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When playing this many Letters, Skarbrand provides two unique benefits.

1. +1 attack to all models. That's pretty huge already.

2. If he actually makes his charge from deepstrike, you can give a penalty to the opponent for trying to fall back, potentially hiding at least a couple of your letter bombs for a turn from shooting.

I like that list, but sadly I do not own any tzangors.
It’s not that I like Skarbrand or Magnus, they are there with all the letters so my opponent have to choose their targets.

Removed Magnus and added Ahriman and two princes instead for more smiting power.

So T2 my opponent will have to try to kill 3x20 letters, Skarbrand or Tsons smiters hiding behind what’s left of pink horrors.
Hopefully I can try this list tomorrow and proxy 30letters and come back for an update.

this is why play Magnus is a no sense, you deep strike your heavy hitters turn 2 so why gift ir opponent with an obvious target turn 1? Magnus works fine in lists where you play some more big guys, Mortarion and/or Ik's i tested a list with Magnus 2 renegade with double gatling and a Dominus and worked pretty fine, but was made to play ij ETC format.

Hey All

I need your help deciding between the two list below. Trying to go for a competitive but not so aggressive list with a bit of durability with some shoot. Any and all comments welcome.

LIST1

Chaos Tzeentch Battalion

Changecaster-Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate
FluxMaster - Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Chaos Nurgle Battalion

DP of Nurgle (WL) - Hellforged Sword, Curruption, WL trait- Virulent Touch Wings

DP of Nurgle - Wings, 2 Claws

Nurglings
Nurglings
Nurglings


1Sons Spear Head- +1 Relic (DP)

DP of Tzeentch - Wings, DMC, Hellforged Sword
Diabolical Str., Warptime

Oblits
Oblits
Oblits


LIST 2

Chaos Tzeentch Battalion

Changecaster-Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate
FluxMaster - Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Pink Horrors 23
Icon

Chaos Nurgle Battalion

DP of Nurgle (WL) - Hellforged Sword, Curruption, WL trait- Virulent Touch Wings

DP of Nurgle - Wings, 2 Claws

Nurglings
Nurglings
Nurglings

1Sons Vanguard +1 Relic (DP)

DP of Tzeentch - Wings, Helm of Many Eyes, Hellforged Sword, Diabolical Str., Warptime

Hellbrute - Lascannon, Missile Launcher
Hellbrute - Lascannon, Missile Launcher
Hellbrute - Lascannon, Missile Launcher

Hellforged Rapier Battery x2
Quad Bolter

I am considering the idea of dropping one unit of Pinkies for 2 blues and use the extra points to invest in another unit. tell me your thoughts

sure better the 1st, but why same pyschic powers on changecaster/fluxmaster?

 blackmage wrote:
sure better the 1st, but why same pyschic powers on changecaster/fluxmaster?

My reason behind using the same spell is two things. These are the best spells for this type of hero since they are more of a supporting role and 2nd in case I do not get flickering fire off with one, i can have the other do so. Thanks for the feedback.

No you can’t.

Once you try to cast a power, except smite, no one else can cast it.

 JNAProductions wrote:
No you can’t.

Once you try to cast a power, except smite, no one else can cast it.

Ahh, noted.

i also suggest you to max the pink horrors size (30) and play like 3rd troop the brimstones

 blackmage wrote:
i also suggest you to max the pink horrors size (30) and play like 3rd troop the brimstones

Ok, so if i were to try and max out horrors, how would i go about it? Drop the 3rd unit and up the other two?

play 2x30 pinks and 10 brims

 blackmage wrote:
play 2x30 pinks and 10 brims

Chaos Tzeentch Battalion

Changecaster-Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate
FluxMaster - Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Brimstone Horrors 10


Chaos Nurgle Battalion

DP of Nurgle (WL) - Hellforged Sword, Curruption, WL trait- Virulent Touch Wings

DP of Nurgle - Wings, 2 Claws

Nurglings
Nurglings
Nurglings


1Sons Spear Head- +1 Relic (DP)

DP of Tzeentch - Wings, DMC, Hellforged Sword
Diabolical Str., Warptime

Oblits
Oblits
Oblits

OK, so if i make that change to bump up two of the pinkies to 30 man and bring in a squad of brims, im left with 51 pts. Where should i invest it?

