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Point values on vehicles specifically are going to change significantly going into 9th (alongside everything else that's getting re-pointed). What theyre at in 8th is not a guidepost I would lean on.

Gee Dubs strikes again. Want to use the anti-Greenskin strat? Congrats, now you have to pay a CP to even be able to pay the CP for it!

fething idiocy.

Sterling191 wrote:
Gee Dubs strikes again. Want to use the anti-Greenskin strat? Congrats, now you have to pay a CP to even be able to pay the CP for it!

fething idiocy.

Since they said on the stream that the Tau strat would not require to first pay for overwatch, I assume the same is true for our strats as well.

 ChargerIIC wrote:


Since they said on the stream that the Tau strat would not require to first pay for overwatch, I assume the same is true for our strats as well.

Assuming that GW is willing or capable of writing competent or functional Deathwatch abilities is an exercise in futility. Theyve spent two years screwing over our ruleset and Im not going to expect them to do otherwise until they demonstrate a modicum of higher brain function.

Sterling191 wrote:
Gee Dubs strikes again. Want to use the anti-Greenskin strat? Congrats, now you have to pay a CP to even be able to pay the CP for it!

fething idiocy.

We know there is going to be a day-1 FAQ for every army. I suspect every single strat and ability that deals with Overwatch will be looked at and many of them overhauled significantly. We may even see things like Stem the Green Tide change how ti works completely. Maybe it'll now affect Ork morale in some way? We haven't seen any details on the new morale rules yet so it's hard to say for sure. What we do know is things will be updated.

Sterling191 wrote:

 ChargerIIC wrote:


Since they said on the stream that the Tau strat would not require to first pay for overwatch, I assume the same is true for our strats as well.

Assuming that GW is willing or capable of writing competent or functional Deathwatch abilities is an exercise in futility. Theyve spent two years screwing over our ruleset and Im not going to expect them to do otherwise until they demonstrate a modicum of higher brain function.

Now we are diving in conspiracy theory territory. If any theory you hold centers around the idea of the company having a personal grudge against a portion of its customer base, its not going to hold much water.

 ChargerIIC wrote:

Now we are diving in conspiracy theory territory. If any theory you hold centers around the idea of the company having a personal grudge against a portion of its customer base, its not going to hold much water.

Bad rules writing doesnt require GW to hate a faction. It only requires apathy, which they have consistently demonstrated across 8th.

I just want the damn Corvus to be able to carry Primaris. That and Land Raiders.

Lemondish wrote:
I just want the damn Corvus to be able to carry Primaris. That and Land Raiders.

This. I was so hopeful when 9th got announced, but the fact that tthey will be using 8th datasheets for most things is disapointing. Probably going to get a primaris Corvus model three years from now with a 20% point cost premium.

Vortenger wrote:
Truly, but that may change after they re-point all the FW vehicles. My bet would be that everything goes up except the Astreus.

Leviathan needs a huge increase, especially since it can shoot into CC now.

What do think about Eradicators? We should be able to get the new stuff. They could be solution to our problem with antitank

The unit looks solid as-is, but I suspect they are going to reshuffle our Fortis teams. Where they shuffle eradicators, outriders, and bladeguard vets in will play heavily into our kill team composition. I'm also rooting for reviers getting shuffled over into a phobos kill team, but that's wish-listing.

Bratr wrote:
What do think about Eradicators? We should be able to get the new stuff. They could be solution to our problem with antitank

Having to rely on an idiotically overpowered unit to solve one of our primary weaknesses is not something I look forward to.

I'm not a big fan of the lack of melee weapons. Unlike Aggressors, Eradicators don't seem to have the ability to defend themselves while still being very close range units. Putting them into a Fortis team would be problematic as their ability to double-shoot is tied to the unit shooting at a single target.

Of course, if they allow the entire unit to double-shoot then I'm still sold!

bmsattler wrote:
I'm not a big fan of the lack of melee weapons. Unlike Aggressors, Eradicators don't seem to have the ability to defend themselves while still being very close range units. Putting them into a Fortis team would be problematic as their ability to double-shoot is tied to the unit shooting at a single target.

Of course, if they allow the entire unit to double-shoot then I'm still sold!

There is zero chance of a unit-wide double tap. You want Aggressors that can fire four times? Storm Bolter Plasma? Assault Cannon SIA?

