Codex: Chaos Space Marines (Preorder: August 5th / Release: August 12th)

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**Nostromodamus**

Demantiae wrote:

The Alpharius thing is up in the air, as is everything AL. Alpharius may have been two people all along (twins) or he may have been one soul split into two bodies by some weird freak of psychic accident (or design....). He/they may or may not be dead because we know for sure they body swapped all the time, and designed their/his legionnaires to look almost exactly alike him/them. At any point they're described as dying you just don't know if it was really them or not. There're theories that Alpharius or Omegon may have gone on to become the founder of the Grey Knights, there's also one that one of them took up disguise as Guilliman. I doubt the later is true given GW's hard-on for Smurfs but the former *might* be true. The fact that such theories exist shows you how uncertain you be of anything AL related, especially concerning their primarch(s). My own pet theory is similar to the way Malkavian work in VtM, I reckon Alpharius had his soul split into two bodies and his entire legion were psychic extensions of him. I think the physical Alpharius is dead but the psychic essence of him, split into two still resides in the Alpha Legionnaires but has gone insane by being affected by the psychic equivalent of a split-personality. Hence why they still seem to follow conflicting objectives, working both for and against chaos, for and against the Imperium without really knowing why. That's my pet theory anyway and entirely OT!

The novel "Legion" explains exactly who Alpharius/Omegon are and why the Alpha Legion sided with Chaos.

Unless the novel is a falsehood to throw people off

**str00dles1**

BrianDavion wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
He'll probably be heavier on the killy side than the buffing side, much like Magnus.

However he will also probably be more than 10 wounds and liable to be gibbed before he does anything useful, also like Magnus.

My guess is that putting him down isn't gonna be that easy (although yes hell have more then 10 wounds, I'd bet 21, multiples of 7 and all ) nurgle is the "tankyness god" so I suspect Mortarian is gonna be the "tanky" deamon Primarch. I mean, let's assume my guesses are about right, stats wise he'll likely be Toughness 7 or 8, 21 wounds (I went with 21 as it's a multiple of 7) invul 4+ with DR re-rolling 1s on DR... he could potentially be pretty tough to take down

Considering how terrible GUO are, I highly doubt he would have that many. GW thinks that if they give something DR, is has to have less wounds then anything else for some reason.

GUO has 12 wounds, Bloodthirster not only has a +3 armor, but 16 wounds. Nurgle may be in the spotlight, but don't expect mortation to be anything amazing. Hes not a loyalist, so already gimped in GWs eyes

**Thousandeyes**

It will be very interesting to see how Mortarion fare out under 8th. I am guessing Magnus will be re-adjusted a bit when the Thousand Sons Codex comes out.

**Gordon Shumway**

Do the Legion traits just apply to infantry or to any unit in a Legion? If any unit, a char+squad in a rhino is -3 LD right there.

**Elbows**

Legion traits have been noted to affect: infantry, bikers, and dreadnoughts.

**Astmeister**

I wonder if Dreadnoughts mean all of them from the FW books or just Helbrutes?

**Elroniel**

Astmeister wrote:
I wonder if Dreadnoughts mean all of them from the FW books or just Helbrutes?

I'm pretty sure they said Helbrute Keyword. Which was added to most FW Dreadnoughts.

**Sgt. Cortez**

World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?

**casvalremdeikun**

They look rather one dimensional, but boy do they perform in that one dimensional! If they get in CC, they will kill whatever it is that they want dead as long as they have the right tools for the job.

**andysonic1**

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?

I wanted something to help get into close combat without having to rely on Warp Time. Hopefully the across the board point reductions that swept through Space Marines will also sweep through Chaos Marines and allow us a little more wiggle room to bring more bodies to the table.

**casvalremdeikun**

andysonic1 wrote:
Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?
I wanted something to help get into close combat without having to rely on Warp Time. Hopefully the across the board point reductions that swept through Space Marines will also sweep through Chaos Marines and allow us a little more wiggle room to bring more bodies to the table.

From the looks of it, CSM will at least be getting the same Wargear price reduction. Hopefully unit prices go down as well, especially for units that both armies have.

**MaxT**

andysonic1 wrote:
Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?
I wanted something to help get into close combat without having to rely on Warp Time. Hopefully the across the board point reductions that swept through Space Marines will also sweep through Chaos Marines and allow us a little more wiggle room to bring more bodies to the table.

Already a suggestion of that with Power Fists confirmed going to 12pts in the article

**Red Corsair**

andysonic1 wrote:
Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?
I wanted something to help get into close combat without having to rely on Warp Time. Hopefully the across the board point reductions that swept through Space Marines will also sweep through Chaos Marines and allow us a little more wiggle room to bring more bodies to the table.

