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**DrNo172000**

Let me be clear about one thing as a prior service Marine since it has been alluded to as it always is alluded to in these conversations. Someone posing does not devalue my achievements or any other achievements by any veteran. That way of thinking has no basis in logic. Nobody can take away my achievements whether they be my GPA in school or my time in service by pretending they also achieved those same things, that's just insane. As far as honor goes, if it all it takes to mar your honor is an insult, or a image, or some guy posing as something he's not, well how strong is that honor really?

**kronk**

Mozzyfuzzy wrote:
feeder wrote:
Manchu wrote:
Something I take away from thinking about DrNo172000's posts is, if you are angry about X then own that it is YOU who are angry about X rather than trying to justify it by saying you are angry on someone else's behalf (e.g., all veterans or something). For me, it is easier to put into perspective what I am angry about once I look at it rationally as my problem, only to realize that sometimes I am actually angry about something that is not "my problem" in any real sense, or maybe to see what the real problem could be. I think Ensis Ferrae kind of brought this up, but perhaps the military aspect of this is just a surface layer to a dysfunctional personal relationship. So rather than being about people at large, this is really about two specific people who don't get along.

The phrase "You can pick your friends and you can pick your nose, but you can't pick your family", also extends to "You can't pick your wife's family." Her brother is an insecure d-bag and there is nothing at all you can do about it.

My advice is to let it go. You know he is a poser, and you get to plow his sister. You win.

I didn't know Kronk had a Canadian relative

Truth. Is. Truth.

**Stormwall**

Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

**d-usa**

Stormwall wrote:
Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

I think that while there are a lot of things that aren't "honorable discharges", for benefit purposes it somewhat gets inverted to having to have a "not dishonorable" discharge vs a straight "honorable" discharge.

**Stormwall**

d-usa wrote:
Stormwall wrote:
Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

I think that while there are a lot of things that aren't "honorable discharges", for benefit purposes it somewhat gets inverted to having to have a "not dishonorable" discharge vs a straight "honorable" discharge.

Well, I was dropped on the day of stepping off for the Crucible for clarity's sake. My DD214 reads Honorable as the character of service. Same as my battle who had a stroke and was put in PEB and he also received an honorable discharge as well. We didn't get certificates, we had our surgeries and months of PT before being discharged and put in touch with the VA, even though my battle was full on PDRL and I was given severance pay.

I am fully aware of the classes of discharge. I was just making an offhanded comment as I was curious. Does that make sense now? (:

**SemperMortis**

d-usa wrote:
Stormwall wrote:
Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

I think that while there are a lot of things that aren't "honorable discharges", for benefit purposes it somewhat gets inverted to having to have a "not dishonorable" discharge vs a straight "honorable" discharge.

I think he meant something along the lines of he was surprised it wasn't considered an administrative separation under other then honorable. Usually that type of discharge would be that type. I had a few fail out of Boot Camp who got that type of Discharge. Hell i knew a guy who hit the fleet who got an adsep because he couldn't hack it.

**Hordini**

SemperMortis wrote:
d-usa wrote:
Stormwall wrote:
Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

I think that while there are a lot of things that aren't "honorable discharges", for benefit purposes it somewhat gets inverted to having to have a "not dishonorable" discharge vs a straight "honorable" discharge.

I think he meant something along the lines of he was surprised it wasn't considered an administrative separation under other then honorable. Usually that type of discharge would be that type. I had a few fail out of Boot Camp who got that type of Discharge. Hell i knew a guy who hit the fleet who got an adsep because he couldn't hack it.

Other than honorable usually requires some kind of misconduct or significant deviation from meeting standards. Entry-level separations usually aren't characterized as other than honorable, as far as I know, unless there was some specific reason to do so.

**SemperMortis**

Hordini wrote:
SemperMortis wrote:
d-usa wrote:
Stormwall wrote:
Ah, I see where you are coming from now Dr.No.

As an aside, I am surprised the man who didn't make it to the crucible even got a Honorable Discharge certificate by the way.

I think that while there are a lot of things that aren't "honorable discharges", for benefit purposes it somewhat gets inverted to having to have a "not dishonorable" discharge vs a straight "honorable" discharge.

