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Adeptus Sororitas Beta Codex. Some background including on the sub-factions.On a quick flip through looks like... maybe 10 or 12 pages of datasheets. Rules for 6 Orders. Character for each Order is drawn from their founding Saint.

Our Martyred Lady - Each time a unit is destroyed, gain a Faith Point.

Faith Points - Get base 3 plus one for 10 models, used to activate Acts of Faith. Inspiration from Stratagems. 6 different Acts, need to roll above the Act's Devotion Value on 1D6. Ways to modify the roll. SImulacrum Imperialis, Sister Dialogous give bonuses. Order of the Ebon Chalice get a +1. No move before the movement phase, now there's an Act to increase movement.

14 Stratagems. Expect to expand for the final Codex, this is a starting mix basically.

Ministorum Priests now split into two datasheets: Missionaries (HQ) and Preachers (basically like the AM Priest).

4 HQ choices

Penitent Engines, arco-flaggents, Death Cult Assassins do not get Acts of Faith

All 6 Orders have Convictions, Warlord Traits, relics.

Covers existing range (so no new units except in cases where they have a model they can make it for, like the Priests above).

 Frowbakk wrote:
Repressor - 91 points

So with 2 Storm Bolters and a Heavy Flamer (AKA Factory Specifications) it's 109 points.

Yes. It dropped the 3 points from the HF reduction. For 121pts I'm only running double HF here on out.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
pretre: Tell us more, you tease.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do you have the book in hand?

 deviantduck wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
pretre: Tell us more, you tease.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do you have the book in hand?

It was from the twitch stream with the rules writer.

 pretre wrote:
Our Martyred Lady - Each time a unit is destroyed, gain a Faith Point.

Faith Points - Get base 3 plus one for 10 models...

I had a feeling the "additional Faith Point per 10 Sororitas models" would be tacked on to some base number.

Martyred Lady doesn't look half bad at all, I'm liking the internal balance, which to choose... Well which 3 to choose, good thing I have all 6!

So, I never paid attention to this but...
Can I run a detachment of +1 to faith checks and then a different painted detachment of +1 Faith when they die?

Have a suicide detachment and a detachment that does all the work?

Still waiting with bated breath for the Argent Shroud rules...

 pretre wrote:
need to roll above the Act's Devotion Value on 1D6.

Equal or above from the warhammer community article.

 pretre wrote:
So, I never paid attention to this but...
Can I run a detachment of +1 to faith checks and then a different painted detachment of +1 Faith when they die?

Have a suicide detachment and a detachment that does all the work?

If the faith pool is universal and all orders share the same AoF keyword (like they do now) I don't see why this wouldn't work to game the system. Make the units you know that will die first be faith generating for the more durable ones. It's similar to the CP and gaming that.

A Legend for the dim like me:
Order = Chapter
Conviction = Chapter Tactic
Act of Faith = IG Orders
Stratagem = Stratagem
Oranges =/= Apples

A.T. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
need to roll above the Act's Devotion Value on 1D6.

Equal or above from the warhammer community article.

They printed equal or above, and in the same article they said greater than like a sentence above, and in the warhammer tv thing earlier today they said higher. So it may not be 5+, it may be 6+.

We're seeing mostly rules so far, and Sisters aren't part of the big points leak earlier today... anyone have a sense if there are major price overhauls coming with this update?

Edit: Also, I have a little under 130 Sisters infantry (pic in my P&M blog), but rarely field more that 2/3rds at 2000 points. So I'm guessing that depending on keywords, I'll be around 10 Faith Points, give or take.

Purifying Tempest wrote:

A.T. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
need to roll above the Act's Devotion Value on 1D6.

Equal or above from the warhammer community article.

They printed equal or above, and in the same article they said greater than like a sentence above, and in the warhammer tv thing earlier today they said higher. So it may not be 5+, it may be 6+.

Highly unlikely. Forcing you to roll a 6 baseline to get the ability means it would be utterly worthless without dedicated buffing units. At least with a 5+ you can hail mary it every once in a while. At 6 you're basically relegating it to 'only when dedicating the entire army to it will you actually get to use this ability.' Also, with Arcos and Deathcults not getting AoF, they certainly wouldn't waste the 6+ AoF on The Passion.

ERJAK wrote:

Purifying Tempest wrote:

A.T. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
need to roll above the Act's Devotion Value on 1D6.

Equal or above from the warhammer community article.

They printed equal or above, and in the same article they said greater than like a sentence above, and in the warhammer tv thing earlier today they said higher. So it may not be 5+, it may be 6+.

