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McGibs wrote: Or charge them through LoS terrain, or charge something nearby and consolidate into them. There's a lot of ways to get around deadly overwatch.
Smart opponents will do this. My friend killed my whole Raven guard gunline with 2 broodlords by moving them to and from cover in and out of assault. He was pissed after I wiped everything else he had from the table and switched up tactics which gave him the win.
This sounds like it must have been an amazing game to have witnessed lol.
McGibs wrote: Or charge them through LoS terrain, or charge something nearby and consolidate into them. There's a lot of ways to get around deadly overwatch.
Smart opponents will do this. My friend killed my whole Raven guard gunline with 2 broodlords by moving them to and from cover in and out of assault. He was pissed after I wiped everything else he had from the table and switched up tactics which gave him the win.
This sounds like it must have been an amazing game to have witnessed lol.
It was epic. He started with tons of stealers, 3 broodlords, and 3 venomthropes. My agressors and sternguard killed all except the two brood lords. Broodlords and stealers are incredibly fast especially with certain strategems.
Here is my new kill everything deathwatch list. It's my latest variation of units I've had massive success with.
Please don't Copy Paste directly from Battlescribe. It looks messy, is lazy, and creates a lot of redundancy as I don't need every Aggressor's weapon listed individually.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
Im going with a Scythes of the Emperor force using Deathwatch rules, fluff wise im saying my guys are 1st company and have a fair few vets from the fall of Sotha and Giants coffin etc plus a couple who have been deployed with the DW due to the Scythes tactics of hunting down nids in search of goodies.
Looking at a non optimised list but also want it to not be completely obliterated when it takes the field. So using the models i have i was thinking of something like this.
1K list to start off with...
Watch captain bare bones
Primaris Librarian
Intercessors x 6
Intercessors x 6
Vets x 7
Missile launcher
Ven Dread
lascannon and ML
inceptors x 3
Hellblasters x 5
its just over 1k the plan would be for the main body of troops to plod forward and fire at the enemy infantry using the buffs from the captain and librarian.
The dread and hellblasters sit slightly further back sit on objectives and use their heavy firepower to take on big targets and vehicles. The inceptors buzz around and pump shots into whatever they fancy.
Any good or total garbage?? I could drop inceptors for something else but not sure what else to get.
At 1 k I have found the bodies and bullets you have the better. Epescially since we have special issue ammo. I'd use a watch master and attach the hellblasters to a unit of intercessors to act as ablative wounds and keep them alive longer. Also vets with stormbolters are amazing I'd ditch the missle launcher for a frag cannon if able. It's an assault weapon that is a badass flamer at 8" , a autocannon at 24" and a lascannon at 12". Very versatile. See my list a couple posts up. If you can get agressors then absolutely do!
Rogerio134134 wrote: Im going with a Scythes of the Emperor force using Deathwatch rules, fluff wise im saying my guys are 1st company and have a fair few vets from the fall of Sotha and Giants coffin etc plus a couple who have been deployed with the DW due to the Scythes tactics of hunting down nids in search of goodies.
Looking at a non optimised list but also want it to not be completely obliterated when it takes the field. So using the models i have i was thinking of something like this.
1K list to start off with...
Watch captain bare bones
Primaris Librarian
Intercessors x 6
Intercessors x 6
Vets x 7
Missile launcher
Ven Dread
lascannon and ML
inceptors x 3
Hellblasters x 5
its just over 1k the plan would be for the main body of troops to plod forward and fire at the enemy infantry using the buffs from the captain and librarian.
The dread and hellblasters sit slightly further back sit on objectives and use their heavy firepower to take on big targets and vehicles. The inceptors buzz around and pump shots into whatever they fancy.
Any good or total garbage?? I could drop inceptors for something else but not sure what else to get.
I'd make sure to give your captain at least a power sword and storm bolter. It's going to let him do something with his statline.
Give the libby a stormbolter as well so he can make pew pew noises and maybe even kill something.
If you take veterans make sure to give them transport or deepstrike them. Also make sure to chuck in at least two stormshields for 3++.
If you are taking veterans at all stormbolters and frag cannons are the way to go.
Mix the hellblasters into your intercessor squads. Fewer drops and they can move up to be more likely to get into rapid fire range.
Be prepared to lose the dread because it will eat all the anti tank firepower. Maybe axe it in favor of another intercessor/hellblaster squad.
Thanks for the advice guys, I'm trying to not go crazy with the mixed units as I'm trying to go fluffy with a semi competitive element I want to find the balance.
One other question about the black Star model, do you have to have the huge inquisitorial symbol on the back? I think it looks a bit crappy and wouldn't fit in with my theme.
Rogerio134134 wrote: Thanks for the advice guys, I'm trying to not go crazy with the mixed units as I'm trying to go fluffy with a semi competitive element I want to find the balance.
One other question about the black Star model, do you have to have the huge inquisitorial symbol on the back? I think it looks a bit crappy and wouldn't fit in with my theme.
Ultimately you'll only learn what works by playing some games. Meta is different in other areas. If you want to play fluffy type list that's cool. However killteams are meant to be mixed not just single unit types like vanilla marines.
Based on my personal experience with many games since the codex dropped I disagree. I see the intercessors as valuable but for ablative wounds for my aggressors. I love my dreadnoughts and corvus but have found that they don't live long and don't even put out as much dakka as my infantry squads. The intercessors I are -1 AP and range is great but I like more shots for taking down... anything really.
