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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 17:37:21
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus
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So a thought came to me last night: how nimble are warlord titans? Can they do simple things like climb stairs (assuming there are stairs large enough) or jump over a casm or something? can they squat down to get lower? Can they do simple kicks against other titans without falling over, or even just knee strikes?
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413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 17:48:33
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar
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They are slow, ponderous, and top heavy.
But their legs should have a decent range of motion. I’d guess “no” on jumping, but “yes" on the others.
Of course, I’m sure there is some fluff somewhere of them doing backflips. But that just strikes me as wrong.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 18:25:04
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Glorious Lord of Chaos
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
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It is about Terminators doing backflips and that alone is too much imo. As someone who has a Warlord Titan model, I can assure you that this thing would not be able to jump on anything but the very lowest gravity worlds, and I am not sure if it would want to! Squatting is quite probable, and a kick should not be impossible (I suspect that is how it has strength D in melee without CCWs) but yeah, no jumping. Most chasms should be simple for it to just step over; anything too wide for its maximum stride should be impossible for it to cross.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/06 18:25:49
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 18:48:51
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential
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There are stairs in the novel titanicus that a completed Titan walks on its first leaving the forge. It strides down a mountain.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 21:01:06
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
Adelaide, South Australia
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Warlords have changed over time. Back in the old Adeptus Titanicus, warlords could jump- albeit with jump jets- considerable distances and heights. But they were also smaller then, much smaller, though it was still one of the less plausible things they did. I suspect it was little more than an attempt to mirror Battletech at the time and is one piece of fluff well buried.
It does beg the question, what kind of slopes, chasms or pits would be necessary to halt or trap a warlord. Everything has a maximum incline it can traverse and top heavy titans are going to hit that sooner rather than later. It also occurs to me that a warlord must exert massive pressure on its forward foot as it walks. I imagine that on an Imperial world, any sort of urban area is likely to have underground components which can bear the weight of anything in daily life but would cave in when the full weight of a warlord was pressed upon it. Structural damage- the type fighting involving a titan could do- would certainly not help. I wonder what kind of drop would be fatal to a warlord. Not as in destroy it, but if it planted a foot on the roof of an uderground tunnel, which then plunged say, 20m to the tunnel floor, would that be sufficient to sent the titan toppling?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 21:36:34
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Not that high at all. Biologist actually have formula's for these kind off questions. I will not bother you with the details but general terms it goes something like this: if you are bigger you can jump/fall less high without breaking your bones.
The same thing would be true for huge metal constructs.
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Inactive, user. New profile might pop up in a while |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/06 21:50:39
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Glorious Lord of Chaos
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
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I suspect it is very vulnerable to falling damage proportional to its size, but it is worth mentioning that it is equipped with various stabilizers, weight distributors and other arcane pieces of technology, so it may be more resilient than it looks.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/07 14:26:14
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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They are not nimble at all.
They are slow plonding weapons platforms not ninjas
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/07 14:47:56
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Courageous Space Marine Captain
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Why would a Warlord Titan need to jump? Anything big enough to stand in its way can be walked through (ie, buildings). Anything not able to be walked through (Baneblades, Titans), can be blown to pieces via Volcano Cannon.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/07 14:56:22
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus
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Deadshot wrote:Why would a Warlord Titan need to jump? Anything big enough to stand in its way can be walked through (ie, buildings). Anything not able to be walked through (Baneblades, Titans), can be blown to pieces via Volcano Cannon.
let's just say i was curious, espcially about kicks and knee strikes
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413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/07 15:00:30
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Courageous Space Marine Captain
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Tiger9gamer wrote: Deadshot wrote:Why would a Warlord Titan need to jump? Anything big enough to stand in its way can be walked through (ie, buildings). Anything not able to be walked through (Baneblades, Titans), can be blown to pieces via Volcano Cannon.
let's just say i was curious, espcially about kicks and knee strikes
Personally I can't see the model having the speed or ability to kick. Any kicks would be akin to the walking through a wall. "Melee" combat between Titans without CCW likely consists of slamming the guns on the opponent or a shoulder charge and rely on pure weight of the blow to do damage, while a Stomp Attack is obvious. Warlords aren't really aimed for Melee though.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 01:42:35
Subject: Re:How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Douglas Bader
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The real threat wouldn't be damage from falling, it would be falling down and being unable to get up. It's not going to take much to trip a Warlord (or any other titan), and once it goes down it has no way to pull itself back up. It has no arms, its legs don't have the angle to provide the necessary leverage, and attempting to carry its whole weight on its guns as improvised arms would probably just destroy the guns without accomplishing anything. So even if the titan's structure survives the fall without any major damage it's effectively killed until a salvage crew can get to it.
