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2017/12/15 04:11:56
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
tneva82 wrote: Seriously some big scenes are like replace Kyle with Darth Vader and Rey with Luke and it would be just scene from originals with new actors.
It's Abrams' modus operandi. You should be expecting this by now.
Mister Not-Involved-In-This-Film? Why?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/15 04:12:13
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2017/12/15 04:40:15
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Unsurprisingly, this thread is a dumpster fire already.
Saw the movie tonight. I loved every minute of it and I can't wait to see it again with the kiddos over their Christmas break (and then again a couple more times probably).
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
2017/12/15 04:55:54
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
I thoroughly enjoyed the movie. Blown away by several parts. No, not DA BEST MOVIE EVAH material but more than enough to sate the feelings of this life long Star Wars fan.
2017/12/15 04:59:17
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
A festering turd of a film. It's a chaotic mess, massive plot problems, pacing problems, dialog problems (platitudes, exposition when it's not necessary, no exposition when it is necessary). No tension, too much humor (and no I don't mean the Porg, I actually liked them..they were the most endearing characters in the film), lack of character development, particularly at the expense of diversity, (look see! An asian girl!)
But most (and worst) of all, a complete lack of understanding (or just failure to adhere to) the rules of mythology that make it great.
2017/12/15 05:05:52
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Just saw it. I must say Wow what a waste of time. I think it's actually worst Star Wars movie I have ever seen. I'm still trying to understand how it has gotten the good reviews it has. If this is the future I'm afraid the franchise is in deep trouble.
The spear wait's not for it's master, but rushes forth to guard the way.
2017/12/15 05:28:51
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Kojiro wrote: The more time that passes after the viewing- the further I get from the spectacle on the screen- the more I'm disliking this film. I'm really, really disappointed with the way they've handled technology.
Spoiler:
I think it can be perfectly summed up with the 'Cloaked Beacon'- a device that simultaneously broadcasts a galaxy wide signal (from a wrist watch sized device no less) yet can't be detected. Throw in the whole 'They're tracking us through hyperspace!' 'But that's impossible!' bit and suddenly the whole plan about a codebreaker (couldn't say slicer? really?) and some secret new tech and busting into the freaking command ship becomes massively questionable (before you even consider it was an utterly pointless subplot!). Worse they know immediately how to circumvent it and which room it's on- in a ship that is sixty kilometers long.
"General Leia, they're tracking us through hyperspace!"
"But that's not possible!"
"It must be some new kind of never before seen technology! "
"Or, you know, I am wearing a galaxy wide beacon. Could be they picked that up. Or a tracker. Or a spy. Wait, no- definitely some never before seen technology. Quick, concoct a horrifyingly convoluted plan that will fail but eat up screen time!"
Spoiler:
And wasn't millenium falcon tracked as well in new hop? Yeah real never seen before thing...
Honestly sounds like the typical technological nonsense I expect of the franchise. Anyone remember Center Point station? Anyone And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
CthuluIsSpy wrote: Ok, that is just nonsense. What got released around that time? Because in order for those movies to rate that highly the competition must have sucked.
A New Hope went up against Smokey and the Bandit (Smokey had a larger opening weekend )
Empire went up against The Shining ROJ went up against Chained Heat
Help me, Rhonda. HA!
2017/12/15 05:46:27
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
LordofHats wrote: Honestly sounds like the typical technological nonsense I expect of the franchise. Anyone remember Center Point station? Anyone And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
Spoiler:
The problem is that we get a long technobabble rant about how to solve the problem, with an insanely convoluted plan that in the end, that has zero impact on the story. Technobabble should be used to smooth over cracks in the plot, not create useless ones! All that screen time could have been given to Luke actually doing something awesome or heaven forbid- some actual development of Rey and Ren's relationship to at least try and justify her actions towards him. Because characters should have good reasons to trust each other, especially if the last time they met they were trying to murder each other. Ultimately Finn and Rose got to do something, but if they disappeared and showed up at the end with no explanation other than 'we failed' nothing changes.
LordofHats wrote: Honestly sounds like the typical technological nonsense I expect of the franchise. Anyone remember Center Point station? Anyone And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
Well they have seemed to forget any semblance of point defence weapons or scanners against smaller craft.
Spoiler:
I swear they have been able to spot x-wing's before nevermind lot bigger transport vehicles! Umm...what? And then suddenly when TOLD there's transports in they suddenly can spot them at will?
