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From a youtube channel. The uploader got this rumours from a guy claiming to be a playtester. He also said that person knew about those buggies before their release.

On the other side the army traits are basicly what most of us would expect for those clans so could be a good guess as well.


@DakkaDakkaDakka!: I love it! Since I play shooty bad moons with lots of shootaboys, flash gits, lootas, tank bustas, battle waggons full of dakka and mek / grot guns this will change a lot for me.
For example my lootas. Before I couldn't shoot fliers if that tank moved, now they can and that 15 lootas will get get 10 hits assuming 3 shots each + Bad Moons trait. Tankbustas will get 5 hits advancing and shooting fliers instead of zero. Adds a lot flexibility and thread range.

That is even without considering shooty strategems we might get as well, like dakkadakkadakka triggering on 5+, getting two extra shots on a 6 or a bad moons strategem rerolling more than just ones.

And it's for free. So often that dakkadakkadakka would have killed that tank one turn earlier or shot that scoring unit from their objective.


With that army trait it's almost 50% more hits for bad moons.

tneva82 wrote:

 davou wrote:
you dont need to repaint to use the klan traits; and if you REALLY want a way to deliniate you can paint the edge of the bases in colors to denote clan seperation

When I have goffs as goffs and bad moons as bad moons like hell IDENTICAL COLOURED bad moons will have different klan trait. No way I'm that rude to my opponent.

well then you're troubling youself for your own reasons, not because the game made you.

RedNoak wrote:

if someone comes across this post, he is inclined to think DDD gives you 16.7% more hits (edit: as in total). but that is simply not true.

5,5% is the number everyone should have in mind when judging DDD. its not much but it is a notable boost.

Coh Magnussen's number on the other hand seems to blow it out of propotion. not a good thing to have in a tactics thread.

Y'all are killin' me here. Assuming you start with the same number of attacks -- With DDD your total number of hits is 16.7% higher than your number of hits without DDD. This assumes the same number of attacks. That math is indisputible. If you compare apples to apples -- whether you look at attack rolls, actual hits, or actual wounds, the only number that matters is 16.7%.

If a unit of <any element of the ork army, regardless of BS> gets X hits on average without DDD, then that same unit gets X * 1.167 hits on average with DDD. 16.7% increase in firepower.
If a unit of <any element of the ork army> gets Y wounds against <any element of any other army>, then that same unit shooting at the same opponent deals Y * 1.167 wounds. 16.7% increase in firepower.

bit of basic algebra -- assume A = #attacks, H = #hits, and W=#wounds %h is the chance of hitting a given attack, and %w is the chance of a given hit wounding (yes, the %h and %w will change based on the shooting unit and the shot-at unit, but for purposes of DDD vs no DDD they will be the same value)

H = A*%h
W = H*%w

or if you put it all together for Wounds, which is what we probably care about, W = A*%h*%w. now lets apply DDD, which we at least all agree results in 16.7% more attack rolls. So with DDD, W = (1.167*A)*%h*%w. enter the associative property of multiplication, and W = 1.167* (A*%h*%w). Which is clearly a 16.7% increase in wounds over what you had without DDD.


If you want to argue the above statements I'll be glad to go over the math with you, but in deference to Jidmah I'll take it to PM. If you accept the above statements as true then I don't see how you can argue that the 'right' number for firepower improvement is 5.5% instead of 16.7%.

Jayne Cobb wrote:Ten percent of nothing is - let me do the math here. Nothing into nothing. Carry the nothing...

My first glance at the exploding 6s of Dakka Dakka Dakka is that it's fine for something free, but won't fix ork shooting by itself. My concern is that it's going to be a lot of rolling without much extra result. It's pretty much impossible to judge without seeing a lot more of the codex though.

RedNoak wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
Yes that is how math works. Absolute gain vs relative gain.

For the second time, can we stop this idiotic discussion?

no it doesnt work that way.
and we can stop this stupid discussion when you stop spreading misinformation...

That's 16.7% more attacks, which should on average yield 16.7% more hits than without DDD.

if someone comes across this post, he is inclined to think DDD gives you 16.7% more hits (edit: as in total). but that is simply not true.

