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ya it is, they need a moderator who will smack these guys upside the head everytime they go off topic. and again the lie that trump can't release his taxes because of the audit.
gorgon wrote: Comparing TV advertising to the horse and social media advertising to the tank is a *preposterous* analogy. There are no horses left on the battlefield.
You're wrong in two different ways there. On the more pedantic end, there are still horses on the battlefield. They are being used right now by raiding groups in the Darfur region.
In a more meaningful sense, you'll note the analogy given was about the rise of the tank. Talking about the modern battlefield is nonsense, because the tank is now 100 years old, it's first deployment was in WWI. At that time both tanks and cavalry were deployed, and both were used to strong effect in different circumstances. However it was clear which would continue to expand its role and importance, and which would go in to decline.
TV advertising is far from obsolete.
Who cares if you work in the field when you don't read the argument presented. I said "Yeah, we may be entering a post tv-ad era of politics. Hell, we may be entering a post-tv ad world." You read that as "TV advertising is obselete right now."
Read the argument given. Words are typed as they are for reasons.
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Polonius wrote: Anne Coulter is an entertainer, she takes provocative positions for the same reasons some comics make provocative jokes: it gets attention. She makes a lot of hay with a simple theory: if some people really, really hate liberals, then they'll like somebody that is hated by liberals. She works to create a reality in which virtually anything that runs against her worldview is the result of some sort of massive liberal conspiracy. Since McCarthy was actually brought down by a liberal coalition, obviously, he must have been telling hard truths that the liberal hate machine had to silence. It's an interesting way to make a living.
It is a model that worked great for Coulter a decade ago. But her star has long since faded - the piece I quoted came from an interview with Newsmax. And it wasn't even a paid opinion piece, just an interview. She's on the very fringes of rightwing punditry now.
I agree that she has worked hard to create a reality where everything is about liberal conspiracies and hating on the liberals. But I'm not sure we can assume it's a cynical ploy to make money, because it hasn't been that profitable for her for a long time now. Either she hasn't been able to change her method and move back in to where the real money is, or possibly she actually believes this nonsense.
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dogma wrote: She's still alive? I thought her relevance fizzled out some time ago.
Her relevance faded years ago, that's true. She's still out there, blathering away, every couple of years she drops down to a lower level of news media. This quote was for a Newsmax article, so she hasn't got far to go now to reach Stormfront.
Really, the only reason I quoted her is to because it was such a strange argument to take. I mean, if you're cynical enough to claim McCarthy, Goldwater and Nixon were the victims of a liberal conspiracy (as opposed to being victims of their own awful beliefs and policies), then you should probably by astute enough to realise that it isn't very sensible politics to associate your guy, Trump, with McCarthy, Goldwater and Nixon.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/10/05 01:54:36
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
awww gak, trumps puppet is now trying to strong arm russia. and they will meet russia with american strength. that nut job really would start a war with russia.
sirlynchmob wrote: because it's laughable that men can be victims? and our issues are absurd? that's incredibly sexist of you.
I guess it's true then, only women can be victims, they're professionals at it. Woe be to anyone who points out how absurd they can be.
There are plenty of fundraisers and awareness exercises for various men's illnesses. I've never seen a single feminist comment that they're bad, let alone protest one.
Right now there are "men's sheds" being set up across the city I live in, these are clubs that any man, and only men, can join. They use a bunch of traditional men's activities, like woodworking, to give men something to do while becoming part of a community. There is a particular focus on overcoming depression. Once again, I've never seen a single feminist comment that these are bad, let alone protest one.
The reason these are not protested, while other clubs are... may well be because the club's in question aren't just about helping men through conditions that affect men. It might be that they are more aligned with the "men's rights" bs.
This is actually very simple. If you want a club for men to address men's actual issues - not sexist. If you want a club for men to spend lots of time complaining about men are the victims of society - then that's sexist and really stupid.
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sirlynchmob wrote: look at them blaming facts for being sexist because the facts are against them.
"Them"... being one grad student. What a stupid load.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/10/05 02:07:19
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
Wishing I was back at the South Atlantic, closer to ice than the sun
And back to the debate.
Is there anyone actually moderating the debate? It's getting frustrating that they are ignoring the questions. At least the last one they were in the ballpark of the subject.
Having seen and lived in a SOFA environment there is no way in hell that the USA could have negotiated a SOFA agreement in the middle east that wouldn't have resulted in massive casualties, by and on both sides.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Its so much easier to defend another person, because you can always deny a bad situation because it's not you. You can be confident in the lie because you don't know better.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/10/05 02:20:33
I don't care what the flag says, I'm SCOTTISH!!!
