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I keep trying to rebuild this list and I'm always unsure of how I'm going about it. The main reason for this is I do not want to run any Rhinos. I understand that this 1, puts my troops at risk for getting blasted rather quickly and 2, leaves them footslogging it. I don't mind the footslogging however I am nervous about the first point. I considered running a large squad of Bikers and a 4 pack of Spawn, then I thought it might be a good idea to break the Spawn pack in half and send my Lord on his bike with 2, 2 on their own and the Biker squad somewhere else. This hopefully could leave my Plague Marines some time to get to an objective or somewhere they could get into cover and cc. My Terminators will be deepstriking as I just feel it's fun and it's the chance you take. Also 2x2 Obliterator squads will also deepstrike into my opponent's backfield and crack things for the Spawn, Bikers or Terminators to get at leaving the other 2 Obliterators firing at things from my side with supporting firepower in the form of a Helbrute. Suggestions are welcome and appreciated! Here's the list.

HQ

Chaos Lord MON, Bike, SOC, P. Fist, BBOS 180pts

TROOPS

5 Plague Marines 2 Meltas 140pts
5 Plague Marines 2 Flamers 130pts
5 Plague Marines 2 Plasma 150pts
5 Plague Marines 2 Plasma 150pts
5 Plague Marines 2 Plasma 150pts

ELITES

5 Chaos Terminators MON, 2 C. Plasma, 2 P. Fist VOLW 226pts
1 Helbrute Plasma Cannon 110pts

FAST ATTACK

5 Chaos Bikers MON, 2 Meltas, 1 C. Bolter163pts
2 Chaos Spawn MON 72pts
2 Chaos Spawn MON 72pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

2 Obliterators MON 152pts
2 Obliterators MON 152pts
2 Obliterators MON 152pts

So that is 1999 points. Not sure how well it will do but I am somewhat excited to field it and see. Thanks again for any suggestions or time given in looking at the list. Take care!

It is so fascinating to read what newbies write for strategy as if they actually get to implement it. On the contrary, the enemy's deadlier units just steam roll over CSM.

so many poi ts wasted on the big terminators squad.

I wrote about 3 pages of fixes, but decided to be more reserved to try to help you keep this army.

If you're Footslogging those marines, I'd dump your small forward units. The 2 spawn alone aren't going to do any damage, and the biker lord is powerful but can still be cut down without support I'd you go against a dedicated cc unit.

I think if you want to make the army work, either keep the bike lord and give him 4-5 spawn, or ditch him for Typhus.

CSM Footslogging only will work (and still not great) if you have an overwhelming number of wounds and large board presence. Typhus let's you keep the Plague Marines as troops, but also gives you fearless zombie cultists that you can take in huge groups.
Alternative to him you can look at the Helbrute formation called the Helcult, which is a Helbrute and 2 units of cultists. The formation had a few benefits, but the main one is Fearless cultists who provide cover saves to the Helbrute.

thanks unclean one.


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hey filch it'd be more helpful if you actually suggested something instead of just stating your opinion which i see you do a lot on other peoples posts. not very helpful.

Hey just a few points to help you keep it nurgle but be abit more competative:

-Take 2 lvl 3 nurgle sorcerers on bikes and try to get invisibility (also take spell familiars for the reroll)

-max out your 2 nurgle spawn squads and put the sorcerers in them

-feel free to ally in some nurgle demons (great unclean one, plague drone star, nurglings, plague hulk are all good)

-take a heldrake and convert it up to look nurgly

-get a fire raptor gunship and paint it up to look like death guard (seriously good CSM unit)

-if you dont like rhinos consider dread klaws to drop them in (maybe 2 for the plague marines)

If he takes two Nurgle sorcerers he can't take plague marines as troops, but if he doesn't mind them being scoring that is fine, zombies can fill the troops tax, and it's not as much of a tax with zombies. Also sorcerers should both be unmarked if you are fishing for invisibility, they can still join Nurgle marked units.

Ally in some daemons for extra warp charges, a Nurgle daemon prince level three works well with three rolls on biomancy or you could bring Belakor.

If you just take one unit of spawn don't be afraid to fill your other two fast attacks with Hell Blades, very underestimated unit.

