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Wow, if those points changes are real then Heretic Astartes and lesser Daemons were just made great again! Now I'm gonna have to get some more Bloodletters and stuff. Also, great to hear that Pink Horrors are less useless and Brims are not quite as easily spammed. I was not looking forward to the prospect of sculpting 100+ Brimstones (on 50+ bases) just to maybe be competitive with pure Daemons.

Probably the best news in there is that Daemon Prince weapons are now the same cost. So it really is a choice now instead of having to say my Prince model isn't holding an axe or sword, he just has a funky looking talon.

Thoughts on converting Primaris Hellblasters into Noise marines with sonic blasters?

Gibs55 wrote:
Thoughts on converting Primaris Hellblasters into Noise marines with sonic blasters?

You are a genius! I have Dark Imperium boxes I was going to convert into "True-scale" Emperor's Children anyway. But that new Hellblaster box the plasma guns with the cables are perfect. I think as good alternate paint job could sell them. Maybe gold with red OSL. Let me sketch out some ideas.

Gibs55 wrote:
Thoughts on converting Primaris Hellblasters into Noise marines with sonic blasters?

Eh, would take a lot of work for some nice looking models that look completely out of place because of their size.

So I was thinking about the Slaanesh obliterator idea when I thought "wait, why not Terminators with plasma?".

Let me show you what I'm thinking:
Let's max out the unit to make the best use of the powers and strategems.
Give the unit icon of excess.
10x combi-plasmas
Cast prescience.
Use the shoot twice strategem.
Now we have a total of 40 shots, hitting on 2s and producing an extra shot on a 4+ and this is all on a S8 AP-3 D2 weapon. You are easily gonna get 60 odd shots from this (rather expensive) unit.
What if we also gave them a 5+++ so they can survive the round and do it again next turn!
Let's not forgot that, if the opponent charges us we strike first with 21x S5 AP-1 attacks.

Oooo, if only I played EC...

Is death to the false emperor now anytime you roll a 6+ to hit ? Since in the index it is fight phase only

No its still fight phase only.

 Sersi wrote:
No its still fight phase only.

Bugger, forgot about that.

That's my cue to get some sleep (it's gone 1am already!).

 Sersi wrote:

Gibs55 wrote:
Thoughts on converting Primaris Hellblasters into Noise marines with sonic blasters?

You are a genius! I have Dark Victory boxes I was going to convert into "True-scale" Emperor's Children anyway. But that new Hellblaster box the plasma guns with the cables are perfect. I think as good alternate paint job could sell them. Maybe gold with red OSL. Let me sketch out some ideas.

I was thinking the exact same thing as I have done that I am not using and am looking to build a CSM army.

I really like the new strategems, I'm planning on taking a Kharybdis with 8 Possessed, 2x 5 man havocs with autocannons with a sorcerer and possibly exalted champion/ lord. Deep strike the Kharybdis right in the midst of the enemy unleash full Dakka with the missile launchers and autocannons double tapping one of the squads with endless Strategem then warp time the possessed into combat who will use the Khorne strategem to attack twice

On the topic of Primaris proxies, what are everyone's opinion on using Pramaris marines as regular CSM for Alpha Legion?

Fanners wrote:
On the topic of Primaris proxies, what are everyone's opinion on using Pramaris marines as regular CSM for Alpha Legion?

That the Codex page for Fabius Bile makes it almost blatantly clear we're getting our own Primaris Marines.

 Arkaine wrote:

Fanners wrote:
On the topic of Primaris proxies, what are everyone's opinion on using Pramaris marines as regular CSM for Alpha Legion?

That the Codex page for Fabius Bile makes it almost blatantly clear we're getting our own Primaris Marines.

That's true, but the Chaos codex doesn't list a primaris equivalent specifically. As far as I know, GW might even release them late next year, and I really want to start my army.

 Arkaine wrote:

Fanners wrote:
On the topic of Primaris proxies, what are everyone's opinion on using Pramaris marines as regular CSM for Alpha Legion?

That the Codex page for Fabius Bile makes it almost blatantly clear we're getting our own Primaris Marines.

Lol really? Also in other news water wet! Fabulous Bill is in the book, of course they are going to mention him. He is the primogenetor and he cloned Horus multiple times lol. Of course he is going to want to experiment on the new kids. I wouldn't read much into it.

Forge World

Hellforged Contemptor
Dreadnought, Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought and
Hellforged Leviathan Dreadnought
Add ‘
Helbrute
’ to the Keywords line of all
these datasheets.

That means they get the benefit of their faction tactics which is very cool.

Gibs55 wrote:
Forge World

Hellforged Contemptor
Dreadnought, Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought and
Hellforged Leviathan Dreadnought
Add ‘
Helbrute
’ to the Keywords line of all
these datasheets.