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/15 07:40:26
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Saw the movie tonight. I loved every minute of it and I can't wait to see it again with the kiddos over their Christmas break (and then again a couple more times probably).
Why is it a 'dumpster fire?' Because people have differing opinions?
Though it seems worth noting that the negative opinions have reasons attached, and the positive ones are just 'Yay, Star Wars!' so...
Now granted, some of the positivity comes from the people counting down with spam posts, so they probably couldn't change their public opinions now, but still. Anyone could spend some time talking about what actually impressed them.
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2017/12/15 08:03:56
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Voss wrote: Now granted, some of the positivity comes from the people counting down with spam posts, so they probably couldn't change their public opinions now, but still. Anyone could spend some time talking about what actually impressed them.
Spoiler:
Luke scenes
In particular how he threw off lightsaber away cracked whole audience here.
Got laugh at how Snope/whateva the entirely forgettable new Emperor refered to Kyle as kid with a mask. Much like viewers noted he was just whiny kid with a mask after TFA Kyle had somewhat better moments than last movie.
Liked the lesson Poe got.
Luke&Leia reunion.
Nice trick with Luke's projection how he appeared as younger one. Didn't realize he was projection but did note something's weird with his appearance. Also nicely explained how he survived all that AT-AT fire that initially made me groan "You got to be KIDDING ME?". Nice one.
Visually top notch. Just wish it had story to make full use of it...
And here's how I would have improved the movie:
Spoiler:
No original trilogy(problem here being if you have seen episodes 5 and 6 this movie actually offers nothing new!), bit more internal logic, more sense to battle sequences(like how they took out that dreadnought...Would it hurt the studio to send MORE than 1 fighter to knock out weapons?). Get rid of the code breaker story line or make it matter. As it is all it did was introduce romantic partner for Finn but that's it...
No Leia in space and somehow survives just like that. Don't think Jedi has been noted to have such a power and besides Leia isn't even trained Jedi...They could have written scene almost same way and have Leia go into healing state without having her be deep vacuumed and saved "because plot says so"
It had it's moments and could have been much better especially if there hadn't been original trilogy already but boy they can somehow miss so badly.
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/15 08:04:40
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
tneva82 wrote: Seriously some big scenes are like replace Kyle with Darth Vader and Rey with Luke and it would be just scene from originals with new actors.
It's Abrams' modus operandi. You should be expecting this by now.
Mister Not-Involved-In-This-Film? Why?
He is credited as an executive producer, but I agree it didn't really have any of his hallmarks so I imagine his impact was very minimal.
On parle toujours mal quand on n'a rien à dire.
2017/12/15 08:52:33
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
LordofHats wrote: Honestly sounds like the typical technological nonsense I expect of the franchise. Anyone remember Center Point station? Anyone And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
Well they have seemed to forget any semblance of point defence weapons or scanners against smaller craft.
Spoiler:
I swear they have been able to spot x-wing's before nevermind lot bigger transport vehicles! Umm...what? And then suddenly when TOLD there's transports in they suddenly can spot them at will?
Yeah, that's covered as well....
Seriously, a lot of the complaints I'm seeing appear to stem from peeps missing stuff in the movie, rather than it not being there in the first place?
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Spoiler warnings in the thread title, so I'm not going to bother trying to keep the spoiler tags straight.
Saw it, entertaining but not great is my opinion. I have to agree with previous criticism of the pacing, technobabble "plot" elements, lack of coherent structure, and idiotic space battles. FFS, why does the rebellion resistance only have three capital ships and a dozen fighters? Why does everything come down to a single fighter wrecking stuff while the capital ships are little more than target practice? And if your ridiculous space B-17 is able to take down a capital ship in a single bombing run why don't you just build a few hundred of them, accept that people die in a war, and send them on a bombing run that wipes out the whole Imperial First Order fleet. This isn't 1977 anymore, we aren't limited by model technology and can actually put lots of ships on the screen at once.
tneva82 wrote: And wasn't millenium falcon tracked as well in new hop? Yeah real never seen before thing...
It was, but that was specifically because the Empire put a tracking beacon on the ship. They didn't magically gain the ability to track a ship through hyperspace, an ability which is simultaneously so shocking that none of the leadership had prepared for it or believed it to be possible but so obvious that a random maintenance worker knows exactly what's going on, to the point of knowing exactly what the limitations of the device are and how to disable it. And even that explanation doesn't make sense. So you disable it for six minutes, and jump to hyperspace. Seven minutes later they switch on the new tracking device, spot your location, and jump the fleet in to kill you.
