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Can someone explain to me what exactly are the free rules and what more will I get by paying the book, please ?

 godardc wrote:
Can someone explain to me what exactly are the free rules and what more will I get by paying the book, please ?

The free rules are just the core rules for how the game is played. Money buys you the different game types, the missions, and the expansions (Cities of Death, Stronghold Assault, ect).

Oh, and the army rules (unless GW drops free PDFs of them with their power levels at launch). Matched points will likely cost money though.

The core rules are free. The advanced rules and the three styles of play are in the book.

THE FULL BOOK IS IN THE BOX SET!?!?!?!?!?!

Sorry all caps but I don't remember that happening since 3rd ed.

I'll probably regret this but I'm all in.

EDIT:
For anyone looking for the contents of the box set.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/23/warhammer-40000-launch-date-announced-may22gw-homepage-post-1/

 Kriswall wrote:
I thought I read somewhere that the matched play rules would have official base sizes for each unit. If true, I can't imagine this would matter outside of tournament settings.

That was Faeith crap even they quickly withdrew.

GW won't care about base size and knows that would be "bit" controversial move. That might be something Kirby&co might have tried to invalidate existing ones and force to buy new ones(hopefully entirely new models if old ones would break in an attempt to separate them from base) but the new GW should know not to piss of players that badly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The way I think it works from what we know:
1. Lascannons roll 3 for damage
2. Plague Marine fails its 6+ save
3. Then you roll 3 separate Disgustingly Resilient tests

Either that or that only happens for multiple wound critters.

Well 2 and 1 are actually reverse. But what I was wondering is if it rolls 4-6. But probably those are discarded ie all 4+ counts as 3. Only way it can work without having to roll every lascannon fully separately after armour saves are done for...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

DCannon4Life wrote:
It will be:
1. Lascannon rolls To Wound, successfully
2. Plague Marine fails its 6+ save
3. Lascannon rolls D6 for Damage; rolls a 4
4. Plague Marine must make 4 successful Disgustingly Resilient rolls

This is the problem I was talking about. If this is how it goes if unit gets wounded by 4 lascannons that's 4 lascannons you need to roll one by one.

d6. 4 wounds. 4 DR rolls.
d6. 2 wounds. 2 DR rolls
d6. 6 wounds. 6 DR rolls
d6. 1 wound. 1 DR roll

See? That would be very slow rolling! With speed and simplicy being buzzwords I doubt that is how it goes.

Is there an MSRP on the boxed set anywhere? I just looked on the first post and couldn't find one.

 rollawaythestone wrote:
The new FNP (disgustingly resilient) is powerful, but weaker than it used to be because now it allows you to ignore Damage instead of Wounds. So a Save is stronger because a Save ignores the whole Wound and all subsequent damage (d3, d6 etc) whereas the FNP allows you an extra save against each damage caused.

Well average wise it's same if you roll first DR and then d6 for damage or first d6 and then DR. Difference is bell curve. Less extreme results, more following average so this actually helps generally as you want steady results. However slower than first save, then damage.

so, to move the topic away from how free the rules will be, one thing I noticed in the release pic of starter set was that the Primaris Assault marines come in a base unit size of 3 and it appears that the standard bearer is in a 3 man unit also. This shows me that the primaris marines are going to have rules designed with base units of 3, or at least the more elite versions of primaris marines will. I've always thought one way to make marines feel more like the fluff is to allow supper MSUs to be more prevalent.

Look at the power armored death guard, some are carrying beefy looking bolt-gun looking weapons. I think those are the blight launchers. Maybe.

At least, that's my observation.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

 MLaw wrote:
THE FULL BOOK IS IN THE BOX SET!?!?!?!?!?!

Sorry all caps but I don't remember that happening since 3rd ed.

I'll probably regret this but I'm all in.

EDIT:
For anyone looking for the contents of the box set.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/23/warhammer-40000-launch-date-announced-may22gw-homepage-post-1/

This is actually a bad move!

The starter set is much more expensive than Dark Vengeance, with near as I can tell very slightly less plastic in it. This bump will be because of the huge hardback tome they decided to include.

So in other words, less people buying more than one kit to build up their army, because it costs more and they don't need several core rulebooks.

 Powerfisting wrote:
so, to move the topic away from how free the rules will be, one thing I noticed in the release pic of starter set was that the Primaris Assault marines come in a base unit size of 3 and it appears that the standard bearer is in a 3 man unit also. This shows me that the primaris marines are going to have rules designed with base units of 3, or at least the more elite versions of primaris marines will. I've always thought one way to make marines feel more like the fluff is to allow supper MSUs to be more prevalent.

