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It will be interesting to see the pt costs of an Interceptor unit compared with normal Assault marines. Placement (Meteoric descent) of 9'' also something has already been introduced - see AoS.

whao so those three guys pump out 18shots! wonder where this leaves HB centurions (lol did anyone ever take em) just better range i guess.

Interesting it says they have two of them but no other rules so the assumption is every model in new 40k can fire all its weapons? interesting if you have a bolter, bolt pistol and a grenade.... we'll have to see

Gravis strikes me as a middleground between centurion armor and regular armor. Also its interesting that the captain is 7 power while that three man unit is 8. I get the feeling these guys are going to be priced closer to centurions than regular marines.

I will be interested in seeing if it is terminator armor that gives the regular terminators +1 wound or if it is veteran status that gives them the extra wound.

Also yes, this seems to be the rules from the starter set as it does not mention any other options, I bet when the plastic kit for them comes out they will have more equipment options to choose from

Set up in high orbit and landing whenever you choose. I really like that the not having to roll for arrival seems to be more common than not.

deleted redundant

Fly means they can fall back and shoot.

So, you would

Turn 1)
Move 10", Shoot, Charge, Crushing Charge, Fight melee.

Turn 2) Fall back 10", Shoot

Then go back to Turn 1 tactics. Though, they might be too expensive to treat in that manner. Looking at the 8 Power level, I am guessing that is around 80-100 points. If five 13pt marines are power level 5.

That's quite a lot of firepower they're putting out. 18 shots from three marines.

Master crafted doing more damage makes more sense then rerolling to hit.

 Robin5t wrote:
That's quite a lot of firepower they're putting out. 18 shots from three marines.

I bet they will cost a lot.

Youn wrote:
Fly means they can fall back and shoot.

So, you would

Turn 1)
Move 10", Shoot, Charge, Crushing Charge, Fight melee.

Turn 2) Fall back 10", Shoot

Then go back to Turn 1 tactics. Though, they might be too expensive to treat in that manner. Looking at the 8 Power level, I am guessing that is around 80-100 points. If five 13pt marines are power level 5.

They are probably more expensive than that. Remember the power level 5 marines are factoring in the cost of the unit upgrades. Meanwhile this sheet is the power level for those with fixed upgrades. I bet they will easily be closer to 40+ points each

But we are also seeing that they are most likely not going to be making assault intercessors nor bike intercessors anytime soon, if at all. I think that also means that landspeeders wont be touched either. I really dont feel like they are planning on completely phasing out regular marines. It seems like they are just making another option.


One thing I really would like to highlight is the fact that he only extends his buffs to models from the same chapter. I bet that is how they are going to handle hybrid armies where some units will be keyword "Imperium" to get the benefits or keyword "Adeptus Astartes" to get the benefits. I like it. Within any force org chart you can bring as many different elements as you want, however the ability to synergize will be limited. Nice little touch.



So potentially I can still bring 4 units of tactical marines as troops, all from different chapters. An assassin for my elites and then a dark angels cmd squad with a Blood Angels librarian HQ. So I can build my army however I want. The key will be that none of these units will be able to take advantage of any potential buffs. I think that as long as they work hard to get points right and maintain balance it will be a wonderful system. You get benefits for taking units from the same faction but you dont have to if you dont want to.

Youn wrote:
Fly means they can fall back and shoot.

So, you would

Turn 1)
Move 10", Shoot, Charge, Crushing Charge, Fight melee.

Turn 2) Fall back 10", Shoot

Then go back to Turn 1 tactics. Though, they might be too expensive to treat in that manner. Looking at the 8 Power level, I am guessing that is around 80-100 points. If five 13pt marines are power level 5.

More like T1: Deep strike, shoot, hope for that 9" (minimum to get within that 1" melee range), fight melee.
T2: Why have I been shot by everything?

With 18 S5 AP-1 shots, you aren't going to want to shoot your closest target. You wont be able to charge it.

