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I mostly use GW paints currently, But I'm considering changing out my old paints.. So, What is everyones opinions on the Army Painter, Vallejo and P3 paints?

Each system has really good stand out paints.
Best to mix and match imo.
I never found an army painter paint that that there wasn't a better equivalent though.

I use Vallejo almost exclusively. Having used a lot of Army Painter sprays I have picked up a few bottles for touch ups. I hope these are flukes because the three bottles I have are terrible. Granted they are yellow and purple - but all three bottles have terrible coverage, very thin and pigment poor. I don't have enough experience to elaborate --- maybe I'm just unlucky.

I won't be buying any other Army Painter bottled paints...their sprays and dips are wonderful though.

Merellin wrote:
I mostly use GW paints currently, But I'm considering changing out my old paints.. So, What is everyones opinions on the Army Painter, Vallejo and P3 paints?

I also mix and match quite a bit. GW just has so many incredible colors, and following the Duncan videos is a lot easier with their formulas. That said I also love P3 and Vallejo paints; I didn't personally find Army Painter to be as good quality.

If I were starting from scratch I'd probably go all Vallejo though because there is so much variety in their range - not just colors but types, the dropper bottles, and the high quality of paint. They also thin to even a 'dirty water' like mix really well.

I mostly use Vallejo, largely because it's sold at the closest hobby store to me.

I have some P3 paints but I don't love them, they don't really agree with my painting style. I don't find myself using them very often and haven't bought any new P3 paints in ages.

I have some Reaper MSP which I like, but only 1 shop sells them which is 30-45 minutes drive away and only sells the triads which just makes them inconvenient for me. Good paint though.

Citadel wise I like their most of the bases. Mephiston Red, Averland Sunset, Rakarth Flesh, Steel Legion Drag, Leadbelcher, Balthasar Gold and Dryad Bark are staples in my line up. Don't like Ceramite white though. I like GW washes but I despise their bottles and since they went to the larger more expensive bottles I just stopped buying them. Vallejo washes and inks have been working well for me.

I have recently created this post: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/713293.page

I'm doing a research with paint's brand and this one sounds interesting as well

All the lines have their own strengths and weaknesses, IMO. I rather like the P3 paints for their consistency and tones, but it's a very limited paint selection. Some of their colors, like Menoth White Highlight, I use on nearly every single model.

Vallejo Model Color has by far the largest amount of paints available, but personally I don't like using them much. I find they separate quickly in the bottle and can take a lot of effort to mix properly, but I know many fantastic painters swear by VMC. I've used a few Vallejo Game Colors and they're OK, basically like the older line of GW paints so can be handy for trying to match those older colors that the new GW line doesn't have exact replacements for.

I've found the new GW paints to be surprisingly good, but you'll get the least value out of them. They're expensive and contain the least paint.

Army Painter, like most paint lines, is a bit of a mixed bag. Some of the colors cover fantastically in one coat, others do not (like some of the yellows). I have the Zombicide Black Plague set and all the paints I've used have been great. I love their shades more than any other washes I've used.

Ultimately what I've learned buying a lot of paints from different manufacturers is that the best path is really just to mix and match. There's not much reason to lock yourself into just one line of paint. Typically any color I can get that is very close to a GW color I will get from Vallejo, Army Painter or P3 and those that are GW only I will get from them.

I've found Vallejo to be a bit hit-and-miss. Some colours are very watery, others (mainly greys and white) can be very thick and dry out easily.

Army Painter, I've only used their inks so far, and love them more than it's healthy for a man to love his paint.

P3 is very similar to the old Coat D'arms paints that used to comprise GW's paint range... They're in the same bottles, and I believe come out of the same factory. So those two, along with Army Painter inks, are my standard go-tos these days.

 insaniak wrote:
P3 is very similar to the old Coat D'arms paints that used to comprise GW's paint range... They're in the same bottles, and I believe come out of the same factory. So those two, along with Army Painter inks, are my standard go-tos these days.

Mike McVey developed the Formula P3 paints. Didn't he also have a hand in the original Citadel paints as well, or was that the second line of paints?

Which paint system do you guys prefer. Is Army Painter a good substitute for GW?

Celestialpainting wrote:
Which paint system do you guys prefer. Is Army Painter a good substitute for GW?

The best thing is to just pick and choose the paints from different lines.

I am looking forward to try Army Painter paints. Honestly, the best system, if you ask me, is to use different brands at the same time.

Vallejo, as already said are hit and miss. Gungrey Metal is awesome color, but Vallejo Green and Red and Vallejo PU primer... I'd throw them to the bin...

On P3.. All their paints, no matter how I prep them leave brush strokes. Don't know what people love so much in them, but from my experience they are mediocre to bad. Althou, they result into some really nice color when you mix them wih Lifecolor or some Vallejo Colors.