5,5% is the number everyone should have in mind when judging DDD. its not much but it is a notable boost.

Coh Magnussen's number on the other hand seems to blow it out of propotion. not a good thing to have in a tactics thread.

Please go google absolute and relative before writing dumb stuff.

100 shots hit 33.33 times without DDD
100 shots hit 38.88 times with DDD

Absolute gain in hits is 5.55 in 100 or 5.55% (% means per hundred in case you didn't know)
Relative gain is 5.55/33.33 which is 16.66%

First one is important to evaluate if the rule has any notable effect on killing stuff, the second one to evaluate the increase in shooting efficiency.

Love your work Jid, people will continue to ignore you though :(
It's really important to "not be misleading" in a tactics thread, so one of those numbers are "correct", and they will find it.

 davou wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 davou wrote:
you dont need to repaint to use the klan traits; and if you REALLY want a way to deliniate you can paint the edge of the bases in colors to denote clan seperation

When I have goffs as goffs and bad moons as bad moons like hell IDENTICAL COLOURED bad moons will have different klan trait. No way I'm that rude to my opponent.

well then you're troubling youself for your own reasons, not because the game made you.

And he won't seem super power gamey

Nuck Fewton wrote:

 davou wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 davou wrote:
you dont need to repaint to use the klan traits; and if you REALLY want a way to deliniate you can paint the edge of the bases in colors to denote clan seperation

When I have goffs as goffs and bad moons as bad moons like hell IDENTICAL COLOURED bad moons will have different klan trait. No way I'm that rude to my opponent.

well then you're troubling youself for your own reasons, not because the game made you.

And he won't seem super power gamey

And we won't run into situation where "wait where was unit with X rules? Was it this? Or that?". I have been through that once where NEITHER player could remember which one was which(was matter of which biker captain exactly was the one that had hit&run and which one was tough as hell. They were against different units and one of them was in serious trouble. He would have liked to get the hell out of there. I obviously wanted to keep him there rather than get blown to bits. Much talking and oohming and at the end we had to dice it. Having experienced that myself like hell I will risk same with my own army). Have fun sorting that out. Can easily ruin atmosphere of game.

Especially easy to run out in say 6k games...Which is, funny that, what I'll likely be heading next month.

Yeah it's not technically rule but it's basic courtesy. It helps YOU play it straight and more importantly helps your opponent to know without having to constantly double check you _and have just your word to go by_

Repainting that one UNFINISHED model is small price to pay for avoiding THAT. Too bad my walkers are goff/dethskull/bad moons. If rather than goff/dethskulls one had been evil sunz it could have been as simple as airbrush red over yellow. I usually use yellow as intermediate colour for red anyway while airbrushing! But I want to keep walkers in 3 klans to allow using all together.

Now if someones army had been ALL bad moon and he would decide to use other klan fine. I'm not fan of that style but it's fair play and won't be overly confusing as all models will use same rules. But my army, inspired by 2nd edition and war of armageddon fluff, is collection of all klans(well 4 ATM. Missing blood axes and snakebite and thanks to the super time consuming trait in codex I'm doubtful will I ever expand into snakebites) under Ghazzkhul. So for sake of sanity for BOTH players one klan colour scheme uses one klan rules consistently.

edit: Realized even BIGGER issue with the whole klan rules and my collection...Grots...I have 120 of those buggers. They are deliberately painted as rag tag no klan colours on the principle these are not as organized as orks and generally collect scraps and bits and clothes where they want. There's zero unifying colours there besides skin...

Which means that with potentially over half a dozen unit separating which is what is going to be super hard...

...Guess I will voluntarily nerf myself and play them as clanless. No bonuses and warboss won't smash heads to keep morale up. Sigh. But small price to avoid the headache "these identical grots are goff, these are bad moons etc" and like hell I will repaint them all! Especially as I like the look of that ragtag collection of mischiffs.

Can't you just add some coloured markings to the grots' bases? Either numbers or just colour coded to the different klans?

PiñaColada wrote:
Can't you just add some coloured markings to the grots' bases? Either numbers or just colour coded to the different klans?

