New Orks & Tau WD 108

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**gungo**

Vineheart01 wrote:
Dreadmob is full of broken rules because its so old. I cant even find it anymore either.

You do realize ghaz supplement has a dread mob formation? In fact it's one of the new formation bundles for preorder. Unless you want to use the forgeworld dreads which only one of them is decent in the first place.

**Vineheart01**

Yes and ive ran that formation before. Its so ungodly expensive that its basically an entire list of armor. Meaning if you face people who dont have reliable AV its amazing as hell, but if you face someone who does they die in a heartbeat.

Our walkers are too expensive for what they do. ALL of them.

**matphat**

Timing on this is pretty perfect for me. This last month has been "Boss month" on my modeling and painting table.
I've finally decided to complete all my boss models and the table currently has a metal Ghaz, Grukk, 5 boss nobz, metal painboy, 2 metal bigmeks with kff, metal snikrot, and a plastic bigmek with shokk attack gun.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Vineheart01 wrote:

Our walkers are too expensive for what they do. ALL of them.

So true. I haven't run my walkers since 5th because of this. I have 9 Kans and 2 Dreds, all fully painted and magnitized. All dressed up and no where to go!

**geargutz**

Admitedly, Waaagh every turn would help the ghaz dredd mob...too bad you have to run 300pts just to have an orkurian with the dreddmob.

**hordrak**

Some calculations done and it seems that if the Council hasn't been reworked it will be impossible to fit it and a usefull Ork Warband into 1850 pts. Barebones - possible, otherwise (with trukks, nobs in boy squads etc.) - no.

**gungo**

Vineheart01 wrote:
Yes and ive ran that formation before. Its so ungodly expensive that its basically an entire list of armor. Meaning if you face people who dont have reliable AV its amazing as hell, but if you face someone who does they die in a heartbeat.

Our walkers are too expensive for what they do. ALL of them.

Again your arguing to argue.
Right now you can field decent army lists that consist of nearly every type of list
The dread mob is a decent list and does well because it is AV spam and makes your opponents anti infantry weapons useless. If you only face grav or melta spam then feel free and take morkanauts which gives a 5+ invul bubble to all your walkers within 6in. This decorian only makes that formation better by allowing your armour to move run and charge each turn.

But this decorian goes a long way to helping Orks with another fearless option, a Death Star option, and another durable MSU option. The only issue I have with the decorian is it's expensive and both core choices are both ~750 points. The council is base 614 pts without upgrades.
If your not playing 1650 or 1850+ games then it's very unwieldly.

**Dakkafang Dreggrim**

Does the kill mob still require the boyz to be Slugga and choppa Boyz? Or can they be shoota boyz ?

Any worth on the new Painmob formation ?

**Swampmist**

Warband with mega nobz, nobs and trukks+ The Council with 5 man nob squad + the Snikkrot Formation is 1730. It might be possible...

**gungo**

Oguhmek wrote:
Source? Customer service has said that "there are no plans" for a new IA8

I've read it online before and specifically recieved an email 3 months ago when I asked customer service about buzzgrobs stompa during the ITC debate. They replied to me with the typical email about the rules team is working on an update but a date is not available at this time for its release.

**Grimmor**

Kanluwen wrote:

If you read the Goff Kill Mob, it seems to require a basic Warboss(60 points), a unit of Nobz, three units of Boyz, Gorkanaut, Killa Kan unit, and two Deff Dreads.
That's 749 points.

Ok, thats significantly better. Still i dont want a Gorkanaught. I didnt want one when they came out with it and i dont want one now. Any way you look at it, both of these Core choices are lousy, not as lousy as Daemons, but about the same level as the Mont'ka ones for IG.

Seriously GW, you've done good Core choices before. The Reclamation Legion and Slaughtercult are both solid. Why? Because they have a low minimum and a high maximum and most (if not all) of the units in there are decent.

The Killmob and the Warband both have way to high of minimums for a Core choice, on top of needing to many types of units. Serously, i dont want that many walkers!!

gungo wrote:

You do realize ghaz supplement has a dread mob formation? In fact it's one of the new formation bundles for preorder. Unless you want to use the forgeworld dreads which only one of them is decent in the first place.

Do you realize that those aren't the same Dredds? The ones in IA8 have Ramshackle Beast and you can take small numbers of. Ghazy's Dred Mob is fething nuts on its requirments.

Theres a reason that Orks, competitively speaking, run either Bullyboyz+Blitz Brigade or Stompa+Vulcha Squad or Red Skull Kommandos. Or just yell sod it and spam Deffkoptas

**geargutz**

The orkurian would've been improved if they said all dedicated trucks and boss nob pk were free then that would've been worth fielding (and able to fit in a 1850 list).
This orkurian right here is an apocalypse only thing....I am disapoint.

