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Today is the last day to register to vote. I hope my fellow dakka members are all signed up and ready to go.
In surprising news, Labour have cut the Tories lead in the polls to single figures
Corbyn is out on the streets with a popular message: take back the trains, scrap tuition fees etc etc
May is in secret locations with a hand picked audience, and the Tory plans for social care are all over the shop.
Interesting times.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Today is the last day to register to vote. I hope my fellow dakka members are all signed up and ready to go.
In surprising news, Labour have cut the Tories lead in the polls to single figures
Corbyn is out on the streets with a popular message: take back the trains, scrap tuition fees etc etc
May is in secret locations with a hand picked audience, and the Tory plans for social care are all over the shop.
Interesting times.
I am not so surprised, actually, having listened to Radio 4. It seems that people don't take much notice of the manifesto, they pick up on a few strong messages and make a decision based on gut instict for 'leadership' and so on.
Like him or not, Corbyn has been out there projecting a few strong messages like you said, while May has been hiding in a bunker in the assumption that the Tories just need to point their fingers and laugh at Labour.
However, the new Social Care plan has gone down in Middle Britain like a lead balloon. Apparently 90% of people in the UK who own their own home have an asset worth over £100,000. May is now rolling back on that plan -- great strong and stable leadership!. Meanwhile the rest of the Tory manifesto is full of lots of policies (which isn't a strong message) and short of actual costings, which makes it difficult to accuse Labour of not having done their sums because they obviously have and the Tories obviously haven't.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Today is the last day to register to vote. I hope my fellow dakka members are all signed up and ready to go.
In surprising news, Labour have cut the Tories lead in the polls to single figures
Corbyn is out on the streets with a popular message: take back the trains, scrap tuition fees etc etc
May is in secret locations with a hand picked audience, and the Tory plans for social care are all over the shop.
Interesting times.
I am not so surprised, actually, having listened to Radio 4. It seems that people don't take much notice of the manifesto, they pick up on a few strong messages and make a decision based on gut instict for 'leadership' and so on.
Like him or not, Corbyn has been out there projecting a few strong messages like you said, while May has been hiding in a bunker in the assumption that the Tories just need to point their fingers and laugh at Labour.
However, the new Social Care plan has gone down in Middle Britain like a lead balloon. Apparently 90% of people in the UK who own their own home have an asset worth over £100,000. May is now rolling back on that plan -- great strong and stable leadership!. Meanwhile the rest of the Tory manifesto is full of lots of policies (which isn't a strong message) and short of actual costings, which makes it difficult to accuse Labour of not having done their sums because they obviously have and the Tories obviously haven't.
As I've said to you before, it's always amusing to see the party that gave us Black Wednesday accuse Labour of not getting their sums right, whilst failing to provide any of their own.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Today is the last day to register to vote. I hope my fellow dakka members are all signed up and ready to go.
In surprising news, Labour have cut the Tories lead in the polls to single figures
Corbyn is out on the streets with a popular message: take back the trains, scrap tuition fees etc etc
May is in secret locations with a hand picked audience, and the Tory plans for social care are all over the shop.
Interesting times.
Its a shame that Labour's plans will just throw everything into even more debt for everyone.
Where is the money for the trains and student fees going to come from?
In the last few years, the cost of borrowing for the government has been at record lows due to the low interest rate. A perfect time to borrow to fund major infrastructure projects you would think.
Osborne, however, saw things differently, which is why we're still in a mess.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/05/22 13:40:17
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/22 13:41:20
Former moderator 40kOnline
Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!
Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
Oh sure, withdraw the invitation and let Eastern Europe suffer the consequences of her foolish mistake? Feth that, its too late to withdraw the invitation.
May's on the ropes, and even Nick Clegg and John Prescott are sticking the knife in
Another shambles from the Tories. We'd better hope the EU doesn't say BOO to them, otherwise, they'll roll up the white flag.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
The European Commission's approach to transparency in the Article 50 negotiations with the United Kingdom
The Article 50 negotiations with the United Kingdom are unique and differ from any other negotiation conducted by the European Union to date. Given their unprecedented nature, the European Commission has decided to adopt a tailor-made approach to transparency.
The Commission, as European Union negotiator, will ensure a maximum level of transparency during the whole negotiating process.
Commission negotiating documents which are shared with EU Member States, the European Council, the European Parliament, the Council, national parliaments, and the United Kingdom will be released to the public.
