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If you want to knock out two birds with one stone, ForgeWorld has that Tartaros hand set that has 5 combi bolter right hand and 5 power axe left hands. You'd have to get left terminator arms from the deathwing kit or something though, but the combi bolters easily pass as stormbolters.

Also, the Breacher shields make for sweet storm shields for vets that are holding a stormbolters + shield. Just stick one of the larger Inquisition icons from the upgrade sprue on the shield and paint some scrawl that resembles the litany xenomortis on it.

So the deathwatch bikers look very solid now. For 27 points you get a veteran biker statline with a free chainsword. 27 points nets you a twin bolter with special issue ammunition on a zippy fast biker model with T5, 2 wounds 3+ and 3 attacks. Also if you want to splurge you can buy them power weapons as well. I think these fellas are the real stars here. They can be pretty decent fighters versus certain targets depending on their loadout and can provide pretty solid shooting especially in the 12-15 inch rage which they can very likely can into considering their movement of 14 inches.

They were already solid, just slightly overpriced. They're worth it for their SIA bikes alone, but 2 power weapon attacks is pretty good. 155pts for 5 w/ power swords is nice. I just wish GW still sold the kit, but I've found that they're still readily available from resellers for even more savings.

How are Vanguard Vets? Did they see a slight point drop too?

Lemondish wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:

 SputnikDX wrote:

Mr. Funktastic wrote:

Spoiler:

 SputnikDX wrote:

 McGibs wrote:
Terminators are also a good source of stormbolters. Just need to replace the terminator sized glove. I like the space wolf ones, they're fancier looking with drum mags.

Terminators in general seem like they're going to actually work for Deathwatch. Deep striking storm bolters with SIA and 2+/5++ alongside maybe two cyclone missiles and a heavy flamer to keep chargers back. Since you can deep strike it'll be somewhat easy to keep them away from any guns that could pose a real threat to them, and even if you lose a few to an immense volley of fire it's not like they won't do some damage. Something really worth testing.

I also think Drop Pods might make a comeback for Deathwatch. Kill Team Veterans are the only unit marines will have that can really pack enough of a punch to convince players to bring 9+Captain and drop them into rapid fire range. 7 combi-plasmas - which can fire hellfire or kraken bolts - mixed with 2 frag cannons will absolutely obliterate everything they drop next to.

Don't forget that DW Termies can get Meltaguns attached to their Power Fists, unless the codex has changed that. I'm thinking a 5 man squad with 2 Termies with Storm Bolters, Power Fists with Meltaguns, 1 with a TH+SS to soak up high AP shots, 1 with a Storm Bolter, Power Fist with Meltagun, Cyclone Missile Launcher, and 1 with an Assault Cannon, Power Fist with Meltagun could do some damage. Deep strike with a Watch Captain for those sweet rerolls. Expensive, but a hell of a threat to any vehicle you want off the board.

Not sure about drop pods, but with the Beacon Angelis you can give it to a Watch Master, deep strike him with the Teleportarium stratagem, and then use the Beacon Angelis to move 10 Hellblasters within Rapid Fire range near him. I reckon that's quite a bit more firepower than a Kill Team

Or why not both? Drop Pod with Kill Team and Watch Master and Librarian. Teleportarium your Dreadnought. Beacon Angelis another squad. Buff your dreadnought. Start shooting.

Edit: I'm also seeing that their Terminators can replace all of their power fists with other power weapons. Ideally to save loads of points while still having a strong choice, I'd want power axes, but I have no idea how to get those for Terminators. Any ideas?

Chaos Terminators come with 5 axes in a box and not everyone uses them. They have a scary face embellishment at the top of the haft that can be sanded or filled in with greenstuff, other than that they're pretty generic.

Chaos Terminator Storm Bolter arms might actually be the simplest way to get Storm Bolter arms right now. Chop off the blade at the front and sand down the pointy symbols and you have something to work with.

While that works, I'll honestly going to just commit to the wrist mounted Grey Knight bolters because they look so bloody cool.