That's one possibility though takes away from visuality. Also I have to check how that works with movement trays. Ie are the bases VISIBLE enough from the movement trays for easy identification.

Another issue with that is that since I don't have 3+ units of boyz per klan(at least yet) I'm 100% REQUIRED to use grots to fill battallions. Even after I get the rest of my boyz painted it means I have: 1 bad moon, 1 goff, 2 deth skull, 2 evil sunz mob. This means MINIMUM I need is 2 units of grots. And exact grot mob sizes vary between games. Thus especially if I field goff and bad moon not sure do I have enough grots to have sufficient flexibility with grot mobs. They were intended partially as filler units to fill up battallions :-/ I might have to buy(and paint) even MORE grots. Not feasible for a while with the speed freek and new mobs.

Ah well. It's the warboss morale boost I'll be missing most but that's why I have been having runtherds anyway. Generally warbosses were elsewhere anyway buffing orks rather than grots. 1-2 warboss have hard time being everywhere!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On the teleport strategem apart from gorkanaut one thing I'm planning to try is tons of evil sunz boyz. Just wondering whether(assumign rumour is true and it's 20PL total and not one unit) 30+10, mob up and charge or 2x20 would be better. 30+10 would result in huge mob of 40 to crash into enemy with +1 attack. 2x20 will likely not get that +1 A but would have flexibility of hitting multiple places at once and more reliable than 1 unit of getting at least 1 charge. 8", rerolls or not, can still fail and 40 mob with all that CP usage(likely 4 plus possibly CP reroll) is investement that sucks if it fails.

Wonder what to bring with that remaining 2 PL. Not much characters that fit so 10 grots to annoy enemy? Could be used to protect maybe flank of the orks that teleported.

Of course what remains to be seen is a) whether that teleport strategem even allows multiple units b) timing wise can you teleport and then mob up. If not that 40 mobs ain't coming anyway.

Hopefully it can be. This is nasty but there's already nastier stuff that can do similar things so hardly game breaking.

tneva82 wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:
Can't you just add some coloured markings to the grots' bases? Either numbers or just colour coded to the different klans?

That's one possibility though takes away from visuality. Also I have to check how that works with movement trays. Ie are the bases VISIBLE enough from the movement trays for easy identification.

Another issue with that is that since I don't have 3+ units of boyz per klan(at least yet) I'm 100% REQUIRED to use grots to fill battallions. Even after I get the rest of my boyz painted it means I have: 1 bad moon, 1 goff, 2 deth skull, 2 evil sunz mob. This means MINIMUM I need is 2 units of grots. And exact grot mob sizes vary between games. Thus especially if I field goff and bad moon not sure do I have enough grots to have sufficient flexibility with grot mobs. They were intended partially as filler units to fill up battallions :-/ I might have to buy(and paint) even MORE grots. Not feasible for a while with the speed freek and new mobs.

"Rag tag no clan colors" is pretty much what snakebites are though. If you want to stay WYSIWYG, just run your gretchin as snakebites?

Otherwise, put magnets on your movement trays, paint up some ork clan glyphs from the boyz/nobz box and stick them to magnet as well. Instant clan change and it even looks decent. Another idea would be building small gretchin standard bearers.

On the teleport strategem apart from gorkanaut one thing I'm planning to try is tons of evil sunz boyz. Just wondering whether(assumign rumour is true and it's 20PL total and not one unit) 30+10, mob up and charge or 2x20 would be better. 30+10 would result in huge mob of 40 to crash into enemy with +1 attack. 2x20 will likely not get that +1 A but would have flexibility of hitting multiple places at once and more reliable than 1 unit of getting at least 1 charge. 8", rerolls or not, can still fail and 40 mob with all that CP usage(likely 4 plus possibly CP reroll) is investement that sucks if it fails.

You could also get 4x10 to have maximum amount of nobz.

Wonder what to bring with that remaining 2 PL. Not much characters that fit so 10 grots to annoy enemy? Could be used to protect maybe flank of the orks that teleported.

There might be a better use for those last 7 PL than bringing 10 boyz, so maybe Dok Grotsnik or a unit of Flash Gits. Once we have our codex I'm sure there will be 2-3 viable combos that will outshine all others.