Highly unlikely. Forcing you to roll a 6 baseline to get the ability means it would be utterly worthless without dedicated buffing units. At least with a 5+ you can hail mary it every once in a while. At 6 you're basically relegating it to 'only when dedicating the entire army to it will you actually get to use this ability.' Also, with Arcos and Deathcults not getting AoF, they certainly wouldn't waste the 6+ AoF on The Passion.

Idk that anyone is wasting Faith points on The Passion...

ERJAK wrote:
Highly unlikely. Forcing you to roll a 6 baseline to get the ability means it would be utterly worthless

I refer you to both of the sisters other special abilities :p

But we'll see soon enough.

So the full leaks are out now.

The army is a fething joke. Sisters got worse across the board. Celestine is worse than a standard space marine captain with powerfist/jumppack/stormshield, the Gemini are elites that you wouldn't take with a gun to your head, the new AoFs are fething awful. The entire codex revolves around using the AoFs but there's no point because they don't fething DO anything. We got no meaningful point reduction and the points we DID save get eaten up by Simulacrum Imperialis. The stratagems are gak, none of the units that were bad before got fixed, the CTs are all dedicated to either AoFs which, again are bad, or things the army isn't very good at. And thanks to how specific, limited, and pointless the AoFs ARE you never need more than 5 or 6 faith points per game anyway.

We are weaker than we were in the index. 100%.

I don't know that anyone is wasting faith points on any of the Acts of Faith and it's possible Sisters are actually worse than they were in the index.

There's a video review out of CA2018 already, 25 minutes long. As far as the six AoF:

Hand of the Emperor is now +3" of movement, tests on a 4+
Divine Guidance is now +1 to-hit, tests on a 4+
Spirit of the Martyr is unchanged, tests on a 3+
Light of the Emperor is a 3+ auto-pass Morale
Aegis of the Emperor gives you a 4++ against Mortal Wounds from Psychic powers on a 3+. Used at the start of the Psychic Phase.
Each AoF can only be used once a turn

Celestine's WARLORD trait now gives a Faith Point each turn on a 4+
Her Geminae are now an Elites choice and a separate unit.
Celestine lost a wound but now costs 160
Celestine can now only stand up where she died.
On the plus side, Celestine doesn't break convictions.
The Martyrdom Stratagem is now d3 Faith points when any of your units dies, or a flat 3 if it was a character
Similacrums are a unit upgrade that give +1 to Act of Faith rolls for 10pts.
Exorcists received no change.

Martyred Lady gives you a Faith point whenever one of your units with this conviction is destroyed.
Argent Shroud gives you a Faith point on a 4+ any time an Argent Shroud unit completely destroys an enemy unit
Sacred Rose never loses more than one unit from Morale tests and Overwatches on a 5+
There seems to be no indication that Ministorum units (not just Missionaries, Preachers and Jacobus) don't break Convictions and Sororitas detachments.

Outside of Celestine and the game-wide drop in points on special weapons, there's no indication of points drops on anything.

Edit: Per this video, Exorcist went to d6 wounds.

Yeah, it's all looking pretty bad. I'm normally one that tries to wait till some practice games get in, but I'm having a hard time finding silver linings here.

Faith in particular is disturbingly bad. Not only will I likely be getting less powers off than in the index, the powers you do get off just aren't very good anyway.

With Faith not being very useful, there isn't a point to building your army to get as many points as you can, and probably not much point in taking the half of Orders that affect faith. So Sacred Rose might be the way to go?

If these rumors are true, then the viablity of the Beta Codex comes down to Strats and the strength and cost of individual units, because the Sororitas unique mechanics aren't going to be helping much.

It doesnt seem like the guy doing the YouTube video ever read the Index sisters section, doesn't seem to have any idea how Sisters played before CA. I appreciate the video, but the commentary is a bit oblivious.

All changes that i thought would be made, we all knew Celestine was going to change and so would AoF, Ynnari most likely will change soon too.

AoF should be more of a buff and plentiful, honestly sounds more fun to me.

My only question is, can AoF effect vehicles?

Also Exorcist being D6 compare to D3 is a good buff, if its still 135pts, not as good as a predator, but i'm assuming they will get some stratagem, or a Specialist detachment for them.

Acts of Faith are basically free strategems with a die roll for success, not sure why everyone is complaining about them.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Acts of Faith are basically free strategems with a die roll for success, not sure why everyone is complaining about them.