Aren't they going to be weird though because A) you need hands, and B) all but one are pointed as if they're holding a two handed weapon.

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
So the deathwatch bikers look very solid now. For 27 points you get a veteran biker statline with a free chainsword. 27 points nets you a twin bolter with special issue ammunition on a zippy fast biker model with T5, 2 wounds 3+ and 3 attacks. Also if you want to splurge you can buy them power weapons as well. I think these fellas are the real stars here. They can be pretty decent fighters versus certain targets depending on their loadout and can provide pretty solid shooting especially in the 12-15 inch rage which they can very likely can into considering their movement of 14 inches.

And the Sergeant can get a Storm Bolter, so that's even more SIA dakka. Yes I really do think the Bikers are looking mad strong. If Combat Squadding is allowed after the codex, you can take a 5 man of Veterans and get 4 bikes and a vanguard veteran. You'll slow the bikes down by a small tad, but you gain the ability to fall back and shoot, and the vanguard vet can supply some extra OOMF in melee if need be.

Can bikers go inside ruins and buildings?

 Primark G wrote:
Can bikers go inside ruins and buildings?

Yes, but only one level 1. And they don't gain cover like infantry.

That’s still pretty good.

Is there any info on whether terminator captains are still stuck with sword and stormbolter only?

changemod wrote:
Is there any info on whether terminator captains are still stuck with sword and stormbolter only?

No they get the expanded combi weapon list and the melee weapons.

Post 400 pg16 of this thread has a good breakdown video. about 52 minutes if you want points info I think.

KaoxVeed wrote:

changemod wrote:
Is there any info on whether terminator captains are still stuck with sword and stormbolter only?

No they get the expanded combi weapon list and the melee weapons.

Post 400 pg16 of this thread has a good breakdown video. about 52 minutes if you want points info I think.

Huh, does that include the melta fist? Because combi melta and melta fist at BS2+ sounds kinda attractive

changemod wrote:

KaoxVeed wrote:

changemod wrote:
Is there any info on whether terminator captains are still stuck with sword and stormbolter only?

No they get the expanded combi weapon list and the melee weapons.

Post 400 pg16 of this thread has a good breakdown video. about 52 minutes if you want points info I think.

Huh, does that include the melta fist? Because combi melta and melta fist at BS2+ sounds kinda attractive

Not sure, but it would be kind of funny to see it made using Shadowsun's guns.

So, with all this talk about Deathwatch Terminators, how would you kit out a squad?

As background, I have a DWO box + 1 vet squad that I've been running as allies with my Admech and Vostroyan Guard. At the present moment I have them built to be one shooty squad (with a Storm Shield+Bolter, 2 regular bolters, 2 Frag Cannons) and one stabby squad (HTH because it looks boss, Shotgun+Storm shield, Powerfist+shotgun, Powersword+Boltgun, Chainsword+Boltgun). They're mostly a fluffy force, as you can tell, as I was limited by the DWO models and what I could convert them successfully to be holding. The rest of the detachment is just my DWO librarian and Chaplain.

What I do have though is a few extra space marine models kicking around who could possibly be ripe for some conversion to flesh out the army, from way back in the day (15+ years ago now) when I had a few space wolfs. Mostly the old 5th ed mono-pose black reach dudes, but a couple addons.

I have:

-One standard dread kit (so he's got missile launcher/twin las build, which I would think would be good)

-One predator, which I could turn into a Razorback or Rhino conceivably

-One box of the newer SW terminators, five monopose AOBR termies, and the terminators from Space Hulk, plus the one salamander dude from DWO

-One box of standard SM bikers plus biker dude from DWO

-One box of old standard jump pack space marines, plus the 2 DWO vets.

-20-30 odd basic space marines with various gear.

Seems like I could probably strip and repurpose a lot of these guys to make a useful Deathwatch force, but what would you guys advise for kill team setups? I think it's possible that some of my...youthfully exuberant modeling decisions might be handy here, as I've got a whole lot of power armored models with crazy special weapons and storm shields, because storm shields were awesome and I had to use all of them.