Units of ten Brinstones... why not put a single Blue in there?

if i were you i would play a thing like this


more solid in my opinion, you have 14 cp's, ds 60 horrors+changecaster with flickering flames and 9 oblys, the rest move over obejactives, Pb's at -2 to be hit are very durable they can tarpit anything if you want more offensive oriented pb's play a scrivener instead of poxbringer, but in that list i would prefer a poxbringer, Slaanesh Dp deliver 8 attacks at str 8 and he got 9 wounds, you have a decent psychic phase, with that spearhead you get slaanesh stratagem to let oblys shot twice. A better setup would be 30 pink and 30 letters 2nd turn you drop 30 pink and 30 letters trying to cripple your opponent and then 3rd turn you drop oblys and finish the job.

 lindsay40k wrote:
Units of ten Brinstones... why not put a single Blue in there?

Because the moment that Blue dies, you lose that 5++ invuln. You CAN run a blue for that initial attack, but honestly the only reason Brimstones are used is for their wounds, not their saves or toughness. They just squat there and laugh as your opponent wastes a 65 point squad of marines killing a 30 point unit of chaff. They are the ultimate example of abusing the wounding mechanic this edition, since wounds don't carry over.

blue is used to cast smite so brims wont die , matter nothing about CaC and also when/if dies matter nothing again.

 blackmage wrote:
blue is used to cast smite so brims wont die , matter nothing about CaC and also when/if dies matter nothing again.

They roll a single die to do smite. Id rather not waste my smite roll on something so bad at it.

ok as you prefer and think

Has there been a discussion about the burning chariot? On paper it looks awesome especially adding the irritating horrors to -1 against enemy psychic test that target units within the bubble. Plus in comeback that chariot can hit back w/ 6 str6 ap 3 hits. I think I may try them out, been having alot more success with tzeentch lately. Thoughts?!?!?

It's like a cheap daemon prince but:

1. Very threatening at range so your opponent will prioritize them earlier

2. Much easier to kill since no character protection, T5, and it's a gigantic model

Its abilities aren't awful if it stays alive long enough to make its points back. But it's a rather easy target for your opponent. A T5 8W body flying around blasting 3 S9 shots every turn? For your opponent, shooting it is a no brainer and it's not even particularly hard to kill.

I think it works ok if you manage to exploit its speed and keep it out of LOS until you get within melee range. Then you unload flames and charge, hopefully killing some of your opponent's expensive elite units. Otherwise it will probably die to medium strength shooting T1.

The reason why daemon princes and obliterators and bloodletters are considered strong is because there are effective ways to prevent them from dying before they unload all their damage and hopefully make most or all of their points back on the initial strike. With burning chariots their best defense is using speed to stay out of LOS. Unlike a DP's character protection, that's not a guaranteed thing because it relies heavily on terrain and deployment. So most likely they will be decent in some games and useless in others.

 barboggo wrote:
It's like a cheap daemon prince but:

1. Very threatening at range so your opponent will prioritize them earlier

2. Much easier to kill since no character protection, T5, and it's a gigantic model

Its abilities aren't awful if it stays alive long enough to make its points back. But it's a rather easy target for your opponent. A T5 8W body flying around blasting 3 S9 shots every turn? For your opponent, shooting it is a no brainer and it's not even particularly hard to kill.

I think it works ok if you manage to exploit its speed and keep it out of LOS until you get within melee range. Then you unload flames and charge, hopefully killing some of your opponent's expensive elite units. Otherwise it will probably die to medium strength shooting T1.

The reason why daemon princes and obliterators and bloodletters are considered strong is because there are effective ways to prevent them from dying before they unload all their damage and hopefully make most or all of their points back on the initial strike. With burning chariots their best defense is using speed to stay out of LOS. Unlike a DP's character protection, that's not a guaranteed thing because it relies heavily on terrain and deployment. So most likely they will be decent in some games and useless in others.

I can agree with you as far as yes, by itself its big but as part of an army that has daemon princes, i think this is a perfect screen for them. Not only will it take the attention off the DP but it can threaten w/ both shooting and combat (2 phases), which to me, should be worth a try out. I am also banking on the fact that because its not a heavily used model people will not see its full potential right away. I do believe running this guy with a 1k Son DP, will allow it to re-roll 1's when shooting the DP aura say 1k sons as well as tzeentch daemons.

