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ArmchairArbiter wrote:

 Weazel wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:

 Aetare wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:


I'd have to double check the Wulfen Hunt curse but if it adds the extra inches into charging I'd trade the 515 points for Skyclaws, Wulfen and a Drop Pod.
Headstrong? Who gives a damn, you'll be charging the nearest enemy unit anyway.
Low BS? Your opponent is going to take anything you kill off the front lines so you have to charge further anyway.

The sheet I have says the Hunt table lets you re-roll the charge, not add inches. Which is EXTRA good when you add in the idea of CP allowing you to reroll any dice for a phase or whatever. However it's a 6" range unless you're Blood Claws, which are 12". Sadly it seems Skyclaws no longer have the 12" benefit.

It seems odd they would not include other variations of 'young' Space wolves like the Skyclaws or Swiftclaws....

I believe this is because of the Skyclaws being able to deep strike now so accurately. So just a little balancing tweak.

¨

Might want to recheck keywords for Skyclaws and Swiftclaws. They are Blood Claws for the purposes of Wulfen rules.

E: Lukas's aura also affects Skyclaws and Swiftclaws while we are at it.

Oh wow... I did not notice that!! That's awesome!! Thank you! I need to pay better attention to these key words. I just assumed it was the unit of blood claws haha.

Lukas is something I really want to make use of, only problem is he's still so slow.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Murderfang lost a lot of his fire when they canned the Dread in a Pod delivery system.

However he is a Character with less than 10 wounds so you can take something like Blood Claws or Wulfen to act as a screen.

How do we feel about Thunder hammers on TWC? I have all my pack leaders with thunder hammers but I am thinking of ripping their arms off for axes or swords. They only get 3 attacks now.. with the -1 to hit, I'd rather make sure I'm hitting with an axe more (that will likely hit on a 3 the same as a TH on a TWC) for 10 less points. Even with the hammers being damage 3. Also thinking, since frost swords are so cheap, just putting frost swords on the TWC instead of chain swords.

After reviewing my list I'm thinking of dropping a lot of the storm shields as well. I normally had SS on every TWC but... 15 pts per model now. Maybe I'll just put them on a few main axe/TH guys. You can give them ALL plasma pistols for just 7 points a pop now! So a Frost sword + plasma pistol costs the 1 point less than a single storm shield on them.

Decisions...
'
I'm having the same internal discussion for my terminators running around with arjac. However the storm shields are only 5 points instead of 15! So that makes the storm shield worth it... the debate is still over the axe or thunder hammer! I really do not like that -1 to hit. But I suppose it would be useful against multi-wound targets.

ArmchairArbiter wrote:
How do we feel about Thunder hammers on TWC? I have all my pack leaders with thunder hammers but I am thinking of ripping their arms off for axes or swords. They only get 3 attacks now.. with the -1 to hit, I'd rather make sure I'm hitting with an axe more (that will likely hit on a 3 the same as a TH on a TWC) for 10 less points. Even with the hammers being damage 3. Also thinking, since frost swords are so cheap, just putting frost swords on the TWC instead of chain swords.

After reviewing my list I'm thinking of dropping a lot of the storm shields as well. I normally had SS on every TWC but... 15 pts per model now. Maybe I'll just put them on a few main axe/TH guys. You can give them ALL plasma pistols for just 7 points a pop now! So a Frost sword + plasma pistol costs the 1 point less than a single storm shield on them.

Decisions...

I think they are still viable, just not an auto-take now. They are still S8 wounding most everything on a 2+/3+ and inflicting 3 wounds, Toss in a Wolf Lord, Wolf Priest (On a Bike) and the -1 to hit will not mater as much.

 Anpu42 wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:
How do we feel about Thunder hammers on TWC? I have all my pack leaders with thunder hammers but I am thinking of ripping their arms off for axes or swords. They only get 3 attacks now.. with the -1 to hit, I'd rather make sure I'm hitting with an axe more (that will likely hit on a 3 the same as a TH on a TWC) for 10 less points. Even with the hammers being damage 3. Also thinking, since frost swords are so cheap, just putting frost swords on the TWC instead of chain swords.

