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I could also see the space wolves also creating new names for ranks, given the Leuitenant is a thing (and over all a good idea) I wonder what the Space Wolves will name theirs? Wolfcarls maybe?
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
hobojebus wrote: Even if they have the right gene seed they still won't be fenrisians and we know how the wolf brothers turned out.
Am I reading this new background differently? Everyone seems to be thinking that the Primaris Marines were all created by Cawl and Guilliman then sent, trained and equipped, out to the various Chapters. To me, it looks like the earliest Primaris were indeed created centrally, but then the new gene seed and techniques were distributed to the Chapters to begin enhancing their existing brethren and recruiting new initiates using the Primaris process. The Space Wolves' New Primaris gene seed contains their unique traits, and some or all Fenrisians recruited by the Space Wolves are implanted with the Primaris geneseed. Of course, after Magnus' efforts, the Wolves have other issues with recruitment, but that's a different story.
Game-wise, you're going to be stuck using the same Primaris squads as everyone else, but I bet the 8th edition Codex Space Wolves will have their own unique Primaris units.
the leaks for 8th edition Space Wolves did not include Primaris Marines on the list. Blood Angels and Dark Angles had them on the list, but not Space Wolves.
Galas wrote: If Space Wolves accept Wulfen, they are gonna accept Primaris Marines.
Wasnt Wulfen the long lost 13th great company? In other words already Space Wolves.
sure but they where massivly mutated etc. which is seen as a bad thing. almost any other chapter would have been horrified and screamed "purge them all" the space wolves reckongized and accepted their common ancestory
The 13th company were Wulfen before they chased the Sons into the warp, on top of that one of the Wolves' current Wolf Lords is a Wulfen himself, Bran Redmaw the Curs'd Lord. Still, not all Space Wolves actually accepted their return.
Amusing that Harold Deathwolf was the one to reject the hairy sodds considering his moniker is Lord of Wolfkin.
Yes okay, still. They were already Space Wolves, they had/have the canis helix like every other SW.
I think we have gone a bit off topic. The thread is about how you would incorporate let's say for example a squad of Primaris Hellblaster into the SW ranks. I can't figure out how it would be possible w/o dropping the rank of Hellblaster and start as a Blood Claw.
But then they wouldn't be Hellblasters anymore.
My point was that the Wolves' reaction to the Primaris Marines will be mixed, same as their reaction to just about everything, they'll argue long and hard then something will demand their attention and they'll forget the argument. The Primaris Marines will join them in the situation and the Wolves will act as if they've always been part of the chapter.
The Space Wolves already have a Blood Claw with skills beyond most Wolf Guard, they have no issue forcing units and individuals to start in the Blood Claws and earn their way out.
Ye i get all that.
But to become a Space Wolf you need, like you say, start as a blood claw and earn your way out.
The problem I have is how I'm gonna incorporate these new ranks of marines into my SW Chapter. Guilliman is sending not just fresh marines but marines with the ranks of Intercessors, Inceptors, Hellblasters for example to reinforce the SW. I don't see Space Wolves just accepting those new ranks just because Guilliman say "here you go, these are your new toys". They will have to start as BCs, hence rendering the new ranks irrelevant to the Space Wolves and in my eyes impossible to incorporate in the chapter.
Or am I over thinking it?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ravingbantha wrote: the leaks for 8th edition Space Wolves did not include Primaris Marines on the list. Blood Angels and Dark Angles had them on the list, but not Space Wolves.
They do. All the Primaris marines are listed in the Space Wolves Chapter in the Index: Imperial 1.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/04 00:52:01
Galas wrote: If Space Wolves accept Wulfen, they are gonna accept Primaris Marines.
