US Politics: 2017 Edition

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**Breotan**

Okay, it's now officially President Trump. Time to walk the walk.

**angelofvengeance**

"I'll never let you down!" Hmmm do you buy that? I don't lol.

**feeder**

angelofvengeance wrote:
"I'll never let you down!" Hmmm do you buy that? I don't lol.

Did Drumpf just rickroll the inauguration?

**Stevefamine**

Rosebuddy wrote:
Goodbye 44, good riddance. Hello 45, god damn.

Frazzled wrote:
If only the DNC hadn't run someone under investigation by the FBI.

Indeed. Sanders would've won. Clinton did more to get Trump elected than anyone else did.

As a trump supporter - correct. Sanders would have won - by a close to sizable margin. I'm sorry the DNC was against you the entire time.

NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Trump's speech is absolutely phenomenal.

Great speech on the otherhand. I love the nationalism tone it had

**tneva82**

NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Trump's speech is absolutely phenomenal.

Yeah. In being full of trash he's known for. I feel pity for america. Things were going better and now trump came to ruin it. Wonder how many decades it takes to fix damage he does. Maybe more than my lifetime even if i live longer than average

**BobtheInquisitor**

NuggzTheNinja wrote:
whembly wrote:
NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Trump's speech is absolutely phenomenal.

Trying to find the transcript... twittah is blowing up now...

"We will eradicate radical Islamic terrorism from the face of the Earth."

Also loving that the first speaker to follow his speech is a rabbi.

My mom would love that. She also has one overriding issue whose big button blots out all reasonable concerns when pushed. And her issue is also Israel. Certain fundraisers have cottoned onto that and lead her around like a bull with a ring in its nose. Must be comforting not to have to weigh dozens of important, often conflicting concerns when making a decision.

**godardc**

tneva82 wrote:
NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Trump's speech is absolutely phenomenal.

Yeah. In being full of trash he's known for. I feel pity for america. Things were going better and now trump came to ruin it. Wonder how many decades it takes to fix damage he does. Maybe more than my lifetime even if i live longer than average

Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

**feeder**

godardc wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Trump's speech is absolutely phenomenal.

Yeah. In being full of trash he's known for. I feel pity for america. Things were going better and now trump came to ruin it. Wonder how many decades it takes to fix damage he does. Maybe more than my lifetime even if i live longer than average

Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Euro Drumpf arse kissing is worse.

**Frazzled**

Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Agreed, and inappropriate for this forum.

**d-usa**

godardc wrote:

All this european Trump bashing is stupid

What the US does affects Europe. What Europe does affects the US.

Citizens of both have valid reasons to have opinions about the leadership of the other.

**WrentheFaceless**

Frazzled wrote:
Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Agreed, and inappropriate for this forum.

How so? A good portion of his platform was built on hate, we're clearly following the President's example now.

**Vash108**

WrentheFaceless wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Agreed, and inappropriate for this forum.

How so? A good portion of his platform was built on hate, we're clearly following the President's example now.

You have to accept his terrible cabinet picks and policies. You should applaud his un-adult behavior as the leader of America. You should follow his example when it comes to his poor business decisions and dealings.

**Breotan**

Yes, but we did recently get a lock on this thread and some angry words from the Admins about how toxic the thread had become. In that light, I don't think it's asking too much to avoid the toxic stuff even as we continue to post our thoughts and concerns.

**Frazzled**

WrentheFaceless wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Agreed, and inappropriate for this forum.

How so? A good portion of his platform was built on hate, we're clearly following the President's example now.

Rule #1 would like to have a word with you.

Besides you're all just jealous that our First Lady is prettier than your First Lady, and that our President is oranger than yours (ok N. Ireland's orange Party guys might disagree).

**d-usa**

I think the thread lock was more pronoun related, and less "I like/don't like Trump" related.

**Breotan**

d-usa wrote:
I think the thread lock was more pronoun related, and less "I like/don't like Trump" related.

Anti-Trump passion is still not a valid reason for expressing one's opinion in an impolite manner. This is Yakface's site, not the comments section of the New York Times and we should respect that.

**The Grumpy Eldar**

I got nothing against Trump, but his speech was just bad. The man just isn't good with speeching. He could have done a lot better.

