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Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




 shinros wrote:
Herzlos wrote:
I think the next year will be more telling, as the remnants of the Old World gamers have moved on and there's essentially nothing left for them at GW. Of course, if they manage to group Blood Bowl in with AoS sales, AoS will have a bumper year.


Most of them have already moved on ages ago to other games or 9th age. I don't think next year will be the most telling that's what people said the last time predicting that AOS will do even worse than WHFB they said that this report will truly show how AOS is doing according to them, yet low and behold it didn't. So when will people be satisfied? Until the next one? Or the one after that?



Probably when substantial fantasy sales no longer fall within the financial year.
   
Made in ie
Calculating Commissar




Frostgrave

 shinros wrote:

Most of them have already moved on ages ago to other games or 9th age. I don't think next year will be the most telling that's what people said the last time predicting that AOS will do even worse than WHFB they said that this report will truly show how AOS is doing according to them, yet low and behold it didn't. So when will people be satisfied? Until the next one? Or the one after that?


The first pure AOS year, i.e. next year, will tell. Whilst a lot of WHFB fans went to other places when AoS dropped, a lot of people were still rounding out armies using GW SKU's which would have reported as sales for AoS, like everything that was cleared out - were people buying the last of the Bretonian or Empire stock AoS players?

This is anecdotal but so far since AOS came out in my GW store there is actually gaps in my friend(who is the manager) fantasy shelf. That never happened before he was telling me constantly that his AOS range is actually doing better than when we had WHFB. Of course I had no evidence I am just glad this report reflect's what he said. This is based on the second half were AOS had to stand on it's own two legs and I feel it has.


Hopefully it is picking up, but without knowing how many kits are coming in, clearing shelves isn't big news. I've heard reports of stores ordering in a lot less (like, 1 of everything instead of 3/4), which means shelves will clear more quickly.

With the general handbook out and the new types of battle tome's I think AOS will do okay in the future.


I hope so, I'd be quite interetsed in getting into a 2nd or 3rd Edition of it with the boy.
   
Made in dk
Regular Dakkanaut




 shinros wrote:
Most of them have already moved on ages ago to other games or 9th age. I don't think next year will be the most telling that's what people said the last time predicting that AOS will do even worse than WHFB they said that this report will truly show how AOS is doing according to them, yet low and behold it didn't. So when will people be satisfied? Until the next one? Or the one after that?

Never because it does not fit their preferred narrative.

It's not about truth or facts, it's about what they want the truth to be - What feels right rather than what is right. It feels unfair that a company is doing well, when they stopped supporting your prefered brand of game. Therefore all signs must be bend to fit the narrative, rather than the other way around.
   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





Spiky Norman wrote:
 shinros wrote:
Most of them have already moved on ages ago to other games or 9th age. I don't think next year will be the most telling that's what people said the last time predicting that AOS will do even worse than WHFB they said that this report will truly show how AOS is doing according to them, yet low and behold it didn't. So when will people be satisfied? Until the next one? Or the one after that?

Never because it does not fit their preferred narrative.

It's not about truth or facts, it's about what they want the truth to be - What feels right rather than what is right. It feels unfair that a company is doing well, when they stopped supporting your prefered brand of game. Therefore all signs must be bend to fit the narrative, rather than the other way around.


*sigh* just kinda tired of all this money talk.

I should just be satisfied that warhammer age of sigmar is doing well. At least it's flat than a loss so they can still pull through, as I said before they need to get their IP out to good game developers that is the thing that will truly help them.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 11:38:39


 
   
Made in us
Stoic Grail Knight





Raleigh, NC

I'd have to guess that AOS is at least stabilized, if not picking up a little steam by now, especially with some of the new releases. However, I do wonder if 40k is starting to really take a hit too: that game has had a lot of negativity over the last two editions (again, with GW calling 7th a lame duck) and it seems its global sales are on a continued downward trend.

