Person claims her experiences with Wyrd (and tabletop gaming) amount to terrorism

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**Breotan**

This one just hit my Facebook feed which means it's been out there a while. It is a post written by someone detailing how depraved and violent table top gamers are.

The essay that was linked target Wyrd (Malifaux) which was really strange as that is one of the more female-friendly games out there.

So, for your amusement (or ire) I'll link to the diatribe.

http://latining.tumblr.com/post/141567276944/tabletop-gaming-has-a-white-male-terrorism-problem

The first thing you notice is that it reads like something written by Jack Thompson during his anti-video game crusade. Claims of behavior that are alien to anything I have ever seen at a FLGS and the omission of those I have immediately suggest that the author is fabricating the entire thing. Make no mistake, this is a piece of work written by an activist for other activists.

I've not seen anything yet that indicates Wyrd's response (other than to ignore it), but the comments on Facebook by supposed games worry me greatly.

So, how prevalent is this stuff? I don't see much but then I'm not the type of person who collects friends and has a million posts across my FB feed each day.

**djones520**

Well thank god I play Eldar. Howling Banshees mean I get a pass, right?

Ok, having actually read through that... I'm about 100% positive that it's all made up.

**Breotan**

SJW seem to have appropriated the Bush Doctrine. Either you're with them or you're against them.

**Vaktathi**

Breotan wrote:
This one just hit my Facebook feed which means it's been out there a while. It is a post written by some SJW detailing how depraved and violent table top gamers are.

The essay that was linked target Wyrd (Malifaux) which was really strange as that is one of the more female-friendly games out there.

So, for your amusement (or ire) I'll link to the diatribe.

http://latining.tumblr.com/post/141567276944/tabletop-gaming-has-a-white-male-terrorism-problem

The first thing you notice is that it reads like something written by Jack Thompson during his anti-video game crusade. Claims of behavior that are alien to anything I have ever seen at a FLGS and the omission of those I have immediately suggest that the author is fabricating the entire thing. Make no mistake, this is a piece of work written by a SJW for other SJW's.

I've not seen anything yet that indicates Wyrd's response (other than to ignore it), but the comments on Facebook by supposed games worry me greatly.

So, how prevalent is this stuff? I don't see much but then I'm not the type of person who collects friends and has a million posts across my FB feed each day.

I've never seen the behavior claimed in the post...anywhere, at least not at the level being described aside from the occaisional one-off comment from the weird guy that shows up once or twice a year to look around but never actually plays. I'm sure it exists on some level somewhere, but outside of the basement trolls going out of their way to be offensive simply to get a rise out of people when they put themselves out there, I've never seen it actually be a real thing.

I see a whole lot of the SJW chatter on facebook amongst friends & acquaintances in certain social circles. One pal is a PHD student, goes to tons of computer science conferences and tech cons, but doesn't ever go to the panels or events that the event is centered around or talk about what new tech frontiers are being explored, but rather "microaggression" trainings, E-Harassment seminars, and panels on online behavior management. These are echo chambers of the worst kind borne from the best of intentions.

Methinks the author of this particular piece has spent a bit too much time in such echo chambers.

**djones520**

Vaktathi wrote:
Breotan wrote:
This one just hit my Facebook feed which means it's been out there a while. It is a post written by some SJW detailing how depraved and violent table top gamers are.

The essay that was linked target Wyrd (Malifaux) which was really strange as that is one of the more female-friendly games out there.

So, for your amusement (or ire) I'll link to the diatribe.

http://latining.tumblr.com/post/141567276944/tabletop-gaming-has-a-white-male-terrorism-problem

The first thing you notice is that it reads like something written by Jack Thompson during his anti-video game crusade. Claims of behavior that are alien to anything I have ever seen at a FLGS and the omission of those I have immediately suggest that the author is fabricating the entire thing. Make no mistake, this is a piece of work written by a SJW for other SJW's.

I've not seen anything yet that indicates Wyrd's response (other than to ignore it), but the comments on Facebook by supposed games worry me greatly.

So, how prevalent is this stuff? I don't see much but then I'm not the type of person who collects friends and has a million posts across my FB feed each day.