What do you guys think of this list? It's basically a bunch of multi-purpose daemon bodies surrounding Ahriman and his pet Leviathan at the center with 18CP. The plaguebearers/cultists start on the board screening the leviathan while the 40x pinks drop T2 to clear screens and finally the bloodletters drop T3 to clean up.

Does the list has enough bodies to prevent the leviathan from getting charged? After pre-game stratagems it should have 13CP to warp surge, Khorne doublefight, etc throughout the course of the battle.

TS Battalion
1x Ahriman, Glamour of Tzeentch, Weaver of Fates, Prescience
1x TS DP, Wings/Talons, High Magister, DMC, Warptime, Death Hex
1x Hellforged Leviathan, 2x Butcher Cannon
3 x 10 Cultists

Nurgle Battalion
1x DP, Wings/Talons, Miasma of Pestilence
1x Poxbringer, Virulent Blessing
30x Plaguebearers
2 x 3 Nurglings

Daemons Battalion
1x Changecaster, Gaze of Fate, Flickering Flames
1x Changecaster, Bolt of Change, Flickering Flames
30x Bloodletters, Banner/Instrument
2 x 20 Pink Horrors




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Blueguy203 wrote:

 barboggo wrote:
.

I can agree with you as far as yes, by itself its big but as part of an army that has daemon princes, i think this is a perfect screen for them. Not only will it take the attention off the DP but it can threaten w/ both shooting and combat (2 phases), which to me, should be worth a try out. I am also banking on the fact that because its not a heavily used model people will not see its full potential right away. I do believe running this guy with a 1k Son DP, will allow it to re-roll 1's when shooting the DP aura say 1k sons as well as tzeentch daemons.

A good screen should be durable and cheap. Burning chariots are neither. They have too much dakka for how vulnerable they are and that means if used purely as a screen it will be difficult for them to make their points back. In order to get value out of burning chariots you MUST make it into CC. Otherwise you're better off running exalted flamers without the chariot for comparable mobility and equivalent shooting. Exalted flamers aren't great either btw as 3x S9 shots usually aren't enough to make a difference considering that the unit is almost 100 pts.

An example of a fast, mobile screening unit that fills the role you're proposing is an Eldar wave serpent. 13W, T7, 3+ sv, -1 to all damage, -1 to hit if Alaitoc, another -1 to hit with Lightning Fast Reflexes, 9x S6 rending shots at 24", and 16" move... all for 10 pts more than a chariot.

I'm taking a Khorne supreme command with my Alpha Legion at my next FLGS competition with Skarbrand, Karanak, and a winged prince with sword.

My CSM only has a Heldrake for Daemon synergy. Warlord is CSM.

Should I consider the Crimson Crown for the prince to tag along Skarbrand? I'm concerned the prince will outpace Skarbrand, and/or Skarbrand will get shot off the board before making it into combat.

Skarbrand keeps my cultists fearless, but with only 9CP I'm not sure if I want to keep him in the warp or field him to give that fearless aura.

Alternatively, what about the Armor of Scorn, or the King of Blades? 4++ would be nice but I already have 4 DTW. The -4 AP on the sword looks great as the meta here is an armor parking lot (there won't be any knights to warrant skullreaver).

I could save 1 CP and take nothing but I think the benefits the relic gives the prince are pretty tasty.

Blueguy203 wrote:

 blackmage wrote:
play 2x30 pinks and 10 brims

Chaos Tzeentch Battalion

Changecaster-Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate
FluxMaster - Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Brimstone Horrors 10


Chaos Nurgle Battalion

DP of Nurgle (WL) - Hellforged Sword, Curruption, WL trait- Virulent Touch Wings

DP of Nurgle - Wings, 2 Claws

Nurglings
Nurglings
Nurglings


1Sons Spear Head- +1 Relic (DP)

DP of Tzeentch - Wings, DMC, Hellforged Sword
Diabolical Str., Warptime

Oblits
Oblits
Oblits

OK, so if i make that change to bump up two of the pinkies to 30 man and bring in a squad of brims, im left with 51 pts. Where should i invest it?

You might consider saving them for reserves to split the pinks into blues when a group would otherwise drop below 20.

On a relevant side note: 1kSons sadly can't take Obliterators.