(This is one of many reasons why titans are a really stupid idea, but hey, it makes sense for the Imperium to have stupid things.)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/08 01:43:39
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 02:53:47
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
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oldzoggy wrote:Not that high at all. Biologist actually have formula's for these kind off questions. I will not bother you with the details but general terms it goes something like this: if you are bigger you can jump/fall less high without breaking your bones.
The same thing would be true for huge metal constructs.
At least on TVTropes, it's called the Square-Cube Law. Namely muscles work by surface area, but an object's mass is measured in volume, so it takes exponentially more strength to lift something with proportionally more mass (or something of that sort. It's late here and my brain no math at night).
However there mere existence of Titans flies in the face of that law since it either has to have paper thin armor or it will collapse in on itself the moment it moves. Funny enough, the Tyranids of all things managed a pretty decent solution for this: make the Bio-Titan a Psyker and hold itself up with a psychic field, negating the laws of physics.
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Gwar! wrote:Huh, I had no idea Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines posted on Dakka. Hi Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can I have an Autograph!
Kanluwen wrote:
Hell, I'm not that bothered by the Stormraven. Why? Because, as it stands right now, it's "limited use".When it's shoehorned in to the Codex: Space Marines, then yeah. I'll be irked.
When I'm editing alot, you know I have a gakload of homework to (not) do. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 03:17:49
Subject: Re:How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
Adelaide, South Australia
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Peregrine wrote:It's not going to take much to trip a Warlord (or any other titan),
Which makes you wonder why there's no dedicated mechanism for mission killing the most powerful units ever seen on the battlefield using such a tactic.
Peregrine wrote:(This is one of many reasons why titans are a really stupid idea, but hey, it makes sense for the Imperium to have stupid things.)
Which unfortunately doesn't explain the titans of other races. No argument that giant mecha/titans are stupid though.
I just feel like if I was a Princeps I'd be terrified every step in an urban environment was going to plunge through into some underground facility. I very much doubt 'Support the weight of a warlord titan' is in the building codes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 03:26:55
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Glorious Lord of Chaos
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
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Ashiraya wrote:it is worth mentioning that it is equipped with various stabilizers, weight distributors and other arcane pieces of technology, so it may be more resilient than it looks.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 03:29:40
Subject: Re:How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Douglas Bader
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Kojiro wrote:Which makes you wonder why there's no dedicated mechanism for mission killing the most powerful units ever seen on the battlefield using such a tactic.
Because it would get in the way of the "OMG TITANS ARE THE MOST AWESOMEST EVAR" fluff that GW wants to have. To have titans "work" you have to handwave away all of the weaknesses and just accept the lack of realistic counters as part of having giant walking cathedrals full of guns.
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There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 03:48:02
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
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Interestingly the titans of other races (except Tau) actually do make some sense:
Eldar - Titans are made up of Wraithbone or some other kind of psychoplastic, meaning that their properties can easily handwave most of the problems conventional walkers face. Being literal Magitek helps there.
Orks - They're essentially walking pyramids. While the usual "ork believes it works so it works" can be used, Ork Titans are actually the most structurally sound titans since they have massive feet on short legs and are basically walking traffic cones, so tripping, falling and stuff aren't an issue.
Tyranids - Like I mentioned, Psychic fields. Generally anything that can use psychic in this setting kicks physics to the curb. Otherwise the Hierophant should have imploded in a shower of gore the moment it made planetfall.
The Tau are an interesting case because prior to the Riptide, Stormsurge and Taun'nar suits, they didn't have giant robots specifically because they were impractical; the Manta was suppose to be the titan equivalent, which made a lot more sense since an aircraft is a much more practical delivery system for mounted weapons.
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Gwar! wrote:Huh, I had no idea Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines posted on Dakka. Hi Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can I have an Autograph!
Kanluwen wrote:
Hell, I'm not that bothered by the Stormraven. Why? Because, as it stands right now, it's "limited use".When it's shoehorned in to the Codex: Space Marines, then yeah. I'll be irked.
When I'm editing alot, you know I have a gakload of homework to (not) do. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 06:35:19
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Courageous Space Marine Captain
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Titans are made from fictional supermetals with properties ranging from "stronger than anything we have today" to "lol I do as I please because its fictional."