Of course what remains to be seen is a) whether that teleport strategem even allows multiple units b) timing wise can you teleport and then mob up. If not that 40 mobs ain't coming anyway.

As above, the limit to 20 PL wouldn't make sense if it was limited to one unit.
As for the mob up, that would be a clear no. With the big FAQ, there have been multiple answers for other armies that disallowed the usage of "at the end of movement" stratagems on units arriving from deep strike, like DG Cloud of Flies on teleporting terminators.

 Jidmah wrote:
"Rag tag no clan colors" is pretty much what snakebites are though. If you want to stay WYSIWYG, just run your gretchin as snakebites?

HUGE issue that: I would not have single battallion of any other clan then legal without giving up clan trait...Only battallion I could run is snakebite with grots...

Also even worse: Snakebite is HUGE time sinker with that bloody feel no pain that is huge time sinker. My slowest games are always vs dark eldars with that bloody FNP and that's with dark eldars. Imagine 200 grots with snakebite...

Now albeit snakebite is probably one of the best tournament traits for orks as a whole. I made list I could soon play that has 180 boyz and 120 grots. FNP with those and good luck getting past turn 2 in time. That FNP would make it time eating as hell. I wouldn't even need to deliberately to slowplay when you would have tons of 2-3 dice groups you need to roll for FNP.

You could also get 4x10 to have maximum amount of nobz.

That costs 2 PL more and you can't mob up more than 2 units together so you would have 2 tiny units and 1 medium only.

As above, the limit to 20 PL wouldn't make sense if it was limited to one unit.
As for the mob up, that would be a clear no. With the big FAQ, there have been multiple answers for other armies that disallowed the usage of "at the end of movement" stratagems on units arriving from deep strike, like DG Cloud of Flies on teleporting terminators.

Generally other armies have PL limit for deep strike(or some other limit) to cut off biggest stuff. GW might not want deep striking stompa after all...

And darn for the 2nd. Well that makes 30+10(nevermind 4x10) less appealing.

Oh I love how people just fail miserably with basic math. And the fact that some keep comparing apples and oranges.

100 shots gives you 16,67 extra shots. A 16,67% gain in number of shots.
Which leads to:
33,33 hits vs 38,88 hits. A 16,67% gain in number of hits.

And it carries over to number of wounds regardless of toughness. A 16,67% gain in number of wounds.

It's a 16,67% increase, and the math is sound.

Oh and it's a 16,67% increase even with -1 to hit. You'll gain the same number of extra shots = 16,67% increase in shots. Which turns out to be
16,67 hits vs 19.44 hits which is a... wait for it... Oh my gosh, a 16,67% increase in hits! Who would have thought?

If you still believe it is a 5,5% gain then by all means do so, but please stop spreading your made up math in this thread.

Thanks.

I mean, at this point can we just be done with this argument? Whichever side of the 5.5%/16.67% rift you fall on, can this discussion just be moved to a mathhammer thread where the argument can be further run to the ground if needed?

 Weazel wrote:
Oh I love how people just fail miserably with basic math. And the fact that some keep comparing apples and oranges.

100 shots gives you 16,67 extra shots. A 16,67% gain in number of shots.
Which leads to:
33,33 hits vs 38,88 hits. A 16,67% gain in number of hits.

And it carries over to number of wounds regardless of toughness. A 16,67% gain in number of wounds.

It's a 16,67% increase, and the math is sound.

Oh and it's a 16,67% increase even with -1 to hit. You'll gain the same number of extra shots = 16,67% increase in shots. Which turns out to be
16,67 hits vs 19.44 hits which is a... wait for it... Oh my gosh, a 16,67% increase in hits! Who would have thought?

If you still believe it is a 5,5% gain then by all means do so, but please stop spreading your made up math in this thread.

Thanks.

Both are right, please refer to my previous post.

Of course the relative gain stays the same when you get -1 to hit, but the absolute gain is less, simply because less of your additional shots hit.

I'll just start reporting every one arguing this from now on, hopefully others that are annoyed by this will too.

 Jidmah wrote:

 Weazel wrote:
Oh I love how people just fail miserably with basic math. And the fact that some keep comparing apples and oranges.

