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Veterans lost doctrines, no vehicle options. How much effort did we all lose just to dumb down an army so little Kevin's space marines don't get rofl stomped ? So geedubs can sell a 20 dollar expansion ?

Hours you'll never get back, hours spend using greenstuff to make those camo plate carapace plates on your vets, money wasted by buying those bulldozer blades, hours of searching melta bombs for your sergeants. Money, effort wasted to respect the wysiwyg, for what in the end ?

Was it to much asked to get a +1 on your save having those camo nets, gear, carapace armour ? Having a source for meltabombs ? Was there an ink limit ? A fun limit ?

Does geedubs take a book of physical laws and says "we will base this s**t edition from page 1 to 152 and forget the last 23 chapters"

Does geedubs say at their meeting stuff like "make it good, but not too good, we don't want to have an edition so good we don't need to update it with new armies, new space marines, new rules books, so no one needs to buy the same recycles stuff they already have. Btw great idea Steve you fedora wearing ratling penetrator producing those Primaris, we will just make up an ogryn turd height of fluff, and say that they are totally not normal space marines, and people still gonna buy them to build the exact same army they already so they have the satisfaction of true scale marines. But we gonna say them that they don't need to buy a new army, but like that, it is going to grow in the back of their heads, having true scale marines, not the same height as the gorilla looking cadians while playing, in the end they gonna start collecting and see how great the new models are"

Playing warhammer and dealing with geedubs looks more like an abusive relationship at best between customers and a money hungry company.

I really love the new edition, but they left out WITHOUT ANY REASONS THE OTHER HALF OF THE LOGIC IN THIS GAME. WHAT BANEBLADE GETS -1 TO HIT WHILE MOVING BUT THE RUSS DOESN'T ???!!!

PLATOONS GONE, OH YEAH BECAUSE THE VOICE OF THE PLATOON COMMANDER CAN ONLY BE HEARD SQUAD BY SQUAD NOW HUH ?!

HUMAN REPRESENTATIVES CAN'T STICK THEY GOD DAMN HEAD OUT THE RAMP OF A CHIMERA ?! DID THE MECHANICUS FINALLY ODed ON LIGHTER FLUIDS ??

geedubs, hope you goin bankrupt

garage hammer and house rules all the way !

There's some glimmer of hope the independent codex will bring back some stuff.

For every good thing they did, I feel like there's at least another thing they did poorly with the Guard.

I guess on the plus side, the faction is overall pretty strong, so there's that.

I'm sure you won't listen but Index<Codex

Further than that Imperial guard are now one of the most competitive codex's too

Everyone lost flavour in the switch to 8th, my 'little kevins' space marines lost armour options, weapons options and custom chapter masters, hell i was using FW chaper tactics that may not be replaced and all my tactical marines have chainswords...

And you know what, i'm cool with it, because codex's are coming>

OP is the very picture of someone who has no idea what's going on with other people's armies.

A lot of cool conversions got boned like the camo cloaks on vets

asides from that meh.

the game is in the best state its been in a long while.

Platoons are gone because massive units benifit way too much from individual aura buffs

its for the game balance otherwise you sit there spread eagle across the table with a commissar on one side and a commander on the other with free split fire and an effectively fearless army.

Arachnofiend wrote:
OP is the very picture of someone who has no idea what's going on with other people's armies.

EVERYONE got bit by this edition, just be thankful you don't play Tau...

I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

Exalted. Ain't this the damn truth.

I could complain how Ravenwing got nerfed hard. They really did. My Landspeeders, of which I have five, cost as much as a Dreadnought and are not even half as durable. We lost our wonderful rerollable jink saves. Black Knights cost as much or more than Terminators and aren't nearly as durable. I could go on. Except I won't complain, because guess what? Another part of my army, the Deathwing, are now viable for the first time in, well, ever! Azrael went from being an overcosted chump in 7th to being the best character in the DA lineup in 8th. We got some cool new Primaris marines. And I suspect every army has a similar story. Even Astra Militarum.

So instead of whining, pissing and moaning, get out there and figure out which units in your army got better. Believe me, there are some. Change your lists. Paint some new gak. And above all, wait for your actual codex to drop before shaking your fist at GW.

C'mon dude.... chill out for a second. Use your head. They have said repeatedly that the indexes are a jumping in point so that every army can play 8th right from the start. Instead of like 7th where armies had to wait a year for an update. Codices will be rolled out that have more taste and more information for armies. It sounds like you've become so obsessed with rules that you don't even enjoy the game... If you did, then you would evolve with the game when it changes and look forward to using your army in a new way. How many people play guard, how many people play this game, they can't make 100% perfect amazing rules for each and every individual person that ever exists. They make the base rules, and it's up to us to learn how to use it. You complain that your WYSIWYG no longer matters, but I bet it looks awesome on the table. You don't even care about that. You should take a breath, get a cool drink of water, and remember what you enjoy about the army and what you want out of your own hobby. Complaining doesn't do anything, it's poison. Best of luck to you.