Further, how are you going to trip a Titan? Where are you going to find a cable long enough, strong enough, to trip it, AT-AT style, and where are you going to find something strong enough that when the Titan hts it it won't simply rip the cable from its mounting?
Let's show this;
Titan walks, hits a cable. Cable snaps.
Or
Titan hits cable, cable holds but the fastenings attaching it to nearby buildings rip out of the wall.
Anything big enough to knock a Titan over very physically pushing or shooting is a threat that the Titan will engage and shoot at. And any blow hard enough to knock it over are going to do serious damage to the titan anyway, so its unlikely falling over is going to do much worse.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 12:01:24
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Heroic Senior Officer
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An Impératrice titan was brought to its knee by collapsing buildings on it n Helsreach
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 12:14:22
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Courageous Space Marine Captain
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Bobthehero wrote:An Impératrice titan was brought to its knee by collapsing buildings on it n Helsreach That's a very different scenario though. Let's use a human being as a an example "Titan." if someone put a thin length of string across a doorway, the type used for sewing needles, you'd walk straight through it. If someone put an elastic band you would also walk straight through. You might stumble initially but if you were walking as slow as the titan, one plondering step at a time, you'd have time to adjust balance and plough through. If someone placed a rope across that gap, but it was only attached to a sheet of paper, the rope would hold but the paper would tear and you'd still walk through. But if someone pushed a bookcase on you, chances are you go down.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/08 12:14:46
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Credit to Castiel for banner. Thanks Cas!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 13:43:19
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Eldar - Titans are made up of Wraithbone or some other kind of psychoplastic, meaning that their properties can easily handwave most of the problems conventional walkers face. Being literal Magitek helps there.
They also have jets and can jump. Plus they are Eldar, which means, like cats they always land on their feet. Orks - They're essentially walking pyramids. While the usual "ork believes it works so it works" can be used, Ork Titans are actually the most structurally sound titans since they have massive feet on short legs and are basically walking traffic cones, so tripping, falling and stuff aren't an issue.
Additionally ork gargaunts and greater gargaunts tend to run on giant treads. I will say tend because no orky thing is exactly like the next orky thing. Tyranids - Like I mentioned, Psychic fields. Generally anything that can use psychic in this setting kicks physics to the curb. Otherwise the Hierophant should have imploded in a shower of gore the moment it made planetfall.
Yes, physics wise, they have to be completely different from normal organics or their guts would immediately tear through their skin and spill onto the ground. The Tau are an interesting case because prior to the Riptide, Stormsurge and Taun'nar suits, they didn't have giant robots specifically because they were impractical; the Manta was suppose to be the titan equivalent, which made a lot more sense since an aircraft is a much more practical delivery system for mounted weapons.
In Epic Tau superheavies were basically Orca and Manta dropships coming in low. They didn't have super robot suits, and were a real pain in the but to kill -unless you played Elder like me...
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/08 13:43:32
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/08 14:33:44
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus
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You know, for a faction that has hover vehicles, false gravity in space ships and guns that use gravity to kill you, you would think they would have some gravity dampeners in the titan machines. not enough to make it completely weightless but you know, enough for it to walk? I dunno.
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413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/09 22:31:11
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Sagitarius with a Big F'in Gun
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Regarding them squatting, I know there's a bit in Titanicus where 3 of the loyalist titans trap an enemy Reaver in a silo complex or something, and I'm pretty sure it's the Warlord Tarses is in, releases some stuff out of the hydraulics in the legs, sending the stuff into reserve tanks, and the whole titan just slowly gets shorter.
That stuff might be something as utterly ridiculous as air; I have a stinking suspicion it is. (Although that would make it Pneumatic).
Just spent 10 minutes scouring my book, trying to find the bit, but to no avail.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/09 23:07:44
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Fixture of Dakka
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Tiger9gamer wrote:You know, for a faction that has hover vehicles, false gravity in space ships and guns that use gravity to kill you, you would think they would have some gravity dampeners in the titan machines. not enough to make it completely weightless but you know, enough for it to walk? I dunno.
Actually, they do. I'll have to dive into my book collection to find it, but I've had this discussion before with a friend. Titans have a large gravity well generator that puts light pressure over a large surface area around the titan, pushing it up. It's not enough to levitate a titan, but it does make crossing squishy ground easier. Apparently it is just enough pressure per square inch that a human can sort-of tell if a titan is walking over him. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it would feel like mild vertigo.