GW systems works best for me. You have Base colors which are really nice to coat, then you have the more transparent Layer colors and etc.

Thanks for all the replies ^_^ I might just stick to primarily GW paints for now, I am finaly learning to water down my paints (Thanks Duncan!)

 DalinCriid wrote:
I am looking forward to try Army Painter paints. Honestly, the best system, if you ask me, is to use different brands at the same time.

Vallejo, as already said are hit and miss. Gungrey Metal is awesome color, but Vallejo Green and Red and Vallejo PU primer... I'd throw them to the bin...

On P3.. All their paints, no matter how I prep them leave brush strokes. Don't know what people love so much in them, but from my experience they are mediocre to bad. Althou, they result into some really nice color when you mix them wih Lifecolor or some Vallejo Colors.

I found P3 paints to be somewhat 'plastic', It was very hard to find the sweet spot where it was thick enough to go down opaque but thin enough to not leave brush marks. I eventually just resorted to multiple coats; the colors themselves are fantastic and vibrant, but they're a lot of work. This may have been the fact that I was using red and green, which are generally very transparent colors in acrylic paints.

I've used VJ primers in black, white, grey, mustard and red-brown, all of which have worked great. VJ paints are hit and miss a bit, but they have 4 different ranges (Game Air, Game Color, Model Air, Model Color) and an unmatched range of different colors.

I also use Reaper HD series paints and found them to be quite good, though the color range is limited.

For Army Painter, I've only used their washes and varnishes, so I can't really comment.

Ihate these questions because people grade paints who are not qualified.

p3 paints are amazing, vallejos amazing the question is what style of painting do you do? if you do what I do which is basically only glazes then some colors from EVERY paint line will "not do as well"

if you just basecoat layer and edge highlight like GW (prob what you are aiming for ) they are ALL good. None of those paint lines suck for what you are going for. If someone is having trouble its because they are doing something wrong NOT the paint

I personally have never once used army painter simply because I have never read about any amazing painters using it. That being said i'm sure they are just fine for what you are looking to do so why not just pick the colors you like? they all mix together so doesn't really matter.

edit - P3 morrow white is 30x better than the GW whites. GW whites suck

I'd say nearly all GW paints tend to be good. Though I dislike their pots

SOME Army Painter are fantastic - their inks most of all, also their gunmetal or whatever it's called, and Skeleton Bone. Plus nearly all of their primers (apart from yellow). But it's true a couple of the regular paints are awful, just terrible coverage.

All the P3 I've tried has been great, too. Vallejo is a mixed bag, some good, and they seem to have more and more excellent replacements for discontinued GW colours.

if you just basecoat layer and edge highlight like GW (prob what you are aiming for ) they are ALL good. None of those paint lines suck for what you are going for. If someone is having trouble its because they are doing something wrong NOT the paint

I'm gonna have to disagree with you there.

If all you do is basecoat, layer and edge highlight you want paints which dry smooth but are high opacity for your basecoat otherwise you'll waste a lot of time and sometimes be fighting to get a smooth solid colour.

The reason people basecoat, layer and edge highlight is because they want models on the table quickly, no point wasting time with paints that take many coats to get a smooth basecoat if the whole reason you're using that method is to save time

That's why Mephiston Red and Averland Sunset are still in my bag of tricks in spite of me otherwise avoiding GW paints (because of the high price and crappy pots).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DalinCriid wrote:
On P3.. All their paints, no matter how I prep them leave brush strokes. Don't know what people love so much in them, but from my experience they are mediocre to bad. Althou, they result into some really nice color when you mix them wih Lifecolor or some Vallejo Colors.

I find P3 paints (at least the ones I've used) are good if your method revolves around putting down lots of semi transparent layers. If you don't, I don't think they're the best option.

I also don't like the way P3 paints dry on my palette, if you're using a wet palette they're probably okay, but I prefer the old slab palette and for that I don't like them.

Some really good painters use P3, but if you aren't using the same techniques as those good painters you're probably better off starting with paints that are more opaque out of the bottle.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

if you just basecoat layer and edge highlight like GW (prob what you are aiming for ) they are ALL good. None of those paint lines suck for what you are going for. If someone is having trouble its because they are doing something wrong NOT the paint

I'm gonna have to disagree with you there.

If all you do is basecoat, layer and edge highlight you want paints which dry smooth but are high opacity for your basecoat otherwise you'll waste a lot of time and sometimes be fighting to get a smooth solid colour.