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

I take exception to this! I am perfectly happy with my Genestealers' new rhinoplasty degree!

Unsatisfied customers are free to speak to HR (aka: my broodlords).

vendetta's being reduced to bs 5, or otherwise sitting still really pisses me off. You're punishing a flyer for...... flying. The mechanic is neither intuitive, nor interesting.

otherwise things seem ok.

 ZergSmasher wrote:

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

Exalted. Ain't this the damn truth.

I could complain how Ravenwing got nerfed hard. They really did. My Landspeeders, of which I have five, cost as much as a Dreadnought and are not even half as durable. We lost our wonderful rerollable jink saves. Black Knights cost as much or more than Terminators and aren't nearly as durable. I could go on. Except I won't complain, because guess what? Another part of my army, the Deathwing, are now viable for the first time in, well, ever! Azrael went from being an overcosted chump in 7th to being the best character in the DA lineup in 8th. We got some cool new Primaris marines. And I suspect every army has a similar story. Even Astra Militarum.

So instead of whining, pissing and moaning, get out there and figure out which units in your army got better. Believe me, there are some. Change your lists. Paint some new gak. And above all, wait for your actual codex to drop before shaking your fist at GW.

Even better, i'm still scared of black knights, the nerf was from god tier to generalist butt kickers.

Honestly there's certainly some not worth units, but overall there's far more now tha is decent and far less that is stupidly OP... ironically much of the latter comes under Imperial Guard units

 General Orange wrote:
40k is a scam bc the indexes aren't the be-all-end-all of gameplay for IG

Riiight. Everyone got the same damn crap. Nobody has their snowflake options. Around 50 units are missing right now. This has nothing to do with SM players being terrified of losing, they are solidly below average atm.

This is a complete overhaul of 40k, on a release schedule that is frankly insane. You can't seriously expect what is essentially a public beta test to have the full features of the final version.

Get off you over-emotional horse and sit down like the rest of us.

Can't believe I'm having to defend GW...

You think GeeDubs screwed IG? Geedubs and forgeworld screwed renegades and heretics!

No millitia training = ork shooting without volume of fire.

 CadianGateTroll wrote:
You think GeeDubs screwed IG? Geedubs and forgeworld screwed renegades and heretics!

No millitia training = ork shooting without volume of fire.

And let's not forget that IG are by a large margin the best army in the game right now. OP has absolutely no reason to complain about who doesn't want to lose to who.

Dont understand all the whining, wailing, weeping and gnashing of teeth tbh.
Us Sisters players are pretty happy.

Giantwalkingchair wrote:
Dont understand all the whining, wailing, weeping and gnashing of teeth tbh.
Us Sisters players are pretty happy.

Just wait until you're the last codex, and then they release C:SM 2 and forget to do it.

 Retrogamer0001 wrote:

Arachnofiend wrote:
OP is the very picture of someone who has no idea what's going on with other people's armies.

EVERYONE got bit by this edition, just be thankful you don't play Tau...

Tau are fine - try playing them in 3rd to 5th... now that was a challenge. 6th edition Tau ruined it for all the original players as everyone jumped on the bandwagon and spammed the new units/FoTM.

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

And nobody bitches more than people bitching about the bitchers.

 Arbitrator wrote:

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

And nobody bitches more than people bitching about the bitchers.

I don't know. The people bitching about the people bitching about the bitchers are really strong this year. I think you guys might have the edge!

I've got to assume that OP hasn't seen many edition changes. This is far from the first time that vehicle upgrades or squad equipment options have been ditched.

This happens all the time to all armies, get used to it.

Compared to the minor annoyance of a few lost upgrade options (did you really take dozer blades for the rules, not the looks?) is entirely outweighed by Guard having gone from being hopelessly rubbish to properly good.

 General Orange wrote:
Whine whine whine whine WHINE WHINE WHINE.

Oh dear.

So it looks like the OP lost a game to Space Marines and came running to the internet to post an incoherent rant about how his army has been ruined, complete with examples of one or two individual rules changes (ignoring any gains his army has made) and three final paragraphs in all caps. All this while his army sits clearly at the top of dakka's power table, compiled from all the recorded wins and losses on the forum.

The truth is that no matter what GW did, if they made the perfect game, if everything was balanced to make every player happy, they would still be powerless to change the biggest problem with the game - people like the OP.