**Prestor Jon**

LordofHats wrote:
Prestor Jon wrote:
Why do we need the Feds to enforce a NY state sales tax? If NY wants to reduce cigarette smuggling they can stop having punitive sin taxes.

Because telling the states they can set their own policy, and then telling them not to complain that people are violating their policy is a bit hypocritical. A country built of a bunch of municipalities with no obligations to one another quickly ceases to be a country. I don't understand why you're jumping to the conclusion that I expect all states to be the same, or that I want some kind of overarching conformity on everything. Setting basic policy standards can be as simple as "all gun manufacturers must include a safety in their design", or as detailed as "vodka is an alcohol with a proof of x to y fermented in manner z from ingredients a, b, and c and bottled as d."

Let's say someone sells a batch of beer and it turns out it contains rat poison. People die in the state of Indiana, but the beer is made and sold in Nevada and distributed from there. Indiana can't just investigate a beer maker in Nevada. Now, Nevada can investigate the crime (and find that the manufacturer was reckless) but Nevada courts can't bring charges for deaths in other states and Indiana can't charge the manufacturer for selling bad goods in Nevada. The only thing Nevada can do is charge for violating state law and and reckless endangerment. And of course, what about the people who died in California, Utah, and Idaho, and the money the business was funneling to New Jersey mob? The only body that can actual handle all of that practically and Constitutionally is the Federal government. Crimes cross state lines, and Constitutionally that's the Federal government's job.

The states are not intrinsically better at everything at all levels, and just because the states can handle a given regulatory challenge doesn't mean they have no need for a federal regulator or investigative arm. Especially in a global economic environment where money and goods travel massive distances, it's kind of absurd to expect the state of Florida be be able to fulfill all the needs that will ever exist or even exist now on any issue, let alone something like alcohol or tobacco. Especially since these are goods that tend to be grown in one place, processed in another, and then manufactured into a consumer good in dozens of other places before shipping to markets all over the country and these steps can take place in completely different states.

NY state tax policy not a concern for the FBI.

I never said it was something for the FBI to do.

We tried to control alcohol at the federal level during prohibition and it failed.

I don't think its that we tried to control it at a federal level so much that we tried to ban it period. That was just doomed to fail (not that we learned any lessons from the experience).

Apologies for making assumptions about your argument. In the context of needing a Federal agency like the ATF to enforce Federal laws regarding tobacco and cigarettes I was trying to argue that a lot of that enforcement doesn't need to be done on a Federal level. Determining what is and isn't an alcohol beverage or cigarette, how it can be manufactured, ingredients, labelling etc. can be done by the FDA just like they do with other consumable products. Crimes that cross state lines do fall under Federal jurisdiction but I thought your previous example of cigarette smuggling was faulty. Buying cigarettes in Georgia in compliance with state laws isn't a Federal crime and neither is transporting those cigarettes into NY state. Now once you're in NY state selling those cigarettes you bought in GA without collecting the appropriate NY state sales tax on them and remitting that tax to the NY state govt is a crime but it's a state crime not a Federal one. It's also an unintended consequence of NY state's tax policy.

If people in Indiana were getting poisoned by a specific brand or batch of beer then that would be investigated by local and state authorities/health officials and then likely forwarded to the CDC since that's how similar things like food poisoning outbreaks are dealt with. If the poisoning involved interstate commerce or otherwise falls under Federal jurisdiction then those responsible would face Federal prosecution but we could still greatly downsize the ATF and it's role in Federal enforcement of alcohol and tobacco without sacrificing public safety.

If you want Federal enforcement over something then you need to establish Federal authority over it and that's going to require Federal laws that are necessarily going to be one size fits all laws that require conformity amongst the states. The ATF isn't enforcing state laws on alcohol only Federal ones so the more enforcement powers they have and the more enforcement actions they undertake the more conformity we get between states and the point of Federal law enforcement is to deal with crimes that the states are poorly equipped to deal with not to enact conformity amongst the states so Federal enforcement should be limited to that narrow scope. I'm sorry if that point wasn't clear I probably jumped ahead with the conclusion too much.