Swastakowey wrote: There is literally a book burning in this film, where the old jedi knowledge is burned by a force ghost who calls lightening from the sky, because the knowledge can be found in Rey and the books aren't. Luke is distraught at this but the force ghost simply whacks him on the head then laughs and says "page turners they where not".
Yes, Yoda commits a book burning on ancient Jedi knowledge and texts.
Honestly, this part makes 100% sense. A fundamental part of the story, starting at least as far back as ROTJ, is that the jedi are too concerned with rules and traditions rather than the real world around them. They've lost sight of the core identity of the light side, of doing what is right, and replaced it with the Star Wars equivalent of the real-world biblical literalists who argue that the earth must be 6000 years old (younger than recorded history) because that's what the chain of genealogy says while ignoring all that stuff about loving thy neighbor and helping the poor. Yoda makes the very relevant point that keeping the jedi rules that destroyed them in the first place is repeating the mistakes of the path, that it's time to move on. The only problem IMO is that the books aren't actually destroyed, making the lesson rather pointless.
Where? They mention cloaks of some kind, but then as soon as someone says "HAY GUYS THERES A TRANSPORT" they're able to target them from extreme range and destroy them with single, perfectly accurate shots. It's more technobabble that works one way until the plot requires that it work differently.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/12/15 08:55:45
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2017/12/15 09:00:05
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
When they decide to flee upon the shuttles, it's mentioned that the First Order are focussed upon the carrier. Switching on the cloaking thing means they can likely slip past unnoticed.
Then, when the game is rumbled, an order is given to use a more specific scan, when the transports are spotted.
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They mentioned they're doing something to hide themselves from scanners, not actual cloaking. So knowing they're doing something like that, they probably needed to tweak their scanners. As said, space is big and ranges are extreme. Spotting them visually was out, so they're relying on whatever they use as 'scanners'.
However, this begs the question of how the hacker knew that plot since he was never involved with anybody who knew they were doing that.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/15 09:03:24
2017/12/15 09:07:19
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
As I noted earlier, a lot of the criticism I've seen in this particular thread has made me wonder if it's from people that have actually been to see the film.
Such as the book burning comment, when No Books Were Burnt In The Making Of This Film, or claiming the cloaking thing isn't resolved, when it is.
The film isn't perfect, but I really enjoyed it on the whole. The only bits I'd have done differently would be Leia In Space (why not have her use The Force to avoid being sucked out in the first place, rather than reeling herself back in.) and Canto Bight could've been a bit punchier - I think they spent too much time on the escape chase.
But those claiming it's the worst Star Wars film ever? Really? Really really?
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LordofHats wrote: Honestly sounds like the typical technological nonsense I expect of the franchise. Anyone remember Center Point station? Anyone And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
Well they have seemed to forget any semblance of point defence weapons or scanners against smaller craft.
Spoiler:
I swear they have been able to spot x-wing's before nevermind lot bigger transport vehicles! Umm...what? And then suddenly when TOLD there's transports in they suddenly can spot them at will?
Yeah, that's covered as well....
Seriously, a lot of the complaints I'm seeing appear to stem from peeps missing stuff in the movie, rather than it not being there in the first place?
Spoiler:
No it was not covered how empire lost ability they used to have. They have tracked LOT SMALLER X-WINGS for christ sake! Now they can't spot big cargo transport? The kind they used in Hoth(they were seen) and even in the start of the film(they were seen). But no. "Empire's scanners aren't designed to detect small crafts". Yeah well except they have been able to do that for decades in-universum time.
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/15 09:26:58
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Wouldn’t the original trilogy have been so much better if everyone had fretted about fuel all the time rather than just jumping across the galaxy to do what needed to be done? Why were the First Order fleet very slowly following with the same few ships lobbing the odd shot every now and then? They have fighters, as we saw them early on. They have more ships, as the dreadnaught in the beginning isn’t supposed to be unique. Are there literally no reinforcements nearby they could use to head off the Resistance?
There are no words to describe how dreadful the bit with Leia floating through space bit was.
Why is everyone astounded that they’re being tracked through hyperspace? Literally in a New Hope Leia tells Han, in HYPERSPACE, “They’re tracking us. It’s the only explanation for the ease of our escape”. Why aren’t their first thoughts either a homing beacon or a traitor on board, either of which are very plausible?