AOS could actually start making decent money, but if the course for 40k isn't rectified things will probably get much worse for GW.
   
Made in es
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine





Falling revenue is never good news.

If not for the royalties, profits would have taken quite a dent.

Total War (plus some help from Vermintide and others) saved their asses this year.

On one hand this shows they've managed to finally make their IP truly profitable out of the miniature market itself, on the other the core issues within the company (and their business model) seem to remain the same.

Progress is like a herd of pigs: everybody is interested in the produced benefits, but nobody wants to deal with all the resulting gak.

GW customers deserve every bit of outrageous princing they get. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Inflation has been running about 1% per year. In addition, most investors are looking for growth from a business.

Revenue is down 1%
Op profit before royalties is down 27%
Total op profit is up 2%

While changing the business model is a good thing, the licensed items aren't going keep the company going in the long run, because someone will eventually buy their IP if they are just a royalty company.

CSM Undivided
CSM Khorne 
   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





 Accolade wrote:
I'd have to guess that AOS is at least stabilized, if not picking up a little steam by now, especially with some of the new releases. However, I do wonder if 40k is starting to really take a hit too: that game has had a lot of negativity over the last two editions (again, with GW calling 7th a lame duck) and it seems its global sales are on a continued downward trend.

AOS could actually start making decent money, but if the course for 40k isn't rectified things will probably get much worse for GW.


I suspect 40k is next year. There is talk on bell of lost souls that the new AOS battle tome's are most likely paving the way for 40k. I think if they get 40k back on track things should be good hopefully.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 12:06:15


 
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





One interesting thing, Total War: Warhammer sold around 800k copies according to SteamSpy. If it sold for an average of $40 that means some $32 million in sales. If you take a guess and say £4 million of the royalties money came from Total War (given they made £4.4M more in royalties this year compared to last year). If we take an exchange rate of about 1.5, that means $6M in royalties. With those numbers GW would have made roughly 19% off each copy of TW:Warhmmer sold

That estimate might be a bit high, might be underestimating how much TWW sold for on average or overestimating it's contribution, but I'd be guessing in the 10-15% range still.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 12:10:03


 
   
Made in no
Stealthy Grot Snipa





AllSeeingSkink wrote:
One interesting thing, Total War: Warhammer sold around 800k copies according to SteamSpy. If it sold for an average of $40 that means some $32 million in sales. If you take a guess and say £4 million of the royalties money came from Total War (given they made £4.4M more in royalties this year compared to last year). If we take an exchange rate of about 1.5, that means $6M in royalties. With those numbers GW would have made roughly 19% off each copy of TW:Warhmmer sold

That estimate might be a bit high, might be underestimating how much TWW sold for on average or overestimating it's contribution, but I'd be guessing in the 10-15% range still.


They made about £4.6m from PC and console games in total, and in addition to Total War there's Vermintide and Blood Bowl 2 (560k + 120k).

Plus other games not menioned in the report, and smaller numbers of older games.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 12:21:16


"The Emporer is a rouge trader."
- Charlie Chaplain. 
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





 Thud wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
One interesting thing, Total War: Warhammer sold around 800k copies according to SteamSpy. If it sold for an average of $40 that means some $32 million in sales. If you take a guess and say £4 million of the royalties money came from Total War (given they made £4.4M more in royalties this year compared to last year). If we take an exchange rate of about 1.5, that means $6M in royalties. With those numbers GW would have made roughly 19% off each copy of TW:Warhmmer sold

That estimate might be a bit high, might be underestimating how much TWW sold for on average or overestimating it's contribution, but I'd be guessing in the 10-15% range still.


They made about £4.6m from PC and console games in total, and in addition to Total War there's Vermintide and Blood Bowl 2 (560k + 120k).