Wasnt Wulfen the long lost 13th great company? In other words already Space Wolves.
sure but they where massivly mutated etc. which is seen as a bad thing. almost any other chapter would have been horrified and screamed "purge them all" the space wolves reckongized and accepted their common ancestory
The 13th company were Wulfen before they chased the Sons into the warp, on top of that one of the Wolves' current Wolf Lords is a Wulfen himself, Bran Redmaw the Curs'd Lord. Still, not all Space Wolves actually accepted their return.
Amusing that Harold Deathwolf was the one to reject the hairy sodds considering his moniker is Lord of Wolfkin.
Yes okay, still. They were already Space Wolves, they had/have the canis helix like every other SW.
I think we have gone a bit off topic. The thread is about how you would incorporate let's say for example a squad of Primaris Hellblaster into the SW ranks. I can't figure out how it would be possible w/o dropping the rank of Hellblaster and start as a Blood Claw.
But then they wouldn't be Hellblasters anymore.
My point was that the Wolves' reaction to the Primaris Marines will be mixed, same as their reaction to just about everything, they'll argue long and hard then something will demand their attention and they'll forget the argument. The Primaris Marines will join them in the situation and the Wolves will act as if they've always been part of the chapter.
The Space Wolves already have a Blood Claw with skills beyond most Wolf Guard, they have no issue forcing units and individuals to start in the Blood Claws and earn their way out.
Ye i get all that.
But to become a Space Wolf you need, like you say, start as a blood claw and earn your way out.
The problem I have is how I'm gonna incorporate these new ranks of marines into my SW Chapter. Guilliman is sending not just fresh marines but marines with the ranks of Intercessors, Inceptors, Hellblasters for example to reinforce the SW. I don't see Space Wolves just accepting those new ranks just because Guilliman say "here you go, these are your new toys". They will have to start as BCs, hence rendering the new ranks irrelevant to the Space Wolves and in my eyes impossible to incorporate in the chapter.
Or am I over thinking it?
Not really, the whole point of any Warhammer game is to overthink it - AKA Forge the Narritive. Consider each battle to be amongst their first with the Space Wolves. The Wolves still haven't decided what to do with them or even if they truly accept them and the Primaris Marines are still trying to prove their worth.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
hobojebus wrote: Even if they have the right gene seed they still won't be fenrisians and we know how the wolf brothers turned out.
Am I reading this new background differently? Everyone seems to be thinking that the Primaris Marines were all created by Cawl and Guilliman then sent, trained and equipped, out to the various Chapters. To me, it looks like the earliest Primaris were indeed created centrally, but then the new gene seed and techniques were distributed to the Chapters to begin enhancing their existing brethren and recruiting new initiates using the Primaris process. The Space Wolves' New Primaris gene seed contains their unique traits, and some or all Fenrisians recruited by the Space Wolves are implanted with the Primaris geneseed. Of course, after Magnus' efforts, the Wolves have other issues with recruitment, but that's a different story.
Game-wise, you're going to be stuck using the same Primaris squads as everyone else, but I bet the 8th edition Codex Space Wolves will have their own unique Primaris units.
or at the very least space wolves will be revealed to have renamed the squad types to be I dunnmo, timber wolf packs, dire wolf packs, air wolf packs.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
hobojebus wrote: Even if they have the right gene seed they still won't be fenrisians and we know how the wolf brothers turned out.
Am I reading this new background differently? Everyone seems to be thinking that the Primaris Marines were all created by Cawl and Guilliman then sent, trained and equipped, out to the various Chapters. To me, it looks like the earliest Primaris were indeed created centrally, but then the new gene seed and techniques were distributed to the Chapters to begin enhancing their existing brethren and recruiting new initiates using the Primaris process. The Space Wolves' New Primaris gene seed contains their unique traits, and some or all Fenrisians recruited by the Space Wolves are implanted with the Primaris geneseed. Of course, after Magnus' efforts, the Wolves have other issues with recruitment, but that's a different story.
