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The astropath's psychic barrier power seems bad in an infantry army, but think of it on Pask or a Baneblade, improving the save of the tank to a 2+. Pretty darn good return on a 15 point investment. Is there anything stopping that from stacking with a cover save?

 Sonobovich wrote:
Is there anything stopping that from stacking with a cover save?

It stacks.

I haven't actually seen the full rulebooks yet. Is there something that prevents a 1+ save? Or is there something preventing psychic barrier from applying to tanks?

Omg I cannot reiterate enough how good Baneblades are. I played Tyranids last night, put my old girls out front, got first-turn charged by Genestealers... and didn't really care. Eventually won combat with the old girls and mopped up.

Being able to shoot whilst immune to enemy shooting is hilarious. Forcing an enemy to fall back or get shot by 18 heavy bolter shots (I was running the classic configuration) and then 9 str 9 -2 d3 damage attacks is hilarious. Running fleeing Genestealers down with a baneblade because they Fell Back is hilarious.

It was a funny game. Genestealers got a first turn charge agains a guard gunline and lost!

 Sonobovich wrote:
I haven't actually seen the full rulebooks yet. Is there something that prevents a 1+ save? Or is there something preventing psychic barrier from applying to tanks?

There is a rule that 1s always fail. Psychic battier can affect any Astra Militarum unit. I actually just noticed that when looking it up, any other army gets far less use out of the Astra Telepathics because they can't get the +1 save.

xmbk wrote:

 Humble Guardsman wrote:
The ability to spend a CP to re-roll one of the charge dice may make it more viable, but yes I agree. Few people aside from IG players will have that kind of CP to freely spend.

Most armies will have CP, if they want it. Guard a few more, but most will have what they need.

At the 2000 point mark, sure. Anything much smaller and a lot of armies have to start being really selective to get those CP. For IG players they were going to fill up all those slots anyway.

I've seen non IG players here mention that they've reached 3CP in 1000pts and they think that's good. Every IG player worth his salt should be garnering enough to spend one in every shooting phase and still have enough left over to use on stratagems or seizing the initiative on a whim.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Omg I cannot reiterate enough how good Baneblades are. I played Tyranids last night, put my old girls out front, got first-turn charged by Genestealers... and didn't really care. Eventually won combat with the old girls and mopped up.

Being able to shoot whilst immune to enemy shooting is hilarious. Forcing an enemy to fall back or get shot by 18 heavy bolter shots (I was running the classic configuration) and then 9 str 9 -2 d3 damage attacks is hilarious. Running fleeing Genestealers down with a baneblade because they Fell Back is hilarious.

It was a funny game. Genestealers got a first turn charge agains a guard gunline and lost!

Your opponent sucks, plain and simple

Can you only spend one CP per turn (or per phase?)

Razerous wrote:
Can you only spend one CP per turn (or per phase?)

It's per phase.

Razerous wrote:
Can you only spend one CP per turn (or per phase?)


It's per phase.

I believe you can spend as many command points as you like but the restriction is you can only spend them on a particular use once per phase. So only one re-roll per phase, but you could for instance interrupt the initiative order and gain a re-roll in the same phase as they are different uses.

 Humble Guardsman wrote:

xmbk wrote:

 Humble Guardsman wrote:
The ability to spend a CP to re-roll one of the charge dice may make it more viable, but yes I agree. Few people aside from IG players will have that kind of CP to freely spend.

Most armies will have CP, if they want it. Guard a few more, but most will have what they need.

At the 2000 point mark, sure. Anything much smaller and a lot of armies have to start being really selective to get those CP. For IG players they were going to fill up all those slots anyway.

I've seen non IG players here mention that they've reached 3CP in 1000pts and they think that's good. Every IG player worth his salt should be garnering enough to spend one in every shooting phase and still have enough left over to use on stratagems or seizing the initiative on a whim.