Plus other games not menioned in the report, and smaller numbers of older games.
I missed the £4.6m figure. Still, £4M from Total War probably isn't a bad estimate, I don't think Vermintide sold nearly as well as TWW and I think it had a lower price at launch as well, so the lion share is going to come from TWW. Even if you lower the estimate of royalties to £3M and raise the average sale price to $50, that's still in the 10~15% range.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

Can someone with access (and not on their phone) check the % sale numbers by channel year over year? It looks like this year their retail stores were 41%, indy trade stores 38%, and website/mail order 21%. I'm curious how their marketshare in FLGS is trending as that is where I traditionally buy/play.

We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in ch
Been Around the Block




Next year the new Dawn of War will probably save them xD
   
Made in gb
Armored Iron Breaker






I adore such lines in the report as:

"We are proud to manufacture our product in Nottingham."

When the Chaos Dreadhold and the new 40k base kits are labeled to be made in China.

Its also funny that even with the great clearance sales there is a drop in revenue.

Oh well I guess I need to Ebay Bretonnians and Tomb Kings.

Fauk Dawn of War wont save them. Its looks like a MOBA not as a Dawn of War game. That can hurt the Core audience.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 14:30:46


   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





herjan1987 wrote:
I adore such lines in the report as:

"We are proud to manufacture our product in Nottingham."

When the Chaos Dreadhold and the new 40k base kits are labeled to be made in China.

Its also funny that even with the great clearance sales there is a drop in revenue.

Oh well I guess I need to Ebay Bretonnians and Tomb Kings.

Fauk Dawn of War wont save them. Its looks like a MOBA not as a Dawn of War game. That can hurt the Core audience.


Well it's pre-alpha I won't judge it until I play it for myself who knows I might have fun with it.
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





The Rock

Fauk wrote:
Next year the new Dawn of War will probably save them xD


Doubt it. So far DoW III has done bugger all to pull me in. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.

AoV's Hobby Blog 29/04/18 The Tomb World stirs p44
How to take decent photos of your models
There's a beast in every man, and it stirs when you put a sword in his hand
Most importantly, Win or Lose, always try to have fun.
Armies Legion: Dark Angels 
   
Made in gb
Armored Iron Breaker






 shinros wrote:


Well it's pre-alpha I won't judge it until I play it for myself who knows I might have fun with it.


It would require significant changes and going by the developers words they will go this way.

I guess this will be the new look of 40k in general even in the TT.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 14:44:57


   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





 angelofvengeance wrote:
Fauk wrote:
Next year the new Dawn of War will probably save them xD


Doubt it. So far DoW III has done bugger all to pull me in. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.


I still have the scar of Gabriel jumping around in terminator armor.
   
Made in fr
Inquisitorial Keeper of the Xenobanks





France

herjan1987 wrote:
I adore such lines in the report as:

"We are proud to manufacture our product in Nottingham."

When the Chaos Dreadhold and the new 40k base kits are labeled to be made in China.

Its also funny that even with the great clearance sales there is a drop in revenue.

Oh well I guess I need to Ebay Bretonnians and Tomb Kings.

Fauk Dawn of War wont save them. Its looks like a MOBA not as a Dawn of War game. That can hurt the Core audience.


Some kits are made in china ?! Which one ?

   
Made in gb
Armored Iron Breaker






 godardc wrote:


Some kits are made in china ?! Which one ?


According to Spikeybits all the Age of Sigmar terrain sprues are made in China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zk0DdxQbD3E

Look at 1.35

Also the new basing kits for 40k : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cx8bgbrIJ_4

Look at 2.29

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 14:53:15


   
Made in gb
[ADMIN]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






London, UK

Yeah most GW terrain appears to be getting made in China now.

Check out our new, fully plastic tabletop wargame - Maelstrom's Edge, made by Dakka!
 
   
Made in gb
Armored Iron Breaker






 legoburner wrote:
Yeah most GW terrain appears to be getting made in China now.


Did the chinese occupy Nottingham, like the UK occupied Hong Kong?