Game-wise, you're going to be stuck using the same Primaris squads as everyone else, but I bet the 8th edition Codex Space Wolves will have their own unique Primaris units.
or at the very least space wolves will be revealed to have renamed the squad types to be I dunnmo, timber wolf packs, dire wolf packs, air wolf packs.
You just ruined my mood.
I'd rather they be called Claws or Fangs - Hell, I'd rather they be called "Dirty Arses" than another "Wolf" unit.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
hobojebus wrote: Even if they have the right gene seed they still won't be fenrisians and we know how the wolf brothers turned out.
Am I reading this new background differently? Everyone seems to be thinking that the Primaris Marines were all created by Cawl and Guilliman then sent, trained and equipped, out to the various Chapters. To me, it looks like the earliest Primaris were indeed created centrally, but then the new gene seed and techniques were distributed to the Chapters to begin enhancing their existing brethren and recruiting new initiates using the Primaris process. The Space Wolves' New Primaris gene seed contains their unique traits, and some or all Fenrisians recruited by the Space Wolves are implanted with the Primaris geneseed. Of course, after Magnus' efforts, the Wolves have other issues with recruitment, but that's a different story.
Game-wise, you're going to be stuck using the same Primaris squads as everyone else, but I bet the 8th edition Codex Space Wolves will have their own unique Primaris units.
or at the very least space wolves will be revealed to have renamed the squad types to be I dunnmo, timber wolf packs, dire wolf packs, air wolf packs.
Even if they rename the ranks, due to the strict SW rank hierarchy it will take a long time before any of the primaris marines will reach them i guess.
Galas wrote: If Space Wolves accept Wulfen, they are gonna accept Primaris Marines.
Wasnt Wulfen the long lost 13th great company? In other words already Space Wolves.
sure but they where massivly mutated etc. which is seen as a bad thing. almost any other chapter would have been horrified and screamed "purge them all" the space wolves reckongized and accepted their common ancestory
The 13th company were Wulfen before they chased the Sons into the warp, on top of that one of the Wolves' current Wolf Lords is a Wulfen himself, Bran Redmaw the Curs'd Lord. Still, not all Space Wolves actually accepted their return.
Amusing that Harold Deathwolf was the one to reject the hairy sodds considering his moniker is Lord of Wolfkin.
Yes okay, still. They were already Space Wolves, they had/have the canis helix like every other SW.
I think we have gone a bit off topic. The thread is about how you would incorporate let's say for example a squad of Primaris Hellblaster into the SW ranks. I can't figure out how it would be possible w/o dropping the rank of Hellblaster and start as a Blood Claw.
But then they wouldn't be Hellblasters anymore.
My point was that the Wolves' reaction to the Primaris Marines will be mixed, same as their reaction to just about everything, they'll argue long and hard then something will demand their attention and they'll forget the argument. The Primaris Marines will join them in the situation and the Wolves will act as if they've always been part of the chapter.
The Space Wolves already have a Blood Claw with skills beyond most Wolf Guard, they have no issue forcing units and individuals to start in the Blood Claws and earn their way out.
Ye i get all that.
But to become a Space Wolf you need, like you say, start as a blood claw and earn your way out.
The problem I have is how I'm gonna incorporate these new ranks of marines into my SW Chapter. Guilliman is sending not just fresh marines but marines with the ranks of Intercessors, Inceptors, Hellblasters for example to reinforce the SW. I don't see Space Wolves just accepting those new ranks just because Guilliman say "here you go, these are your new toys". They will have to start as BCs, hence rendering the new ranks irrelevant to the Space Wolves and in my eyes impossible to incorporate in the chapter.
Or am I over thinking it?
Not really, the whole point of any Warhammer game is to overthink it - AKA Forge the Narritive. Consider each battle to be amongst their first with the Space Wolves. The Wolves still haven't decided what to do with them or even if they truly accept them and the Primaris Marines are still trying to prove their worth.
I guess I will just keep them outside my chapter untill the codex drops.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/04 01:49:53
hobojebus wrote: Even if they have the right gene seed they still won't be fenrisians and we know how the wolf brothers turned out.