I've been playing around with detachments & it seems entirely possible for guard to have 21+ command points in a 2000 pt game. 2 Brigade detachments = 18. +3 for being battle forged. Unless there is some rule preventing that.

KurtAngle2 wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Omg I cannot reiterate enough how good Baneblades are. I played Tyranids last night, put my old girls out front, got first-turn charged by Genestealers... and didn't really care. Eventually won combat with the old girls and mopped up.

Being able to shoot whilst immune to enemy shooting is hilarious. Forcing an enemy to fall back or get shot by 18 heavy bolter shots (I was running the classic configuration) and then 9 str 9 -2 d3 damage attacks is hilarious. Running fleeing Genestealers down with a baneblade because they Fell Back is hilarious.

It was a funny game. Genestealers got a first turn charge agains a guard gunline and lost!

Your opponent sucks, plain and simple

I mean they could have not charged the Baneblades at all. Maybe the genestealers could have killed them with angry glares.

 Humble Guardsman wrote:

xmbk wrote:

 Humble Guardsman wrote:
The ability to spend a CP to re-roll one of the charge dice may make it more viable, but yes I agree. Few people aside from IG players will have that kind of CP to freely spend.

Most armies will have CP, if they want it. Guard a few more, but most will have what they need.

At the 2000 point mark, sure. Anything much smaller and a lot of armies have to start being really selective to get those CP. For IG players they were going to fill up all those slots anyway.

I've seen non IG players here mention that they've reached 3CP in 1000pts and they think that's good. Every IG player worth his salt should be garnering enough to spend one in every shooting phase and still have enough left over to use on stratagems or seizing the initiative on a whim.

It shouldn't be hard to fill up a full Brigade at 1000 points. I haven't tried it yet, but it seems pretty easy.

 Trickstick wrote:

 Sonobovich wrote:
I haven't actually seen the full rulebooks yet. Is there something that prevents a 1+ save? Or is there something preventing psychic barrier from applying to tanks?

There is a rule that 1s always fail. Psychic battier can affect any Astra Militarum unit. I actually just noticed that when looking it up, any other army gets far less use out of the Astra Telepathics because they can't get the +1 save.

In Age of Sigmar, (and back in Warhammer Fantasy as well), the 1+ Armor Save fails, and is really there to keep the model/unit at a 2+ Save against Rend/AP -1. I would imagine that, if the 1+ Armor Save is legal in 40K, then a roll of 1 will still fail.

It's amazing to hear that Baneblades are combat monsters. This game is awesome.

 ross-128 wrote:
Keep in mind that, for hot-shot Scions, deep striking puts them just outside of rapid-fire range (because they're just outside of 9"). So they actually will have to fire single-shot for one turn, take one turn of return fire, then get into rapid-fire next turn.

You're right - for some reason I was thinking they were 24". I'll rerun the numbers but it shouldn't really change the analysis. There would still be an advantage to face dropping vs foot slogging even if you're only getting RF on the plasma. First turn Veterans aren't getting RF on anything.

 ross-128 wrote:
Keep in mind that, for hot-shot Scions, deep striking puts them just outside of rapid-fire range (because they're just outside of 9"). So they actually will have to fire single-shot for one turn, take one turn of return fire, then get into rapid-fire next turn.

Well it wouldn't be single shot. It would be 2 shots, it just wouldn't be 4 shots.

Razerous wrote:

-Troop choice deep-striking Scions (are these still AM or are they a different army?!)

Kinda?

Yes, they share the ASTRA MILITARUM keyword and so can benefit from things like medi-packs and hop into Chimeras. However, they do not share the <REGIMENT> keyword so your Company Commander and Platoon Commanders can't give them orders. Likewise, most of your IG can't ride in a Taurox Prime.

I like the keyword system, but you have to watch it very carefully; it doesn't always work the way you expect.