Well, right now it goes even further than that. Then don't even let them make the unit bigger! I'm guessing those assault marines will be 3W, too.

changemod wrote:

 MLaw wrote:
THE FULL BOOK IS IN THE BOX SET!?!?!?!?!?!

Sorry all caps but I don't remember that happening since 3rd ed.

I'll probably regret this but I'm all in.

EDIT:
For anyone looking for the contents of the box set.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/23/warhammer-40000-launch-date-announced-may22gw-homepage-post-1/

This is actually a bad move!

The starter set is much more expensive than Dark Vengeance, with near as I can tell very slightly less plastic in it. This bump will be because of the huge hardback tome they decided to include.

So in other words, less people buying more than one kit to build up their army, because it costs more and they don't need several core rulebooks.

They'll probably release a scaled down one after the initial sales drop..

BUT..

HOW MUCH IS IT???? Srsly, I think I'm looking a little too frantically.. I am not seeing the price anywhere..

 MLaw wrote:


They'll probably release a scaled down one after the initial sales drop..

BUT..

HOW MUCH IS IT???? Srsly, I think I'm looking a little too frantically.. I am not seeing the price anywhere..

$150-160 presumably.

 Powerfisting wrote:
so, to move the topic away from how free the rules will be, one thing I noticed in the release pic of starter set was that the Primaris Assault marines come in a base unit size of 3 and it appears that the standard bearer is in a 3 man unit also. This shows me that the primaris marines are going to have rules designed with base units of 3, or at least the more elite versions of primaris marines will. I've always thought one way to make marines feel more like the fluff is to allow supper MSUs to be more prevalent.

Minimal size of 5 for normal squads and minimal size of 3 for more elite units. Just like Stormcast Eternals.

 TheDraconicLord wrote:
There was someone some posts back worried about the Sororitas. Here, found this in the FB comments:

So I really had to squint, but I didn't see any reference to Sororitas in the "Imperial Not-Marines" book contents. Did we get anymore confirmation that the Sororitas will be in one of the two Imperial Armies books? I didn't see anything using Dakka's search function...

Valete,

JohnS

 MLaw wrote:

changemod wrote:

 MLaw wrote:
THE FULL BOOK IS IN THE BOX SET!?!?!?!?!?!

Sorry all caps but I don't remember that happening since 3rd ed.

I'll probably regret this but I'm all in.

EDIT:
For anyone looking for the contents of the box set.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/23/warhammer-40000-launch-date-announced-may22gw-homepage-post-1/

This is actually a bad move!

The starter set is much more expensive than Dark Vengeance, with near as I can tell very slightly less plastic in it. This bump will be because of the huge hardback tome they decided to include.

So in other words, less people buying more than one kit to build up their army, because it costs more and they don't need several core rulebooks.

They'll probably release a scaled down one after the initial sales drop..

BUT..

HOW MUCH IS IT???? Srsly, I think I'm looking a little too frantically.. I am not seeing the price anywhere..

To phrase it in a way independent of currency or whether you're buying with a store discount, it's about one and a half dark vengeances.

 cygnnus wrote:

 TheDraconicLord wrote:
There was someone some posts back worried about the Sororitas. Here, found this in the FB comments:

So I really had to squint, but I didn't see any reference to Sororitas in the "Imperial Not-Marines" book contents. Did we get anymore confirmation that the Sororitas will be in one of the two Imperial Armies books? I didn't see anything using Dakka's search function...

Valete,

JohnS

Agents of the Imperium...as their current codex is titled.

tneva82 wrote:

 rollawaythestone wrote:
The new FNP (disgustingly resilient) is powerful, but weaker than it used to be because now it allows you to ignore Damage instead of Wounds. So a Save is stronger because a Save ignores the whole Wound and all subsequent damage (d3, d6 etc) whereas the FNP allows you an extra save against each damage caused.

Well average wise it's same if you roll first DR and then d6 for damage or first d6 and then DR. Difference is bell curve. Less extreme results, more following average so this actually helps generally as you want steady results. However slower than first save, then damage.

I think it will be:

1) Roll hit and wound
2) Roll saves for each wound
3) Roll damage and make a pool of wounds
4) Roll DR for each wound of the pool
5) Remove models. Cannot remove more models than hits received.

This is the faster way and gives more value to multi damage weapons against resilient targets. Yes, it has a bit of wounds spilling, but it still saves the "Use powerfull weapons on big guys and high ROF stuff on small guys" concept.

Do we know where we get the point costs (not the power level) yet?
1. in the rulebook
2. in the index books
3. in a General's Handbook publication later this year
4. in the app

Can someone provide a source please. I have followed the teaser campaign closeley and have double-checked the summary in this thread, but could'nt find the answer. It seems this hasn't beent answered explicitly yet (or I can't use the internet).

