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p5freak wrote:

 Coyote81 wrote:

This is the problem with trying to fall back to the old idea that blood angels are indeed a codex chapter and should be run like one. They don't do anything better then a codex chapter when playing this style. If you play to the BA strengths, then we start looking a lot better. Does that mean all melee, no, not at all. But a much more balanced list then the all shooty codex chapter armies from C:SM.

According to the fluff we like to deepstrike with JP, we like flamers, and we like melee. And what of this can we do better than any other chapter ? Nothing. So, what are those BA strength you are talking about ? Black rage ? Nice to have, but nothing spectacular.

It's good to know there are other people thinking the same currently. We really need the codex to find our identity!

@ Coyote 81: I love BA for their aggressive style but as I mentioned earlier the only two games I won I had a shooty list. This is the shootiest I've done so far and yes I'm currently playin as a vanilla marine but what are the other choices we have? We need a really CaC troop who can eradicate enemies and sadly neither DC nor SG are currently capable of doing this. Just have a look at berserkers: this is a true devoted CC unit which cost 80 points compared to the 85 of DC but can they can fight twice each round and they butch really well.

The aggression just gets us killed atm. I'm not sure how the codex magically changes that.

Maybe if they give DC a 4+ FNP?

Well, we could get the option to deepstrike closer than 9", making it easier to get into CC. We could get a cost reduction on flamers, or buffed flamers. JP for less pts., more units with JPs. Imagine we could equip a dev squad with JP. Imagine we could get a drop pod which can deepstrike a dreadnought. Or get a big cost reduction on drop pods. We could get the rule that we always attack first, even when we get charged.

What would you like to see in the codex ?

It's just like 7th, really. The problem is complex to the point where I'm not sure. What WAS the fix for BA in 7th? Nothing, really. A photocopy of gladius like the lions' blade would have just made us red vanilla marines.

Elite infantry is taking it up the ass again, this time for different reasons. Getting elite infantry to where it needs to be vs hordes and even pseudo hordes is basically impossible against a knowledgeable foe. You spend the whole game cutting up conscripts or gaunts, because they can give you no choice in the matter. The only helpful mechanic would be a strategem that changes the way your opponent can setup, forcing them to leave DS holes.

Spado wrote:
Heavy support

5x devastator squad, 4x lascannon [7]

Predator quadra-lascannon [9]

Predator lascannon sponsons and autocannon [9]

I have to concur with the previous statement-- if you can find a way to squeeze a cheap HQ in there, this could give you another CP. It's not heavily necessary but certainly might help.

Also, I'm sadly shaking my head at people who say BA have to be all jump packs all the time with no shooting at all. That's not BA. That's fething world eaters.

 Melissia wrote:

Spado wrote:
Heavy support

5x devastator squad, 4x lascannon [7]

Predator quadra-lascannon [9]

Predator lascannon sponsons and autocannon [9]

I have to concur with the previous statement-- if you can find a way to squeeze a cheap HQ in there, this could give you another CP. It's not heavily necessary but certainly might help.

Also, I'm sadly shaking my head at people who say BA have to be all jump packs all the time with no shooting at all. That's not BA. That's fething world eaters.

But if they want to play it like that, shouldn't they be able to?

jcd386 wrote:
But if they want to play it like that, shouldn't they be able to?

You already can play like that with any SM army, including BA.

It's still not a very BA setup.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In fact, let's see...

Outrider:
Captain w/JP, relic blade, BP
6 ASM squads w/combat shield, PAxe, Chainsword
Vanguard:
Chaplain w/JP, BP, Croz
2 ASM squads w/combat shield, PAxe, Chainsword
3 DC w/TH, 4 PAxes, 4 Chainswords
Vanguard:
Chaplain w/JP, BP, Croz
2 ASM squads w/combat shield, PAxe, Chainsword
3 DC w/TH, 4 PAxes, 4 Chainswords

Ridiculously melee-focused jump pack list with 80 jump pack troopers in 16 squads led by three HQ, for 2k points. You can do this. It can be aggressive enough to win, even, if you play it right. Hell, once the codex comes out and thunder hammers become cheaper, you can probably squeeze in another five or ten more-- in fact, I could easily find a way to squeeze in another squad of five if I wanted to. Is this the kind of list you want to use?

I find it, as noted before, ridiculous. But it seems to be the kind of list people would want BA to bring.