100 shots gives you 16,67 extra shots. A 16,67% gain in number of shots.
Which leads to:
33,33 hits vs 38,88 hits. A 16,67% gain in number of hits.

And it carries over to number of wounds regardless of toughness. A 16,67% gain in number of wounds.

It's a 16,67% increase, and the math is sound.

Oh and it's a 16,67% increase even with -1 to hit. You'll gain the same number of extra shots = 16,67% increase in shots. Which turns out to be
16,67 hits vs 19.44 hits which is a... wait for it... Oh my gosh, a 16,67% increase in hits! Who would have thought?

If you still believe it is a 5,5% gain then by all means do so, but please stop spreading your made up math in this thread.

Thanks.

Both are right, please refer to my previous post.

Of course the relative gain stays the same when you get -1 to hit, but the absolute gain is less, simply because less of your additional shots hit.

I'll just start reporting every one arguing this from now on, hopefully others that are annoyed by this will too.

5.5% comes when you compare the number of extra HITS to the number of initial SHOTS. That's comparing apples and oranges.

E: Anyway, I don't want to argue about this further either since (excuse my arrogance) I know I'm on the right about this.

tneva82 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
"Rag tag no clan colors" is pretty much what snakebites are though. If you want to stay WYSIWYG, just run your gretchin as snakebites?

HUGE issue that: I would not have single battallion of any other clan then legal without giving up clan trait...Only battallion I could run is snakebite with grots...

Also even worse: Snakebite is HUGE time sinker with that bloody feel no pain that is huge time sinker. My slowest games are always vs dark eldars with that bloody FNP and that's with dark eldars. Imagine 200 grots with snakebite...

Now albeit snakebite is probably one of the best tournament traits for orks as a whole. I made list I could soon play that has 180 boyz and 120 grots. FNP with those and good luck getting past turn 2 in time. That FNP would make it time eating as hell. I wouldn't even need to deliberately to slowplay when you would have tons of 2-3 dice groups you need to roll for FNP.

True. Try the other suggestions then. Or just give every unit some sort of marking and not the mark on your army rooster. Or maybe put colors on them that don't match any clan markings, so they can count as whatever you need. For my pox walkers I have packs of 10 painted in one color, so if I need a unit of 2x20, I just combine green and purple pox walkers in one and blue and grey pox walkers in another unit. If I need 3x 10 each unit has its own color.

You could also get 4x10 to have maximum amount of nobz.

That costs 2 PL more and you can't mob up more than 2 units together so you would have 2 tiny units and 1 medium only.

Yeah, but the only things you can get for those 2 PL are gretchin, two runtherds or a single big gun. Since you most likely can't mob them up anyways, there is little lost. Really depends on how much PKs cost and what their stats are though.

Generally other armies have PL limit for deep strike(or some other limit) to cut off biggest stuff. GW might not want deep striking stompa after all...

20PL is still very odd since the single units it excludes aren't powerful at all (especially not compared to a Gorkanaut). They could just have excluded titanic and gargantuan models if they wanted the stompa and big squiggoth out.
Also note no army has a PL limit for deep strike, daemons just pay more CP if they reach a certain PL threshold. All of them limit their stratagems by the number of units they allow to bring.

 Jidmah wrote:
Or maybe put colors on them that don't match any clan markings, so they can count as whatever you need.

That's what they basically are but the issue comes that grot unit A is pretty much identical looking to grot unit B. Fine if they all use same klan but as I need multiple klans just to fill battallions that results in identical models sharing different rules. That's big no-go. Have had huge headaches due to opponent doing that and that was with 2 models. We are talking about 100+ easily...

Seems like it's either base edge(if movement trays don't put an end to that idea) or simply play them klanless. Only big help from my klans would be dethskulls so 1-2 unit from there. Goffs? Bohoo. Oh and that warboss thing but as generally either grots are totally elsewhere to orks or first grot, then boyz, then warboss they rarely have got that anyway. Only so many places 1-2 warboss can reach anyway.