Negotiating documents on Article 50
The negotiating documents mentioned above include, but are not limited to:
agendas for negotiating rounds
EU position papers
non-papers
EU text proposals
This transparency policy will be regularly reviewed to ensure that it fulfils its objective and does not negatively impact the integrity of the negotiations. In implementing this policy, the Union negotiator will act within the limits of EU law and respect the Commission's legal obligations with regard to protection of information as defined in art 4, paragraph 1 of Regulation n° 1049/2001 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 30 May 2001 regarding public access to European parliament, Council and Commission documents.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/05/22 16:24:22
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
On a serious note, I don't expect for a minute that Middle England marginals will ever elect a Corbyn/Abbott/McDonnell government, but this election could be a lot closer than people think.
Yes, I've been predicting a Conservative landslide for months, but when the facts change, I change my opinion, as somebody once said. Now, I think it will be a lot closer, seeing as Corbyn is getting balanced media coverage.
Updated DINLT prediction: Conservative win, with say, 30 seat majority and not the 100+ I originally predicted.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
Oh sure, withdraw the invitation and let Eastern Europe suffer the consequences of her foolish mistake? Feth that, its too late to withdraw the invitation.
She should have never made this invitation. Now the route from Turkey to Europe through Greece is mainly closed. The shelters/camps built in Germany for the refugees have been cleared during the last months.
Former moderator 40kOnline
Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!
Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
Oh sure, withdraw the invitation and let Eastern Europe suffer the consequences of her foolish mistake? Feth that, its too late to withdraw the invitation.
She should have never made this invitation. Now the route from Turkey to Europe through Greece is mainly closed. The shelters/camps built in Germany for the refugees have been cleared during the last months.
Right, but she did, the damage is done and Germany should pay the consequences.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/22 17:05:54
I'm probably getting carried away, but now he's free from the Commons and the Blairites, Corbyn actually looks like he's enjoying himself.
More public events, cracking jokes, at ease - he seems to be going down fighting.
May on the other hand looks scared stiff and increasingly relying on the right-wing media to shield her.
If we had a better and more balanced media, Corbyn would probably have a decent chance of victory in June, and I never thought I'd say that.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: A pro-Statist, pro surveillance authoritarian right winger, and an old Labour Marxist. What wonderful choices we have.
Re-nationalising the trains and taking on the spivs and speculators, seems to be quite popular with the British public.
At any rate, it's a contest now, and not a coronation, which is a good thing for our democracy.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
Oh sure, withdraw the invitation and let Eastern Europe suffer the consequences of her foolish mistake? Feth that, its too late to withdraw the invitation.
She should have never made this invitation. Now the route from Turkey to Europe through Greece is mainly closed. The shelters/camps built in Germany for the refugees have been cleared during the last months.
Right, but she did, the damage is done and Germany should pay the consequences.
Germany already pays for it. Most of the Germans were not happy with Merkel's decision.
Former moderator 40kOnline
Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!
Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."
Sentinel1 wrote: Immigration will always be a sticking point in politics, but you can't ignore it was one of the major factors in the lead up to Brexit. It remains extremely unlikely the Conservatives will ever reach their desired target until freedom of movement becomes invalid after concluding the Brexit deal/no deal. I for one believe immigration should be tightly controlled in reflexion to the economy and what positions are needed. The problem with mass migration is that it is primarily unskilled migration. We will be needing more skilled labour such as engineers rather than field workers as time goes on. We are luckier than most European countries for actually having a physical body of water between us rather than a land border, the central countries will never be able to control to control their immigration even if they helped each other. The whole Asylum seeker-jump on the band wagon economic migrant crisis proved how woefully inadequate the EU was/n't prepared to stop it. As much as they can try and register people to stay in one place they will never truly know who or how many people they have. Going back to us, at some point we will reach saturation in my opinion in which the unskilled jobs are either being replaced by machines or that the industry does not require more bodies, this will be the true end and shift in immigration.