Cradle.of.chaos wrote:

Blueguy203 wrote:

 blackmage wrote:
play 2x30 pinks and 10 brims

Chaos Tzeentch Battalion

Changecaster-Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate
FluxMaster - Flickering Fyre, Gaze of Fate

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Pink Horrors 30
Icon

Brimstone Horrors 10


Chaos Nurgle Battalion

DP of Nurgle (WL) - Hellforged Sword, Curruption, WL trait- Virulent Touch Wings

DP of Nurgle - Wings, 2 Claws

Nurglings
Nurglings
Nurglings


1Sons Spear Head- +1 Relic (DP)

DP of Tzeentch - Wings, DMC, Hellforged Sword
Diabolical Str., Warptime

Oblits
Oblits
Oblits

OK, so if i make that change to bump up two of the pinkies to 30 man and bring in a squad of brims, im left with 51 pts. Where should i invest it?

You might consider saving them for reserves to split the pinks into blues when a group would otherwise drop below 20.

On a relevant side note: 1kSons sadly can't take Obliterators.

Yeah, i changed it to an CSM Iron warrior detachment which ended up working out better but i had to lose the DP to do so. The list worked out well, i was surprise as to how much trouble 25 pinks gave people. My new list i am working with will bring in 3 units of 25 but with no icon. Never felt like i needed it plus the pinks were going to die by mass shooting so it wouldnt of helped much.

Blueguy203 wrote:
i was surprise as to how much trouble 25 pinks gave people. My new list i am working with will bring in 3 units of 25 but with no icon. Never felt like i needed it plus the pinks were going to die by mass shooting so it wouldnt of helped much.

I have found this nearly every time I play them. Pinks are just scary to lots of folks. When I drop in my 30-man blob, and I say that I get 90 shots wounding vehicles on 4s or infantry on 3s, people get pretty antsy.

The last game I played I used my Horde II list, which has 30 Pinks (Fire Bomb), 30 Plaguebearers (Virus Bomb), and 30 Bloodletters (Letter Bomb). At the end of the game, I had like 5 bloodletters left, roughly 15 plaguebearers, and every. single. Pink.

Pinks have been good for several editions now. I remember back in 5e (or 6e?) when I had my Pink Star: 20 Pinks with two Tzeralds that were actually, literally unkillable with a 2++ rerolling 1s, that did something like 4d6 ignores armor wounds.

Dactylartha wrote:
I'm taking a Khorne supreme command with my Alpha Legion at my next FLGS competition with Skarbrand, Karanak, and a winged prince with sword.

My CSM only has a Heldrake for Daemon synergy. Warlord is CSM.

Should I consider the Crimson Crown for the prince to tag along Skarbrand? I'm concerned the prince will outpace Skarbrand, and/or Skarbrand will get shot off the board before making it into combat.

Skarbrand keeps my cultists fearless, but with only 9CP I'm not sure if I want to keep him in the warp or field him to give that fearless aura.

Alternatively, what about the Armor of Scorn, or the King of Blades? 4++ would be nice but I already have 4 DTW. The -4 AP on the sword looks great as the meta here is an armor parking lot (there won't be any knights to warrant skullreaver).

I could save 1 CP and take nothing but I think the benefits the relic gives the prince are pretty tasty.

Take axe and run Skullreaver. Deletes Knights real good.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

Dactylartha wrote:
I'm taking a Khorne supreme command with my Alpha Legion at my next FLGS competition with Skarbrand, Karanak, and a winged prince with sword.

My CSM only has a Heldrake for Daemon synergy. Warlord is CSM.

Should I consider the Crimson Crown for the prince to tag along Skarbrand? I'm concerned the prince will outpace Skarbrand, and/or Skarbrand will get shot off the board before making it into combat.

Skarbrand keeps my cultists fearless, but with only 9CP I'm not sure if I want to keep him in the warp or field him to give that fearless aura.

Alternatively, what about the Armor of Scorn, or the King of Blades? 4++ would be nice but I already have 4 DTW. The -4 AP on the sword looks great as the meta here is an armor parking lot (there won't be any knights to warrant skullreaver).

I could save 1 CP and take nothing but I think the benefits the relic gives the prince are pretty tasty.

Take axe and run Skullreaver. Deletes Knights real good.

I won't be playing against any knights, otherwise I would (and my list would be way different).

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

Blueguy203 wrote:
i was surprise as to how much trouble 25 pinks gave people. My new list i am working with will bring in 3 units of 25 but with no icon. Never felt like i needed it plus the pinks were going to die by mass shooting so it wouldnt of helped much.