I've never seen the behavior claimed in the post...anywhere, at least not at the level being described aside from the occaisional one-off comment from the weird guy that shows up once or twice a year to look around but never actually plays. I'm sure it exists on some level somewhere, but outside of the basement trolls going out of their way to be offensive simply to get a rise out of people when they put themselves out there, I've never seen it actually be a real thing.

I see a whole lot of the SJW chatter on facebook amongst friends & acquaintances in certain social circles. One pal is a PHD student, goes to tons of computer science conferences and tech cons, but doesn't ever go to the panels or events that the event is centered around or talk about what new tech frontiers are being explored, but rather "microaggression" trainings, E-Harassment seminars, and panels on online behavior management. These are echo chambers of the worst kind borne from the best of intentions.

Methinks the author of this particular piece has spent a bit too much time in such echo chambers.

The post was made on TUMBLR...

**Tactical_Spam**

Has this SJW ever been in a CoD match in BO2? Can't tell you how many death threats come from there.

I will have to agree Breotan and say this is entirely fiction (or the SJW in question has terrible luck). There is some possibility of you being sexually harassed for... 7-8 years running, but I find it hard to imagine that nobody helped or payed any attention to this "victim."

**malfred**

I'd share this with other female gamers and see if their
experience matches the writer's. Could be that her own
community is just that fethed up.

**godardc**

What is a sjw ?

**Tactical_Spam**

godardc wrote:
What is a sjw ?

Social Justice Warrior. It tends to be used in a negative connotation.

**djones520**

godardc wrote:
What is a sjw ?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=SJW

Social Justice Warrior. A pejorative term for an individual who repeatedly and vehemently engages in arguments on social justice on the Internet, often in a shallow or not well-thought-out way, for the purpose of raising their own personal reputation. A social justice warrior, or SJW, does not necessarily strongly believe all that they say, or even care about the groups they are fighting on behalf of. They typically repeat points from whoever is the most popular blogger or commenter of the moment, hoping that they will "get SJ points" and become popular in return. They are very sure to adopt stances that are "correct" in their social circle.

The SJW's favorite activity of all is to dogpile. Their favorite websites to frequent are Livejournal and Tumblr. They do not have relevant favorite real-world places, because SJWs are primarily civil rights activists only online.

**Howard A Treesong**

I just don't believe a good chunk of what I've written. That group of people chanting at a 13 year old girl like that? Don't believe it. She says she won a 'precedent-setting human rights case', that's a big claim that needs backing up. She says she gets abuse directly from staff at Wyrd, where's the evidence? Multiple sexual assaults and no one says anything? Really? Most places I've been, there'd likely be quite a fuss made.

Some just doesn't make sense. She says 13% of people report unwanted sexual comments, but then goes on to say that if 13% of people suffered that at SDCC it would be 17,000 in a weekend. Well the 13% of cases is clearly a lifetime of gaming not all those reported in a weekend. Women unfortunately get harassed in all walks of life, I bet over 13% have suffered such comments out in the street at some point. While I won't defend such behaviour, to then say, imagine if 13% of women suffered such comments today in London - that's nearly half a million sexual assaults against women in 24 hours in one city! It's clearly nonsense, meaningless numbers pulled out of the air without logic or context, simply to shock.

I think there's sexism in this hobby but generally it's low level awkwardness, or it's inappropriate language. I particularly the use of the word 'rape' when simply saying that someone is going to lose badly. But open sexual assaults are not common. Other gamers do not just cover up for other players and laugh at women. The author of this piece describes numbers is extreme situations and then tars all 'white male' players as being deliberately complicit. Frankly it sounds like she has a problem with white men, given how often she needs to repeatedly specify the gender and ethnicity of the people she has a problem with, despite her examples of racism in particular being a bit thin.

**Jihadin**

Think I saw that before....even think I might have stepped in it by accident. Brown...black....smelly....yep...looks quite quite similar.

**flamingkillamajig**

Not to be too mean here but I find the most extreme SJW crowd to be players of 'sisters of battle'. Not all of em are but they usually pick the 'all female' faction as a sort of 'girls rule, boys drool' agenda. It's sad as 'sisters of battle' as a faction don't really push that agenda but being all female they somewhat do.