Am I reading this new background differently? Everyone seems to be thinking that the Primaris Marines were all created by Cawl and Guilliman then sent, trained and equipped, out to the various Chapters. To me, it looks like the earliest Primaris were indeed created centrally, but then the new gene seed and techniques were distributed to the Chapters to begin enhancing their existing brethren and recruiting new initiates using the Primaris process. The Space Wolves' New Primaris gene seed contains their unique traits, and some or all Fenrisians recruited by the Space Wolves are implanted with the Primaris geneseed. Of course, after Magnus' efforts, the Wolves have other issues with recruitment, but that's a different story.
Game-wise, you're going to be stuck using the same Primaris squads as everyone else, but I bet the 8th edition Codex Space Wolves will have their own unique Primaris units.
or at the very least space wolves will be revealed to have renamed the squad types to be I dunnmo, timber wolf packs, dire wolf packs, air wolf packs.
Even if they rename the ranks, due to the strict SW rank hierarchy it will take a long time before any of the primaris marines will reach them i guess.
not if they create a parallel heirarchy with Primaris Marines.
at the end of the day we won't know until GW gets around to fleshing it out.
BTW we do know primaris Marines have been made with spacewolves geneseed, one gets mentioned in Dark Imperium.
it's also possiable that the space wolves didn't take any of the existing ones, took the tech and folded the tech in. and now all wolf guard are Primaris. and only wolf guard can be.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
Well I'd of thought it'd be a personal choice each pack deciding amongst themselves if they want upgrading, don't see long fangs choosing to do it though too long in the tooth to be arsed with that kind of thing.
From squinting at the unboxing video, the Space Wolves unit markings for Primaris Marines have the red-on-yellow Blood Claws markings labelled "Close Support", the black-on-white Long Fang markings as "Fire Support" and the black-on-yellow Wolf Guard markings as "Veteran". I couldn't see what the red-on-black Grey Hunter markings were labelled as.
Before you get all agitated (too late ... ), this is a single image on a page of colour schemes; the full background will no doubt name them more appropriately.
AndrewGPaul wrote: From squinting at the unboxing video, the Space Wolves unit markings for Primaris Marines have the red-on-yellow Blood Claws markings labelled "Close Support", the black-on-white Long Fang markings as "Fire Support" and the black-on-yellow Wolf Guard markings as "Veteran". I couldn't see what the red-on-black Grey Hunter markings were labelled as.
Before you get all agitated (too late ... ), this is a single image on a page of colour schemes; the full background will no doubt name them more appropriately.
Ye, I did see that and I feel its bs to just use already existing pack markings for new ranks. I think that the primaris marines will be in a separate company(maybe the 14th company?) if they are to be included in the Space Wolves chapter. Heard at a Q/A they said "some chapters will welcome the primaris marines into their ranks, some won't. Some will create entirely new companies for the primaris marines." And if that's the case I think it's super lazy of GW to do it that way.
But we'll have to wait and see.
Edit: The black on red(Grey Hunter) pack marking for the primaris marines say Battle line.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/05 14:03:00
AndrewGPaul wrote: From squinting at the unboxing video, the Space Wolves unit markings for Primaris Marines have the red-on-yellow Blood Claws markings labelled "Close Support", the black-on-white Long Fang markings as "Fire Support" and the black-on-yellow Wolf Guard markings as "Veteran". I couldn't see what the red-on-black Grey Hunter markings were labelled as.
Before you get all agitated (too late ... ), this is a single image on a page of colour schemes; the full background will no doubt name them more appropriately.
Ye, I did see that and I feel its bs to just use already existing pack markings for new ranks. I think that the primaris marines will be in a separate company(maybe the 14th company?) if they are to be included in the Space Wolves chapter. Heard at a Q/A they said "some chapters will welcome the primaris marines into their ranks, some won't. Some will create entirely new companies for the primaris marines." And if that's the case I think it's super lazy of GW to do it that way.