So it seems that the most devastating WMD in Star Wars is to launch yourself into hyperspace directly at your enemy. Why has no body done this before? What’s the point of guns on ships if you get a much better effect by having your fleet accompanied by drone/droid ships that can be set to jump into enemy ships as needed? Why, when everything was looking grim at Endor did Ackbar not order the entire Rebel fleet to jump directly towards the Death Star?
Who was Admiral Purple? Just a character dumped into the film to give Poe someone to rail against. But because that’s how she was introduced there was no real story there, she came across as some sort of tyrannical supply teacher making things unfair for the cool kid who just wants to fight. Why not have her in the film from the beginning? She could have done something heroic early on so that when she’s butting heads with Poe there’s some doubt with the audience as to who’s in the right. Or make remove her entirely and have that role filled by Ackbar, who seemed to just get killed offscreen as an afterthought?
Daisy Ridley’s acting in the early scenes on the Island was just dire. She had no chemistry with Mark Hamill but she did improve later on.
The bombers at the beginning were just ridiculous. Having such a design flaw as ‘any damage to the huge bomb magazine causes the ship to explode dramatically’ is bad enough, but how are they supposed to be used? Their only tactic is to float slowly over an undefended target and drop their payload. This sort of works, but on a ship used by the good guys? Is part of the Resistance doctrince razing civilian cities?
And also on the bombers, what was causing the bombs to fall out of them onto the dreadnaught?
Was there any point at all to anything Finn (and Rose) did in this film beyond adding an hour to the run time? Their side adventure played out like a bad RPG campaign, with the GM having to suddenly conjure up an alternative expert codebreaker as the players totally screwed up meeting the one guy in the galaxy who can help them (as per Maz). “No wait, there’s another one in the same buliding, and he’s in your cell, even though he can get out at any time!” Those circumstances were so fortuitous I was sure it was going to be some First Order plot, somehow. But in the end it just went literally nowhere.
Who was that guy anyway? IMDB lists him as ‘DJ’ but I don’t think he was named in the film. How was he able to tell the First Order about the Resistance transports? He didn’t know about that. Finn or Rose didn’t know. And did he get away? Who knows.
Those fancy secret Resistance rings, with their super-high-tech yet super-visible levers.
Why have two completely separate infiltration missions on the same ship and then not have them play into each other somehow? I almost feel like they had 2 competing storylines for the Snoke’s ship sequence and just decided to do both because they really needed Rey’s Snoke scenes but literally couldn’t think of anything else Finn should be doing. And did Rey just go from the ‘throne room’ to being on the Falcon magically?
‘Battering Ram Cannon’. Not only is that the single stupidest name for a weapon in any film ever, how does it even make sense? Who in the First Order would be familiar with the concept of a battering ram having grown up in a high-tech galaxy?
And what was the Resistance plan in that battle anyway with those speeders? Not just “why were they not utilising their increased manoeuverability to attack the flanks of the walkers” (because we all know it was just an ESB homage) but literally what were they trying to do to the battering ram cannon? I wondered if they were trying the Zapp Brannigan ‘clog it up with the wreckage of their speeders’ and it seems Finn was doing exactly that until Rose tried to nobly sacrifice herself to stop Finn nobly sacrificing himself… what?
Kylo’s decision to fire all guns at Luke was surprisingly sound and the sequence was pretty cool. It was slightly marred a few seconds later when Finn dragged Rose back through the doors. Did he just walk through all that firepower?
I could have laughed at the “we know all our secret allies have seen our message, but they’re not responding” bit. I had visions of the officer studying some sort of space WhatsApp, seeing all the ticks turn blue and not getting any replies (and I thought maybe Rey and Kylo had each swiped right on the Force-based dating app, Sabr)
And who is Snoke anyway? Is it important and was it ever? I suppose we’ve still got Force Ghosts that can infodump but at the moment it seems he’s ‘just some guy’. I was thinking afterwards that I’d have loved if it had been some sort of Wizard of Oz con job that Kylo found out about.
Also it would have been great to have a dual face/heel turn in the throne room with Kylo ending up with Leia (and obviously not trusted by anyone else) and Rey not quite having turned evil but become very dangerous and pretty much just acting on instinct, lashing out at everyone. It would have actually been a twist and given some meaning to Luke’s worries about her.
Anyway, thank the Force the Resistance is now in such a good place, ready to kickstart a whole new Rebellion, even if the whole thing can be carried by the Falcon.