**Dakkafang Dreggrim**

From what I'm reading , the orkurian sounds lame.

We can already waaagh every turn with 2 formations and get HoW on our S3 models. Whats the point of a decurion if it doesn't add a new ability? Just to get ghazzy a 2++ most the game ?

I was hoping for something our formations don't already do.

Hopefully there is something missng we don't know yet.

**Swampmist**

...2000 points is apoc now? Huh, guess Ive been playing wrong then.

**Grimmor**

Swampmist wrote:
...2000 points is apoc now? Huh, guess Ive been playing wrong then.

It may as well be as far as tournaments are concerned. Casually speaking this should be not craptastic, but you cant make it work right unless you're playing in 2k points, as otherwise you're just to barebones.

**Swampmist**

I still think mass fearless is good enough. Also, we have no idea what formations can fill an auxiliary. Might be something small there to help out.

**Oguhmek**

gungo wrote:
Oguhmek wrote:
Source? Customer service has said that "there are no plans" for a new IA8

I've read it online before and specifically recieved an email 3 months ago when I asked customer service about buzzgrobs stompa during the ITC debate. They replied to me with the typical email about the rules team is working on an update but a date is not available at this time for its release.

Ok, maybe thats changed then, lets hope so.

Anyway, I'm disappointed that the Necrons get a core formation that contain all useful units and is fairly flexible, and with a few essential upgrades can fit in around 700 points, while the Orks are stuck with either one particular play style, or well over 1000 points for the core formation - and then the bonuses are nowhere near the usefulness of the ones the Necrons get.

Orks really needed good stuff sice the codex is comparatively weak.

**the Signless**

Do we have any ork formations that give options for how many units we can take? I have searched my supplements and looked over these rumours and it seems like every formations I have seen is always 3 of unit X and 6 of unit Y. Has that changed with this supplement or is there something that I am missing?

gungo wrote:
The dread mob is a decent list and does well

HA! Ha ha ha.

Ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Ha ha ha.
Ha ha ha ha ha.

Ha ha ha.
Ha.
No.
Ork walkers are overpriced, underpowered, and get glanced to death by everything.

**Grimmor**

Swampmist wrote:
I still think mass fearless is good enough. Also, we have no idea what formations can fill an auxiliary. Might be something small there to help out.

Really i just see people cribbing the Formations to use alongside a CAD. Those Cores are way to restrictive and the Bonus just isn't worth it, unless you bring Ghazy. But really all of this is just bringing us back to our 4th ed book. Rememeber that? Virtually the entire codex was Fearless for a fair chunk of the game. Now we can do that again, if you bring all of this stuff you dont want.

**gungo**

Grimmor wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:

If you read the Goff Kill Mob, it seems to require a basic Warboss(60 points), a unit of Nobz, three units of Boyz, Gorkanaut, Killa Kan unit, and two Deff Dreads.
That's 749 points.

Ok, thats significantly better. Still i dont want a Gorkanaught. I didnt want one when they came out with it and i dont want one now. Any way you look at it, both of these Core choices are lousy, not as lousy as Daemons, but about the same level as the Mont'ka ones for IG.

Seriously GW, you've done good Core choices before. The Reclamation Legion and Slaughtercult are both solid. Why? Because they have a low minimum and a high maximum and most (if not all) of the units in there are decent.

The Killmob and the Warband both have way to high of minimums for a Core choice, on top of needing to many types of units. Serously, i dont want that many walkers!!

gungo wrote:

You do realize ghaz supplement has a dread mob formation? In fact it's one of the new formation bundles for preorder. Unless you want to use the forgeworld dreads which only one of them is decent in the first place.

Do you realize that those aren't the same Dredds? The ones in IA8 have Ramshackle Beast and you can take small numbers of. Ghazy's Dred Mob is fething nuts on its requirments.

Theres a reason that Orks, competitively speaking, run either Bullyboyz+Blitz Brigade or Stompa+Vulcha Squad or Red Skull Kommandos. Or just yell sod it and spam Deffkoptas

The requirements on the formation don't matter it's a full list by itself. The only decent forgeworld dread is the mega dread the meka dread is garbage. Deff dreads and killa kans are exactly the same. And if you play with the misprinted buzzgrobs rule then a 500 point stompa is a good deal.