The odd thing I find is most girls tend to play factions outside of sisters of battle like eldar, orks, nids, daemons and some others. So they tend to like gender mixed factions or ones without a gender. I've also seen some that like imperial guard that had pretty much no women at all.

Anyway at the end of the day I don't think the supposedly SJW's are trying to help out all women so much as certain women or their idea of what women want even if it isn't true.

-------

If anything when 'warhammer fantasy' existed you'd imagine SJW's had no room to complain. Greenskins were gender neutral, all 3 elf factions had female characters and models, vampire counts had at least one female character and models (coven throne) and even a book main character that was female, tomb kings had a female character, ogres had a female model goofy as it was (rolling pin butcher or man o' war), warriors of chaos had a female character (valkia the bloody), bretonnia had damsels (the wizard ladies of the 'lady of the lake'), skaven sort of had forgeworld females (brood horrors) and probably more that I don't know about.

Of 15 factions that's a lot of representation for women for a hobby that I've seen maybe 2-3 women players in my entire game experience. Seriously I've only seen one GW employee that was female, one that was a girlfriend of a player and another that was sort of a wife. I don't know what the employee played but one wanted to play nids and one of the elf factions before AoS was a thing and the other played orks.

**chaos0xomega**

Here is Wyrds response: https://www.facebook.com/groups/AWYRDPLACE/permalink/471376139726122/?hc_location=ufi

Given what I know about the company, its employees, its policies and past behavior, I am inclined to believe Wyrd on this one.

In fact, I found the initial claims against Wyrd to be rather ridiculous, but as soon as I read "Old enough to bleed, old enough to breed" I was pretty sure it was all a load of bs.

Thats not to say that nobody would ever say it, but the idea that a group of warhammer 40k players would spontaneously erupt into chanting it after it was said by the person she was speaking to was outright comical, and conjures images of a gakky sexploitation film where they are in a torch lit dungeon where a bunch of illuminati types hidden beneath hoods slowly back their young naive victim into a corner as their claw like hands reach towards her and begin tearing at her clothes and flesh.

**malfred**

flamingkillamajig wrote:
Not to be too mean here but I find the most extreme SJW crowd to be players of 'sisters of battle'. Not all of em are but they usually pick the 'all female' faction as a sort of 'girls rule, boys drool' agenda. It's sad as 'sisters of battle' as a faction don't really push that agenda but being all female they somewhat do.

The odd thing I find is most girls tend to play factions outside of sisters of battle like eldar, orks, nids, daemons and some others. So they tend to like gender mixed factions or ones without a gender. I've also seen some that like imperial guard that had pretty much no women at all.

Anyway at the end of the day I don't think the supposedly SJW's are trying to help out all women so much as certain women or their idea of what women want even if it isn't true.

-------

If anything when 'warhammer fantasy' existed you'd imagine SJW's had no room to complain. Greenskins were gender neutral, all 3 elf factions had female characters and models, vampire counts had at least one female character and models (coven throne) and even a book main character that was female, tomb kings had a female character, ogres had a female model goofy as it was (rolling pin butcher or man o' war), warriors of chaos had a female character (valkia the bloody), bretonnia had damsels (the wizard ladies of the 'lady of the lake'), skaven sort of had forgeworld females (brood horrors) and probably more that I don't know about.

Of 15 factions that's a lot of representation for women for a hobby that I've seen maybe 2-3 women players in my entire game experience. Seriously I've only seen one GW employee that was female, one that was a girlfriend of a player and another that was sort of a wife. I don't know what the employee played but one wanted to play nids and one of the elf factions before AoS was a thing and the other played orks.

You should probably read the post. The author is female.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Here is Wyrds response: https://www.facebook.com/groups/AWYRDPLACE/permalink/471376139726122/?hc_location=ufi

Given what I know about the company, its employees, its policies and past behavior, I am inclined to believe Wyrd on this one.

In fact, I found the initial claims against Wyrd to be rather ridiculous, but as soon as I read "Old enough to bleed, old enough to breed" I was pretty sure it was all a load of bs.