Another size comparison photo - Source: Steppingbetweengames blog



http://steppingbetweengames.com/new-8th-edition-40k-models-size-comparison/

Warhams-77 wrote:
Size comparison - Source: Steppingbetweengames blog

Wow! That primaris is substantially larger than a standard Marine. I approve.

Looks like numarines are taller than old heresy marines too.

i guess t sons are just naturally taller.

So, would I be right in assuming that the new poxwalkers are taking the place of plague zombie cultists?

Warhams-77 wrote:
Another size comparison photo - Source: Steppingbetweengames blog



http://steppingbetweengames.com/new-8th-edition-40k-models-size-comparison/

Huh, I wasn't expecting them to actually be falsescale.

 docdoom77 wrote:

Warhams-77 wrote:
Size comparison - Source: Steppingbetweengames blog

Wow! That primaris is substantially larger than a standard Marine. I approve.

Huh, 10,000 years and all they could figure out was how to increase the tibia length? Working on cranial cavity size might have been more productive.

The models look great, but yeah the scale is all over the place now. I'm also bummed the set is so expensive, I was hoping for 130 USD at the most. The hardback book is nice for fluff and looking at. But in a practical sense it might overwhelm a new player.

I also can't wait to see the multi part kits. Hoping for a 2 pack of primus lieutenants with unique weapon options. The auto bolter is the coolest weapon of the lot IMO. And sort of making them like mini characters as opposed to the more generic intercessor squads would be interesting. Would also be cool if they could buff one nearby primus unit, so a chain of command thing is going on.

edit: I also don't like that the terminator has a powerpack, part of what made the normal terminators cool was that they were built in...giving them a menacing profile.

That Terminator armor.. WOW..

wait.. does that mean a Spacehulk reissue in a few years?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Didn't the Primaris announcement mention that the shoulderpads, heads, and backpacks would be the same size while the rest of the components were being re-scaled? ..or was that someone's comments here?

EDIT: Found it
Are the kits compatible with existing Space Marine kits?
Good Question. There are certainly elements of the existing Space Marines kits that will be cross-compatible, while the new armour mark means that some parts won’t mix as easily. Shoulder pads and helmets are the same scale, and will still work, whereas the legs, torso and arms are different, and not quite as interchangeable. In terms of the Primaris sets themselves, you’ll have loads of fun kit-bashing them.

 docdoom77 wrote:

Warhams-77 wrote:
Size comparison - Source: Steppingbetweengames blog

Wow! That primaris is substantially larger than a standard Marine. I approve.

Bleh, A little too large for my taste actually. At that size they will start to interact with doorways and barriers much differently. I actually prefer the calth guy to be honest. Interesting to note that the deathguard marine is the same scale as the current marines, just bulkier.




I guess we know now why Guilliman was so fething huge BTW. I am betting he looks more normal for a primarch next to the Numarines.

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Powerfisting wrote:
so, to move the topic away from how free the rules will be, one thing I noticed in the release pic of starter set was that the Primaris Assault marines come in a base unit size of 3 and it appears that the standard bearer is in a 3 man unit also. This shows me that the primaris marines are going to have rules designed with base units of 3, or at least the more elite versions of primaris marines will. I've always thought one way to make marines feel more like the fluff is to allow supper MSUs to be more prevalent.

Well, right now it goes even further than that. Then don't even let them make the unit bigger! I'm guessing those assault marines will be 3W, too.

I'm guessing that primaris marines are intended to be very new-kid friendly. They don't have sub-optimal choices like taking more than the minimum squad size or picking the wrong special weapon. You just get a decent all-rounder unit right out of the box and don't have to worry about understanding the rules before building them or anything.

tneva82 wrote:
This is the problem I was talking about. If this is how it goes if unit gets wounded by 4 lascannons that's 4 lascannons you need to roll one by one.

d6. 4 wounds. 4 DR rolls.
d6. 2 wounds. 2 DR rolls
d6. 6 wounds. 6 DR rolls
d6. 1 wound. 1 DR roll

See? That would be very slow rolling! With speed and simplicy being buzzwords I doubt that is how it goes.

I suppose, if you have a unit rolling 12+ LasCannon shots, it could slow the game down. I'm not familiar with any units that do that. And we're all already used to rolling results separately; when shooting LasCannons at a unit of War Walkers, for example, we roll the results one at a time to see if we get 'Explodes' results.

This will very much be like that: "Is he dead yet? No? Here's the next LasCannon's Damage roll." "Is he dead NOW? NO?! Good grief, here's the NEXT LasCannon's Damage roll...."