   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





It might be that GW doesn't have the necessary machinery in house to make the large sprues for the terrain pieces? Or maybe if they're only doing short runs, my understanding is you can use cheaper processes for making the moulds which maybe again they can't do in house.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka




angelofvengeance wrote:Just read it and it's nice to see a more professional element to these things rather than the deranged statements Kirby came out with lol.


But now it's not so entertaining.

motski wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
They say AoS is selling better than WHFB has been in the past years, but that's not saying much because WHFB had received very little attention in recent years and 8th ed was poorly received.


Maybe so but the hater crowd claims it sells worse than WHFB did and was some kind of financial disaster for GW. Good to hear the official word on the matter.


If true that AoS is selling better and the 4 out of 5 months their increased sales (or was it profits?) are showing. So that is a good sign then AoS is healthy if the facts are true. What that means though is 40K is doing worse than people are saying or thinking.

legoburner wrote:Yeah most GW terrain appears to be getting made in China now.


So much for everything being done in Nottingham. I also got a chuckle of "all...... artwork.....done in Nottingham." I thought they outsourced their artwork and not all the artwork is done in house. A bit of confusing statements or mis truths being told.

Also my favourite statement from Mr Roundtree.

In my opinion the greatest risk is the same one that we repeat each year, namely, management. So long as we have the right people in the right jobs we will be fine. Problems will arise if the board allows egos and private agendas to rule. I will do my utmost to ensure that this does not happen on my watch.


Doesn't sound like a Kirby croney at all.

So I guess we will really have to wait till next year to see the full results or at least, January for the 1/2 year report.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/07/26 15:38:00


Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.

Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?

Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong".  
   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





Wow I missed that line good on Kevin IMO. I think GW should overall be okay with him in charge.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/07/26 17:06:26


 
   
Made in ca
Rampaging Carnifex





Toronto, Ontario

In my opinion the greatest risk is the same one that we repeat each year, namely, management. So long as we have the right people in the right jobs we will be fine. Problems will arise if the board allows egos and private agendas to rule. I will do my utmost to ensure that this does not happen on my watch.


The fact that this is in the preamble only makes me like Rountree even more. I really hope he continues to take the company in the right direction and I think a lot of what he's done so far has been fantastic. I'm cautiously optimistic about the future of 40K.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

The ol' Kirby moat 'round the castle darn folks stealing mah' pigs preambles were more entertaining though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/26 17:08:40


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Stoic Grail Knight





Raleigh, NC

 warboss wrote:
The ol' Kirby moat 'round the castle darn folks stealing mah' pigs preambles were more entertaining though.


I mean, who remembers Pokemon, amirite??

Wanders off trying to catch a Squirtle
   
Made in gb
The Daemon Possessing Fulgrim's Body





Devon, UK

That egos and agenda thing was in the last report too, it certainly reads like a subtle "Kirby was an idiot, mah house now" sort of sentiment.

I agree that a lot of stuff, both factual and anecdotal, coming out of GW recently seems to be positive, but let's not gloss over the fact that the licensing revenue saved their ass, and it's another period of contraction for the core business.

Sadly, it won't matter how popular Rountree's tenure is with hobbyists if it doesn't have a tangible, positive, commercial impact. There's still time, but I'd have liked to have seen more of a reaction after, what, 18 months?

We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark

The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.

The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox

Ask me about
Barnstaple Slayers Club 
   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





 Azreal13 wrote:
That egos and agenda thing was in the last report too, it certainly reads like a subtle "Kirby was an idiot, mah house now" sort of sentiment.

I agree that a lot of stuff, both factual and anecdotal, coming out of GW recently seems to be positive, but let's not gloss over the fact that the licensing revenue saved their ass, and it's another period of contraction for the core business.

Sadly, it won't matter how popular Rountree's tenure is with hobbyists if it doesn't have a tangible, positive, commercial impact. There's still time, but I'd have liked to have seen more of a reaction after, what, 18 months?


According to my GW manager and area manager everyone did actually hate the guy and like what kevin is doing for the company.
   
 
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