Thats not to say that nobody would ever say it, but the idea that a group of warhammer 40k players would spontaneously erupt into chanting it after it was said by the person she was speaking to was outright comical, and conjures images of a gakky sexploitation film where they are in a torch lit dungeon where a bunch of illuminati types hidden beneath hoods slowly back their young naive victim into a corner as their claw like hands reach towards her and begin tearing at her clothes and flesh.

You'd have to share the text. It's a closed group.

**SlaveToDorkness**

Sounds like she was asking for it somehow....

(totally kidding, it sounds really made-up!)

**Breotan**

chaos0xomega wrote:
Here is Wyrds response: https://www.facebook.com/groups/AWYRDPLACE/permalink/471376139726122/?hc_location=ufi

The OP's FB page is... a lot of what you'd expect, I guess.

**flamingkillamajig**

Just read parts of this. I've never really been to game stores outside of GW's but from what I've seen this never takes place. If a gaming group exists with more than 5 women that's probably more than I've seen at any GW. While I'd imagine as gaming nerds we're not all the most comfortable bunch to be around if you're a woman (mostly an attractive one as average ones don't get any special treatment or interest). I don't think I've ever seen anything so extreme.

I think the worst thing I've ever done to a girl at a GW was say I thought it was funny that girls often enjoyed painting. I don't think she was too thrilled about that for some odd reason. I wasn't trying to be mean. It's more of an odd quirk I found. They are often really good at it. In general they just prefer stuff like painting, nids, orks and maybe elf factions. Not saying they all do but that's something quite a few of them do. It's like how somebody could say otakus loved tau.

Anyway I think most of this is crap. If this ever happened I'm pretty sure the people who did wrong in question would be punished. Not to mention the writer mentions groping and possibly rape as well as people insulting black players (huh?).

On the topic of black players we have at least a few at our local shop. 2 I've known are some of the nicest people you'd meet and another 2 have had moments of being jerks. Normally along the lines of teasing people though (one teased the fantasy players and the other was a GW manager at some point and was fun though sometimes teased too).

**chaos0xomega**

Wyrd Response via Nathan Caroland (owner)

Yeah, I've read this, and we've seen the same thing from this individual last year when she expressed herself in our forums (you can easily find it if you really want to read through all that vitriol) and then took it upon herself to hound after my employees to demand a direct talk with myself, how I am responsible for stepping up to make certain the community at large (the whole of gaming and geek society, not just Malifaux) is policed, and to bring her on board to be the Woman's Ambassador to Gaming and to make certain that Wyrd is doing it right and proper as we're apparently misogynistic asses here. Considering that a large majority of the work force here is female, the males are outnumbered, I sort of kinda doubt we're all running around scratching our crotches and telling the ladies how they do it for us.

Somewhere in there apparently threats have been issues to her in my name as well as the company's and supposedly that there are copious amounts of evidence that has been made available to the Canadian law authorities as well as the FBI (which apparently were soon to swoop down and confiscate our entire office computers and arrest us if I didn't take the time to take her Skype call). That never happened. We also never received any copies of said evidence so that we could follow up or ban individuals from this end.

After multiple phone calls, e-mails, etc, etc, etc she and her circle of friends have been told to please do hand over any and all evidence to the authorities as we do not condone or tolerate any behavior of that matter, beyond that, all harassment calls without evidence beyond someones anger at the community could be directed to our on retainer lawyer who would love nothing more than to bill me for the privilege of telling folks legally what and where to go with it and to please bring forth legal evidence so that it can be sorted directly. To date that has never happened, and neither myself, the company or any individuals within it condone such behavior and if we did find someone of that ilk among us, it would be a rather large surprise, and a swift exit out the door to authorities.

As this issue is almost a year old at this point and I've yet to see any evidence to date, nor been contacted by authorities in any manner, I can only assume that someone is wanting to stir the waters and get attention. I neither know this individual personally nor what has happened in their history, what I do know. is what she has tried to do to this company and community with zero evidence of any misbehavior from anyone at Wyrd.

**flamingkillamajig**

Wow this woman sounds pretty freaking terrible. Considering I've never noticed any of these things in the gaming scene myself esp. to that absurd degree I can only assume she's full of it.

Sounded like she also wanted a position of power and sort of tried to blackmail for it. Jeez she's out of control.