Can someone explain to me why a scion squad or command squad has to be taken in order to get a Taurox Primw??
Wouldn't the keyword astra militarium be enough to add the taurox prime for say an infantry squad?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just mean for the purpose of taking a Taurox not having units go inside it, just to clear that bit up.

Trollsmyth wrote:

Razerous wrote:

-Troop choice deep-striking Scions (are these still AM or are they a different army?!)

Kinda?

Yes, they share the ASTRA MILITARUM keyword and so can benefit from things like medi-packs and hop into Chimeras. However, they do not share the <REGIMENT> keyword so your Company Commander and Platoon Commanders can't give them orders. Likewise, most of your IG can't ride in a Taurox Prime.

I like the keyword system, but you have to watch it very carefully; it doesn't always work the way you expect.

So in terms of filling a force org, we're good to use Scions alongside say Wyverns?

I wonder if it's worth running a shadowsword with 4 heavy flamer sponsons, the shadowsword itself is extremely good at killing big targets and can easily make back it's 444 points, esoecially since its so durable and has long range.

The question is if its worth 200 extra points for 4 extra las cannons (that will also hit on 3+ against titanic targets) and 4 twin linked heavy flamers. It would make it more versatile being able to eliminate big targets and hirdes just as easily, and no hordes will be able to assault with its brutal 8d6 str 5 overwatch flamer hits

 ThePie wrote:
I wonder if it's worth running a shadowsword with 4 heavy flamer sponsons, the shadowsword itself is extremely good at killing big targets and can easily make back it's 444 points, esoecially since its so durable and has long range.

The question is if its worth 200 extra points for 4 extra las cannons (that will also hit on 3+ against titanic targets) and 4 twin linked heavy flamers. It would make it more versatile being able to eliminate big targets and hirdes just as easily, and no hordes will be able to assault with its brutal 8d6 str 5 overwatch flamer hits

Personally, if I was gonna get the sponsons, I would save some points and get the heavy bolters. I wouldn't really move this thing too often, maybe park it on an objective. Even against non titanic models, it's main gun has a very good chance of popping a vehicle or creature every turn. There are better variants to put all those flamers on, like a storm lord loaded with units or a hellhammer.

 Chris521 wrote:

 ThePie wrote:
I wonder if it's worth running a shadowsword with 4 heavy flamer sponsons, the shadowsword itself is extremely good at killing big targets and can easily make back it's 444 points, esoecially since its so durable and has long range.

The question is if its worth 200 extra points for 4 extra las cannons (that will also hit on 3+ against titanic targets) and 4 twin linked heavy flamers. It would make it more versatile being able to eliminate big targets and hirdes just as easily, and no hordes will be able to assault with its brutal 8d6 str 5 overwatch flamer hits

Personally, if I was gonna get the sponsons, I would save some points and get the heavy bolters. I wouldn't really move this thing too often, maybe park it on an objective. Even against non titanic models, it's main gun has a very good chance of popping a vehicle or creature every turn. There are better variants to put all those flamers on, like a storm lord loaded with units or a hellhammer.

Indeed, i just feel like the shadowsword is a must, its just that awesome against big targets for its price and survability (especially with and enginseer for 52 pts behind it that repairs1d3 wounds every round). And the twin heavy flamers, while expensive, absolutely murders hordes. Getting thebest of both would be nice.

On the otherhand, it might be viable to run 2 baneblades in this edition, one shadowsword and one normal baneblade with sponsons, especially with such cheap bubblewrap we have acess too, and enginseers who can repair them.

What is your take on the Chimera?

I am searching for a way to use it. Probably with 2 x Heavy Flamer, but which units inside would complement this good?

lash92 wrote:
What is your take on the Chimera?

I am searching for a way to use it. Probably with 2 x Heavy Flamer, but which units inside would complement this good?

Don't forget to add a storm bolter. 4 shots for 2 points. It's a great deal.

 labmouse42 wrote:

lash92 wrote:
What is your take on the Chimera?