For my pox walkers I have packs of 10 painted in one color, so if I need a unit of 2x20, I just combine green and purple pox walkers in one and blue and grey pox walkers in another unit. If I need 3x 10 each unit has its own color.

I have my grots in total random colours with total of 6 colours with 2-3 colours per grot in random places(pretty much literally. I take up colour and put in on random grots in random part. Then move in next colour etc. Sometimes have to pick up previous colour to fill in if I run up too many grots with too much unpainted area for the colour I use. Actually boyz have same system EXCEPT they have without fail clan colour prominantly somewhere. For boyz that's the first colour I put in on all models to ensure klan is obvious) so that doesn't really work. Not to mention exact composition changes often. Sometimes I have 3x30, sometimes 2x30 and 5x10, other times 1x30 and 7x10...

Yeah, but the only things you can get for those 2 PL are gretchin, two runtherds or a single big gun. Since you most likely can't mob them up anyways, there is little lost. Really depends on how much PKs cost and what their stats are though.

Well mobup isn't only thing that has to be. Mob of gretching around there to come between boyz and enemies that could come to flank could be useful. Or have grots go completely different direction say grab some unguarded objective...Well assuming strategem doesn't have some special limitation like every model within X" from certain point. Hard to say when we don't know 100% wording

20PL is still very odd since the single units it excludes aren't powerful at all (especially not compared to a Gorkanaut). They could just have excluded titanic and gargantuan models if they wanted the stompa and big squiggoth out.
Also note no army has a PL limit for deep strike, daemons just pay more CP if they reach a certain PL threshold. All of them limit their stratagems by the number of units they allow to bring.

Good point about daemons but other things it could limit are multiple deff dreads(22PL). Well we'll see. Could very well be just total PL but I don't count my eggs before they hatch. Rumours are not always all that accurate. Just ask any knight player how they felt about the shrine unit when rumours about that started to float and how they felt when FULL rules were revealed Even if initial rumours don't exactly lie they might have let out some crucial detail off. The initial rumours about shrine was 100% accurate. They just left out couple details out which meant what looked like "groovy" turned out into unit opponent is happy to give you for free on the off chance you are silly enough to use it...

Edit: tried out movement trays. Painting edge of base is not an option. It sinks into movement tray so well edge not visible. Painting edge of movement tray meanwhile does work. I just need to buy pile of them...

if you cant keep track of which models have which rules, none of them get them.

If you want to keep track you can add a mark to their bases and have a cheatsheet next to the table.

If you ABSOLUTELY dont want to marr a black run of plastic :eyeroll: then you can get a pack of elastic hair bands at the dollar store in different colors and lay one across your models neck.

Complaining that the color you arbitrarily chose in the past now invalidates something when the rules make no such implication is silly. You paid for the codex in whole, not for the parts that happen to match your favorite color.

My orks bases are colored red, green blue white and yellow. I also have checks on the trukks in similar colors so that I can deploy and keep squads seperated easy; it takes NOTHING away from the aesthetic

 davou wrote:
If you ABSOLUTELY dont want to marr a black run of plastic :eyeroll:

Ah yes how nice of you eye rolling when there's even practical reason why I can't that I wrote. IT WOULDN'T HELP AT ALL!

I paint that black edge in different colour. Nice. I put model into movement tray. Suddenly that colour isn't even visible.

Nice job.

Ah well. Good thing dakkadakka has ignore feature.

One of the easiest ways would be to build some banner Gretchin for each clan you plan to use.
Just stick it it the middle of each mob so they have a clear allegiance and both players can easily keep track.

Looks cool as well. You could even do the same for boys.
For example you could have a bad moons warlord that has a few evil sunz boys in his army. While they are painted yellow they have a evil suns banner to show where they came from.

wondering fo telling grot units apart on "borrowing" some on the many unused Goblin standards and associated goblins I have.

Normally they are all going to be Blood Axes, as thats how they are painted, and frankly dey is da best, but is some skullduggery is called for a few standard bearers in the units should make clan allegiance pretty hard to dispute - especially since while the grots match the colours of the boys, none carry the insignia

 davou wrote:
if you cant keep track of which models have which rules, none of them get them.

If you want to keep track you can add a mark to their bases and have a cheatsheet next to the table.