That means they get the benefit of their faction tactics which is very cool.

Yea now go email forge world like I did and complain about why contemptors can't take twin las canons for some strange idiotic reason so they can fix it. FW is currently gathering questions and concerns for another round of FAQ's.

I was at a 1500 pt tournament today and let me tell you, kharybdis dreadclaws do fething work. I thought I had a pretty unfavorable matchup against brimstone spam but the ability to hit multiple squads at once with the flamer is exceptional. I almost feel like it's worth it's points without putting anything inside of it; to be sure, the dreadclaw did much more killing than the contemptor tucked inside of it.

Everyone's talking about strength 8 plasma spam with Slaanesh terminators but I'm not down. You're overheating on a 1 and even precience won't save you, since it just increases your to-hit margin, not re-roll.

At 50 points a model losing 70% of the squad to gets hot doesn't sound like my idea of fun.

Prescience will save you.

Re-reading it, you seem to be right. I don't why I read it as increasing your BS by one.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Re-reading it, you seem to be right. I don't why I read it as increasing your BS by one.

Can't you also bring a DP or Lord that lets you re-roll to help keep the termies from overheating?

But why Slaanesh? Every Terminator can take Plasma and shot in after the drop ?

Bluthusten wrote:
But why Slaanesh? Every Terminator can take Plasma and shot in after the drop ?

There's a Slaanesh only Stratagem that will allows them to shoot a second time at the end of the shooting phase.

Arachnofiend wrote:
I was at a 1500 pt tournament today and let me tell you, kharybdis dreadclaws do fething work. I thought I had a pretty unfavorable matchup against brimstone spam but the ability to hit multiple squads at once with the flamer is exceptional. I almost feel like it's worth it's points without putting anything inside of it; to be sure, the dreadclaw did much more killing than the contemptor tucked inside of it.

Kharybdis Assault Claw and Dreadclaw are in a very weird place now.

The price differential between them is far too small, Kharybdis is only 100 pts more, and for this extra cost it gets +6 wounds, 5 K. Storm Launchers, better "pistol", double the attacks. The amount of attacks is very important as Kharybdis can heal itself quite well in melee. And then Kharybdis has the monster killer laser cannon that can theoretically one-shot many vehicles, monsters and even the Robby G.

I'm actually considering getting one now, only problem is that Kharybdis is clearly broken. Or if it is not broken then the Dreadclaw is far too expensive. But dreadclaw cannot be that much too expensive, it already works exactly like normal SM drop pod, except it has much better performance for extra 105 points. SM Drop pod is essentially 100 points for deep strike, 2 mediocre weapons and ability to combine drops in deployment, which is somewhat underrated ability.
Kharybdis should cost atleast 350, maybe even more.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

Bluthusten wrote:
But why Slaanesh? Every Terminator can take Plasma and shot in after the drop ?

There's a Slaanesh only Stratagem that will allows them to shoot a second time at the end of the shooting phase.

:O :O :O :O :O :O

That is amazing!

So we need:

Black Legion

-Abbadon
-5 Chaosterminators of Slaanesh with billions of Plasma
-1 Sorcerer with Jumppack

Bluthusten wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

Bluthusten wrote:
But why Slaanesh? Every Terminator can take Plasma and shot in after the drop ?

There's a Slaanesh only Stratagem that will allows them to shoot a second time at the end of the shooting phase.

:O :O :O :O :O :O

That is amazing!

So we need:

Black Legion

-Abbadon
-5 Chaosterminators of Slaanesh with billions of Plasma
-1 Sorcerer with Jumppack

Is abbadon worth it though as it forces you into black Legion?

To really maximize effect with Slaanesh Terminators you have to remember that Prescience works also in melee, so to really maximize its effect one should:
1: Prescience.
2: Warptime.
3: Shoot with Endless Cacophony.
4: Charge, preferably multiple units.

At hard targets supercharged plasma is the best, but against lighter hordes shooting both bolter and plasma normally is preferable.

Charging then again is weird choice, you either charge to maximize the prescience and casualties to enemy, but at the same time this will expose your Sorcerer and possible Lord to enemy shooting, unless you bring second unit next to it. But bringing second unit would have you making 4 unit deep strike with bare minimum total cost of 550 pts, easily going above 600 pts when units are kitted.
I don't know, this feels excessive.

miniwargaming just put a review out
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQa-to_os94

Deredeo with 2x shooting seems really fair :p

Someone pointed out that the "helbrute" on the fire frenzy stratagem card isnt in the same font treatment as other keywords, suggesting that it's likely intended to be the helbrute unit specifically, not the helbrute keyword.
Now, arguing RAW vs RAI on a goddamn FONT TYPE is a new low for GW, but I wouldn't expect the doublefiring doritos and leviathans to make it through a FAQ round.

Nope. The double blastmaster hellbrute should count