I am searching for a way to use it. Probably with 2 x Heavy Flamer, but which units inside would complement this good?

Don't forget to add a storm bolter. 4 shots for 2 points. It's a great deal.

I would put something that is good at sort range combat and objective grabbing inside. Shotgun melta/flamer vets are one choice, although I feel that they are better suited to Valkyrie play. Other than that, the two main options are basic infantry squads or command/special squads. With basic infantry you keep the cost right down whilst giving some objective capturing power to the unit. A few Chimeras with support characters (officers/commissars) mixed in can be a nice advancing force if you add some support units. Or, you can go with maximum special weapons for a nasty strike force.

I am tempted to go with basic infantry for both the fluff aspects and cheapness. If you spend a load of points on special weapons then it is a waste if they fail. Infantry squads are more of a bonus, which are not as bad if thrown away or not used immediately.

Razerous wrote:
So in terms of filling a force org, we're good to use Scions alongside say Wyverns?

In terms of filling out detachments, you're fine using anything with the keyword IMPERIUM. So you can have your scions alongside Wyverns backed up by Custodes supported by Death Company all being led by Belisarius Cawl.

Granted, you'd lose some of the synergies doing that; the "bubble powers" of characters are generally tied to more selective keywords than just IMPERIUM.

Still, force orgs, as we've known them, are no longer a thing.

shank911 wrote:
Can someone explain to me why a scion squad or command squad has to be taken in order to get a Taurox Primw??
Wouldn't the keyword astra militarium be enough to add the taurox prime for say an infantry squad?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just mean for the purpose of taking a Taurox not having units go inside it, just to clear that bit up.

This the way keywords work right now. Taurox Prime is an imperial unit, so you can purchase one for each other slot you purchase in an imperial army.
-Buy a Primaris Captain, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Inquisitor, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Landraider, buy a Taurox Prime (His escort buddy I guess)

 Coyote81 wrote:

shank911 wrote:
Can someone explain to me why a scion squad or command squad has to be taken in order to get a Taurox Primw??
Wouldn't the keyword astra militarium be enough to add the taurox prime for say an infantry squad?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just mean for the purpose of taking a Taurox not having units go inside it, just to clear that bit up.

This the way keywords work right now. Taurox Prime is an imperial unit, so you can purchase one for each other slot you purchase in an imperial army.
-Buy a Primaris Captain, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Inquisitor, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Landraider, buy a Taurox Prime (His escort buddy I guess)

So having an astral militarism army, with no scion (militarism tempestus) units would still allow me to bring it due to imperium and astral militarism keyword matching my company commander and rest of my list correct?? Or do i have to take a unit with the militarium tempestus keyword??

shank911 wrote:

 Coyote81 wrote:

shank911 wrote:
Can someone explain to me why a scion squad or command squad has to be taken in order to get a Taurox Primw??
Wouldn't the keyword astra militarium be enough to add the taurox prime for say an infantry squad?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just mean for the purpose of taking a Taurox not having units go inside it, just to clear that bit up.

This the way keywords work right now. Taurox Prime is an imperial unit, so you can purchase one for each other slot you purchase in an imperial army.
-Buy a Primaris Captain, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Inquisitor, buy a Taurox Prime
-Buy a Landraider, buy a Taurox Prime (His escort buddy I guess)

So having an astral militarism army, with no scion (militarism tempestus) units would still allow me to bring it due to imperium and astral militarism keyword matching my company commander and rest of my list correct?? Or do i have to take a unit with the militarium tempestus keyword??

Yes, as long as they all share any keyword, even imperial, your good, you don't need a tempestus unit

shank911 wrote:
So having an astral militarism army, with no scion (militarism tempestus) units would still allow me to bring it due to imperium and astral militarism keyword matching my company commander and rest of my list correct?? Or do i have to take a unit with the militarium tempestus keyword??

You can take it. But only tempestusesesses can ride in it. But you can still add it to your detachment.