Well, i think that kind of army should be playable if people want it to be. I'm also fine with their being other BA builds.

What does a fluffy BA list look like in your opinion, and what sort of special rules would help seperate them from normal marines, but not pigion hole them to jump packs, while still being fluffy? I don't know a ton about BA as i prefer playing over fluff etc.

p5freak wrote:
What would you like to see in the codex ?

I would like to see all infantry and Dreads get "Red Thirst: You may charge, even if you have advanced this turn".

Simple, fluffy and it shows our love for speed and getting into the enemy quickly. It also means that assaulting out of Deep Strike becomes viable (not guaranteed but viable).

Death Company should be fearless (these guys WANT to die) and should be better in CC. I am not saying Besereker-level but better than they are currently. Maybe something like Wulfen whereby when they are killed, they get to make a final CC attack before they go down.

Our CC Dreads need a big price cut (look at the Ironclad).

Sanguinary Guard need a substantial price cut too. Angelus Bolters for 9 points is daft when you can get plasma pistols for 7 which are better in just about every way. Also encarmine weapons are overpriced. They cost more than Force Weapons for equivalent rules yet are put on models with fewer attacks (and wounds).

Dante needs some decent rules to represent being the oldest Chapter Master in the Imperium.

Sort those out and we might get somewhere around mid-tier whilst actually being fluffy too.

 Karhedron wrote:

p5freak wrote:
What would you like to see in the codex ?

I would like to see all infantry and Dreads get "Red Thirst: You may charge, even if you have advanced this turn".

Simple, fluffy and it shows our love for speed and getting into the enemy quickly. It also means that assaulting out of Deep Strike becomes viable (not guaranteed but viable).

Death Company should be fearless (these guys WANT to die) and should be better in CC. I am not saying Besereker-level but better than they are currently. Maybe something like Wulfen whereby when they are killed, they get to make a final CC attack before they go down.

Our CC Dreads need a big price cut (look at the Ironclad).

Sanguinary Guard need a substantial price cut too. Angelus Bolters for 9 points is daft when you can get plasma pistols for 7 which are better in just about every way. Also encarmine weapons are overpriced. They cost more than Force Weapons for equivalent rules yet are put on models with fewer attacks (and wounds).

Dante needs some decent rules to represent being the oldest Chapter Master in the Imperium.

Sort those out and we might get somewhere around mid-tier whilst actually being fluffy too.

I would be pretty disappointed by that CT i think. It wouldn't effect deepstriking units, since they can't advance. And unlike chaos renegades, who have the same trait, BA doesn't have easy access to charge rerolls from khorne standards.

If they get any of the chaos tactics, id think it might be the night lord's.

I personally hope for something more interesting, like buffs as enemy or friendly units start dying, free attacks when models die, or not letting enemy units fall back from combat.

All the other things you mention seem fair, though.

jcd386 wrote:
What does a fluffy BA list look like in your opinion

I was asking you what you were looking for.

For me, BA are a mostly codex-adherent chapter; barring the exception of sanguinary guard and death company, they still make use of a mix of tacticals, assault marines, and devastators as other chapters, with more willingness to get in to close combat than most codex-adherent chapters have.

If we're doing wishlisting now, I'd like to see BA tacticals get the option to equip a boltgun and chainsword instead of boltgun and bolt pistol, a small change that'd let them them hit harder on the charge while still keeping them similar enough to other codex adherent chapters. I'd also like to see BA special pistols (inferno and hand flamer) become useful and worth taking-- at least make them cheaper if nothing else!

 Melissia wrote:

jcd386 wrote:
What does a fluffy BA list look like in your opinion

I was asking you what you were looking for.

For me, BA are a mostly codex-adherent chapter; barring the exception of sanguinary guard and death company, they still make use of a mix of tacticals, assault marines, and devastators as other chapters, with more willingness to get in to close combat than most codex-adherent chapters have.

If we're doing wishlisting now, I'd like to see BA tacticals get the option to equip a boltgun and chainsword instead of boltgun and bolt pistol, a small change that'd let them them hit harder on the charge while still keeping them similar enough to other codex adherent chapters. I'd also like to see BA special pistols (inferno and hand flamer) become useful and worth taking-- at least make them cheaper if nothing else!

Yeah, I'm a little afraid that BA will get the WE trait, and SW will get the EC trait (to make up for the old true grit).