I think he meant something along the lines of he was surprised it wasn't considered an administrative separation under other then honorable. Usually that type of discharge would be that type. I had a few fail out of Boot Camp who got that type of Discharge. Hell i knew a guy who hit the fleet who got an adsep because he couldn't hack it.

Other than honorable usually requires some kind of misconduct or significant deviation from meeting standards. Entry-level separations usually aren't characterized as other than honorable, as far as I know, unless there was some specific reason to do so.

Usually, (this is my personal experience) those who get separated while in Boot Camp that aren't horrendously injured (IE Broken bodies) are usually considered non-hackers. Complaining about back pain or knee pain is fine and dandy but Corpsmen and DI's usually can tell which Recruits are legitimately hurt and those who are realizing they made a mistake by enlisting. Don't get me wrong they might try to force them through but there are always those that can't be fixed and because of that they give them other then honorable. But again that was just what i saw when I was at Parris Island.

**Shadow Captain Edithae**

Kap'n Krump wrote:
conker249 wrote:
FIrst off a little about me. I served in the Air force as security forces for 6 years, been deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan each once. So I know what it means to me about serving our country. I wish my brother(in law) would understand this. He served 2 weeks in Marine Corps Basic training(he gave up claiming his knee hurt), He got to his 2nd week and after receiving a letter from his fiance to come home, he now claims he is hurt and after 2 months of med hold, comes home. Only to start working as a tower climber. Doesn't seem right to me to fall out because of knee problems, only to go into a job that is physically stressful. and now he considers himself a marine corps Veteran. Marpat pants, semper fi brotherhood shirt, Marine corps bracelet, belt buckle, 8 point marpat cover. Devil Dogs stickers on vehicle. Everyday he wears at least 2 of the above items it seems. He wears his dog tags as "proof of service" and people eat it up, and give him discounts with no ID, just see the tags and assume. When people ask him about where he was stationed at during small talk, he says He was stationed in San Diego(Marines Boot camp training site) and doesn't say more. It irritates me because I feel that he is only telling half of the story. I have talked about it to him, yelled about it to him, explained in public when he tries to do it. Nothing works. He thinks he is better than me since I was "only Air Force". Being a marine trumps my service apparently, and brings it up every so often.
So my questions are
1) Should I care that he is posing
2) From a Marines standpoint, Is he a marine
3) What to do about it.
4) Am I being overly salty and blowing the situation out of proportion?

I'm late to the party, but I have a very similar story.

My brother's dream was always to join the marines, even when he was a little kid.

Eventually, he got into basic for the marines, and he made it through about 2 months, but came down with some kind of major intestinal issue that caused him to be unable to continue, and he had to quit due to from what I understand to be a very significant medical issue.

Long story short, he never got back into basic. They said they'd give him another shot once he got better, but it never materialized for him. It was a great tragedy for him.

And he doesn't ham it up near as much as your BIL seems to, I don't think he gets any material gain, doesn't claim military veteran discounts at the movies or anything, but he definitely considers himself an ex-marine, and his friends have mentioned to me that, for example, he's a good shot 'because he was in the marines". (He is a good shot, btw).

Plus, he will sometimes introduce him as being former military / marine.

And........I don't think that's accurate. Being a marine was a big deal for him, and I am truly sad that he wasn't able to make it through basic, I'm sure not for lack of trying, but I still don't feel super-awesome about him claiming to be a former marine because I don't think he was, technically. But I guess I don't feel that it's a big enough deal to call him out on it.

Well, at least he was medically discharged and didn't choose to quit the marines voluntarily like the op's brother in law did.

Is there a reason why he can't just join some other branch of the military with less rigorous fitness requirements like the army, or logistic/support regiments? Or does that same medical issue still preclude him for applying?

**Stormwall**

Peace time cutback, recruiter effort level vs time of investment.

A recruit can just sign a highschooler and be done. Why get the kid who failed?