Three Eliminators in a Fortis team with two Aggressors and five Intercessors arent going to worry for a moment about getting bogged down in melee..

I suspect every DW player will need 9 Eradicators. They play into our infantry-only lists very well too...

Well given that they very likely just put a bullet in the head of the Veteran-based kill team if the stormshield rumors and accompanying points changes are accurate, we're going to need everything we can get.

If you run Salamander Eradicators they get +1 to wound.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
If you run Salamander Eradicators they get +1 to wound.

Im genuinely at a loss as to what you're speaking to here, given that the Salamanders superdoctrine precludes the use of Deathwatch in the same army.

Not saying DW, just saying a detachment of Salamanders get +1 to wound. not entirely out of the realm of possibility to soup these guys with the max potential for silliness.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Not saying DW, just saying a detachment of Salamanders get +1 to wound. not entirely out of the realm of possibility to soup these guys with the max potential for silliness.

The +1 to wound for Salamanders requires only Salamander units in the entire army to retain their superdoctrine. If you soup, you lose it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Attack allocation rules have changed. Once a model in a unit has an attack allocated to it, it has to continue taking all remaining attacks in a phase until it either dies or saves them all.

Our mixed squads are even more fethed.

Also, we can access +1 to wound with a strat for 2cp, while still using the mission and watchmaster buffs, so I think souping in sallies isn't really worth it...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yeah just chatting about that allocation rule with a mate. It's bad news for us and custodes for sure...

 grouchoben wrote:

Yeah just chatting about that allocation rule with a mate. It's bad news for us and custodes for sure...

It hurts a bunch of armies. Tau and SW rely on it, as does any unit that uses survivable ablative wounds.

Im genuinely struggling to conceive of what Vets can bring to the table now, especially with the possibility of losing the Fall Back + Shoot/Charge (the bike + VanVet slingshot charge is already dead thanks to the new Coherency rule).

So where can I read this, because Terminators or anything with lots of attacks or high price melee is going to hurt? If I understand this it's by unit to unit? IE a Unit of Custodes guard (3x spears) gets 6 attacks, against a unit of boyz. First hit kills a boy, and other attacks are allocated in line? Now it's per model? So the other 5 attacks after the first are wasted? How did shooting survive this rule? It makes way more sense that a burst of bolter fire hits one model and then is over than my custodes kill a gretchen then proceed to pile in and beat it's corpse into paste.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So where can I read this, because Terminators or anything with lots of attacks or high price melee is going to hurt? If I understand this it's by unit to unit? IE a Unit of Custodes guard (3x spears) gets 6 attacks, against a unit of boyz. First hit kills a boy, and other attacks are allocated in line? Now it's per model? So the other 5 attacks after the first are wasted? How did shooting survive this rule? It makes way more sense that a burst of bolter fire hits one model and then is over than my custodes kill a gretchen then proceed to pile in and beat it's corpse into paste.

No. This has nothing to do with outgoing fire. It's about the fact that in 8th, Deathwatch relied on the capacity to shunt wounds to various models in a unit based on which kinds of attacks each model was best suited to defend against. High AP shots went to storm shields, low AP shots went to terminators.

In 9th, that kind of thing isnt possible. Once a model in a unit has an attack allocated against them, all subsequent attacks in the phase aimed at the unit are resolved against that model.

Simply put, between losing the capacity to selectively save attacks, and shields functioning radically differently, Veteran squads are going to look a lot different. If they see the table at all.

The specific details are in the 9th edition rules making the rounds.

So have peeps seen the new stormshield rules that came out with the new units? 4++ and 1+ to armour saves. Think this will change up how deathwatch squads will be taken?

Obviously points will matter but it gels as well as can be hoped with the allocation changes. It makes any vet with shield as strong against small arms and AT as possible.

Given that the Frag Cannon seems to get the new Blast special rule despite being an auto-hit weapon, do you guys think it will be viable to use again (assuming the points for the weapon don't change)?

Think it is decent, but unless it gets a points drop you won’t see it.

Just too expensive what it does, and it doesn’t get the overwatch benefits anymore either.

Well As the new storm shield Is +1 to save and 4+ invul Do se still need terminators in vet squads?

Also have aby one spoted point cost fór storm shield?