But we'll have to wait and see.
Edit: The black on red(Grey Hunter) pack marking for the primaris marines say Battle line.
Personally I've been modding Blood Angels and Dark Angels shoulder pads, getting me some winged claws, winged wolf skulls and blood drops with viking runes.
The claws are the worst.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
Likely a separate command structure. The primus under own captains and Lt.
However if they wanted a space wolf rank. Then everyone even the captain is a blood claw till you earn your ranks.
No cross promotion. You learn to be a propper space wolf the old way. The Russ way.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
jhe90 wrote: Likely a separate command structure. The primus under own captains and Lt.
However if they wanted a space wolf rank. Then everyone even the captain is a blood claw till you earn your ranks.
No cross promotion. You learn to be a propper space wolf the old way. The Russ way.
Damn right you want food you go hunt a six legged stag with antlers 12 feet across using your bare hands, every meal must be accompanied by three times your weight in ale, each loaf must be lathered in a stick of butter and wrapped around a whole chicken.
To train you must go fishing for kraken with nought but a wooden spear and yourself as bait, to exercise there are several options like running alongside thunder wolves as they hunt, controlling the local troll populations or descending into the depths to cull night kin.
Gun drills are fine for weaker chapters but the vlka frenryka only accept heroes worthy of the sagas.
jhe90 wrote: Likely a separate command structure. The primus under own captains and Lt.
However if they wanted a space wolf rank. Then everyone even the captain is a blood claw till you earn your ranks.
No cross promotion. You learn to be a propper space wolf the old way. The Russ way.
Damn right you want food you go hunt a six legged stag with antlers 12 feet across using your bare hands, every meal must be accompanied by three times your weight in ale, each loaf must be lathered in a stick of butter and wrapped around a whole chicken.
To train you must go fishing for kraken with nought but a wooden spear and yourself as bait, to exercise there are several options like running alongside thunder wolves as they hunt, controlling the local troll populations or descending into the depths to cull night kin.
Gun drills are fine for weaker chapters but the vlka frenryka only accept heroes worthy of the sagas.
You gotta remember, if you don't open with over the top boasts nobody is going to listen to you.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
Mleander wrote: Does anyone have any more info on this new Wolfspear Chapter?
A LITTLE it's not much though, I'll give what I can.
The Wolf Spear are a new chapter made up of the remains of the Primaris Space Wolves from the Grey Shields, based on Raukos (the world where Gulliman ended the Indomatus Crusade) their job is to Guard "The Pit" which is, as I understand it a part of the great rift. Raukos is one of several guard station worlds that the Imperium is eistablishing along it until they can figure out how to close the bloody thing.
Makes me wonder if the Space Wolf chapter has, for the moment rejected Primaris Marines. or at least the ones they've not created themselves.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
Mleander wrote: Does anyone have any more info on this new Wolfspear Chapter?
A LITTLE it's not much though, I'll give what I can.
The Wolf Spear are a new chapter made up of the remains of the Primaris Space Wolves from the Grey Shields, based on Raukos (the world where Gulliman ended the Indomatus Crusade) their job is to Guard "The Pit" which is, as I understand it a part of the great rift. Raukos is one of several guard station worlds that the Imperium is eistablishing along it until they can figure out how to close the bloody thing.
Makes me wonder if the Space Wolf chapter has, for the moment rejected Primaris Marines. or at least the ones they've not created themselves.
I remember reading Sanguinius wasn't overly fond of the first Terran Blood Angels, maybe Russ held similar views.
One thing I know is Russ wanted Space Wolves' successors encircling the Eye of Terror, this might not be a rejection so much as a beginning to that desire, then again it could be both.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
Grimnar has led the Space Wolves for centuries and is a smart cookie. He won't reject the Primaris Marines out of hand and certainly not once he has fought alongside them in battle.