Because they are just as limited as stratagems, but as you mentioned have a die roll for success.
They could've just given us the faith effects as stratagems, and have our army special rule be "you get 6 starting CP instead of 3" or something and it would have been better.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Acts of Faith are basically free strategems with a die roll for success, not sure why everyone is complaining about them.

Because Acts of Faith were the only thing propping up Sisters in the index and keeping them from being really really bad. Now Acts of Faith are less reliable, and far less useful.

Well with the ability to gain +1 and re-rolls on them, being a MSU army, so Brigades are going to be very cheap and easy for a sob army, idk if it actually will be a problem.

Im more excited about playing 5-6 Aof for a couple turns in a row then using the few left appose to 3 a turn at the most.

Also with the stratagem thats a huge amount of aofs we could be doing.

Sacred Rose sounds fun if you like blobs of 20 sisters.

It might be a good idea to start a new thread for the post-codex discussion and let this one die. Easier for people to figure out where the currently relevant posts start.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Acts of Faith are basically free strategems with a die roll for success, not sure why everyone is complaining about them.

So Imperial Guard Orders should work the same way then????

So our Convictions only work on Infantry - FFS.

Amishprn86 wrote:Well with the ability to gain +1 and re-rolls on them, being a MSU army, so Brigades are going to be very cheap and easy for a sob army, idk if it actually will be a problem.

Im more excited about playing 5-6 Aof for a couple turns in a row then using the few left appose to 3 a turn at the most.

Also with the stratagem thats a huge amount of aofs we could be doing.

Each act of faith can only be played once per turn. So you would be hard pressed to use all of them in a turn (not impossible though but it will be way less flashy than some might think).

John Prins wrote:Sacred Rose sounds fun if you like blobs of 20 sisters.

AFAIK we can't take any squad in blob of 20. 15 max on BSS.

Hmm trying to find positive things in this pile of gak

1. its a "beta" dex so it might be fixed
2. Celestine - although much worse, pops back up at the end of the phase so can't be shot any more that phase?
3. That one Strategem

errr thats about it?

The way things look right now with the Beta, Sisters are going to need to be less aggressive, more of a gunline without much long range weapons. Trying to Alpha Strike likely won't work as Seraphim and Celestine can't use faith to get downrange to support the Dom's anymore.

Sacred Rose seems like it will be the Order of choice. Overwatch bonus plus morale mitigation is much better than the 3 that give Faith point bonuses.

I wish Immolators (and Rhinos) we're like 20 points cheaper, really have a hard time spending 100 points on them.

My reaction to the Sisters Beta was to promptly order more Skyweavers

While the beta dex is a nerf, having lots of ways to buff shield of faith seems fun/silly
have a block of 3/4++ tanks or blob sisters and move it up the field.

Well....

 John Prins wrote:
Sacred Rose sounds fun if you like blobs of 20 sisters.

Can't take 20 in a squad.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Amishprn86 wrote:
Well with the ability to gain +1 and re-rolls on them, being a MSU army, so Brigades are going to be very cheap and easy for a sob army, idk if it actually will be a problem.

Im more excited about playing 5-6 Aof for a couple turns in a row then using the few left appose to 3 a turn at the most.

Also with the stratagem thats a huge amount of aofs we could be doing.

You'll be lucky to get 2 per turn and even then they won't do anything. They're still limited to one of each AoF PER TURN. In general you're going to end with unspent faith points A LOT.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Acts of Faith are basically free strategems with a die roll for success, not sure why everyone is complaining about them.

They're not even as good as the worst stratagems in the game. They also absorbed most of the actual stratagems sisters get to populate these useless 'bonuses'.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Amishprn86 wrote:
All changes that i thought would be made, we all knew Celestine was going to change and so would AoF, Ynnari most likely will change soon too.

AoF should be more of a buff and plentiful, honestly sounds more fun to me.

My only question is, can AoF effect vehicles?

Also Exorcist being D6 compare to D3 is a good buff, if its still 135pts, not as good as a predator, but i'm assuming they will get some stratagem, or a Specialist detachment for them.

AoF's are still limited to once per turn and are so incredibly weak they might as well not even exist. The only way AoFs can affect SOME of our vehicles is through Vessels.

Celestine is worse than a standard Jumpack SM captain. The D6 damage means that they're still worst than a leman russ with no sponsons BEFORE they double shoot. It's been 125 points for them. They aren't as good as a predator and the only stratagem they get access to is Vessels of the Emperor, which means they spend 3 CP to get a 50% chance of getting +1 to hit.

There is literally nothing to salvage here.