Martel732 wrote: I just feel that aggressors and hellblasters and such are still far too expensive for 2W models.
To each their own. My aggressors have done the heavy lifting most games. In my Raven guard as well. Just sooooo many shots. I'll take them almost every game except with my space wolves.
It does help to have the intercessors in front, but I'm playing vs a lot of dissy cannons very frequently. The teleportarium helps, but even then, they only get to shoot once. Doesn't seem worth it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/14 15:13:16
Disintegrator cannons? Dark eldar? Take away their advantage by using regular vet squads then with storm shields. 3++ on a 1 w model. They would be wasting shots on regular vet squads. By killing your intercessors they are getting more bang for their buck. Also play on boards with an appropriate amount of cover and line of sight blocking terrain.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/14 16:44:10
I'm not suggesting you list tailor. It seemed from your post that you encounter lots of dark eldar. .How is a vet more vulnerable? Vets and intercessors are both T4. Intercessors have 2w but vets can take a SS for a 3+ invul. Judging by your post count you've been around awhile. Do you have any vanilla marines you can paint black and silver? If so than diversify and use some regular vets and put the primaris in reserve.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/14 17:22:44
Anyone use Reivers? Look like a good choice to take down vulrable units in the back field, fancy a unit of 6 with grav chutes and heavy pistols coming down and firing hellfire rounds into the enemy then charging using shock grenades to finish them off.
Rogerio134134 wrote: Anyone use Reivers? Look like a good choice to take down vulrable units in the back field, fancy a unit of 6 with grav chutes and heavy pistols coming down and firing hellfire rounds into the enemy then charging using shock grenades to finish them off.
Personally I think they're garbage. They gross levels of expensive and pitiful damage for their points. With chutes they are 25 points a model which is just stupid for the pitiful amount of damage they do (21 if you take melee and they're still bad at that). Even if you do deepstrike them in they 9 inches away so good luck charging anything and their grenade is only 6 inches so you can't even use it on the turn they come in. Also have fun coming in turn two and beyond. For 25 less points you can get an intercessor troop choice who have better guns, can shield more valuable models, and are on the board turn one. You can also pay a CP to deepstrike the intercessor squad. Reiver's are just plain bad and I largely blame the fact that you have to pay an outrageous four points for their gun and always one point for their pistol. It went from 0 to 4! It's the same thing as a storm bolter (which is 4points for deathwatch), but half the rate of fire within rapid fire. IMO all pistols should still be free and their guns should be 1 point up from what it was like the other standard options. Reivers could have been a very solid unit, but nope. We get trash.
DW Reivers have to go knife loadout to avoid the nasty tax on their bolters. So if you're looking for a unit to threaten backfield low-armour units, then go ahead. There aren't many of those worth threatening, however. I can think of worse ways to spend 105pts but DW have so many excellent troops options, and teleportarium, so reivers are just a poor choice most of the time. I can see an argument for dropping a single reiver in a bare-bones intercessor squad.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/15 09:58:06
grouchoben wrote: DW Reivers have to go knife loadout to avoid the nasty tax on their bolters. So if you're looking for a unit to threaten backfield low-armour units, then go ahead. There aren't many of those worth threatening, however. I can think of worse ways to spend 105pts but DW have so many excellent troops options, and teleportarium, so reivers are just a poor choice most of the time. I can see an argument for dropping a single reiver in a bare-bones intercessor squad.
Just for gits and shiggles, I started to actually think about worse ways to spend 105 points. There aren't really that many. Any type of Chaplain. Maybe the Primaris Watch Captain?
They're really quite expensive for what they bring, sadly.
If I had reivers to test out in a list I wouldn't put grav chutes on them I'd give them grapnel launchers instead. This way I could bring them in on top of or behind a building if needed and then they could move or charge without being overwatched and ignore terrain for there movement. Could be useful. And My FLGS does not use the Beta rules. So I could DS firs turn if I want.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/15 11:46:26
If you want to drop a 105pt infiltration unit in a backfield turn one, for me it would be a 5-man vet squad, all packing stormbolters and chainswords, with one stormshield. Dropping into cover, dishing out 20 SIA shots, and hitting the same amount in CC if it comes to it, with a 3++ invuln, and obsec, and contributing towards a batallion. Downside: 1cp & 1W instead of 2W.
But 20 SIA shots is a non-trivial attack; with no rerolls, auras or mission tactics, that's 4.4 damage against reivers, for example. It's not really close for me.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Or spend 6pts more for 3 Aggressors dropping in with their 29 bolters shots, doubling to 58 next turn if left unmolested. I don't think Reivers can compete with either option.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/07/15 12:12:41
Based on another poster's idea I tried my two Reiver squads with a teleporting chaplain dread. They do threaten much more when swinging with S5 attacks. Still not competitive by any stretch of the imagination, but they were fun to play at least.
Reivers being a close combat unit with a relatively low amount of non-AP attacks just puts them in a weird place in general. They’re reasonabnly tough but they aren’t actually good at killing any sort of unit. If they had 4 attacks each maybe they could do something, but 15 S4 AP0 attacks just doesn’t cut it. They function best with the carbines normally but that makes them quite expensive as Deathwatch.
Aggressors on the other hand I absolutely love. They have a clear role, clearing away hordes of infantry, and they are devastatingly efficient at doing that. Just park a Watch Master nearby and let them do their thing.
Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 16k+ 
4k 
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