I spent over half a year at P.I while having pending RA orders. I never was allowed to finish the crucible due to the sheer severity of injuries. Emergency surgery and sizeable rehab in P.I and through the VA. Did it all but the Crucible and Graduation. Still made it longer than any other branches boot camp. If I had gone any branch but the USMC or had my injuries been caught sooner Id have made it.

So "veteran," with full benefits and the treatment, if you can say that but, never a Marine.

I generally don't tell anyone. If people introduce me as a Veteran, it is what it is. My I.D for the VA and USPS states it. Do I consider myself one? No.

How could I? When measured to heroes like Chesty Puller, the Marines at Tarawa, Fallujah veterans, etc etc.

I was PEB'd via a med board. Honorable discharge against my will.

I have RE-3P for my re-enlistment code that is what keeps me out. Even having the chief VA ortho surgeon and two private doctors clear me "fit for full duty, re-enlistment and combat duties." No recruiter would want to mess with me. Even with the Army it can take years to get a RE-3P waiver pushed through.

That's why. Hope it answers your question.

**CptJake**

Waivers have dried up considerably for Army recruiting.

**Stormwall**

Indeed.

Timeframe I am referring to is 2013-16 BTW. Manning is all times low, budget cuts, retension is too expensive.

Train up those high schoolers, screw waivers is the mindset.

Also to those trying to interpret what I said above.

I meant a certificate. Like an award that you get like a NAM (Navy achievement medal,) in a jacket/diploma style sleeve or a promotion styled award. I was only aware that you got the DD214 which displays character of service. Not a certificate or award on top of that/ a discharge certificate on top of that to display at work or your house. If that makes any sense.

I just got the DD214, being as I am somewhere between shower shoe and boot. Please forgive my ignorance.

Other than honorable would denote other things which is not what I was implying at all gents.

**dracpanzer**

sirlynchmob wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I've actually quoted official sources. It isn't a fething opinion at this point.

do marines have a milspermanual, I'm sure they have an equivalent? Let's see the regulation. without a regulation it's just an opinion.

Newsflash, unlike soldiers, airmen, sailors, coast guardsmen or otherwise. Marine is a title that is earned by some. The fact that you don't know this, proves you don't know anything about it.

To the OP. Your brother in law is a washout. If he is having issues with it, talk to the recruiter who signed him up and tell them he's walking around calling himself a Marine. They'll sort him out.

**Stormwall**

Yeah he ain't a Marine. It's earned, when you get your Eagle Globe and Anchor on Peatross Parade Deck, roughly around TD what, 64-65?

At the OP: While I was in PEB we were made to make and watch the RSP malingerers do work parties and go to their appointments so they would get Adsepped and kill time while waiting on the processing.

He is one of those. At the two week mark, he had just gotten his shots and wasn't even with his real Drill Instructors yet. Basically like getting fired on your first day in a civilian job He hadn't even got his nametapes sewn on yet. Not even a Phase 1 recruit. End of recieving drop.

**Ahtman**

Apparently, while not common most likely, this is apparently a thing that happens enough that there is a meme about it.

**sirlynchmob**

dracpanzer wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I've actually quoted official sources. It isn't a fething opinion at this point.

do marines have a milspermanual, I'm sure they have an equivalent? Let's see the regulation. without a regulation it's just an opinion.

Newsflash, unlike soldiers, airmen, sailors, coast guardsmen or otherwise. Marine is a title that is earned by some. The fact that you don't know this, proves you don't know anything about it.

To the OP. Your brother in law is a washout. If he is having issues with it, talk to the recruiter who signed him up and tell them he's walking around calling himself a Marine. They'll sort him out.

The fact the marines make such a huge deal of finishing boot camp is hilarious to me. They take themselves so seriously they actually wrote it into the instruction, hilarious

I do know the marines, they're great guys, the butt of thousands of jokes and numerous pranks.

*mocking voice* It's a title to be earned */MV* LOL

The nerve of him thinking he's a marine, after swearing the oath and serving on active duty in the marine corpse during a time of war.

**CptJake**

I'm honestly not sure why you feel the urge to mock and be condescending over this. Like many titles, it is earned not just given. Placing value on the earning means there is value to the title. Your inability to understand why folks value the title and do not like to see folks claim it without having earned it is really amazing.