After reviewing my list I'm thinking of dropping a lot of the storm shields as well. I normally had SS on every TWC but... 15 pts per model now. Maybe I'll just put them on a few main axe/TH guys. You can give them ALL plasma pistols for just 7 points a pop now! So a Frost sword + plasma pistol costs the 1 point less than a single storm shield on them.

Decisions...

I think they are still viable, just not an auto-take now. They are still S8 wounding most everything on a 2+/3+ and inflicting 3 wounds, Toss in a Wolf Lord, Wolf Priest (On a Bike) and the -1 to hit will not mater as much.

Well since I run multiple dreads I have 2 Iron Priests on TWC running around. I feel like that's where my hammers are if I need them, especially since as you said they're not an autotake. How do you feel about the stormshields though? Especially since I intend to bring Wulfen as well. I'd put two thunder hammers with them. 15 points on the TWC for one is harsh... for termies it's only 5 points! I feel like I might get more bang for my buck with a plasma pistol on everyone.

ArmchairArbiter wrote:

 Anpu42 wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:
How do we feel about Thunder hammers on TWC? I have all my pack leaders with thunder hammers but I am thinking of ripping their arms off for axes or swords. They only get 3 attacks now.. with the -1 to hit, I'd rather make sure I'm hitting with an axe more (that will likely hit on a 3 the same as a TH on a TWC) for 10 less points. Even with the hammers being damage 3. Also thinking, since frost swords are so cheap, just putting frost swords on the TWC instead of chain swords.

After reviewing my list I'm thinking of dropping a lot of the storm shields as well. I normally had SS on every TWC but... 15 pts per model now. Maybe I'll just put them on a few main axe/TH guys. You can give them ALL plasma pistols for just 7 points a pop now! So a Frost sword + plasma pistol costs the 1 point less than a single storm shield on them.

Decisions...

I think they are still viable, just not an auto-take now. They are still S8 wounding most everything on a 2+/3+ and inflicting 3 wounds, Toss in a Wolf Lord, Wolf Priest (On a Bike) and the -1 to hit will not mater as much.

Well since I run multiple dreads I have 2 Iron Priests on TWC running around. I feel like that's where my hammers are if I need them, especially since as you said they're not an autotake. How do you feel about the stormshields though? Especially since I intend to bring Wulfen as well. I'd put two thunder hammers with them. 15 points on the TWC for one is harsh... for termies it's only 5 points! I feel like I might get more bang for my buck with a plasma pistol on everyone.

Currently I think they are good, but possibly something Thunderwolves need. They are big and Scary and have three Wounds. This will make them the target of Anti-Tank Weapons and most do horrible things to Armor saves. I would take at least half of them with Storm Shields, me personally I am sticking with one on each.

I think it depends on what role you want them to fill. If you're using them to hunt infantry then swords and axes are fine. If you want to hunt vehicles or monstrous creatures then hammers and maybe axes are the go to weapons imo.

I think storm shields are essential to protect against enemy shooting. 8th edition still favors shooting and a 3+ alone will not hold up.

What would you guys put into a 1850 point list to go against that "deathstar"

So which weapon for Bjorn? Good Old Assault Cannon seems alright but Lascannons are pretty awesome now. 2+ to hit with a reroll seems like two autohits and 2+/3+ to wound almost anything with D6 damage to boot... Thoughts?

heavy Plasmacannon for Bjorn because of his re-roll

Just decided to start a SW army after a 20 year hiatus from 40K. Did play some fantasy in between for a couple of years, but now friends startet a gaming group again, so here i am. Was no other choice for me than SW, since i look like one with beard and long hair.

I've spend a lot of time trying to create 2000 pts lists from the new rules. Especially since i'm looking to invest in an entire army - so i really want to be sure on what i want, and how it works.

These are the tactics i've come up with so far.

1) Dreadnought deathstar with iron priests shielding them. 3 dreads with blizzard shields.
Pros: unkillable, very strong offense, not too expensive.
Con: slow moving.
Use: Move forward and kill on contact.

