity. And your guys style blows away miniwargaming who never show "real" lists that you will actually see in a game, or its necrons beating up on fluffy pretty but underpowered orks. My only complaint was it was a very rock vs scissors matchup due to particular builds, which tend to be predictable. Don't take it personal its not like I could do any better, was just a shame it was basically over turn one, which is just as bad as watching a death Star walk across the other army.

I love this report and watched turn 1 several times. Classic !

@Orock

Hey, no worries man, we appreciate the honest feedback! No hard feelings at all, I was just presenting an alternative point of view. And yeah, I agree that it was a bit of a one turn game. Frankie and I discussing it before the game started both felt the same way. Turn 1 goes the way I want it to, the Tau are finished. If I falter turn 1, he blows me off the table and it's an ass kicking the other direction. It just hapenned to go the way it went.

Thank you for the support on Twitch, too, much appreciated!

@Dozer

Glad you enjoyed it, buddy

 Orock wrote:
And so far tau are 0 for 3 in front line demos. They are no where near tier 1 like they claimed. I'd put them 5 the or 6th in power behind eldar, marines, necrons, ect. I feel the army wide bbuff sharing bogeyman is way overblown, as actual games show that its never 12 rhinos across from you with no cover in optimum range of everything in your army. Further nerfs are hardly justified.

Totally in agreement! Everyone hears the word "buffmander" and the thought process stops there. That to benefit from the hunter contingent Tau uses 3 (three) units to shoot at 1 (one) enemy unit. When the units already cost a lot that isn't very effective.

I hope FE get some nice formation that gives them free weapons or models

As for the batrep, Tau never stood a chance against the list fielded against them. The mistakes in deployment didn't really matter.

Well, when Codexes are getting updated left right and centre (SM got points decreases, unit buffs, upgraded Chapter tactics and more while Necrons/Eldar got unit buffs and new rules) if you only get a campaign supplement and a few new units, then yeah I can see you lagging behind the top dogs.

Hey @reecius just a quick questions in case I missed it in the FAQ, but can IC's (for example the jump chaplain from the pinion demi-company). It doesn't say anything on the actual formation rules, but I feel like I'm missing something about IC's cannot join units in deep strike reserve? Appreciate the help, I'm building my own Pinion demi-company right now and that would be a big help lol

Thanks boss

@Naw

You think the Tau didn't stand a chance? Huh, I was sweating bullets all the way through his round of interceptor fire. Had he seized, I probably get pwnd. Had he killed both units of Vanguard with interceptor? Buffmander is never locked in combat on turn 1 and he lights me up like a Christmas tree.

It feels like a lopsided game (and it was) because literally everything went my way in the opening play. If we played that game 5 times in a row, I bet money Raven Guard don't win all 5 times.

@Castellan Alaric

Yeah, we get that questions a ton with Skyhammer, too. For one, the IC doesn't have the special rule to assault from reserves that the formation has (they both reference models in the formation). But, you can attach a character to them if you want, they just lose some of their special bonuses.

Also, it's a bit much. For example, if you played that the formation special rules transferred to ICs, you would see people first turn assaulting out of reserves with characters like Draigo and such attached to each 5 man assault unit. It would not be fun for the other player at all.

@ reecius - right after I posted that question my buddy told me the same thing I agree it would be a tad bit much for sure. Thanks for the reply though!