I definitely think that the best BA lists right now are basically some Tacs, scouts, Devs/Preds, Dreads, with some kind of DC/SG unit dropping in to spice up the list. Seems balanced and reasonably strong to me. Libs also seem quite good. But i can see that a lot of people would think this was the same as regular marines, and without a codex, they would be kind of right except for the better powers and okayish deepstriking assault units.

 Karhedron wrote:

p5freak wrote:
What would you like to see in the codex ?

I would like to see all infantry and Dreads get "Red Thirst: You may charge, even if you have advanced this turn".

Simple, fluffy and it shows our love for speed and getting into the enemy quickly. It also means that assaulting out of Deep Strike becomes viable (not guaranteed but viable).

Death Company should be fearless (these guys WANT to die) and should be better in CC. I am not saying Besereker-level but better than they are currently. Maybe something like Wulfen whereby when they are killed, they get to make a final CC attack before they go down.

Our CC Dreads need a big price cut (look at the Ironclad).

Sanguinary Guard need a substantial price cut too. Angelus Bolters for 9 points is daft when you can get plasma pistols for 7 which are better in just about every way. Also encarmine weapons are overpriced. They cost more than Force Weapons for equivalent rules yet are put on models with fewer attacks (and wounds).

Dante needs some decent rules to represent being the oldest Chapter Master in the Imperium.

Sort those out and we might get somewhere around mid-tier whilst actually being fluffy too.

I'd agree with quite a bit on this list. I'd prefer a decent of angels ability that allows us to better chance to charge after DS, and i'm not just talking re-rolls like Lemartes gives, maybe adding to charge distance or just a closer DS. Maybe 7" instead of 9". that would make it harder for opponents to block off their side of the table and allow us more chance to charge off DS.

I totally agree about dreads, our dreads, specially the DC dread and furioso are woefully overpriced. The Hellbrute is like 30 points cheaper and has just about the same, if not better rules and stats. Currently is there any reason to even take the furioso over the DC dread other than the frag cannon? Blood Talons are utter trash compared to the blood fists and cost 15 points more!! you'd be crazy to them over the fists.

DC definitely need a little bit of a boost. They cost more than bezerkers I believe and clearly aren't close to what they are in.

Dante needs to add CPs like the other major chapter masters like calgar, abbadon, hell, even azreal adds 1 CP. He might even need something else too for 215 points, either that or a points drop.

Our wargear costs are mostly way overpriced. Angelus bolters, infernus pistols, blood talons, encarmine weapons. I don't even know that hand flamers are worth 8 points, when a plasma pistol is 7.

jcd386 wrote:

I definitely think that the best BA lists right now are basically some Tacs, scouts, Devs/Preds, Dreads, with some kind of DC/SG unit dropping in to spice up the list. Seems balanced and reasonably strong to me. Libs also seem quite good. But i can see that a lot of people would think this was the same as regular marines, and without a codex, they would be kind of right except for the better powers and okayish deepstriking assault units.

I'm actually just getting into BA myself. Just started around a core of tacticals, scouts and devastators with baal predator support. I intend to expand on it with some death company to support.

Reason being is that I like it fluff and game play wise. To have a solid vanilla esque space marine core with blood angels flavour seems right to me.

As I go on I'd like to explore alternatives but I'm quite happy with the current situation.

Also, the BA tactical squad is one of the better looking 10-man space marine boxes, weird space-vampire-heads notwithstanding (I don't like any of the unhelmeted heads for any space marine, regardless).

 AEIOUMadden wrote:

I definitely think that the best BA lists right now are basically some Tacs, scouts, Devs/Preds, Dreads, with some kind of DC/SG unit dropping in to spice up the list. Seems balanced and reasonably strong to me. Libs also seem quite good. But i can see that a lot of people would think this was the same as regular marines, and without a codex, they would be kind of right except for the better powers and okayish deepstriking assault units.

I would have waited for the BA codex, to see what changes/improvements happen. I was getting "screwed" by GW when i started with 7th ed at the beginning of this year. Rules changed, and the units i bought were useless/different. The baal predator is to expensive, same with the rhino. Razorbacks is the way to go. I also bought a drop pod, which is now useless.

p5freak wrote:

 AEIOUMadden wrote:

I definitely think that the best BA lists right now are basically some Tacs, scouts, Devs/Preds, Dreads, with some kind of DC/SG unit dropping in to spice up the list. Seems balanced and reasonably strong to me. Libs also seem quite good. But i can see that a lot of people would think this was the same as regular marines, and without a codex, they would be kind of right except for the better powers and okayish deepstriking assault units.