I think there's one extra element that the Veterans have over the Intercessors. It's small, but there:
Every single one of them can get a Chainsword in addition to their primary weapon. This means each marine is spitting some hot damage from range while also having 3 attacks per model (4 for the sergeant).

I think only time will tell which one is preferred. Competitively I know we'll only see 1 spammed, but I still don't think Veterans are 100% outclassed.

Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Maybe a quad las contemptor?

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Mortis dreads, Mortis contemptor, stormeagle, Deimos relic pred, deredeo dread.

The Mortis dread with quad las is the cheapest option for both $$$ and points for solid reliable AT. If you really need T8 then use Seige dreads with a twin lascannon (ironclad body and hammer with a venerable dread lascannon arm)

 WindstormSCR wrote:

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Mortis dreads, Mortis contemptor, stormeagle, Deimos relic pred, deredeo dread.

The Mortis dread with quad las is the cheapest option for both $$$ and points for solid reliable AT. If you really need T8 then use Seige dreads with a twin lascannon (ironclad body and hammer with a venerable dread lascannon arm)

Wouldn't Razorbacks be a viable choice as well?

KaoxVeed wrote:

 WindstormSCR wrote:

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Mortis dreads, Mortis contemptor, stormeagle, Deimos relic pred, deredeo dread.

The Mortis dread with quad las is the cheapest option for both $$$ and points for solid reliable AT. If you really need T8 then use Seige dreads with a twin lascannon (ironclad body and hammer with a venerable dread lascannon arm)

Wouldn't Razorbacks be a viable choice as well?

Depends if you're using the transport capacity or not. A twin las razor is ~120 a quad las Mortis dread is ~175 and gets mission tactics

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Deep striking dual cyclonic meltas/grab bombard Leviathan Dreadnaughts, when you absolutely, positively have to kill every tank on the board, accept no substitutes


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok guys, new plan. Deep striking a chaplain dread and Leviathan at the same time followed by using the beacon angelus to summon a 10 man Primaris kill team (5 aggressors/5 intercessors) to his position as meatshields.

What would be the best load out for the chaplain dread? I'm thinking dual claws with HF to keep him cheapish.

As a non-deathwatch player, do you guys reckon this book will make a primaris foot list viable? Intercessors with a vastly better damage output and being able to tank for aggressors are two huge wins for me. I'm very tempted to try a bunch of units something along the lines of 5 intercessors, 1 aggressor and 1 hellblaster and just run them as line infantry

 DoomMouse wrote:
As a non-deathwatch player, do you guys reckon this book will make a primaris foot list viable? Intercessors with a vastly better damage output and being able to tank for aggressors are two huge wins for me. I'm very tempted to try a bunch of units something along the lines of 5 intercessors, 1 aggressor and 1 hellblaster and just run them as line infantry

I think they will be the best primaris force for sure. Being able to shield your valuable units is a big plus in addition to the fact that the intercessors are now both useful and worth killing. Will foot primaris be competitive? No I don't think so, but they will have gotten a solid power boost in this rather tame codex.

RogueApiary wrote:

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Deep striking dual cyclonic meltas/grab bombard Leviathan Dreadnaughts, when you absolutely, positively have to kill every tank on the board, accept no substitutes


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok guys, new plan. Deep striking a chaplain dread and Leviathan at the same time followed by using the beacon angelus to summon a 10 man Primaris kill team (5 aggressors/5 intercessors) to his position as meatshields.


What would be the best load out for the chaplain dread? I'm thinking dual claws with HF to keep him cheapish.

Why the full team? Combat squad out the aggressors, make it 2 flame storm/2 auto-bolt, then add a reiver for overwatch denial. Still an obsec troops unit and you don't waste the intercessors as wounds. Also your 'meatshield' aggro-bubble is now T5 majority.

Intercessors are used to tank wounds that otherwise would be going on your expensive Aggressors.