**Stormwall**

Because it is earned not given. Must be hard to understand, I know.

**sirlynchmob**

CptJake wrote:
I'm honestly not sure why you feel the urge to mock and be condescending over this. Like many titles, it is earned not just given. Placing value on the earning means there is value to the title. Your inability to understand why folks value the title and do not like to see folks claim it without having earned it is really amazing.

after 20 years of mocking marines, it's a hard habit to break

the "title" is the equivalent of a participation award handed out at little league.

**Hordini**

sirlynchmob wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I'm honestly not sure why you feel the urge to mock and be condescending over this. Like many titles, it is earned not just given. Placing value on the earning means there is value to the title. Your inability to understand why folks value the title and do not like to see folks claim it without having earned it is really amazing.

after 20 years of mocking marines, it's a hard habit to break

the "title" is the equivalent of a participation award handed out at little league.

That's ridiculously untrue. If it was true, everyone could/would be a Marine.

**Stormwall**

Did you not read anything I've wrote over the past few pages?

Recruits die on that island. If it was easy, everyone would be a fething Marine.

**sirlynchmob**

Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I'm honestly not sure why you feel the urge to mock and be condescending over this. Like many titles, it is earned not just given. Placing value on the earning means there is value to the title. Your inability to understand why folks value the title and do not like to see folks claim it without having earned it is really amazing.

after 20 years of mocking marines, it's a hard habit to break

the "title" is the equivalent of a participation award handed out at little league.

That's ridiculously untrue. If it was true, everyone could/would be a Marine.

It is true, everyone who played in little league and stayed for the whole game got a cool shiny medal. Then they made fun of the kid with asthma who had to leave early because he didn't get one.

**Hordini**

sirlynchmob wrote:
Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I'm honestly not sure why you feel the urge to mock and be condescending over this. Like many titles, it is earned not just given. Placing value on the earning means there is value to the title. Your inability to understand why folks value the title and do not like to see folks claim it without having earned it is really amazing.

after 20 years of mocking marines, it's a hard habit to break

the "title" is the equivalent of a participation award handed out at little league.

That's ridiculously untrue. If it was true, everyone could/would be a Marine.

It is true, everyone who played in little league and stayed for the whole game got a cool shiny medal. Then they made fun of the kid with asthma who had to leave early because he didn't get one.

You have no idea what you're talking about. It's embarrassing. I would have thought a Navy veteran would know better.

**Stormwall**

Ah, so my life threatening injury and emergency surgery was a participation trophy, seeing how I'm TD 61 drop. (Papers read 64 though so meh.)

I have to simply guess my three screws were the prize.

USMC boot camp is no joke, there is a reason the title is earned and it is the toughest boot camp out of all the branches.

**MrDwhitey**

Just press the yellow triangle with a ! in it.

**sirlynchmob**

Stormwall wrote:
Ah, so my life threatening injury and emergency surgery was a participation trophy.

I guess my three screws were the prize.

USMC boot camp is no joke, there is a reason the title is earned and it is the toughest boot camp out of all the branches.

No, you were the kid with asthma who got sent home early, you didn't get the trophy.

After your pain and suffering while in the marines, I'd gladly call you a marine and thank you for your service.

**dracpanzer**

sirlynchmob wrote:
Stormwall wrote:
Ah, so my life threatening injury and emergency surgery was a participation trophy.

I guess my three screws were the prize.

USMC boot camp is no joke, there is a reason the title is earned and it is the toughest boot camp out of all the branches.

No, you were the kid with asthma who got sent home early, you didn't get the trophy.

After your pain and suffering while in the marines, I'd gladly call you a marine and thank you for your service.

Fortunately your calling anyone a Marine is worth absolutely nothing. I highly doubt with your attitude that you are anything more than the subject of the OP. Poser much? Troll much? Your a joke, welcome to the ignore button.

**Stormwall**

Is there anything left to discuss concerning this, or has this ran its course gents?

**Alpharius**

It looks like it has?

And now, certain people are on The List.