I would have waited for the BA codex, to see what changes/improvements happen. I was getting "screwed" by GW when i started with 7th ed at the beginning of this year. Rules changed, and the units i bought were useless/different. The baal predator is to expensive, same with the rhino. Razorbacks is the way to go. I also bought a drop pod, which is now useless.

I'd definitely say this %100 true. At best, I've had units that went from good to not even worth playing, and at worst i've had entire army lists invalidated by new books.




On another note, I know a lot of you guys/gals think the BA should just be red marines, with a couple extra unit entries, but if that's the case, then they should just be rolled into the SM book like black Templars were, with a unit entry for DC and sanguinary guard/priests. To me the blood angels are the jump pack assault army. They are the world eaters of the imperial armies. They are about CC and they are teetering on the edge of madness, some already mad with rage, and blood lust for CC. That's how I hope they play out, as I want a heavily skewed CC army for my BA that's fairly competitive.

bobafett012 wrote:
On another note, I know a lot of you guys/gals think the BA should just be red marines, with a couple extra unit entries

Chaos marines are just marines with a few chaos units added in and some chaos upgrades-- Havocs are just devastators, Chosen are just company veterans, Raptors are assault marines, and so on. Space Wolves are just wolfy marines who wolf a lot with a few wolf units added in for wolfing-- blood claws and sky claws are assault marines, grey hunters are tacticals, longfangs are devastators. Dark Angels are just marines who are emo a lot and have deathwing. Black Templars are just marines who are purging with their kin. Death Guard are just marines who are way too damn sick for their own good and gave in to that sickness because they're weak. And so on and so forth. All marines are "marines with a couple extra unit entries". Even Grey Knights can be called that, and they're the most different of any marine army. That's what makes them Space Marines. The only way to get away from this is to make them not Space Marines. Would you prefer them to be Orks, perhaps, or Eldar, or Necrons, or Guard?

BA already can be a jump pack army. However, making them "the world eaters of the loyalists" is both boring AND goes against the lore. If you want an army of crazed jump pack fanatics who are good in melee, you can play an army of death guard and chaplains-- and furthermore, it's perfectly legitimate in the current system! Lemartes, 3 death company squads, chaplain, 3 death company squads, chaplain, 3 death company squads, plus whatever support you want to bring scattered throughout the three detachments. There you go. Not for me, however, and it's a death company list rather htan a BA list. Trying to pidgeonhole the rest of us in to playing the same army as you would require a massive retcon of what the Blood Angels actually are. I didn't buy and assemble and start to paint a BA force only to see the flavor that attracted me to them be subsumed in to becoming a bland-ass World Eaters clone. They're better than that.

 Melissia wrote:

bobafett012 wrote:
On another note, I know a lot of you guys/gals think the BA should just be red marines, with a couple extra unit entries

Chaos marines are just marines with a few chaos units added in and some chaos upgrades. Space Wolves are just wolfy marines who wolf a lot with a few wolf units added in for wolfing. Dark Angels are just marines who are emo a lot and have deathwing. Black Templars are just marines who are purging with their kin. Death Guard are just marines who are way too damn sick for their own good and gave in to that sickness because they're weak. And so on and so forth. All marines are "marines with a couple extra unit entries". Even Grey Knights can be called that, and they're hte most different of any marine army.

BA already can be a jump pack army. However, making them "the world eaters of the loyalists" is both boring AND goes against the lore. If you want an army of crazed jump pack fanatics who are good in melee, you can play an army of death guard and chaplains. Trying to pidgeonhole the rest of us in to playing the same army as you would require a massive retcon of what the Blood Angels actually are.

A vast majority of this statement is patently false. Sure, at the moment it's fairly close because many of these armies are still utilizing the index, which is as vanilla as is possible and the armies in the SM codex only vary slightly, as they are all codex adherent chapters. Can you just take tac marines and devestators, sure, but then there's no point in the playing BA over another SM faction, matter fact, you'd be much better off just playing Ravenguard or something. Just pick your favorite color and have fun.