Well this list is uhhh.... well sh*t

Ok so im know to be that person that defends flch cause wherever he goes i kinda end up there somehow, he and i are true chaos players so ya we are pretty salty in the fact that we went from 3.5 to this garbage. But here let me at least try to help you... my reply will come in 2 hours im on the phone rn and this may seem weird that im telling you this but i dont want any unwanted fights between my chaos brothers so ya just wait and dont make any modifications



Automatically Appended Next Post:
so i just got back home here we go:

chaos lord: bbos is garbage unless used properly, go with lc instead

troops: change your plague marines into chaos space marines, and dont take any special weapons, if you have plague marines sure they can last long but they will get wiped by guns as if they were a kleenex, why are you putting flamers? they are better off used for sexual pleasure if you expect to get close with 20 marines then good luck cause you wont, if you want to play hordes of power armour, go with 6 squads of 5 marines and then take another cad and do the same. plasma too expensive, melta too close and flamers too close

5 termies is not enough, 2 plasma is nothing, it will make your opponent laugh
helbrute is garbage if you want to use one use the helfist and take them raw with pf and mm

ok listen here the spawn is one thing but the COMBI BOLTER that is as useless as a treadmill for a cripple, why are you doing this, why? get a melta bomb instead and make your chaos brothers happy.


now the spawn... 2 spawn will be better off being used as a toothpick for your teeth than being used to kill things, go with 4 spawn and put your lord in there, or if you want a shooty lord then put him in the biker squad

oblits are good and that's the only thing i agree with

saturn999 wrote:
thanks unclean one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
hey filch it'd be more helpful if you actually suggested something instead of just stating your opinion which i see you do a lot on other peoples posts. not very helpful.

when j said too many points wasted on termi it means break them down into small 3 man squads with combimeltas instead of all the expensive upgrades you got.

good luck and have fun.

 -v10mega wrote:

troops: change your plague marines into chaos space marines, and dont take any special weapons if you have plague marines sure they can last long but they will get wiped by guns as if they were a kleenex, why are you putting flamers? they are better off used for sexual pleasure if you expect to get close with 20 marines then good luck cause you wont, if you want to play hordes of power armour, go with 6 squads of 5 marines and then take another cad and do the same. plasma too expensive, melta too close and flamers too close

This is the point where you stop giving advice.

Edit: Also, for the poster/OP, Plague marines are a top tier unit (for CSM at least). Plasma guns are your best firepower for those guys.

 -v10mega wrote:
Well this list is uhhh.... well sh*t

Ok so im know to be that person that defends flch cause wherever he goes i kinda end up there somehow, he and i are true chaos players so ya we are pretty salty in the fact that we went from 3.5 to this garbage. But here let me at least try to help you... my reply will come in 2 hours im on the phone rn and this may seem weird that im telling you this but i dont want any unwanted fights between my chaos brothers so ya just wait and dont make any modifications



Automatically Appended Next Post:
so i just got back home here we go:

chaos lord: bbos is garbage unless used properly, go with lc instead

troops: change your plague marines into chaos space marines, and dont take any special weapons, if you have plague marines sure they can last long but they will get wiped by guns as if they were a kleenex, why are you putting flamers? they are better off used for sexual pleasure if you expect to get close with 20 marines then good luck cause you wont, if you want to play hordes of power armour, go with 6 squads of 5 marines and then take another cad and do the same. plasma too expensive, melta too close and flamers too close

5 termies is not enough, 2 plasma is nothing, it will make your opponent laugh
helbrute is garbage if you want to use one use the helfist and take them raw with pf and mm

ok listen here the spawn is one thing but the COMBI BOLTER that is as useless as a treadmill for a cripple, why are you doing this, why? get a melta bomb instead and make your chaos brothers happy.


now the spawn... 2 spawn will be better off being used as a toothpick for your teeth than being used to kill things, go with 4 spawn and put your lord in there, or if you want a shooty lord then put him in the biker squad

oblits are good and that's the only thing i agree with

Thank you v10mega.

Its so cute to see new Chaos Players talk like they know everything. its even funnier when they come gere for advice and all the suggestion are, "GET 3 DRAKES! BAWGAWK!"

foot slogging plague marines can work but only if you have 5man squads with 2 plasma guns and shoot all guns 24". A plague marine with a plasma ghn cost as much as a terminator but you get +1T and a fnp.





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 Tactical_Spam wrote:

 -v10mega wrote:

troops: change your plague marines into chaos space marines, and dont take any special weapons if you have plague marines sure they can last long but they will get wiped by guns as if they were a kleenex, why are you putting flamers? they are better off used for sexual pleasure if you expect to get close with 20 marines then good luck cause you wont, if you want to play hordes of power armour, go with 6 squads of 5 marines and then take another cad and do the same. plasma too expensive, melta too close and flamers too close

This is the point where you stop giving advice.

so much hate lolz!

Tell me the last time CSM were ever worth taking. Ever... You take cultists or plague marines. In the case of Crimson Slaughter, one squad of Possessed might be worth it.

