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 Fafnir wrote:
But AoS is fantastic. Its early release kind of sucked, but given a touch of development, it's become the best ruleset GW's put out in years, perhaps ever even.

Not if you actually liked Warhammer Fantasy it isn't.

I would like a p proper free people's or new high elves

[enter thread]

*looks around*

Hmm. Could've sworn this was a thread highlighting that GW are about to show off some goodies...

Instead seems to be one dedicated to circular arguments where neither side can or will be persuaded.

Silly me.

[exit thread]

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
[enter thread]

*looks around*

Hmm. Could've sworn this was a thread highlighting that GW are about to show off some goodies...

Instead seems to be one dedicated to circular arguments where neither side can or will be persuaded.

Silly me.

[exit thread]

Yep, this is why we can't have nice things.

Maybe the announcement was premature?

 jmurph wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
[enter thread]

*looks around*

Hmm. Could've sworn this was a thread highlighting that GW are about to show off some goodies...

Instead seems to be one dedicated to circular arguments where neither side can or will be persuaded.

Silly me.

[exit thread]

Yep, this is why we can't have nice things.

Maybe the announcement was premature?

Yes, it was premature. Let's be honest, the contents of this new are these: we are going to announce something. So barring saying: oh, new stuff is coming, there's nothing of substance to add to this thread. Hence why there's so much wish listing and bickering running rampant.

Wish-listing is cool. It's also fun and productive.

Going round and round and round and round and round and round and round ad infinitum about a game some love and some loathe? Utterly, singularly pointless and nothing to do with the topic

For what it's worth, I find AoS a fantastic game. If you don't, I don't give a Goblins Nethers.

I love announcements about up coming announcements.

To be fair, we did get non-rubbishy pics of the Moritat and Siege Tyrant Terminators.

 Ghaz wrote:

 Captain Azrael wrote:
At least we know what will one big reveal be.

Link: https://www.facebook.com/1575682476085719/photos/a.1576243776029589.1073741828.1575682476085719/1791355207851777/?type=3&theater

No. That's already been announced:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/03/10/talons-of-the-emperor-in-the-41st-millennium/

Spoiler:

Probs £100.

I read $165US on another thread though.

Not for me though - I only really want the Custodes, so the rest is a waste.

More Custodes and SoS would be nice, and the Rhino and LR could always come in handy for SM projects. But that damn Dread is actually putting me off.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
But AoS is fantastic. Its early release kind of sucked, but given a touch of development, it's become the best ruleset GW's put out in years, perhaps ever even.

Not if you actually liked Warhammer Fantasy it isn't.

Mods have already got rid of a load of this nonsense. Take the hint

If they give us new dwarf models (not the slayers with lizards, wtf was that all about?) I'll probably dust of my old minis and get into AoS. I keep hearing good things, but cannons don't shoot in a line anymore, so I don't know.

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
If they give us new dwarf models (not the slayers with lizards, wtf was that all about?) I'll probably dust of my old minis and get into AoS. I keep hearing good things, but cannons don't shoot in a line anymore, so I don't know.

True, but I do enjoy the mechanics of the warmachines that are more effective the bigger the unit or some other factor.

Cannon are still pretty deadly.

Fully crewed, it's two shots a turn, 4+ to hit, -2 rend, D6 damage. So the outside chance to tonk 12 wounds off a unit.

And as AoS seems to tend toward smaller units (certainly compared to 8th) that's pretty deadly.

It's starter box set for both AoS and W40k with a soft launch of next edition. Loyal against Traitor.

My guessing

 Hulksmash wrote:
You do realize that by spouting "a few years before endtimes" that GW would have had to essentially cancel Fantasy at the latest in the first year of 8th edition right? 8th came out in 2011. End Times started rolling out in the summer 2014. Fantasy was dying a slow death before GW canned it.

That's what they did. AOS was birthed in 2012 summer. When FB was still top 3 selling game. GW thought everything can sell same amount as marines so screw it. They weren't happy with 2 top-3 sellers. They wanted two top-1 seller. And no wonder sales tanked after that without releases. Most of GW's releases come from new releases. No new releases, no meaningful sales. If GW had one year without any 40k releases 40k sales would tank.

We are talking about company to whom exceeding expected sales by 400% is not enough...FB was doomed the moment GW realized they aren't selling as much as space marines.

Solidcrash wrote:
It's starter box set for both AoS and W40k with a soft launch of next edition. Loyal against Traitor.

My guessing

I don't think there's anything in Order that could transfer over to 40k as easily as say the Tzeentch forces can.