The reason people basecoat, layer and edge highlight is because they want models on the table quickly, no point wasting time with paints that take many coats to get a smooth basecoat if the whole reason you're using that method is to save time

That's why Mephiston Red and Averland Sunset are still in my bag of tricks in spite of me otherwise avoiding GW paints (because of the high price and crappy pots).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DalinCriid wrote:
On P3.. All their paints, no matter how I prep them leave brush strokes. Don't know what people love so much in them, but from my experience they are mediocre to bad. Althou, they result into some really nice color when you mix them wih Lifecolor or some Vallejo Colors.

I find P3 paints (at least the ones I've used) are good if your method revolves around putting down lots of semi transparent layers. If you don't, I don't think they're the best option.

I also don't like the way P3 paints dry on my palette, if you're using a wet palette they're probably okay, but I prefer the old slab palette and for that I don't like them.

Some really good painters use P3, but if you aren't using the same techniques as those good painters you're probably better off starting with paints that are more opaque out of the bottle.

so what you are saying is those paints dont work. cus thats what would have to happen. bs i can do exactly that with ANY paint line easy. so annoying you and some other guy giving people wrong advice. its a pet peeve of mine maybe but annoying nonetheless. you are just wrong

eosgreen wrote:
Ihate these questions because people grade paints who are not qualified.

p3 paints are amazing, vallejos amazing the question is what style of painting do you do? if you do what I do which is basically only glazes then some colors from EVERY paint line will "not do as well"

if you just basecoat layer and edge highlight like GW (prob what you are aiming for ) they are ALL good. None of those paint lines suck for what you are going for. If someone is having trouble its because they are doing something wrong NOT the paint

I personally have never once used army painter simply because I have never read about any amazing painters using it. That being said i'm sure they are just fine for what you are looking to do so why not just pick the colors you like? they all mix together so doesn't really matter.

edit - P3 morrow white is 30x better than the GW whites. GW whites suck

I gotta agree with this guy. If you like/prefer painting with really thin mixes P3 is the best and Vallejo is also very nice. All of the white-ish / bone / tan P3 colors are amazing... I use the Menoths in everything, but VMC white is also brilliant. P3 Sanguine Base is also in nearly everything I paint.

If you use washes I personally don't think there are any better than GW though. They are the "smartest" washes in regards to going where they are supposed to go and leaving the least amount of offensive sheen.

The newest GW metallics cover extremely well, but they are really tough to clean off your brush. I'd never put them in my airbrush, but I put VMC metallics in the airbrush regularly and I love them.

Personally I think Army Painter is far inferior to any of these 3 lines of paint, but I've only tried a few.

eosgreen wrote:
so what you are saying is those paints dont work.

Learn to read bro, I never said they don't "work". I said if you use a basic style of painting it typically means you are doing it for the sake of speed and thus want paints that are strong in that area.

I could use Mephiston Red to basecoat an area or I could use Vallejo's Flat Red. I've tried both. I use the former because it's quicker and easier, not because Vallejo's Flat Red doesn't "work".

so annoying you and some other guy giving people wrong advice. its a pet peeve of mine maybe but annoying nonetheless. you are just wrong

It's not wrong advice, it's different advice.

I understand you're a pretty good painter and I've seen your work, but not everyone is trying to spend 100 hours painting a model to enter Golden Demon, some people just want to spend half an hour on a model so they can play a game with it.

Sometimes different brands of paints are similar enough, sometimes they're quite different, just because someone is targeting a basic style doesn't mean the differences are going to be lost on them. It just means the properties they are looking for might be different.

@AllSeeingSkink - good point, that some folks just want to get stuff done easy and efficiently, I get it.

You are both exceptionally good painters... stay are target haha!

 Gunzhard wrote:
@AllSeeingSkink - good point, that some folks just want to get stuff done easy and efficiently, I get it.

You are both exceptionally good painters... stay are target haha!

I am aware eosgreen is a far better painter than I but people have different goals, there's also not a single wargaming model in my gallery that I've spend more than 7 or so hours on (some of the aircraft took me 50-150 hours, but they're a different kettle of fish, most of them are painted with Tamiya acrylics which I swear by for airbrushing but do not recommend for hairy brushing, if you have to airbrush a red or a yellow I absolutely recommend Tamiya's Flat Red and Flat Yellow).

I will admit I haven't tried P3's white/beige colours though, maybe I'll give them a shot.

Unfortunately paints are one of those things that's hard to gauge until you yourself have used them. I have tons of paints I never use just because it took me buying them and using them before deciding I didn't like them

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

eosgreen wrote:
so what you are saying is those paints dont work.

Learn to read bro, I never said they don't "work". I said if you use a basic style of painting it typically means you are doing it for the sake of speed and thus want paints that are strong in that area.

I could use Mephiston Red to basecoat an area or I could use Vallejo's Flat Red. I've tried both. I use the former because it's quicker and easier, not because Vallejo's Flat Red doesn't "work".

so annoying you and some other guy giving people wrong advice. its a pet peeve of mine maybe but annoying nonetheless. you are just wrong

It's not wrong advice, it's different advice.