To the OP, pick up the crimson slaughter supplement (probably of a torrent site) and use that. Probably 75% better and you can get the same stuff and many more.

Horde of csm not so great. Horde of scouts with ml and sniper rifles is good.

hey tactical_spam, thanks for the advice and your time. i appreciate it.


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and thank you [[intercessor]] and [[chaosmarauder]]! much appreciated!

Iám also building a CSM Nurgle list and we share a lot of similarities so might be usefull to take a look here.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/604020.page
2000 points with Helbrute mayhem pack because i just love the look and fluff of Helbrutes.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/668599.page
1850: bit smaller list but more balanced in my eyes.

I do like the use of Rhinos but I see why you would footslog with Nurgle Fluff wise. I hope this helps a bit and never give up on Pappa Nurgle

Why do you guys like plasma so much? They are so expensive, this is my view:

for ine plague marine squad i can get 2 csm squads with nothing. Yes they will tun but who cares? I have 20 more squads coming at you and they are scoring and they can put down a lot with pure bolter fire, take a datk apostle and done they are fearless or you can give them votlw and perfect your done. Plague marines are just not worth if they dont have melta in a rihno in my opinion


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Btw so much salt here


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Demic25 wrote:
Iám also building a CSM Nurgle list and we share a lot of similarities so might be usefull to take a look here.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/604020.page
2000 points with Helbrute mayhem pack because i just love the look and fluff of Helbrutes.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/668599.page
1850: bit smaller list but more balanced in my eyes.

I do like the use of Rhinos but I see why you would footslog with Nurgle Fluff wise. I hope this helps a bit and never give up on Pappa Nurgle

Oh i pkay nurgle alright but i play a fast army thats how you play nurgle, you make a tough to kill with 2+ jink army

For Helbrutes if you really really want to take the models but hate the rules:

Possibly.....take space marine allies and find a detachment formation that will allow you to take dreadnaughts and use the helbrutes as 'counts as' dreadnaughts

Take the dreadnaught squadron if you can

 -v10mega wrote:
Why do you guys like plasma so much? They are so expensive, this is my view:

for ine plague marine squad i can get 2 csm squads with nothing. Yes they will tun but who cares? I have 20 more squads coming at you and they are scoring and they can put down a lot with pure bolter fire, take a datk apostle and done they are fearless or you can give them votlw and perfect your done. Plague marines are just not worth if they dont have melta in a rihno in my opinion

T5, 3+, 3+++ > Bolter fire.

CSM are overcosted and NEED fearless.

Plague marines have fearless, are toughness 5, have feel no pain and can take 2 special weapons in a five man squad.

There's too many other options to take that pump out more dakka, at longer range to justify taking CSM. Chosen are better than CSM. Warp Talons are better than CSM.

Btw so much salt here

Salt is for Slaanesh, this a Nurgle list.

Oh i pkay nurgle alright but i play a fast army thats how you play nurgle, you make a tough to kill with 2+ jink army

No. You play Nurgle like you have no place to be, casually slogging through LoS blocking terrain until your enemy is stupid enough to come into range of all your guns. One bike squad, maybe, to get easy melta into their back field, but you are better off running Oblits or Defilers. Nurgle has no reason to jink. T6 on a bike unit is ridiculous, but you will get wiped by anyone with a S10 blast (Every flavour of vindicator).

OP, if you plan on camping like a god Nurgle Disciple, get a void shield generator. 100 points for 3 ablative AV12 shields... Actually, get two.

this is supposed to be a game that you are to win right? the only way to win consistently is by being fast, camping nurgle lists work if you have a crap ton of dakka you just pissed that i play my csm and win with them in local tourneys ,

 -v10mega wrote:
this is supposed to be a game that you are to win right? the only way to win consistently is by being fast, camping nurgle lists work if you have a crap ton of dakka you just pissed that i play my csm and win with them in local tourneys

...

How do you win? You just said, "I run 20 man blobs of CSM"

I doubt you win at Tournaments unless you are playing an ork army relying on grots

i really like these suggestions as it's helping me to learn more about what can work and be fun and playable. i was lucky enough to get a copy of the chaos daemons codex late last night and was thinking of a great unclean one with greater reward +1 mastery level, 10 plaguebearers, plagueridden greater locus of fecundity, and a daemon prince of nurgle, with flight, armour, 1 greater reward and 1 mastery level. granted, i need to cut a lot of stuff form the original list. any thoughts. i thought about making the plague marines 7 men possibly and cutting a squad?

I would Make the GUO a ML3 psyker so he can roll on biomancy... T10 or EW is OP on that guy

ok cool. going to redo the list now and post in ten minutes!