Competitve here is different we either see bike spam with the forgeworld bikerboss, buzzgrob stompa and man missiles, or greentide. I have never seen a kommando spam list and I occassionally run a 30 man squad of vulchas for gaks and giggles but they are not competitve. Deff Kopta spam is a remnant of 5th edition. However army wide fearless will do wonders making that msu list a lot more of a pain to deal with.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

the Signless wrote:
Do we have any ork formations that give options for how many units we can take? I have searched my supplements and looked over these rumours and it seems like every formations I have seen is always 3 of unit X and 6 of unit Y. Has that changed with this supplement or is there something that I am missing?

gungo wrote:
The dread mob is a decent list and does well
HA! Ha ha ha. Ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha.
Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha.
Ha.
No.
Ork walkers are overpriced, underpowered, and get glanced to death by everything.

Laugh all you want but the dread mob was still one of the highest placing ork lists in tournaments.
I agree they can do with army wide ramshackle however move run and charge each turn with rerolls does help them a lot.

There is small changes to restrictions on certain formations but still specific units. But things like the Goff mob no longer require 20 models in each boy unit.

**Brokk**

This new update to the supplement is just lazy copy paste with hardly any changes to the rules at all. This is the first decurion detachment where many of the auxiliary choices are without any formation, because they didn't already have one.

My second complaint would be the rules. The boss is watchin and tha biggest and da best is just punishing. The +2 to the mob rule table hurts so much! Your only option to avoid that is to make Ghazkull the warlord as he has his warlord trait fixed. The only way to do that is to bring in the council of waagh it seems.

If waaagh every turn would be such a good rule, then everyone would choose the ork warband formation from the Ork codex. There are hardly any benefits in this supplement that makes it better than the CAD-detachment with objective secured.

**Dakkafang Dreggrim**

Let's hope the Painmob is good I guess .......

**Brokk**

By the way. I emailed Forgeworld in january this year about the missing IA8. They did reply that they had no plans for a new edition of IA8 at the moment. I don't remember exactly how the worded the rest, but they said something about that they maybe would create a new IA book with the orks in it. I guess that the Elysian drop troops doesn't sell so good.

**Swampmist**

Brokk wrote:
This new update to the supplement is just lazy copy paste with hardly any changes to the rules at all. This is the first decurion detachment where many of the auxiliary choices are without any formation, because they didn't already have one.

My second complaint would be the rules. The boss is watchin and tha biggest and da best is just punishing. The +2 to the mob rule table hurts so much! Your only option to avoid that is to make Ghazkull the warlord as he has his warlord trait fixed. The only way to do that is to bring in the council of waagh it seems.

If waaagh every turn would be such a good rule, then everyone would choose the ork warband formation from the Ork codex. There are hardly any benefits in this supplement that makes it better than the CAD-detachment with objective secured.

Um... Where are you getting a +2 to the table from? No-one has said anything about it. Also, the warband is worse because you can't have Ghazghkull in it, who is the only one who makes use of it.

**gungo**

The only cool thing with the boss is watching is if you win a challenge you reroll to wound for the rest of the game. However being forced to challenge is still lame. I agree

Fearless is the only way to ignore mob rule.
Your choices is either ghaz, banner relic, or bullyboyz.

Also trukk boyz really aren't that good because when the trukk explodes as they usually do they always take out several boyz which is rough considering a trukk only holds 12 boyz Max.

I would of been happy with the decorian giving free upgrades to all boyz. Eavy armour is great if it wasn't so costly.

I'm still wondering what the other two new formations are...

**Swampmist**

Ok, did I miss something? When did those rules pop up, wut?

**Grimmor**

Swampmist wrote:
Ok, did I miss something? When did those rules pop up, wut?

Its the Waaagh Ghazy FOC specific rules, they both suck. Im not sure if they are in the new Orkcurion, but since im never gonna run it, i dont really care either way.

**Swampmist**

They are not, the orcurion just gives waaagh every turn and a better version of the HoW thing, which doesnt require you to roll a 10+ to charge. Dunno where you guys are coming from as such

.

**MajorWesJanson**

If only the Ork bonuses were half as good as the ones Space Wolves got. Imagine if Orks got even one of the bonuses of the Iron Wolf Formation- free vehicle upgrades, or move 12 and disembark, or +6 for flat out moves. Orks get none, while Space Wolves get ALL THREE

**Grimmor**

MajorWesJanson wrote:
If only the Ork bonuses were half as good as the ones Space Wolves got. Imagine if Orks got even one of the bonuses of the Iron Wolf Formation- free vehicle upgrades, or move 12 and disembark, or +6 for flat out moves. Orks get none, while Space Wolves get ALL THREE

Ya the rules are nice, but have you seen the pre reqs to get those???

**warboss**

Swampmist wrote:
...2000 points is apoc now? Huh, guess Ive been playing wrong then.

500pts is apoc now as there effectively is no difference. You use fliers, superheavies, formations, and can ignore factions and the CAD in both since 7th edition hit.