Best definition of the word Battleship?
Mr Nobody wrote:
Does a canoe with a machine gun count?
jasper76 wrote: Tim Kaine is a known commodity to Virginians and perhaps bordering states. He was a fairly popular governor of Virginia and is an active US Senator representing Virginia.
He's fairly popular in that 'he's okay but I don't really give a gak' kind of way.
I honestly was only marginally aware of Pence as a vocal homophobe before he was selected as Trump's VP.
He's going at about 40% popularity in his own state. One of the things about really divisive legislation like his bathroom laws is that you have to actually get them over the line. Pence abandoned them late in the day after big economic threats, and so managed the worst of both worlds. He'd already pissed off the left by proposing the law in the first place, and then he pissed off the right by abandoning it.
Not that it really matters, on a ticket with Trump at the top no-one is thinking about how the undercard at all.
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Frazzled wrote: I imagine they will both end up defending their Presidential running mates, and just look awful doing so.
Pence would be mad to try and defend Trump. In part because in the past when he's tried to moderate Trump's statements, Trump has immediately responded by pointing out that he actually did mean what he said in the nastiest or most irresponsible way imaginable.
And more than that, Pence will exist in politics past 2016. Whereas Trump will either win, in which case Pence takes up his VP spot and no-one ever remembers the 2016 VP debate, or Trump loses and walks away from politics, leaving much anger and resentment in the Republican party and greater electorate. Pence would be mad to tie himself to Trump anymore than he has. Instead, he should just attack Clinton. This will do as much as anything else would of putting him in the Whitehouse, and if they do lose then he can say he was always about defeating Clinton - which we still need to focus on in 2020!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/10/05 02:25:45
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
Wishing I was back at the South Atlantic, closer to ice than the sun
That was, I don't want to say boring, bland might be a better word.
Pence let all the attacks hit Trump while simply attacking Clinton. The public has heard them all before so why bother, but then the public has heard all the points against Clinton but at least Kaine made a halfhearted attempt to defend them.
Neither side won that one.
I don't care what the flag says, I'm SCOTTISH!!!
Best definition of the word Battleship?
Mr Nobody wrote:
Does a canoe with a machine gun count?
I have to say that Pence really was impressive on the stage. Sure most of what he said was known lies, but he kept his composure and let kaine look foolish by trying to interrupt him at every turn.
the oddest thing I found pence saying was about allepo, when contrasted with trumps immigration plans. he thinks we should get in there and get the people to safety, just not bring them to the US where they would be safe. because the people who he would save are probably terrorists. followed in a close second was, it's hillary running the smear campaign, then answering every question with smears against clinton.
kaine did a great job putting pence on the spot, and quotting trump often, which pence denied that trump said any of them. Trump will probably fire pence for it
AndrewC wrote: Pence let all the attacks hit Trump while simply attacking Clinton.
Called it
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
This is excellent news, because I only do this for the internet cookies.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/10/05 05:25:59
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
Heh, in 2012 Trump tweeted "HALF of Americans don't pay income tax despite crippling govt debt…" Of course, there’s the obvious joke in there that it turns out Trump was one of them.
But this actually opens up an interesting conversation on exactly how you look at the tax burden. Here’s a breakdown of how many people in different income brackets aren’t paying tax;
Under $20k there’s about 47 million Americans who aren’t paying tax. This is the source of Trump’s claim, and before that Romney’s famous 47%, and statements like it are made by Republicans pretty constantly. What isn’t mentioned is that 47 million voters aren’t paying taxes because of the Earned Income Tax Credit, passed by a Republican congress in order to clean up welfare and get Americans working.
The EITC costs about $61 billion a year. That’s a lot of money, but it pales in comparison to some other tax exemptions in the system.
On the graph you’ll see 4,000 people who earned more than a million dollars and paid no tax. One method used was to put income in to a tax free retirement account – while the scheme is used by more than the very rich, they are the primary beneficiaries and the scheme costs $137 billion a year.
And the reduced tax rate on capital gains, while it doesn’t go just to the rich they do get the majority of the benefit… that costs $161 billion.
So all up, next time you see a Republican say that it is bad that so many people pay no Federal taxes, remember that changing that would net around $60 billion. But capping the amount put in retirement accounts, and taxing capital gains like other income could net something closer to $300 billion.
I'm gonna put this in my big bucket of circumstantial evidence that hardly anyone working in the administration of the Republican party actually gives a gak about the party or its platform, they're just looking to get paid. It can sit in there alongside the 10% buyer's fee demanded by Republican ad brokers, Herman Cain selling his mailing list to an erectile dysfunction company, Ben Carson's campaign funds disappearing in to an administrative blackhole of friends and grifters, and the Trump candidacy.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/10/05 05:36:35
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
d-usa wrote: Can't believe I missed the VP debate. How will I ever make an informed decision now...