 Leth wrote:

They are probably more expensive than that. Remember the power level 5 marines are factoring in the cost of the unit upgrades. Meanwhile this sheet is the power level for those with fixed upgrades. I bet they will easily be closer to 40+ points each

The community page explicitly stated that PL does not include upgrades. Those PL5 marines are primaris.

PL8 rubrics have roughly the same ratio cost of sorcerer to rubric. If their points are similar then these guys will be about 50 points each.

Incidentally the sentence “Every Space Marines army is going to want one of these guys at its head.” is a pretty impressive achievement in condescension.

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Leth wrote:

They are probably more expensive than that. Remember the power level 5 marines are factoring in the cost of the unit upgrades. Meanwhile this sheet is the power level for those with fixed upgrades. I bet they will easily be closer to 40+ points each

The community page explicitly stated that PL does not include upgrades. Those PL5 marines are primaris.

PL8 rubrics have roughly the same ratio cost of sorcerer to rubric. If their points are similar then these guys will be about 50 points each.

Someone linked a FB post where the GW community dude says that PL takes into consideration that it's a 'pretty suped up' version of the unit.

changemod wrote:
Incidentally the sentence “Every Space Marines army is going to want one of these guys at its head.” is a pretty impressive achievement in condescension.

How so?

Hey, Mars has to fix those slightly broken chapters somehow!

Presumably Inceptors can shoot with both of their weapons, but there is no rule allowing them to do so... Does this mean that everyone can now shoot with all their weapons like in AOS? Can a tactical marine shoot with a bolter and a pistol and lob a grenade all at the same time?

Anyhow, good to know that gravis is not a termie replacement. Looking forward to primaris terminators. Move 5 is a tad annoying though, for a guy you'd want to advance together with your troops.

Oh, and these are better be starter set profiles, and in reality the characters don't come with fixed equipment. If I cannot choose gear for my characters I will lose it.

FunJohn wrote:

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Leth wrote:

They are probably more expensive than that. Remember the power level 5 marines are factoring in the cost of the unit upgrades. Meanwhile this sheet is the power level for those with fixed upgrades. I bet they will easily be closer to 40+ points each

The community page explicitly stated that PL does not include upgrades. Those PL5 marines are primaris.

PL8 rubrics have roughly the same ratio cost of sorcerer to rubric. If their points are similar then these guys will be about 50 points each.

Someone linked a FB post where the GW community dude says that PL takes into consideration that it's a 'pretty suped up' version of the unit.

Yes, and we've gone over that. If PL were based on upgrades then which upgrade is it based on for the dreadnought?

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
The more I read about Inceptors the more brain cells I lose. Assault Marines with bike toughness toting double heavy bolters is absolute madness. Matt Ward and CS Goto love child level madness. Spartan kick into the endless pit level madness. If anyone had posted something like that in Proposed Rules they'd have been chased out by an angry mob.

Not assault marines.

Jump marines, then. Its still a rediculous unit design that would have been shot down instaneously in proposed rules.

They stated in the article on shooting that models armed with two one handed weapons may shoot both of them. The example they used was Cypher as being extremely dangerous with his two pistols.

Basically, the new rules assume gunslinger is a thing for everyone.

Daedalus81 wrote:

FunJohn wrote:

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Leth wrote:

They are probably more expensive than that. Remember the power level 5 marines are factoring in the cost of the unit upgrades. Meanwhile this sheet is the power level for those with fixed upgrades. I bet they will easily be closer to 40+ points each

The community page explicitly stated that PL does not include upgrades. Those PL5 marines are primaris.

PL8 rubrics have roughly the same ratio cost of sorcerer to rubric. If their points are similar then these guys will be about 50 points each.

Someone linked a FB post where the GW community dude says that PL takes into consideration that it's a 'pretty suped up' version of the unit.

Yes, and we've gone over that. If PL were based on upgrades then which upgrade is it based on for the dreadnought?

Its a guideline for people who just want to make a quick game amongst friends. IF people want to abuse that it is on them. I think the main idea is that you use what you got. So if you are the type to build the most expensive option model that you plan to use all the time in both pointed and power games that is on you.