That's simply not true. There are more and more reports that we do not have the enough low skilled workers to keep things ticking along. It's getting especially bad in the farming sector which relies on seasonal workers that the UK populace simply isn't willing to do overall. Unless you start press ganging students into doing these jobs there is a risk that at this low skill level we'll just pull the rug from under ourselves in some desperate bid to reduce immigration for *insert reason*. It is also nonsense to think that we can encourage only 'skilled' workers from other countries and then expect them not to have the comforts of home such as family, food specialities and so on. It's as if there is an expectation that they should just be consumed by the *great British ideals* (yes sarcasm) and then do what we need them to do to keep the country *great*. Why would people leave for another country when they can't take friends and family with them, expect a hostile reception and are effectively being used by the country until at some point they are deemed as no longer being required? Bizarrely of course should such trained and selected people actually come to the country then it discourages training of the UK populace because you are selecting by those already trained. On the other hand an open market allows the free flow of people and will naturally over time come to an equilibrium. With more people in the country you can support larger numbers of niche high tech businesses that would otherwise either not find the business or the employees to support it.
The ironic thing about all this of course is that we are all immigrants if you look back a couple of thousand years. As a species we migrated out of Africa and there have been several waves of migration over time. That we are the nation we are today is because of migration, not because of a lack of it. What about America, where was that 500 years ago, yet through sustained migration it is now the most powerful nation on the Earth. The one simplistically similar thing however is that there has always been resistance to migration, always fear of the 'alien' (which is an evolved trait); yet the desire to keep things the same never happens and the migration continues unabated. In reality as climate change kicks in migration is going to become greater as populaces move from larger regions that are uninhabitable - so it's going to have to be something people will have to get use to over the next couple of hundred years (assuming we don't nuke ourselves in the meantime).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: I'm probably getting carried away, but now he's free from the Commons and the Blairites, Corbyn actually looks like he's enjoying himself.
More public events, cracking jokes, at ease - he seems to be going down fighting.
May on the other hand looks scared stiff and increasingly relying on the right-wing media to shield her.
If we had a better and more balanced media, Corbyn would probably have a decent chance of victory in June, and I never thought I'd say that.
It's probably why May shielded herself away from the public and media because she was fearful of being exposed and hoped that the negative press on Corbyn would win here the victory. The problem is that at some point she did have to start coming out with policies and be exposed to the type of politician she is.
Still it's funny watching May go into car crash mode. That's two major policies (NI on small businesses and this) that are perceived to be uturns making her mantra of "strong and stable" look increasing unrealistic (and if she take this approach to Brexit well it isn't going to go well).
However, the new Social Care plan has gone down in Middle Britain like a lead balloon. Apparently 90% of people in the UK who own their own home have an asset worth over £100,000. May is now rolling back on that plan -- great strong and stable leadership!. Meanwhile the rest of the Tory manifesto is full of lots of policies (which isn't a strong message) and short of actual costings, which makes it difficult to accuse Labour of not having done their sums because they obviously have and the Tories obviously haven't.
Of course she hasn't really done a uturn on it yet. They have just said they will include a cap as an item in the consultation. The thing is the Tories in the last two governments have completely ignored a lot of consultations and just done what they wanted anyway. My suspicion is that this is a way to try and push back the issue until after they get elected and then implement it anyway.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/05/22 18:33:05
"Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror. " - V
I've just supported the Permanent European Union Citizenship initiative. Please do the same and spread the word!
"It's not a problem if you don't look up." - Dakka's approach to politics
In hindsight, it seems that the Tory plan to hide May away from the public was a smart move.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: A pro-Statist, pro surveillance authoritarian right winger, and an old Labour Marxist. What wonderful choices we have.
Re-nationalising the trains and taking on the spivs and speculators, seems to be quite popular with the British public.
At any rate, it's a contest now, and not a coronation, which is a good thing for our democracy.
Anyone who has travelled by our wonderful 20 years privatised railways will agree. Looking at going to Durham with my daughter, for her to see the university in case she might apply. Return tickets are over £149 each for Super Advance, which is off peak with no flexibility, in second class, and there's actually only one train that could get us there.
If she got in, tuition is over £9,000 a year.
If my parents need social care, there goes the inheritance that might have paid for the university fees.
You can see why my wife and I actually are thinking Labour's got a better manifesto than the Tories. I can't be the only one. There are plenty of parents with more children than me.
The best thing is, the Social Care thing apparently was Theresa May's idea, which she shoved into the manifesto at the last minute without consulting anyone.
Unions have piped up that the sale to a new entrant – this time, state-backed Italian firm Trenitalia – is proof that the government is standing by and letting foreign companies take over Britain's railways instead of grabbing the bull by the horns and bringing the network back under public ownership.