The question isn't whether they will be accepted but how they will be integrated. Since we don't have a definitive answer yet, that means players are free to choose how they use their models.
As it should be.
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
Mleander wrote: Does anyone have any more info on this new Wolfspear Chapter?
A LITTLE it's not much though, I'll give what I can.
The Wolf Spear are a new chapter made up of the remains of the Primaris Space Wolves from the Grey Shields, based on Raukos (the world where Gulliman ended the Indomatus Crusade) their job is to Guard "The Pit" which is, as I understand it a part of the great rift. Raukos is one of several guard station worlds that the Imperium is eistablishing along it until they can figure out how to close the bloody thing.
Makes me wonder if the Space Wolf chapter has, for the moment rejected Primaris Marines. or at least the ones they've not created themselves.
I remember reading Sanguinius wasn't overly fond of the first Terran Blood Angels, maybe Russ held similar views.
One thing I know is Russ wanted Space Wolves' successors encircling the Eye of Terror, this might not be a rejection so much as a beginning to that desire, then again it could be both.
it could simply be something as simple as the space wolves couldn't handle the sheer number of Space Wolf Primaris Marines produced. given they;re limited to only 1 chapter right now if Gulliman had produced say a modest 2000 Primaris Space Wolves that'd be WAAAY more then the space wolves could take in without impacting their chapter
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
Mleander wrote: Does anyone have any more info on this new Wolfspear Chapter?
A LITTLE it's not much though, I'll give what I can.
The Wolf Spear are a new chapter made up of the remains of the Primaris Space Wolves from the Grey Shields, based on Raukos (the world where Gulliman ended the Indomatus Crusade) their job is to Guard "The Pit" which is, as I understand it a part of the great rift. Raukos is one of several guard station worlds that the Imperium is eistablishing along it until they can figure out how to close the bloody thing.
Makes me wonder if the Space Wolf chapter has, for the moment rejected Primaris Marines. or at least the ones they've not created themselves.
I remember reading Sanguinius wasn't overly fond of the first Terran Blood Angels, maybe Russ held similar views.
One thing I know is Russ wanted Space Wolves' successors encircling the Eye of Terror, this might not be a rejection so much as a beginning to that desire, then again it could be both.
it could simply be something as simple as the space wolves couldn't handle the sheer number of Space Wolf Primaris Marines produced. given they;re limited to only 1 chapter right now if Gulliman had produced say a modest 2000 Primaris Space Wolves that'd be WAAAY more then the space wolves could take in without impacting their chapter
You jest right? The Space Wolves have the capacity to have a solid ten thousand Marines, currently they'd be lucky to have six hundred including the Wulfen.
More likely Guiliman negotiated 2000 Primaris Marines for some Codex compliance.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
Mleander wrote: Does anyone have any more info on this new Wolfspear Chapter?
A LITTLE it's not much though, I'll give what I can.
The Wolf Spear are a new chapter made up of the remains of the Primaris Space Wolves from the Grey Shields, based on Raukos (the world where Gulliman ended the Indomatus Crusade) their job is to Guard "The Pit" which is, as I understand it a part of the great rift. Raukos is one of several guard station worlds that the Imperium is eistablishing along it until they can figure out how to close the bloody thing.
Makes me wonder if the Space Wolf chapter has, for the moment rejected Primaris Marines. or at least the ones they've not created themselves.
I remember reading Sanguinius wasn't overly fond of the first Terran Blood Angels, maybe Russ held similar views.
One thing I know is Russ wanted Space Wolves' successors encircling the Eye of Terror, this might not be a rejection so much as a beginning to that desire, then again it could be both.
No Russ took his new legion into orc territory and over five years killed every last green skin and emerged with a fully unified force, wolves respect their elders they would of welcomed the experience of the terrans.
), this is a single image on a page of colour schemes; the full background will no doubt name them more appropriately.