This is 2016. There is no such thing as informed opinions.
Its hard to be awesome, when your playing with little plastic men. Welcome to Fantasy 40k
If you think your important, in the great scheme of things. Do the water test.
Put your hands in a bucket of warm water,
then pull them out fast. The size of the hole shows how important you are.
I think we should roll some dice, to see if we should roll some dice, To decide if all this dice rolling is good for the game.
Is there anyone actually moderating the debate? It's getting frustrating that they are ignoring the questions. At least the last one they were in the ballpark of the subject.
Having seen and lived in a SOFA environment there is no way in hell that the USA could have negotiated a SOFA agreement in the middle east that wouldn't have resulted in massive casualties, by and on both sides.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Its so much easier to defend another person, because you can always deny a bad situation because it's not you. You can be confident in the lie because you don't know better.
I watched about 30 minutes on and off, mainly to watch the moderator. Strangely I was drawn into watching something called Star Wars Rebels and then Spiderman. I haven't watched a kids show in years.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
"Gary Johnson: Knowledge of world geography allows leaders 'to put our military in harm's way'"
I know people say that "anyone can be president " , but you really do not need to be this literal.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/10/05 11:49:12
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
He's a libertarian. Starting foreign wars is not his thing.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
d-usa wrote: Can't believe I missed the VP debate. How will I ever make an informed decision now...
I think watching any of the debates could actually be a hindrance to making an informed decision.
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
In terms of demeanor, I think Pence came out way ahead and looked almost presidential. He wisely avoided defending Trump and pressed the attacks on HRC. Kaine looked off balance and unnecessarily aggressive. Interrupting the moderator on several occasions played very poorly, I think, and distracts from Trump's temperament. Pence is showing to be a very strong camp as the straight man to Trump's theatrics. Overall, I would say Pence won it, but it doesn't really matter for anything except for his possible 2020 ambitions.
Didn't i read somewhere that Pence used to have a radio show? That experience probably is what helped him in this debate.
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
jmurph wrote: In terms of demeanor, I think Pence came out way ahead and looked almost presidential. He wisely avoided defending Trump and pressed the attacks on HRC. Kaine looked off balance and unnecessarily aggressive. Interrupting the moderator on several occasions played very poorly, I think, and distracts from Trump's temperament. Pence is showing to be a very strong camp as the straight man to Trump's theatrics. Overall, I would say Pence won it, but it doesn't really matter for anything except for his possible 2020 ambitions.
This.
I watched the post debate on CNN.
Anyone see the panel of voters... when asked who would prefer the VPs being the top of the ticket... EVERY indy voter raised their hands.
jmurph wrote: In terms of demeanor, I think Pence came out way ahead and looked almost presidential. He wisely avoided defending Trump and pressed the attacks on HRC. Kaine looked off balance and unnecessarily aggressive. Interrupting the moderator on several occasions played very poorly, I think, and distracts from Trump's temperament. Pence is showing to be a very strong camp as the straight man to Trump's theatrics. Overall, I would say Pence won it, but it doesn't really matter for anything except for his possible 2020 ambitions.
Pence might have won the debate on style, but all the talk afterward is going to be (and currently is) either how many of Pence's points were outright lies, or how his viewpoints seem to be at odds with everything Trump has been espousing since the beginning of the primaries.
jmurph wrote: In terms of demeanor, I think Pence came out way ahead and looked almost presidential. He wisely avoided defending Trump and pressed the attacks on HRC. Kaine looked off balance and unnecessarily aggressive. Interrupting the moderator on several occasions played very poorly, I think, and distracts from Trump's temperament. Pence is showing to be a very strong camp as the straight man to Trump's theatrics. Overall, I would say Pence won it, but it doesn't really matter for anything except for his possible 2020 ambitions.
Pence might have won the debate on style, but all the talk afterward is going to be (and currently is) either how many of Pence's points were outright lies, or how his viewpoints seem to be at odds with everything Trump has been espousing since the beginning of the primaries.
Anyone see the panel of voters... when asked who would prefer the VPs being the top of the ticket... EVERY indy voter raised their hands.
Was that the same panel that agreed that Pence won, but also showed that the VP debate wouldn't change their voting choice?
I don't know. Trump hasn't been running on facts for a while now and his inconsistencies don't seem to be hurting him. He is the Reality Show Candidate. I don't see Pence's performance as negatively affecting Trump's campaign in any way.