2) Lone Wolves with frost sword and thundershield.
Pros: Cheapest elite choice (for CP). Very good defense (3+/3++/4+FNP).
Cons: Weak offensive power (3A at 1 dmg).
Use: Keeps expensive enemy models busy.

3) Termicide. We have the rare opportunity to kit every Wolf Guard TDA with combi-weapons.
Pros: Dmg output. Terminators.
Con: Expensive. Low mobility after deep strike (if kitted with low range meltas).
Use: Deep strike for one-turn kill of tanks, characters, heavy weapon units (basically: kill whatever can kill the termies before they get to).

4) Wolf Guard TDA with storm shield in GH/BC/LF units.
Pros: Great defensive boost, since you get to allocate wounds to a 2+/3++ model with 2 wounds. Good all around melee model.
Cons: Cost, less mobility for the unit.
Use: Stick them in blood claw units in transports. Embark, shoot, charge and let the WGBL soak up the wounds.

I'm unsure about the Stormfang and the Stormwolf. They are very strong and a huge benefit for the mobility of the army - but they might be too weak defensivly to hold up.

 kodos wrote:
What would you guys put into a 1850 point list to go against that "deathstar"

Spoiler:

5x CSM daemon prince
Belakor
Changeling
12x 8 Brimestone + 2 Blue Horrors
6 exalted Flamers

the 100 Horrors are "swarming" around the other Princes so you can't shoot them and blocking charges

Ouch... My initial opinion is lots of flamers. Are horrors immune to morale? Their save is already bad so a volume of fire/wounds would be go to. Bloodclaws in numbers to "match" the horrors maybe and some elite/monster hunters like Wulfen could do the job. Alternatively if you want to shoot... Space Wolf scouts with sniper rifles = you can target the characters. Our scouts are awesome too. Just my initial thoughts.

 Weazel wrote:
So which weapon for Bjorn? Good Old Assault Cannon seems alright but Lascannons are pretty awesome now. 2+ to hit with a reroll seems like two autohits and 2+/3+ to wound almost anything with D6 damage to boot... Thoughts?

If you want to put a Lascannon on Bjorn just use the hellfrost cannon instead. Same thing basically with more options. And it looks cool!

 Anpu42 wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:

 Anpu42 wrote:

ArmchairArbiter wrote:
How do we feel about Thunder hammers on TWC? I have all my pack leaders with thunder hammers but I am thinking of ripping their arms off for axes or swords. They only get 3 attacks now.. with the -1 to hit, I'd rather make sure I'm hitting with an axe more (that will likely hit on a 3 the same as a TH on a TWC) for 10 less points. Even with the hammers being damage 3. Also thinking, since frost swords are so cheap, just putting frost swords on the TWC instead of chain swords.

After reviewing my list I'm thinking of dropping a lot of the storm shields as well. I normally had SS on every TWC but... 15 pts per model now. Maybe I'll just put them on a few main axe/TH guys. You can give them ALL plasma pistols for just 7 points a pop now! So a Frost sword + plasma pistol costs the 1 point less than a single storm shield on them.

Decisions...

I think they are still viable, just not an auto-take now. They are still S8 wounding most everything on a 2+/3+ and inflicting 3 wounds, Toss in a Wolf Lord, Wolf Priest (On a Bike) and the -1 to hit will not mater as much.

Well since I run multiple dreads I have 2 Iron Priests on TWC running around. I feel like that's where my hammers are if I need them, especially since as you said they're not an autotake. How do you feel about the stormshields though? Especially since I intend to bring Wulfen as well. I'd put two thunder hammers with them. 15 points on the TWC for one is harsh... for termies it's only 5 points! I feel like I might get more bang for my buck with a plasma pistol on everyone.

Currently I think they are good, but possibly something Thunderwolves need. They are big and Scary and have three Wounds. This will make them the target of Anti-Tank Weapons and most do horrible things to Armor saves. I would take at least half of them with Storm Shields, me personally I am sticking with one on each.