My advice to you, OP, is to be the guy this edition change has so far sadly lacked - the guy who burns his army and uploads the video to YouTube. That would be funny. Either that, or realise that it you're reacting anything like this in real life then you're the guy in your club that no-one wants to play. You're the bad loser who plays for the wrong reasons, placing too much emphasis on winning and not enough on fun. Take the time to learn how to play your army again, play for fun, wait for your codex, and try not to be a whiny douche when you lose.

 General Orange wrote:
Veterans lost doctrines, no vehicle options. How much effort did we all lose just to dumb down an army so little Kevin's space marines don't get rofl stomped ?

This is a really dumb thing to say considering that this edition is the absolute most powerful state Imperial Guard have ever been in the game's entire history.

Oh sweet, it's this thread again, where you look only at your own army in a vacuum and just assume the rest of the index is full of fully fleshed out armies. As a bonus we get the guy that hasn't read a single thread talking about what army is winning a lot now, or seemingly have played a single game of 8th. Welcome, mate.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 General Orange wrote:
Veterans lost doctrines, no vehicle options. How much effort did we all lose just to dumb down an army so little Kevin's space marines don't get rofl stomped ?

This is a really dumb thing to say considering that this edition is the absolute most powerful state Imperial Guard have ever been in the game's entire history.

I never got this weird idea that GW constantly writes the rules for space marines to be super strong. yes on average you can find a marine army or two that is high tier each edition, but this shouldn't be a suprise given how many marine varient armies there are. Marines have done well (they've also done poorly. just ask Martel about how strong his blood angels where in 7th )

also every army has had some of their choices etc reduced, space marines have likely lost more then guard have (with the new detachments there's simply no reason to bother with platoons) marines have lost chapter tactics, numerous upgrade options, including artifacer armor on captains. generic chapter masters (which is a bit of a loss given CMs have a superior buff bubble) IG is hardly unique in this. IG are currently the strongest army in 40k.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Purifier wrote:
Oh sweet, it's this thread again, where you look only at your own army in a vacuum and just assume the rest of the index is full of fully fleshed out armies. As a bonus we get the guy that hasn't read a single thread talking about what army is winning a lot now, or seemingly have played a single game of 8th. Welcome, mate.

and whom belvies GW writes the rules purposefully to make it impossiable for marines to lose.

My Field Artillery, my 9 Leman Russ Tanks (half of them Mars-Alpha) and my Rapiers were all made worse, so I guess that's several hundred euros worth of units that are now worse. On the other hand, the rest of my army was actually made much more playable so I'm happy I don't have to rely on certain units to be my crutches anymore.

But I don't think OP understands why the game is abstract in certain ways to keep it a game, nor that releasing all codices at the same time would have been unfeasible. All armies have lost somethng for now, and might get it back later. I wouldn't worry too much right now.

Y NO PLATTONS?

Simple, really. Battleshock/Leadership. That's changed how I deal with hordes of infantry. Rather than just try to find a pie plate or three to sling at them, I now try to stack my damage just right to maximise ancillary casualties inflicted at the end of the turn.

But then, you have Commissars to muck that up. Commissars which can reduce any and all LD casualties to 1.....

See that? That's why you don't get Blob Squads anymore.

Y NO CPARCAER ARMOUR?

Because your basic 5+ save is now way, way better than it ever was before. The majority of small arms don't bypass or reduce your armour's effectiveness.

Y NOO FLIP LID ON CHIEMAR??

Nobody can do that unless their transport is open topped. It's not something done solely to Guard.

Chill dude. You're focussing solely on things you no longer enjoy, without questioning why.

A guy at my FLGS spent about $4k on his Renegades and Heretics army. Beautiful to see, mostly Forgeworld models. Took him almost 2 years to complete. He's played it for maybe 6 months.

The Codex better be good, he's not enjoying 8th at all. All that work for a game where the principle activity is removing his models from the board and mumbling "I have no counter for that."

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

GW fandom in a nutshell. "OMG I hate you, you ruined my life! Here's a thousand dollars!"

 djones520 wrote:
I'm enjoying this. All over the place, people bitching about 8th. You go into the 30K part, people bitching about how 30K stayed 7th. Tau suck, Eldar Suck, IG suck, everything sucks.

It's like, everyone just likes to bitch.

Truth. The negative whiners are the ones making the most noise, as it has always been. Most are out there enjoying the game. It's way better than it was in 7th.

One day I'll understand what the point of focusing on the negative is, or what the point of complaining about something is seeing as it will have no effect on anything really. Just pointless.

Was someone genuinely surprised that some things will get better, some will get worse, some will vanish and something new will also come along? How did you manage that, how is it even possible?