The owner should seriously consider filing a lawsuit against her and her constant harassment provided that's possible.

**Oldmike**

The same line is being used in video games "hire me or I will call your game sexist/Transphobic" and sadly it works as it's seen as cheaper than the negative publicity.

**chaos0xomega**

Im not going to say that this stuff doesn't happen in gamer/nerd culture. I/we know for a fact that it does, but this womans claims in particular and clearly over the top and reading her post make me suspect that she has a very clear axe to grind - the entire post should have been hashtagged #onlywhitemen

**flamingkillamajig**

Oldmike wrote:
The same line is being used in video games "hire me or I will call your game sexist/Transphobic" and sadly it works as it's seen as cheaper than the negative publicity.

In many ways I hate the 2012 time period onward. Maybe the world really did end in a sense and now we're living a trigger happy SJW world. Sad thing is there are places in the world where women do have it bad as well as race and religion. Pretty sure this is what the First World Problems Meme started existing for. What's sad is that real struggles happen (people dying from terrorist attacks for example) and in comparison these people's problems are a joke in comparison.

**Tactical_Spam**

flamingkillamajig wrote:
Wow this woman sounds pretty freaking terrible. Considering I've never noticed any of these things in the gaming scene myself esp. to that absurd degree I can only assume she's full of it.

Sounded like she also wanted a position of power and sort of tried to blackmail for it. Jeez she's out of control.

The owner should seriously consider filing a lawsuit against her and her constant harassment provided that's possible.

After reading through 30-odd pages of her Tumblr, I can tell you she LOVES bashing white men. There are occasionally valid issues, but the woman blows the rest of it way out of proportion. Most of the issues end in something like the OP; there is a problem, but I am going to make this gak up about it. Pretty fethin sad really.

**flamingkillamajig**

Tactical_Spam wrote:
flamingkillamajig wrote:
Wow this woman sounds pretty freaking terrible. Considering I've never noticed any of these things in the gaming scene myself esp. to that absurd degree I can only assume she's full of it.

Sounded like she also wanted a position of power and sort of tried to blackmail for it. Jeez she's out of control.

The owner should seriously consider filing a lawsuit against her and her constant harassment provided that's possible.

After reading through 30-odd pages of her Tumblr, I can tell you she LOVES bashing white men. There are occasionally valid issues, but the woman blows the rest of it way out of proportion. Most of the issues end in something like the OP; there is a problem, but I am going to make this gak up about it. Pretty fethin sad really.

Why are white men the new devil in the world? Seriously aside from being pervy to women in my life I don't think I've really held power over any woman since ever or offended them. I mean sheesh even in some games some girl gamers have been awful to me for no reason or next to no reason. Why don't you hear about that? I mean i'll admit I've had my bad moments but never about saying women couldn't do something or do what they like.

Seriously just about all the women of my age in my family have better paying jobs than their male equivalents. This is absolutely insulting to hear. Not only that but making it out that men of other races can never be offensive to women by the SJW crowd. I'm pretty sure even Dave Chappelle commented on how black men supposedly objectify women (joking they did that a while back).

------

The saddest part of all this is you have to police your own language before writing it sometimes too. At one point a dakka member's wife played 'the witcher' series and I was curious why. I didn't say the reason why I was curious but it is because the game often has what the SJW crowd would see as being offensive to women or super empowering to men with all the hot women he has sex with (it'd be like a guy questioning why a girl wants to play 'duke nukem'). Suddenly for being curious about why said girl would play said game meant to a person that I was somehow not wanting a girl to play said game. Jeez it's like people want to be offended and to claim meanings and intent that the original speaker or writer didn't intend.

**OgreChubbs**

Another one of these huh....... Sad to say but I am not suprised she is from Canada.

When I was in highschool we had a female activist teacher tell us daily how men are pigs and women are better off with out men. Then as time went on these girls poped out of hishschool looking to keep the good fight going. So they would jump on issues that dont exist anymore. One actually got into a fight because she believed that the reason you marked your sex down on voting cards was because they threw out votes by women cause white men dont respect them......