(Unless, of course, NuMarines are rocking the Greek hoplite look and have a craving for twin-tailed comets on their armor. )

Lord Kragan wrote:Yes, it was premature. Let's be honest, the contents of this new are these: we are going to announce something. So barring saying: oh, new stuff is coming, there's nothing of substance to add to this thread. Hence why there's so much wish listing and bickering running rampant.

That.

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Wish-listing is cool. It's also fun and productive.

Productive!?!

Going round and round and round and round and round and round and round ad infinitum about a game some love and some loathe? Utterly, singularly pointless...

You just described wishlisting. Even the 'nothing to do with the topic' bit is iffy.

tneva82 wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
You do realize that by spouting "a few years before endtimes" that GW would have had to essentially cancel Fantasy at the latest in the first year of 8th edition right? 8th came out in 2011. End Times started rolling out in the summer 2014. Fantasy was dying a slow death before GW canned it.

That's what they did. AOS was birthed in 2012 summer. When FB was still top 3 selling game. GW thought everything can sell same amount as marines so screw it. They weren't happy with 2 top-3 sellers. They wanted two top-1 seller. And no wonder sales tanked after that without releases. Most of GW's releases come from new releases. No new releases, no meaningful sales. If GW had one year without any 40k releases 40k sales would tank.

We are talking about company to whom exceeding expected sales by 400% is not enough...FB was doomed the moment GW realized they aren't selling as much as space marines.

7 Army books and accompanying model releases in 2013 & 2014 (thru August) seem to argue with you stating a year of non new releases. That's exactly the pace GW used to have (actually higher at more than a army book every 3 months) throughout most of it's business cycle. Especially for Fantasy. I wish the myth that GW strangled WFB with no releases would die.

40k did have closer to 17 codex & supplement releases in the same time period (2013-End Times). Granted 10 of them didn't have model releases so....oh look, same codex and model release numbers!

***Numbers per Wikipedia Army book & Codex pages***

OgreChubbs wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
And I hear the same old tired argument by the AOS hater, and yet, they never manage to show why and how AOS is a bad ruleset.

Reasons

1: Shooting into combat.
2: formations which have a mandate make up so lack creativity.
3: over powered heroes.
4: over powered monsters.
5: a model on foot costs the same for a model on a mount.
6: lack of weapon choices for nearly all models.
7: no reason not to take full command since it in the same if you didn't.
8 summoning needing to pay the cost for a unit that may not show up.
9: double turns.
10: you buy a box of 3 models and the data slate says 9 cost 90 points you can still take 3 for 90 tho.......
11: magic phase just all wrong.
12 lack of creative special rules making each unit different.
13 no rend no play models.
14: All models are too big and easy to model for advantage.
15: lack of proper syengery between use to exist models.
16: each battletome has about 3 models in it you can head swap to make it a (new) unit looking at you flesh eaters.
17: naked chaos.

If you would like a list on all that's wrong with the
Lore
Names
Models
I can go in.

1. So? 2. Incoherent but most likely wrong, very few formations actually see use is AoS so whatever you said isn't super likely to be true 3. False 4. Largely false, some exceptions but keep in mind that in 8th the only models on the board that meant anything were wizards and cannons. 5. Not always, but when it does happen it's honestly not usually seen as a big deal. 6. Most models have 2-3 weapon profiles with a few options for special weapons, compare to 40k where you have bolters and grav and that's the whole army. 7. So? Why is that bad? Doesn't that make more sense anyway? 8. Paying for summoning is one of the best rules in the game 40k would kill for that rule. 9. One of the most interesting parts of the game tactically. 10. Very few boxes are mismatched this way and every game has minimum unit size, try taking 3 space marines. 11. By wrong do you mean way way way way better than either 40k or 8th? 12. Bulls*** 13. Tell that to moonclan grots. 14. Also bulls*** 99% of games are base to base post ghb 15. Tomb kings. Just Tomb Kings. 16. Not since the GHB came out, admittedly some are fairly small but the last few have been awesome. 17. Meh, personal preference.

I don't need you to go on, you've been wrong about everything so far; the patterns pretty clear.

Baron Klatz wrote:

Solidcrash wrote:
It's starter box set for both AoS and W40k with a soft launch of next edition. Loyal against Traitor.

My guessing

I don't think there's anything in Order that could transfer over to 40k as easily as say the Tzeentch forces can.

(Unless, of course, NuMarines are rocking the Greek hoplite look and have a craving for twin-tailed comets on their armor. )

Whoop. Mind my bad English..

I mean starter box set for AoS and starter box set for W40k.....
AoS = Order vs Death?
W40K = imperial vs Chao via Gathering storm storyline?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
[enter thread]

*looks around*

Hmm. Could've sworn this was a thread highlighting that GW are about to show off some goodies...