I have found this nearly every time I play them. Pinks are just scary to lots of folks. When I drop in my 30-man blob, and I say that I get 90 shots wounding vehicles on 4s or infantry on 3s, people get pretty antsy.

The last game I played I used my Horde II list, which has 30 Pinks (Fire Bomb), 30 Plaguebearers (Virus Bomb), and 30 Bloodletters (Letter Bomb). At the end of the game, I had like 5 bloodletters left, roughly 15 plaguebearers, and every. single. Pink.

Pinks have been good for several editions now. I remember back in 5e (or 6e?) when I had my Pink Star: 20 Pinks with two Tzeralds that were actually, literally unkillable with a 2++ rerolling 1s, that did something like 4d6 ignores armor wounds.

Just a quickie, what does the rest of the list look like? I imagine that fills most of it up.

 Vomikron Noxis wrote:

Spoiler:

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

Blueguy203 wrote:
i was surprise as to how much trouble 25 pinks gave people. My new list i am working with will bring in 3 units of 25 but with no icon. Never felt like i needed it plus the pinks were going to die by mass shooting so it wouldnt of helped much.

I have found this nearly every time I play them. Pinks are just scary to lots of folks. When I drop in my 30-man blob, and I say that I get 90 shots wounding vehicles on 4s or infantry on 3s, people get pretty antsy.

The last game I played I used my Horde II list, which has 30 Pinks (Fire Bomb), 30 Plaguebearers (Virus Bomb), and 30 Bloodletters (Letter Bomb). At the end of the game, I had like 5 bloodletters left, roughly 15 plaguebearers, and every. single. Pink.

Pinks have been good for several editions now. I remember back in 5e (or 6e?) when I had my Pink Star: 20 Pinks with two Tzeralds that were actually, literally unkillable with a 2++ rerolling 1s, that did something like 4d6 ignores armor wounds.

Just a quickie, what does the rest of the list look like? I imagine that fills most of it up.

Tzeentch Battalion
Ahriman on Disc
TSons Winged Prince (WL, 3++, Helm)
Changecaster
10x Brims
10x Brims
10x Brims
30x Pinks, Icon
Reinforcements: 77pts for Splits

Khorne Battalion
Winged Prince, Skullreaver
Skullmaster, Crown
10x Bloods
10x Bloods
30x Bloods, Icon, Instrument, Banner Upgrade

Nurgle Battalion
Poxbringer
Scrivener
3x Nurglings
3x Nurglings
3x Nurglings
30x Plaguebearers, Icon, Instrument

CPs start with 18, -5 for Deep Strike, -4 for relics = 9 to start with regen

LOTS of bodies, zero targets for anti-tank weaponry. I used to have an unkillable LoC at the middle of a Daemon Prince gang bang...but when the FAQ made him literally HALF as survivable (went from a 2++ to a 3++), I gave into the salt and don't want to use him. So I'm trying something else. (Arioch, Thelek’a’arnab, did a really good job, too. I'm sad he's banished to the Warp for now.)

PBs start on the field, with the Fire Bomb and Letter Bomb in reserve. PBs protect characters. Khorne moves up one side of the field, PBs hang in middle. T2 Pinks and Letters drop in and do work. Hopefully the small letter squads and nurglings have cleared an opening for the Letter Bomb.


I have several alternate ideas, but the core Triple Bomb is the same. The other two are: mix the Nurgle and Tzeentch Daemons, have a SC of TSons (Ahriman + 2 DPs); or replace some Brims and reinforcements with a Skull Cannon.
I think the single Skull Cannon is a bad idea, since it is less survivable than the reinforcement splits and since it also will be the single anti-tank fire magnet on the table.
But I like DPs, so more is better.

Daemon Battalion
Changecaster
Poxbringer
Scrivener
3x Nurglings
3x Nurglings
30x Plaguebearers, Icon, Instrument
10x Brims
30x Pinks, Icon

Khorne Battalion
Winged Prince, Skullreaver, WL (Legandary Fighter)
Skullmaster, Crown
10x Bloods
10x Bloods
30x Bloods, Icon, Instrument, Banner Upgrade

TSons Supreme Command
Ahriman on Disc
TSons Winged Prince, Helm
TSons Winged Prince

CPs start with 14, -5 for Deep Strike, -3 for relics = 6 to start with regen