Berserkers in a rhino are not bad at all. Rhinos are a real pain for most armies I have faced to deal with. My emperors children list has 4 lol, I just keep my troops safe turn 1 then disembark and assault their lines with my rhino wall, it really does work. It's tough for armies to kill a t7 10 wound 3+ model in a shooting phase, let alone multiple.

**zerosignal**

Powerfists going to 12pts is GREAT news for my Terminators

**Loopstah**

The best thing is a WE rhino also gets an extra attack when it charges in to soak up overwatch.

**combatcotton**

Loopstah wrote:
The best thing is a WE rhino also gets an extra attack when it charges in to soak up overwatch.

I don't think so, since it is neither a biker, helbrute or infantery model.

**Voss**

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?

No, but it would be nice if Khorne was the god of all bloodshed, not just punching people in the face.

**Galas**

Voss wrote:
Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?

No, but it would be nice if Khorne was the god of all bloodshed, not just punching people in the face.

So the best chaos God, because this is a WARgame? You ask for the chaos legion rules to be so generaliced to fit tour interpretation of the gods that they lose their reason to exist.

**Desubot**

Hmmmm so fight for korn
fight for berserk
fight for stratagem?

thats what 4 times the swings in CC?

dont think much of anything will survive that.

**Astmeister**

Surprising that they don't do Alpha Legion tomorrow, although it is next on their list. And they kept to the list until now...

**andysonic1**

Astmeister wrote:
Surprising that they don't do Alpha Legion tomorrow, although it is next on their list. And they kept to the list until now...

They will most likely keep revealing them through the weekend and then spend next week on Grey Knights.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Red Corsair wrote:
andysonic1 wrote:
Sgt. Cortez wrote:
World Eaters are here.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/08/03/legion-focus-world-eaters-aug-3gw-homepage-post-2/

Automatically Appended Next Post:
They kill you in CC, they kill your characters in CC, and they kill your spells. That's basically it. But hey, it's World Eaters, did we expect something else?
I wanted something to help get into close combat without having to rely on Warp Time. Hopefully the across the board point reductions that swept through Space Marines will also sweep through Chaos Marines and allow us a little more wiggle room to bring more bodies to the table.

Berserkers in a rhino are not bad at all. Rhinos are a real pain for most armies I have faced to deal with. My emperors children list has 4 lol, I just keep my troops safe turn 1 then disembark and assault their lines with my rhino wall, it really does work. It's tough for armies to kill a t7 10 wound 3+ model in a shooting phase, let alone multiple.

I know Rhinos are amazing right now but I really want to use my Khrybdis. Rhinos are flat out a better option right now and it hurts me inside to say that. I want to use my flying tank of doom damnit!

**Sgt. Cortez**

Astmeister wrote:
Surprising that they don't do Alpha Legion tomorrow, although it is next on their list. And they kept to the list until now...

Alpha legion trickery.

Interesting that they didn't mention marks at all so far. I know they said on FB they wouldn't modify the statline anymore, but they have to do something, right?

**Elbows**

Is it wrong I want to see the look on a horde army player's face when his Orks or Imperial Guard mobs run into Berzerkers? That'll be fun to watch.

**Tiberius501**

I'm assuming no points leaks have been posted? I'm interested to see if Plague Marines have changed in point costs, as they said Plague Marines and Rubrics will be in the book, and also their new options.

**macluvin**

Marks determine what strategems and psyker powers you can use.

**Loopstah**

combatcotton wrote:
Loopstah wrote:
The best thing is a WE rhino also gets an extra attack when it charges in to soak up overwatch.

I don't think so, since it is neither a biker, helbrute or infantery model.

Where does it list legion traits are only for bikes, infantry and helbrutes?

**godardc**

So, how many attack does a squad of 8 zerkers has ?
+1 for chainsword
+1 for assaulting this turn
And they fight 3 times ?

**Elbows**

Loopstah wrote:
combatcotton wrote:
Loopstah wrote:
The best thing is a WE rhino also gets an extra attack when it charges in to soak up overwatch.

I don't think so, since it is neither a biker, helbrute or infantery model.

Where does it list legion traits are only for bikes, infantry and helbrutes?

This is the case with Chapter Tactics so it's exceptionally likely to be the case.

**Sgt. Cortez**

They also said it in the EC article.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Since it was Crystal clear again, I would love to see some posts about how the rumored Alpha Legion trait makes Fireraptors and Heldrakes super broken. Because it's super clear, you know.