 Tactical_Spam wrote:

 -v10mega wrote:
this is supposed to be a game that you are to win right? the only way to win consistently is by being fast, camping nurgle lists work if you have a crap ton of dakka you just pissed that i play my csm and win with them in local tourneys

...

How do you win? You just said, "I run 20 man blobs of CSM"

I doubt you win at Tournaments unless you are playing an ork army relying on grots

i dont run 20 man blobs i run 5 man squads and max them out and then copy and paste and put a little anit air, but i do that for fun, i play tourneys by playing gore pack and nurgle bikers with sorcerers and 2 blood thirsters i also play nurgle flying circus which is fast and 2+ jink

ok so here goes.

HQ

Chaos Lord MON, Bike, BBOS, P. Fist, SOC 175pts

TROOPS

5 Plague Marines 2 melta 140pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts

FAST ATTACK

4 Chaos Spawn MON 144

1 Heldrake Baleflamer 170pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

1 Obliterator MON 76pts
1 Obliterator MON 76pts
1 Obliterator MON 76pts

ALLIES

HQ

Great Unclean One M. Level 3, 1 Greater Reward 260pts

TROOPS

10 Plaguebearers 1 Plagueridden, Greater Reward, Icon 125pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

DAEMON PRINCE D.O.N., Daemonic Flight, Armour, M. Level 2, 1 Greater Reward, 290pts

I'm horrible at math but I believe that's 1997 pts. Can this do anything? Yes, I am new. Haha, I haven't even played a game yet but I love the game and would love to start. Thank you guys for all your help!

Now it's becoming solid, but the list will perform better if you get rhinos. You'll also want another greater reward on the GUO and DP. A 3rd Mastery Level would also be better. You can get the extrs greater rewards and make it better if you:

1. Cut a squad of plague marines
2. Buy the other 3 rhinos (I also suggest dozer blades)
4. Give them all 2x meltaguns

If you still don't want rhinos then I'd dump a plague marine squad, get the rewards, and stick thr extra points into putting more Plague marines in each squad.

Edit: I didn't see the greater reward on your plagueridden. That's a bit overkill, use those for getting the other greater rewards on the DP and guo, and Mastery Level 3 for the dp.

he just went in a long rant about why he hates rhinos, honestly saturn your a lost cause right now, you can keep the plasma but you honestly ignored everything i said, keep the plague marines but i have no idea in hell how you will get close to the enemy for your melta, i also told you to take off the bbos but i guess you want to play it like that, we can only lead you in the right direction but in the end it is you who will choose what he wants oh and i think flch will agree with me but make sure you build your list you build it to expect counters and not expecting to role board over, dont make strats before the game make the strat in the game

saturn999 wrote:
ok so here goes.

HQ

Chaos Lord MON, Bike, BBOS, P. Fist, SOC 175pts

TROOPS

5 Plague Marines 2 melta 140pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts
5 Plague Marines 2 plasma, melta bombs 155pts

FAST ATTACK

4 Chaos Spawn MON 144

1 Heldrake Baleflamer 170pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

1 Obliterator MON 76pts
1 Obliterator MON 76pts
1 Obliterator MON 76pts

ALLIES

HQ

Great Unclean One M. Level 3, 1 Greater Reward 260pts

TROOPS

10 Plaguebearers 1 Plagueridden, Greater Reward, Icon 125pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

DAEMON PRINCE D.O.N., Daemonic Flight, Armour, M. Level 2, 1 Greater Reward, 290pts

I'm horrible at math but I believe that's 1997 pts. Can this do anything? Yes, I am new. Haha, I haven't even played a game yet but I love the game and would love to start. Thank you guys for all your help!

The list seems pretty good here, I've never been a fan of taking small foot slogging squads, but that's just my preference. Let us know how it goes!

will do! and thank you!

 -v10mega wrote:
he just went in a long rant about why he hates rhinos, honestly saturn your a lost cause right now, you can keep the plasma but you honestly ignored everything i said, keep the plague marines but i have no idea in hell how you will get close to the enemy for your melta, i also told you to take off the bbos but i guess you want to play it like that, we can only lead you in the right direction but in the end it is you who will choose what he wants oh and i think flch will agree with me but make sure you build your list you build it to expect counters and not expecting to role board over, dont make strats before the game make the strat in the game

Son, leave. Lost cause? This bro is new and new people need to be shown the ropes

-v10mega, i'm sorry if i upset you. i actually put your posts to ignore because you come off semi rude and pompous. i understand that you play competitively but please understand that the way you come off can turn someone off to the game. i am also a 37 year old man and regardless of the fact that we are on the internet, do not talk to people even in jest the way that you do. thank you for your time. take care.