Don't have my rule books with me atm but doesn't the beacon require you to start the turn on the board? If so, the plan doesn't work anyway.

You could use a jump pack watch captain and just move + advance him into position though.

saint_red wrote:
Intercessors are used to tank wounds that otherwise would be going on your expensive Aggressors.

Don't have my rule books with me atm but doesn't the beacon require you to start the turn on the board? If so, the plan doesn't work anyway.

You could use a jump pack watch captain and just move + advance him into position though.

My understanding is the unit being beaconed needs to start on the board. IE you can't use a movement ability on a unit that came in from reserves. So the chaplain dread would come in, but the unit affected by the beacon was already in your deployment zone somewhere.

Also you got it right, the intercessors are absolutely there to soak the wounds. The mixed toughness works because at 50/50 the owner chooses. Therefore, everybody is T5 to the bitter end. In a perfect world, the enemy is unable to kill any/many aggressors and they will get to double shoot for standing still the following turn.

Thanks for all the replies on the dealing with t8 question.

I like the look of those fw dreads, but before I go and spend an arm and a leg on fw are there any decent other options which are non-fw?

It's not too obvious to me, I mean we have the regular dreads which could have a dual Las and missile launcher, or Las razor backs.

How do we crack multiple russes or knights without fw? (If there is an answer!)

mrtomski wrote:
Thanks for all the replies on the dealing with t8 question.

I like the look of those fw dreads, but before I go and spend an arm and a leg on fw are there any decent other options which are non-fw?

It's not too obvious to me, I mean we have the regular dreads which could have a dual Las and missile launcher, or Las razor backs.

How do we crack multiple russes or knights without fw? (If there is an answer!)

People might crucify me for this, but...heavy thunder hammers might not be total trash at the job? Pop one of the +1 wound strats and it's going to be wounding on 2s or 3s, rerolling 1s, and damage 6 on a 5+. Seems at least fun enough to toss a couple into a vanvet squad to handle a tank, and if you ever have them in range of a chaplain, they'll do serious work.

in the same vein if you don't want to use forgeworld what would be best dealing with tanks?

mrtomski wrote:
Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting a deathwatch army, really like the idea of small elite squads.

I can see that anti horde and meq and teq is nicely covered. But how do you deal with t7 and t8?

I'm thinking dreds will get blasted off the board? Do you guys run land raider etc to get Las cannons on the board?

Hellblasters spit some gross dakka if you do the math. They'll need a captain to keep them alive, and even then you can almost expect some to die, but 4 overcharged Hellblasters in rapid fire range with captain and reroll 1s to wound will do 10 wounds to T7 60% of the time and 8 wounds to T8 50% of the time. I would keep your Dreadnoughts around regardless, because you can't have too much dakka.

the_scotsman wrote:

mrtomski wrote:
Thanks for all the replies on the dealing with t8 question.

I like the look of those fw dreads, but before I go and spend an arm and a leg on fw are there any decent other options which are non-fw?

It's not too obvious to me, I mean we have the regular dreads which could have a dual Las and missile launcher, or Las razor backs.

How do we crack multiple russes or knights without fw? (If there is an answer!)

People might crucify me for this, but...heavy thunder hammers might not be total trash at the job? Pop one of the +1 wound strats and it's going to be wounding on 2s or 3s, rerolling 1s, and damage 6 on a 5+. Seems at least fun enough to toss a couple into a vanvet squad to handle a tank, and if you ever have them in range of a chaplain, they'll do serious work.

Oh damn, I didn't even think about doing 6 damage on a 5+. That's nutso. I still hope we get a points decrease because 30 points for a melee weapon makes me want to vomit.

It is rumored that we do not, and the hammer is unchanged in price at least. The only points decrease for a HTH is the 4-point body decrease on vets, sadly.

My big issue with the HTH has always been: Why does it not get the Onager Dunecrawler's 3 damage minimum? Why does a "heavy" thunder hammer not do at LEAST as much damage as a regular thunder hammer?