Prior to 8th, or at least 7th since I didn't play in 7th, These armies (BA, SW, DA) not only felt different but they could do things that other space marine chapters couldn't because of force org and what slots different units filled, and their special units. No other army could run assault marines as troops, only white scars and Ravenwing could run biker armies, Deathwing could run all terminator armies, space wolves not only have many different non standard units in the codex, but their wargear and standard load outs on various units made them play very differently. And Chaos marines used to be able to take marks that made each squad play a little different based on how you equipped them and their mark.

There is ton's of BA players that want to play good jump pack armies, and probably just as many that want to play red marines. Clearly there's nothing stopping you from playing red marines with plenty of tac marines and devastators. There isn't now and won't be after the codex drops. There's also nothing stopping us from playing assault marine armies other than the fact that assault marines are terrible at the moment. They aren't troops so can't obsec, and this is only part of this issues for Jump Pack or even just CC oriented BA armies.

What I gave was MY OPINION. No where am I pushing my opinion onto anyone else. Again, MY VIEW of the Blood Angels. That's how I want MY Blood Angels to play. And even if MY blood angels play like that, YOUR blood angels can still just be red marines if you so choose. What's funny is their special rules have always favored exactly what I am saying. Getting into CC and doing damage, ALL the special units they have are geared for CC, DC dreads, DC, Sanguinary guard, Sanguinary priests, Stormravens, furiosos, Assault squads, Dante, Mephiston, Lemartes, Astorath, the sanguinor, all their rules, red thirst, priests aura, black rage, decent of angels, unleash rage etc etc It's laughable that you think their lore is not a CC leaning army yet, every single thing special in their list, rules and units, plus fluff, plus books, all contradict what your saying. I just read the Mephiston and Dante and every book contradicts what your saying. The BA specialize in the use of jump packers. That's not their only unit but every marine, JP or not, is struggling with the red thirst and the need/want to drop their guns and rush forward into combat and slay the enemy. It's why Khorn choose them to try and turn them to chaos. It's in the fluff, it's in codexes, it's in the books, it used to be in the force org, it's everywhere. They are masters of aerial assault. The only thing I would like is for us the get some decent special rules (some points drops) to facilitate these units into a cohesive list.

I'm glad you think the BA playing similar, not exactly the same, but similar to a CC khorn army would be "both boring and going against the fluff". That's just a false statement and completely your opinion, so please don't try to push it on me like it's correct.

I don't want anyone not to be able to play their Blood Angels the way they want but let me be the bearer of some bad news for you, your not going to get any special rules for BA that boost the shooting of the army. Sorry to break your heart but that's what codex space marines is for, maybe dark angels too... Expect CC oriented rules for SW, and for BA. The way it has been for many editions now, and i'll play my CC BA and you can play your red marines and the world will be good.

FYI, next time, if you want to have a real conversation about the BA, try not to be a massive donkey-cave, and maybe there is a fair conversation to be had...

bobafett012 wrote:
A vast majority of this statement is patently false.

It's based on a comparison of the various SM armies to non-SM armies. And it's true. And it was true all the way back to second. Each marine list is still a marine list, and is only slightly different from the next marine list compared to differences they have to non-marine lists.

bobafett012 wrote:
These armies (BA, SW, DA) not only felt different but they could do things that other space marine chapters couldn't

And they still can. For example, BA can equip heavy flamers on their tacticals, hitting harder at short range than any other tactical squad. BA can also equip different pistols than plasma on their assault marines, giving options for how to equip them and give them different roles-- yes, those pistols are kinda lackluster due to point costs right now, but they exist. And there's the Baal Predator and its ability to output a ton of damage at short range, and its ability to move faster than any other predator as well. And that's just to start.

Even without a codex, BA can do things other marine chapters can't.

bobafett012 wrote:
That's just a false statement and completely your opinion

Actually, no. They are, in GW's own words, one of the examples of codex-adherent chapters with minor deviations. Thus, it is not my opinion, unless you're going to try to say "well, that's just GW's opinion, nyeah!" in which case... fair enough, I guess, but that doesn't exactly lend credence to your argument.

bobafett012 wrote:
I don't want anyone not to be able to play their Blood Angels the way they want but let me be the bearer of some bad news for you, your not going to get any special rules for BA that boost the shooting of the army

Actually, the index already gave rules that boost the shooting of the BA army. They could be optimized, sure, but they exist.

Your condescension is amusing, but ultimately fruitless.