If a titan's fields exerted 0.25 pounds per square inch, then a field with a diameter of 150 feet could support an extra 320 tons (minus the area taken up by the feet) . how much do titans weigh again?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 00:14:20
Subject: Re:How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot
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I belive there is actually a Titan to Titan weapon designed to specifically disable (not destroy) a Titan. Its like a Harpoon missile or something and the firing Titan essentially spins its torso once the other Titan is hooked. The hope being that the top heavy Titan will fall over and be disabled and easily captured.
With them so top heavy I dout one would want to jump. Maybe a Warhound or at least a Knight (technically still a "Titan") but anything larger probably can't or at least shouldn't attempt a jump.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 00:43:18
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Ashiraya wrote:It is about Terminators doing backflips and that alone is too much imo.
As someone who has a Warlord Titan model, I can assure you that this thing would not be able to jump on anything but the very lowest gravity worlds, and I am not sure if it would want to!
Squatting is quite probable, and a kick should not be impossible (I suspect that is how it has strength D in melee without CCWs) but yeah, no jumping.
Most chasms should be simple for it to just step over; anything too wide for its maximum stride should be impossible for it to cross.
I'm with Ashi on this one. Warlords are just too freakin' big and top heavy. The superstructure and chassis probably couldn't handle the stress, any way. Same goes for the Reaver-Class.
I could, however, see Warhounds doing short hops because of their relative swiftness for a Titan and leg design.
A caveat: I know what makes sense for us might not be the case in the craziness of Warhammer 40k. An example would be the Catachan Hellhammer that a Jokaero named K'cee played around with. The damned thing was capable of speeds up to 200 MPH WITHOUT THE CREW NOTICING! And it has extra armor that is electrified to fry traitors if they get stupid and try to storm the tank.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/10 00:44:39
Proud Purveyor Of The Unconventional In 40k |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 09:19:46
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Sagitarius with a Big F'in Gun
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oldravenman3025 wrote:
-snip-
A caveat: I know what makes sense for us might not be the case in the craziness of Warhammer 40k. An example would be the Catachan Hellhammer that a Jokaero named K'cee played around with. The damned thing was capable of speeds up to 200 MPH WITHOUT THE CREW NOTICING! And it has extra armor that is electrified to fry traitors if they get stupid and try to storm the tank.
That sounds magical.
And that electric armour? Sounds like an Anbaric Claw, which is something the Taghmata put on their tanks.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 09:49:12
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Keeper of the Holy Orb of Antioch
avoiding the lorax on Crion
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Anything larger than a warhound no.
In storm of iron the war hounds are fast and agile machines but then there designed to be agile.
Reavers and warlords where shown to stride but not jump etc.
They could make a fast walking pace but Its not said jumping. There still hundreds to thousands of ton machines.
They cannot escape there size.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 10:32:34
Subject: Re:How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
Adelaide, South Australia
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Even Warhounds, which the Lexicanum would be too heavy at 410 tonnes to do much jumping. The sheer amount of power it would take to propel even a warhound any distance would be enormous, to say nothing of the strain it would put on every articulated joint.
Of course it's possible with enough tech and effort it could be done, but the designs of Titan stretch back to a far more practical and rational time (which begs the question of why the far more rational Imperium ever used them). Just because you can, doesn't mean you should, which is especially true in design principles. Doubly so for combat vehicles.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/10 14:04:28
Subject: How High Can A Warlord Titan jump?
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Trigger-Happy Baal Predator Pilot
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To the gents who suggested tripping a titan, oh my god you're ignoring the sort of inertia something that big and heavy has. That would be like trying to trip a moving skyscraper, or, to compare to a skyscraper like object that actually moves, that tank think NASA uses to move around vertical rockets.
Also, I wouldn't imagine titans walking the way humans run. When you run you're effectively in a controlled free fall. You can't at any time stop your motion and retain that position exactly. If you do a more robotic motion of raising one leg, moving it forward, fully placing it down, then repeating with the other leg, you won't really be tripable.
NOW, to the OP, according to the rules, 'dragons teeth', ie, totally contemporary tank traps, ie concrete cubes about 3 feet in height, are impassible terrain to all vehicles that don't ignore terrain. This means super heavy walkers. THIS MEANS YOU, EMPEROR TITAN. Therefore a titan can't step over a 3 foot cube, and it cannot jump. THERE, QUESTION ANSWERED.
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