If you ABSOLUTELY dont want to marr a black run of plastic :eyeroll: then you can get a pack of elastic hair bands at the dollar store in different colors and lay one across your models neck.

Complaining that the color you arbitrarily chose in the past now invalidates something when the rules make no such implication is silly. You paid for the codex in whole, not for the parts that happen to match your favorite color.

My orks bases are colored red, green blue white and yellow. I also have checks on the trukks in similar colors so that I can deploy and keep squads seperated easy; it takes NOTHING away from the aesthetic

While tneva is almost famous for complaining for little to no reason, this one is a real problem he is trying to solve - having multiple units of gretchin that might be used to represent different clan's gretchins in different games. No need to attack him for that.

There are plenty of ways to solve the problem though, if you refuse all of them you should at the very least put down your need to complain.

People calm down we only know part of the codex.
No point crying how Goffs suck or badmoons are useless or whatever we still don’t know what are the stratagems or relics...or special characters....
All of which makes playing certain clans over others.

Wait, people are surprised most sub-factions are bad? Are you new to 8th ed? D:

how do other armies handle this issue? maybe ask them and they can give you reasonable solutions. i highly doubt every salamnder player went and repainted their army blue or whatever.

maybe this issue is not that big of an issue for the community (admittedly i dont have much experience with it, ive haven't gotten as many games in for 8th as i would've liked) and in a casual environment i haven't heard any real problems from other local gamers, also i think most tournaments will have clear rules on it.

at most, if you really want you can do some simple solutions that many have already stated. another one could be using a magnetized looted bit (like those abundant shell casing piles painted in clan colors) or banners for bases (have it on the nobz base if its a large squad, just remember who all is in the squad).

if the model does not have a base then work to do the magnetized painted banner on a noticeable spot on the figure.

as an alternative for going "really" expensive but your too lazy to repaint then add LED lighting that can change colors.
expensive=yes
diffcult to do=yes
is it flash=ALL DA ZOGGIN FLASH!!!!

There are two solutions done by Space Marines:
1) Just play the chapter you have painted, even if its not the most powerful one
2) Count your chapter as whatever you want

The issue really only arises when you want two models flying the same colors to represent two different klans, outside of highly competitive gaming this can easily be circumvented by just not playing more than one clan.

If you are aiming to win tournaments, painting proper klan colors should be a small effort compared to switching out large parts of your army when the meta changes. Most of my orks only have their shoulderpads, helmets or pants in clan colors, those are quickly repainted and washed.

IMO you simply have to decide whether you want to have your cake or whether you want to eat it.
Either you properly paint your models so they can be distinguished, your simply play your entire army as one klan, no matter how (or if) they are painted.

geargutz wrote:
how do other armies handle this issue? maybe ask them and they can give you reasonable solutions. i highly doubt every salamnder player went and repainted their army blue or whatever.

maybe this issue is not that big of an issue for the community (admittedly i dont have much experience with it, ive haven't gotten as many games in for 8th as i would've liked) and in a casual environment i haven't heard any real problems from other local gamers, also i think most tournaments will have clear rules on it.

at most, if you really want you can do some simple solutions that many have already stated. another one could be using a magnetized looted bit (like those abundant shell casing piles painted in clan colors) or banners for bases (have it on the nobz base if its a large squad, just remember who all is in the squad).

if the model does not have a base then work to do the magnetized painted banner on a noticeable spot on the figure.

as an alternative for going "really" expensive but your too lazy to repaint then add LED lighting that can change colors.
expensive=yes
diffcult to do=yes
is it flash=ALL DA ZOGGIN FLASH!!!!

I think there is a matter of how much effort you have put into your army.
If your orks are only painted to the minimum tournament standard it is pretty easy to slob on some new paint here and there or just paint the edge of the bases. If you have an army that is fairly well painted then this issue just became a big problem.

Why would you want, say Boyz, from different clans anyway? I'm sure there's one cookie cutter Klan trait that is best for Boyz in all situations then just state that all your Boyz are Klan X, no matter how they are painted. Then have the rest of your army with different Klan traits if there's a better one suited for them (like Bad Moons is good for KMK etc).