I understand you're a pretty good painter and I've seen your work, but not everyone is trying to spend 100 hours painting a model to enter Golden Demon, some people just want to spend half an hour on a model so they can play a game with it.

Sometimes different brands of paints are similar enough, sometimes they're quite different, just because someone is targeting a basic style doesn't mean the differences are going to be lost on them. It just means the properties they are looking for might be different.

exactly and every paint line will allow people to paint things with simple solid basecoats and highlights. I stopped posting on suggestion thread cus it got my jimmys rustled i should continue with that

eosgreen wrote:
exactly and every paint line will allow people to paint things with simple solid basecoats and highlights.

Yes but "will allow" is not the same as "is the best choice". I was never arguing that paint choice disallowed you to paint in a basic style, rather that if you have a basic style you should consider your needs. I may not be a high end painter but the differences in paint still affect my style and inversely my style affects the paints I prefer to use.

You could also paint miniatures with enamels or oil paints, I've seen some awesome work done with oil paints on miniatures, but it's not within the scope of what most people want to achieve so it rarely gets recommended beyond using it as a wash.

I stopped posting on suggestion thread cus it got my jimmys rustled i should continue with that

Or just chill out a bit I know you paint really well but not everyone has the same goals or abilities.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:


I will admit I haven't tried P3's white/beige colours though, maybe I'll give them a shot.

I like their white (although it's a little thick) and their bone has replaced Bleached Bone for me... It's a little greyer than Bleached Bone (or whatever stupid name it has these days) but looks better.

I never really liked GW's bleached bone, I use it a lot to mix in with other colours for highlights but rarely on its own. I did just buy Vallejo's Bonewhite but haven't tried it yet. Where I'd normally use Bleached Bone I'd usually use Rakarth Flesh as it has good coverage but it's a bit more greyish, before Rakarth Flesh I actually had a homemade mix of Dheneb Stone + Bleached Bone that worked for me but got replaced by Rakarth Flesh when that came out.

Does the P3 bone act a bit more like Rakarth Flesh or is it more its own thing?

I really like the P3 range. There are not many colors, but all the available tones are great. The range is a paint-mixer's paradise, as they have very vibrant bright paints (necrotite green, khador red base, the two cygnar blues, cygnus yellow, heartstone, meridus blue, murderous magenta, arcane blue etc...), and there is a good selection of off whites (underbelly blue, frostbite, hammerfall khaki, menoth white highlight etc), and a bunch of great dark tones (gnarls green, exile blue, umbral umber, coal black, beaten purple etc). Browns and drab colors are well represented as well. Dark red is a weak spot, but the more I mix the paints, the more I appreciate Mike McVey's choices for colors provided.

my last post on the subject.

GW - tend to have more cartoonish vibrant colors'
vallejo GAME COLOR - was supposed to be GW's new paint line but it didnt happen ALSO cartoonish colors very vibrant

P3 is also more like GW in cartoonishness but also like vallejo in its matte more realistic color
vallejo model color is a more "dull" color range or maybe more "realistic"

none of this matters lol. they all work for his purposes

From my experience I find Vallejo paints really great to work with. I mostly have paints from Vallejo model color
and game color range and few colors from air range.

Paints have great coverage except the yellow ones but yellow is a problematic color anyways.
They thin and flow really well. My top paints. I can't praise the silver metallics from model air enough.
Super covering and extremely fine pigments. They produce really smooth finish. For some
application even too smoth. Highly recommend.

I have all the washes from Army painter and a few paints. Can't fault washes one bit.
They are really good. I don't have enough paints to comment on them, but I'm gonna buy more.
Recently they expanded their range hugely, but you can only buy sets. You will be able to buy single paints
In february.

I also have several paints from Scale 75. They are a bit different. Paints leave an extremely matt
finish. Some people like it but I prefer Vallejo.

About citadel paints. IMHO they are not worth the money. Don't get me wrong the quality is there
but the pots are just horrible. Pots are a thing of the past. Dropper bottle are just superior.
It's like GW make these kind of pots on purpose so they dry out fast so people buy more paints.
Then there's the price. Per ml citadel paints are by far the priciest miniature paints on the market.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Does the P3 bone act a bit more like Rakarth Flesh or is it more its own thing?

Not sure - I stopped buying GW paints with the name change. That was just one range change too many...

 Modock wrote:
Pots are a thing of the past. Dropper bottle are just superior.

I disagree, to be honest. Dropper bottles clog, and they're really wasteful for washes (the one thing that I dislike about the Army Painter inks).


And I haven't had any issues with the paint drying out in the current GW pots. The previous pots, certainly, but the current pots are much better.