In fact, according to the Rail, Maritime and Transport union, 70 per cent of Britain's railways are now under foreign ownership to some degree.
Devil in the detail
On the face of it, overseas operators do play a major part in running the UK's railways.
But because many overseas transport firms are involved through joint venture agreements with UK companies, it isn't quite as simple as saying there is a growing dominance by firms outside of the UK.
Odd how , apparently, foreign govts can run rail franchises but UK ones cannot.
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
Perhaps we should start calling it repatriation of the railways rather than nationalisation since about three quarters of the railways are already owned by government, just not ours.
George Spiggott wrote: Perhaps we should start calling it repatriation of the railways rather than nationalisation since about three quarters of the railways are already owned by government, just not ours.
Same thing for the power companies.
We have this twilight zone situation where British rail passengers are bank rolling cheaper fares for passengers in other countries.
John Major has a lot to answer for
Up here in Scotland, the Dutch government runs Scotrail. Badly, I may add.
In England, you guys have German, Italian, Hong Kong, running the show...
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: A pro-Statist, pro surveillance authoritarian right winger, and an old Labour Marxist. What wonderful choices we have.
Re-nationalising the trains and taking on the spivs and speculators, seems to be quite popular with the British public.
At any rate, it's a contest now, and not a coronation, which is a good thing for our democracy.
Anyone who has travelled by our wonderful 20 years privatised railways will agree. Looking at going to Durham with my daughter, for her to see the university in case she might apply. Return tickets are over £149 each for Super Advance, which is off peak with no flexibility, in second class, and there's actually only one train that could get us there.
If she got in, tuition is over £9,000 a year.
If my parents need social care, there goes the inheritance that might have paid for the university fees.
You can see why my wife and I actually are thinking Labour's got a better manifesto than the Tories. I can't be the only one. There are plenty of parents with more children than me.
The best thing is, the Social Care thing apparently was Theresa May's idea, which she shoved into the manifesto at the last minute without consulting anyone.
This is what happens when the Tories think they can't be beaten. They always over reach themselves.
As for trains, the horror stories I could tell you. Imagine being stuck on a Virgin train at the height of summer. Imagine that train has broken down and the air conditioning is not working...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/22 21:21:22
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
konst80hummel wrote: Indeed that was the agreement from the days of Schengen. And it held (creating a completely different beast in the process)until the numbers spiked with the refugee crisis. However nor Greece, nor Italy not anyone country on it 'sown can provide shelter in humanitarian conditions for the flood of people that came with the Syrian refugee status. And when we asked for support the central Europe raised barbed wire fence and set the army to watch the borders.
Put them all on a flight to Germany. Merkel invited them after all.
This invitation no longer exists. This is what Merkel has pointed out.
Oh sure, withdraw the invitation and let Eastern Europe suffer the consequences of her foolish mistake? Feth that, its too late to withdraw the invitation.
She should have never made this invitation. Now the route from Turkey to Europe through Greece is mainly closed. The shelters/camps built in Germany for the refugees have been cleared during the last months.
Right, but she did, the damage is done and Germany should pay the consequences.
Has Britain paid for the 2004 and 2007 EU expansions?
The answer is no. Blair did, with his (political) head.
It's Tory ideology to ensure a minimal state ownership. However for some areas, where there is significant lack of competition (such as rail and energy) there is a big argument that by handing it over to private companies it just favours price gouging of the public over a decent public service.
"Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror. " - V
I've just supported the Permanent European Union Citizenship initiative. Please do the same and spread the word!
"It's not a problem if you don't look up." - Dakka's approach to politics
That's because it's pretty hard to have competitions over trains, as the majority of them share track and not many people seem to be building new tracks for whatever reason.
I've always figured that the important things, health, education, transport, water and electric possibly should be nationalised, but then there is nothing stopping the government from screwing you over and you're stuck without a second option.
DS:90-S+G+++M++B-IPw40k03+D+A++/fWD-R++T(T)DM+ Warmachine MKIII record 39W/0D/6L
So, seven million years ago, when this election was called, if someone had written "X is having a complete nightmare of a campaign, and appears to be losing all control. Their uncosted promises are haunting them and they've already been forced to change their manifesto commitments. Y on the other hand appears to be campaigning with great confidence, and has really gained momentum" would YOU have guessed X and Y correctly?
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