It is like they want to be back in the day figting for rights they already have. Hell the girl on cnn was saying when bernie sandrs inturpted hillary clinton with a funny sounding voice it was ok. but when he sounded grump and talked to her like a rivial it was to far and typical man abuse to women....

**Tactical_Spam**

flamingkillamajig wrote:
Why are white men the new devil in the world?

You have to blame all your problems on someone, yes? Its so easy to blame those who "have been in power" because if they reverse the blame, it looks like they are oppressing someone, doesn't it? Why does the American Media feel the need to point out every "White cop shoots black guy" case and place the blame on the Cop, including the cases where the black guy was clearly in the wrong? Why is it so easy for the Left to call the Right "intolerant" whilst being intolerant themselves?

**flamingkillamajig**

OgreChubbs wrote:
Another one of these huh....... Sad to say but I am not suprised she is from Canada.

You could always consider moving to another country. I know people crap on the usa but it is one of the countries that isn't as big on this subject far as I know. Dunno how things are in the UK.

Tactical_Spam wrote:
flamingkillamajig wrote:
Why are white men the new devil in the world?

You have to blame all your problems on someone, yes? Its so easy to blame those who "have been in power" because if they reverse the blame, it looks like they are oppressing someone, doesn't it? Why does the American Media feel the need to point out every "White cop shoots black guy" case and place the blame on the Cop, including the cases where the black guy was clearly in the wrong? Why is it so easy for the Left to call the Right "intolerant" whilst being intolerant themselves?

At the end of the day sometimes I have seen how I fail and sometimes blamed those that hurt me. Truthfully though I kept holding myself down and held myself back. While they hurt me it was my choice to keep holding myself back.

There's actually a movie with this as a lesson learned by the end of the movie. It has woodie harrelson I think and is about him being a professional bowler taking a Mormon guy under him and training him to be great like he was. Supposedly woody's character almost won a big bowling tournament or something but ended out 2nd place and it really got to him. By the end of the movie he realizes he could've picked himself back up and didn't.

It's sad how in many ways these people could benefit from that movie's lesson.

**OgreChubbs**

Tactical_Spam wrote:
flamingkillamajig wrote:
Why are white men the new devil in the world?

You have to blame all your problems on someone, yes? Its so easy to blame those who "have been in power" because if they reverse the blame, it looks like they are oppressing someone, doesn't it? Why does the American Media feel the need to point out every "White cop shoots black guy" case and place the blame on the Cop, including the cases where the black guy was clearly in the wrong? Why is it so easy for the Left to call the Right "intolerant" whilst being intolerant themselves?

I blame it on the fooling people syndrome.

You know like when you see a weight loss commercial or those bible ones. You know you are in trouble when these comments show up.

Its not your fault
This is the reason you are not getting/got what you want
You do not have t work harder or better
Give me money/ follow me and

Soon as you see those things you know it is a scam.

flamingkillamajig wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
Another one of these huh....... Sad to say but I am not suprised she is from Canada.

You could always consider moving to another country. I know people crap on the usa but it is one of the countries that isn't as big on this subject far as I know. Dunno how things are in the UK.

Oh I LOVE Canada and 80% of what we do but are policey on this type of stuff makes me sick how they teach it at school. Our sex ed class taught us that if you touch a girl before 18 even if your under 18 your a rapist cause she cant concent then went on to tell the girls it is natural to have the desire to have sex.

Then the whole trudo idiot if we love isis they will stop killing people..... like.... this is what you get when you hire a snow boarding teacher to lead your country.

Oh I am editing to make sure I make sopmething clear cause people on here think I grumpy lol.

I am not for anyone getting hurt or upset and I do not agree with ANYONE for ANY reason to get picked on ever. But I do know click exist where they pick on new comers and altho not fair it happens. If any of this stuff did happen to her god love her hope they get whats coming to them. But at GW the store owners are known to be... close talkers and very aggresive to get sales. When your a man getting followed by a man smiling and telling you about stuff it is creepy but expected. When your a woman 90% of the time if thats happeneing he may be a rapist lol.

**Oldmike**

Sadly the uk is just as bad if not worse some have made a job out of exposing the SJW types and all the biggest ones are from UK. After all the BBC ran a program that stated men are raised to hate women. Sadly it was not a joke.