Instead seems to be one dedicated to circular arguments where neither side can or will be persuaded.

Silly me.

[exit thread]

There should be an option to highlight threads that contain for rants and off-topic banter. That way, we would not need to read those dozens of threads, and could focus on the other one or two that are free from such noise.

 techsoldaten wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
[enter thread]

*looks around*

Hmm. Could've sworn this was a thread highlighting that GW are about to show off some goodies...

Instead seems to be one dedicated to circular arguments where neither side can or will be persuaded.

Silly me.

[exit thread]

There should be an option to highlight threads that contain for rants and off-topic banter. That way, we would not need to read those dozens of threads, and could focus on the other one or two that are free from such noise.

I've noticed that the rant threads usually mark themselves by having Games Workshop in the title. If that is in the title the OT rant is inevitable.

ERJAK wrote:

OgreChubbs wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
And I hear the same old tired argument by the AOS hater, and yet, they never manage to show why and how AOS is a bad ruleset.

Reasons

1: Shooting into combat.
2: formations which have a mandate make up so lack creativity.
3: over powered heroes.
4: over powered monsters.
5: a model on foot costs the same for a model on a mount.
6: lack of weapon choices for nearly all models.
7: no reason not to take full command since it in the same if you didn't.
8 summoning needing to pay the cost for a unit that may not show up.
9: double turns.
10: you buy a box of 3 models and the data slate says 9 cost 90 points you can still take 3 for 90 tho.......
11: magic phase just all wrong.
12 lack of creative special rules making each unit different.
13 no rend no play models.
14: All models are too big and easy to model for advantage.
15: lack of proper syengery between use to exist models.
16: each battletome has about 3 models in it you can head swap to make it a (new) unit looking at you flesh eaters.
17: naked chaos.

If you would like a list on all that's wrong with the
Lore
Names
Models
I can go in.

1. So? 2. Incoherent but most likely wrong, very few formations actually see use is AoS so whatever you said isn't super likely to be true 3. False 4. Largely false, some exceptions but keep in mind that in 8th the only models on the board that meant anything were wizards and cannons. 5. Not always, but when it does happen it's honestly not usually seen as a big deal. 6. Most models have 2-3 weapon profiles with a few options for special weapons, compare to 40k where you have bolters and grav and that's the whole army. 7. So? Why is that bad? Doesn't that make more sense anyway? 8. Paying for summoning is one of the best rules in the game 40k would kill for that rule. 9. One of the most interesting parts of the game tactically. 10. Very few boxes are mismatched this way and every game has minimum unit size, try taking 3 space marines. 11. By wrong do you mean way way way way better than either 40k or 8th? 12. Bulls*** 13. Tell that to moonclan grots. 14. Also bulls*** 99% of games are base to base post ghb 15. Tomb kings. Just Tomb Kings. 16. Not since the GHB came out, admittedly some are fairly small but the last few have been awesome. 17. Meh, personal preference.

I don't need you to go on, you've been wrong about everything so far; the patterns pretty clear.

These are valid reasons RazorEdge does not like AOS, and I share them wholeheartedly. There may be some overstatement in there, but it's easier to point out problems than the alternative.

On the subject of big announcements, what happened with AOS scares me. I like the idea of simplifying the ruleset, but that was excessive. I like the idea of updating the model range, but invalidating old lines was excessive.

My impression is GW does too much or not enough. I am all for change and updates to a stagnant system, but will be watching to see if the baby is indeed being thrown out with the bathwater.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Wish-listing is cool. It's also fun and productive.

Going round and round and round and round and round and round and round ad infinitum about a game some love and some loathe? Utterly, singularly pointless and nothing to do with the topic

For what it's worth, I find AoS a fantastic game. If you don't, I don't give a Goblins Nethers.

Well, yeah. But you don't understand the unbridled need to hate on AoS on threads for completely unrelated games! Pretty soon we'll see the same argument randomly on the Privateer Press general discussion, for no apparent reason.

Personally, I think the BiG Thing will be introducing Sisters of Silence and Custodes into 40k. Which is both completely expected and completely boring.

Already confirmed as at least part of this week's pre-orders.

Here's hoping for a revamp for the Guard - I've been meaning to start of a small Guard project for a few years now, but I can't help but feel that as soon as I start, they're gonna phase out Cadians and release a new generic Guard box.

Big question with that custodes box is what sort of Land Raider is included, just 1 variant or all 3?

Currently the best LR box to buy is the Deathwatch one as it includes all LR variants plus an extra Deathwatch Sprue.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Already confirmed as at least part of this week's pre-orders.

Sorry, that's what I meant, as I saw that already.