Jump packs had such potential after they ripped the balls off drop pods. But GW inadvertently took deep strike out of the game in high level play. Sigh...

Martel732 wrote:
The aggression just gets us killed atm. I'm not sure how the codex magically changes that.

Im having success with a 15 man JP DC squad atm, Lemartes and Sang Priest make sure they are a threat to pretty much anything, I keep them cheap at 20 pts each, chainsword and bolt pistol, 60 re roll attacks on the charge at str 5 will make a dent in pretty much anything.

I'd give them two or three few thunder hammers if you're investing that many points in the squad. Helps deal heavier damage to vehicles in a pinch. Though they do pay a bit of a premium for THs... but then again, I really like that model of a DC two-handing a thunder hammer, so

 Crusaderobr wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
The aggression just gets us killed atm. I'm not sure how the codex magically changes that.

Im having success with a 15 man JP DC squad atm, Lemartes and Sang Priest make sure they are a threat to pretty much anything, I keep them cheap at 20 pts each, chainsword and bolt pistol, 60 re roll attacks on the charge at str 5 will make a dent in pretty much anything.

That's close to my version of 15 man JP DC with Astorath and a libby. Mine costs more, since I'm rocking 3 X thunder hammer, 3 X power sword in the squad, but immunity to morale, plus shield of sanguinius and unleash rage are hot on 15 dudes. Plus, astorath helps other BA squads as well (if that mattered). I really feel like priests are best with multiwound units. I've never missed the reroll on the charge, and Astorath is better at punching and taking hits.

I wish sanguinary priests had the option for terminator armor.

Yes yes, I know the old rant, "but terminators suck!", but still. Making claw termies S5 would do a great deal in making them better. And while I know they can just jump pack to deep strike with termies, it just isn't as visually appealing.

Hello everyone!

Thought I would sign up and reply as I started playing 40k in the second edition, just so happens that back then I chose BA as a chapter as I couldn't paint and preferred red over blue for spraying my mk6 armour troops

I have not played for years and am now getting back into it as I have introduced my son to the game (he plays Necrons).

So, from where I came from, BA always have been just a space marine chapter, but it turns out now they are a thing!

So, some questions for you all.

I have a bunch of Apothecaries who are painted in standard issue imperial armour (white armour, red helmet with white stripe) do you think I can run these with my BA's and just say that their "official" BA apothecary outfits are in the dry cleaners?

As I mentioned, my son plays Necrons, it also turns out that he loves vehicles. What weapons would you guys take along to get past quantum shielding, the more damage I do the less likely it is to actually stick!

Cheers!

The current BA apothecaries are "Sanguinary Priests", which wear white armor, red shoulders, and typically go without helmets-- but red helmets would be perfectly fine.

So IMO, you could use them without having any excuse really.

Sanguinary Priests are actually better than normal apothecaries, as they give an aura of +1 strength to friendly units with a model within 6".


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For reference, it's this guy:

Front:


Back:


However, standard apothecaries painted in BA/Apothecary colors work just fine, you'd still say they're sanguinary priests as that's what BA use as apothecaries. SM use ancestral armor all the time after all, why not use armor from previous editions?

I started back in 3rd, played some 4th and a touch of 5th. Just getting back into the hobby now. Always wanted to play BA even back in 3rd, and like the army being melee oriented but not melee-only. I love the look of devastators with red power armor and blue helmets but them moving forward on the roll of a die back in 3rd turned me off the army completely. I'd be perfectly happy playing red marines this edition with some fluffy exclusive units but I'll likely be happy with whatever the codex gives us, barring loyalist World Eaters, because as mentioned, that sounds bland.

I've just started with the Dark Imperium box so far and it's disappointing reading how poorly regarded Primaris are. Truescale 2W marines pretty much got me interested in the hobby again. I'll likely get the "get started" box next despite people saying Baal preds are overpriced and tac marines are mediocre. Seems like a good value and the minis look quite good, bare heads aside. I don't remember the vampirism aspect being so blatant in 3rd but I'm sure I just wasn't as astute back then lol, not sure I even clued into what the DA Fallen were back then. I'm somewhat nervous to buy too much before the codex comes out in case nicer new minis come out, and at this point assault marines seem like a waste of points and money.

Quick question; should primaris inceptors have yellow helmets as "close support" squads?

very posh model that one.. mine look like this, see the regulation issue armour on the image