**BobtheInquisitor**

Truly, Trump needs a new pronoun, the best pronoun. Kablhe! wants people to refer to kablim! uniquely, fitting the stupenditudinousness of kabliszl! disctinctividuality.

**Breotan**

The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
I got nothing against Trump, but his speech was just bad. The man just isn't good with speeching. He could have done a lot better.

That's fine. I didn't listen to it because I was at work so I can't speak to the quality or the content. I'm sure I'll be able to get the gist from news articles later today.

**BobtheInquisitor**

The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
I got nothing against Trump, but his speech was just bad. The man just isn't good with speeching. He could have done a lot better.

What he lacks in structure and finesse, he makes up for in saying what you want to hear, if you want to hear what he's saying.

**WrentheFaceless**

Frazzled wrote:
WrentheFaceless wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

Agreed, and inappropriate for this forum.

How so? A good portion of his platform was built on hate, we're clearly following the President's example now.

Rule #1 would like to have a word with you.

Besides you're all just jealous that our First Lady is prettier than your First Lady, and that our President is oranger than yours (ok N. Ireland's orange Party guys might disagree).

Trump isnt a poster on this forum, rule # 1 doesnt apply to us calling him a scumbag when hes the topic of political conversation

Speaking of, who's ready for the official @POTUS twitter to be Trumped?

**tneva82**

godardc wrote:
Please, stop being hateful. Let him try at least.
All this european Trump bashing is stupid

'

He's already SHOWN to be totally disqualified at the job. His policies are already shown to be trash. I judge him by his actions. They are utter and complete disaster. Only ones in the world who have chance of escaping his effect in better or at least same shape are filthy rich white christians.

Do you need to be shot in brain to know it's bad?

You could get better president by grabbing random 5 year old kid from the street and putting him to the job.

**BigWaaagh**

A billionaire reality TV show host and real estate developer, who has never shown any interest in anybody but himself and his bottom line, and who now has appointed the wealthiest cabinet in U.S. history, is going to "return the country to the people". I await this with the most eager of bated breath.

**d-usa**

Added some stuff, ignored some suggestions

GDP
Budget Deficit/Surplus
Total Debt
Amount of Federal Spending
Federal Tax Rate
Trade Balance
Unemployment Rate
Underemployment Rate
# of soldiers killed
# of drone strikes
# of Nobel Prizes
# of executive orders
# of uninsured
Cost of Insurance (although that one would be hard, because it is ripe for number games)
# of manufacturing jobs
Inflation
Productivity-Pay Gap
Median Household Income
SNAP Participation
Medicaid Participation
# of Illegal Immigrants
# of Deportations

I think I'll try to do some homework tonight and find numbers for first and last year of the last few Presidents, and then start tracking Trump.

**Brother SRM**

Stevefamine wrote:

Great speech on the otherhand. I love the nationalism tone it had

With nationalism being one of the chief reasons for the first World War and god knows how many other conflicts, I disagree. Nationalism is not a good thing, and it's not the same as merely loving your country.

**WrentheFaceless**

True, but I'm calling the Overripe Orange in Chief names, no one else.

**Vaktathi**

WrentheFaceless wrote:

Speaking of, who's ready for the official @POTUS twitter to be Trumped?

Apparently he will not be using it and will continue to use his existing account.

**Breotan**

WrentheFaceless wrote:
Trump isnt a poster on this forum, rule # 1 doesnt apply to us calling him a scumbag when hes the topic of political conversation.

I suggest you take a few moments and refresh yourself about the rules of decorum Yakface set up for this site.

yakface wrote:
HOWEVER, please be aware that all of the other normal rules for the site apply. In particular that means you still need to be polite and friendly, even when discussing such hot topics as politics and religion.

**The Grumpy Eldar**

BobtheInquisitor wrote:
The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
I got nothing against Trump, but his speech was just bad. The man just isn't good with speeching. He could have done a lot better.

What he lacks in structure and finesse, he makes up for in saying what you want to hear, if you want to hear what he's saying.

Sadly a lot of the thing he said aren't great either. He tends to overreact an say what the people want to hear, but he might have said a lot of things he will not be able to realize and will get a lot of backlash

He was talking about "all" Americans but he only seemed to talk about his own voters. He should have reached out to different voters to at least in his speech imho..