 Deadshot wrote:


Jump marines, then. Its still a rediculous unit design that would have been shot down instaneously in proposed rules.

Shot down by whom? I don't like the models, but the rules are ok by me.

They're pretty much Starcraft 2 Reapers

Semi-assault hit and run harassment units

Wow, they sure gave those Inceptors some pretty mean rules. I guess folks may have to get over their dislike of them! Twin heavy bolters on a jump pack unit, yikes!

I really don't have a problem with any of the Adeptus Restartes models, they are all pretty nice looking. I am not a Marine player, though, so I don't really have a dog in the fight - I will be giving the box set a pass, despite it being a pretty evidently great deal. Just a rulebook plus the tyranid/gsc and elder indexes for me so far. Can't wait to see what kind of love they have in store for the Xenos down the road, although it sounds like we will have nothing but space marines and bad space marines for a little while at least...

Apologies if it's already been discussed (I've read quite a bit of the thread, but I'm still a few days behind), but things look to be shaping up very nicely for Harlequins. The Starweaver profile they showed a few days ago was very nice - Harlequins really needed a good overwatch soak what with us having multiple overwatch now (and Harlies were definitely one of the factions where getting your unit wiped by overwatch was a real possibility). The fact that the Starweaver actually fights pretty well is definitely a bonus. In 7th games, I have had to either use something like a Death Jester or a Skyweaver unit to soak overwatch just to get a troupe in, and that often lead to a unit being sacrificed.

Notably, it looks like the Starweaver might be getting a bump in price to compensate for the increased utility. The Starweaver is power level 5, just like a 5 man unit of intercessors. If, as is expected, intercessors come in around 20 ppm, that would put a Starweaver at around the 100 point mark.

Death Jesters should be interesting too. I expect they will get the Sniper rule that allows them to target characters, and possibly a rule similar to their current rule where they can impose an Ld penalty on any unit that takes am unsaved wound from their fire. Since units no longer fall back, they will probably lose their ability to force units to fall back toward you. Even if it is just an Ld debuff, however, that would still be pretty useful, as you can now stack the damage you're doing in shooting with the casualties caused in melee. And they definitely received an indirect buff since they will no longer be models that you always want to be separate from the squads, and can instead take advantage of the rule saying that characters cannot be targeted unless they are the closest enemy unit.

Shadowseers are kind of a question mark, but if I had to guess, I would expect Veil of Tears to be a straight bubble aura effect, possibly providing a debuff to enemy units' to-hit rolls. Then they will get Smite and probably some other offensive psychic powers, but we will see.

Very excited to see where this all shakes out!

Assault Marines, or more specifically their jetpack, were bulky models correct? The distinct lack of bulky on the inceptors is interesting. Sideways Transport capacity buff?

Youn wrote:
They stated in the article on shooting that models armed with two one handed weapons may shoot both of them. The example they used was Cypher as being extremely dangerous with his two pistols.

Basically, the new rules assume gunslinger is a thing for everyone.

What part of the article did they say that in? https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/30/new-40k-shooting-phase-apr30gw-homepage-post-4/

Youn wrote:
With 18 S5 AP-1 shots, you aren't going to want to shoot your closest target. You wont be able to charge it.

Units like these will actually make solid characters assassins. Drop them in behind early and light up their key characters (remember split fire is a thing). I mean 18 shots at s5 rend -1 will probably drop most none power armored targets.

I will say though, if power level assumes most expensive loadout, and these guys appear to lack options. Then these guys are going to be pricey.

Youn wrote:
They stated in the article on shooting that models armed with two one handed weapons may shoot both of them.

Right. So is any weapon which is specifically noted to be two-handed one-handed then?

If a captain is that scary, what does a chapter master look like?

The unit arrives on turn 1.

Fires 18 shots of S 5 AP -1
Then gets to charge a unit.

Assuming the 18 shots hit 12 times, and wound 9 of those.
This likely means they have killed 4-5 marines

The charge is also likely to have killed another 5 marines by end of combat phase.

If they get gunned down at this point. The have very likely made their points back. If they are not dead by this phase then they can only be a positive points unit.