My TWC have always been a majority Storm Shield thing.
3x TWC means two Storm Shields and one model with a pair of Wolf Claws, the Wolf Claws have lost a lot of their bite with the reduction of TWCs base power but they're still extra attacks at higher strength and ap, meaning they can potentially cut wounds off anything. Pack Leader gets a pair of claws and he's swinging eight s5 attacks, five with higher ap, three with a bit lower - nasty.

 kodos wrote:
What would you guys put into a 1850 point list to go against that "deathstar"

Isn't the counter for any spam list MSU with twin AssCan razorbacks?

So I made another list just trying to think of how else I'd like to play my Space Wolves. My initial list was very rush and melee based so I was trying to strike a better balance. I believe I've found it but... let's see what you all think! Battlescribe, though it took some digging, is functional for a number of armies in 8th now. Made it much easier to toy around with lists!


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) ++

+ HQ +

Arjac Rockfist: Foehammer
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear

Wolf Guard Battle Leader: Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Frost axe, Jump Packs
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear

+ Troops +

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

+ Elites +

Venerable Dreadnought
. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

Venerable Dreadnought
. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader in Terminator Armour: Frost sword, Storm shield

+ Fast Attack +

Skyclaws
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack

Skyclaws
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack

+ Heavy Support +

Land Raider Crusader: Hunter-killer missile, 2x Hurricane bolter, Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Predator: Twin lascannon
. Two Lascannons: 2x Lascannon

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

++ Total: [113 PL, 2000pts] ++

++ Selection Rules ++

. And They Shall Know No Fear: You can re-roll failed Morale tests for this unit.

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Very nice - looks like it can pump out a lot of different types of damage.

Ulfhednar_42 wrote:

 kodos wrote:
What would you guys put into a 1850 point list to go against that "deathstar"

Isn't the counter for any spam list MSU with twin AssCan razorbacks?

I hoped someone has a better idea than fight spam with spam
however, invest a 100-150 Points to kill of 25 Points is not the best but I guess AC and Heavy Flamer spam ist best we have in a SW list.

I don't know, for Bjorn feels like the Plasma Cannon and Helfrost are kinda mediocre. Against hordes the Assault Cannon feels superior and against tough targets the Twin Lascannon feels superior. Need to playtest a few options then.

 Weazel wrote:
I don't know, for Bjorn feels like the Plasma Cannon and Helfrost are kinda mediocre. Against hordes the Assault Cannon feels superior and against tough targets the Twin Lascannon feels superior. Need to playtest a few options then.

Oh right it's a twin lascannon now.... that does make a difference! Always forgetting little things like that. :(

the twin Laser and Plasma cannon do the same average damage
with the Laser having advantage on range and against single models while the Plasma is better against units and cheaper in points.

ArmchairArbiter wrote:
So I made another list just trying to think of how else I'd like to play my Space Wolves. My initial list was very rush and melee based so I was trying to strike a better balance. I believe I've found it but... let's see what you all think! Battlescribe, though it took some digging, is functional for a number of armies in 8th now. Made it much easier to toy around with lists!


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) ++

+ HQ +

Arjac Rockfist: Foehammer
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear

Wolf Guard Battle Leader: Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Frost axe, Jump Packs
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear

+ Troops +

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

Grey Hunters
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter: Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Boltgun, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Meltagun

+ Elites +

Venerable Dreadnought
. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

Venerable Dreadnought
. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Frost axe, Storm shield
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader in Terminator Armour: Frost sword, Storm shield

+ Fast Attack +

Skyclaws
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack

Skyclaws
. Rules: And They Shall Know No Fear
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack
. Skyclaw Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Frag & Krak grenades, Jump Pack

+ Heavy Support +

Land Raider Crusader: Hunter-killer missile, 2x Hurricane bolter, Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Predator: Twin lascannon
. Two Lascannons: 2x Lascannon

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

Razorback: Twin heavy bolter

++ Total: [113 PL, 2000pts] ++

++ Selection Rules ++

. And They Shall Know No Fear: You can re-roll failed Morale tests for this unit.

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

This list looks pretty good. I'd suggest adding a power sword or axe to your sky claws for a little more cc punch but it's not a necessity. I'd be careful of having the skyclaws kited away too since they'll have to charge the closest unit without a wolf guard in the pack.

Am I missing how much the wolf guard pack leader costs for units like grey hunters? I wanted to get a frost sword in the unit but the grey hunter pack leader can only take a power sword and I don't need him to have terminator armor if it's a good bit cheaper.

Just to let all of you know I am taking inspiration from this thread for my First Impressions Thread...btw today in Bjorn.

 lessthanjeff wrote:
Am I missing how much the wolf guard pack leader costs for units like grey hunters? I wanted to get a frost sword in the unit but the grey hunter pack leader can only take a power sword and I don't need him to have terminator armor if it's a good bit cheaper.

WG PL cost the same as a normal Model of the unit

So Long Fangs. I have 10 guys with Missile Launchers so it would be so very convenient to run 5+5 Fangs. However for the same points I could get Lascannons which are strictly better against T8+ (and arguably better against any toughness because of better AP) and for a few points less I could get Plasma Cannons which seem to be better than Frag Missiles against anything with a decent save really.

So should I stick with the utility of Missile Launchers or specialize and go 5 Plasma Cannons and 5 Lascannons instead? Or even 5 Lascannons and 5 Heavy Bolters?

 Weazel wrote:
So Long Fangs. I have 10 guys with Missile Launchers so it would be so very convenient to run 5+5 Fangs. However for the same points I could get Lascannons which are strictly better against T8+ (and arguably better against any toughness because of better AP) and for a few points less I could get Plasma Cannons which seem to be better than Frag Missiles against anything with a decent save really.

So should I stick with the utility of Missile Launchers or specialize and go 5 Plasma Cannons and 5 Lascannons instead? Or even 5 Lascannons and 5 Heavy Bolters?

Like all units, it depends on what role you want them to fill and what the rest of your army consists of. Missile launchers are good all around weapons that can take on light to medium vehicles and hordes. Lascannons are better for going after super heavies and monstrous creatures. Plasma cannons are also good for big game hunting, especially using long fangs with the built in re roll. Heavy bolters are also great for taking out light vehicles and troops.

Ragnar69 wrote:

 lessthanjeff wrote:
Am I missing how much the wolf guard pack leader costs for units like grey hunters? I wanted to get a frost sword in the unit but the grey hunter pack leader can only take a power sword and I don't need him to have terminator armor if it's a good bit cheaper.

WG PL cost the same as a normal Model of the unit

How sure are you about that? I'm not talking about the Grey Hunter Pack Leader for the squad, I'm talking about the Wolf Guard Pack Leader which is an optional second character you can add to the unit. He has an additional Power Level cost that is more than what you pay for each other model in the unit.

I was guessing he was going to be the cost of a regular Wolf Guard model since the Wolf Guard Pack Leader in Terminator Armor is the same as the regular members of a wolf guard unit in terminator armor.

Wolf Guard Pack Leaders have no points for now
we are also missing the points for Ragnars wolves and Wolf Guard Terminator Pack Leaders are missing the Terminator keyword

I would go with the Wolf Guard points for now

PL in TDA have a cost Listed. PA Not, just like SM vet sergeants.
They cost extra power because they are additional Models contrary to vet sergeants.

the SM Sergeant is the equivalent of the standard Pack Leader (there is no veteran sergeant upgrade for vanilla marines)
yes, a Blood Claw Pack Leader cost the same points as a normal Blood Claw

the problem with Wolfguard Pack Leader is:
if they cost like regular models of the unit and have not their own entry, they also have the same keywords as the unit
which makes no sense that a Wolf Guard Pack Leader has the Bloodclaw keyword instead of Wolfguard (and would not count as WG for the BC forst assault special rule)

if they count as Wolfguard and have the Wolfguard keyword from the WG entry, you cannot use the Bloodclaw points as WG have their own.