“Good people are quick to help others in need, without hesitation or requiring proof the need is genuine. The wicked will believe they are fighting for good, but when others are in need they’ll be reluctant to help, withholding compassion until they see proof of that need. And yet Evil is quick to condemn, vilify and attack. For Evil, proof isn’t needed to bring harm, only hatred and a belief in the cause.”
2017/12/15 09:26:58
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Seriously, a lot of the complaints I'm seeing appear to stem from peeps missing stuff in the movie, rather than it not being there in the first place?
If you have to pay careful attention to the exact technobabble statement made about why the plot device works the way it does for a scene to make sense then the movie has failed.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2017/12/15 09:35:31
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
So what you're saying is we should be able to ignore any dialogue because reasons, and then criticise the film for putting in an explanation we chose to ignore?
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: So what you're saying is we should be able to ignore any dialogue because reasons, and then criticise the film for putting in an explanation we chose to ignore?
When it's a throwaway line that is easy enough to miss that multiple people in this thread missed it, and consists of little more than "the plot requires us to see them now, do the technobabble thing", yeah, we shouldn't give the film credit for the "explanation".
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2017/12/15 09:38:43
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Wouldn’t the original trilogy have been so much better if everyone had fretted about fuel all the time rather than just jumping across the galaxy to do what needed to be done? Why were the First Order fleet very slowly following with the same few ships lobbing the odd shot every now and then? They have fighters, as we saw them early on. They have more ships, as the dreadnaught in the beginning isn’t supposed to be unique. Are there literally no reinforcements nearby they could use to head off the Resistance?
Yeah or howabout using some ships do micro hyperspace jump to get ahead?
Why is everyone astounded that they’re being tracked through hyperspace? Literally in a New Hope Leia tells Han, in HYPERSPACE, “They’re tracking us. It’s the only explanation for the ease of our escape”. Why aren’t their first thoughts either a homing beacon or a traitor on board, either of which are very plausible?
Yeah. Tracking through hyperspace is old tech. Why they figure it's not that rather than some never seen before tech and also correctly surmis what it is, where it is and how to stop it?
So it seems that the most devastating WMD in Star Wars is to launch yourself into hyperspace directly at your enemy. Why has no body done this before? What’s the point of guns on ships if you get a much better effect by having your fleet accompanied by drone/droid ships that can be set to jump into enemy ships as needed? Why, when everything was looking grim at Endor did Ackbar not order the entire Rebel fleet to jump directly towards the Death Star?
Good question! X-wing sized craft doing that likely has pretty darn good impact as well. Can't be price because they can massproduce x-wings with hyperspace and sure is cheaper than losing lots of them in head on assault with tons of casualties.
The bombers at the beginning were just ridiculous. Having such a design flaw as ‘any damage to the huge bomb magazine causes the ship to explode dramatically’ is bad enough, but how are they supposed to be used? Their only tactic is to float slowly over an undefended target and drop their payload. This sort of works, but on a ship used by the good guys? Is part of the Resistance doctrince razing civilian cities?
Yeah seemed kinda stupid design. Very vulnerable, hard to hit and rebels had better bombing platforms before...
And also on the bombers, what was causing the bombs to fall out of them onto the dreadnaught?
It was The Force!
Was there any point at all to anything Finn (and Rose) did in this film beyond adding an hour to the run time? Their side adventure played out like a bad RPG campaign, with the GM having to suddenly conjure up an alternative expert codebreaker as the players totally screwed up meeting the one guy in the galaxy who can help them (as per Maz). “No wait, there’s another one in the same buliding, and he’s in your cell, even though he can get out at any time!” Those circumstances were so fortuitous I was sure it was going to be some First Order plot, somehow. But in the end it just went literally nowhere.
Nope. That was literally just to give Rose screen time for future romance plot between them no doubt.
And did Rey just go from the ‘throne room’ to being on the Falcon magically?
Yeah last we heard of her she used escape pod/Vessel. Next she's on falcon.
And what was the Resistance plan in that battle anyway with those speeders?
Die? The way tie's took out those in the initial run should have meant the mere 13 speeders should have been dead before falcon arrived.
Guess just humour for kicking through side of pod. That seemed to be whole point of that scene.
And who is Snoke anyway? Is it important and was it ever? I suppose we’ve still got Force Ghosts that can infodump but at the moment it seems he’s ‘just some guy’. I was thinking afterwards that I’d have loved if it had been some sort of Wizard of Oz con job that Kylo found out about.
Palpatine mkII. Remember these aren't really new stories but original trilogy with new tech.
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/15 09:52:07
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: So what you're saying is we should be able to ignore any dialogue because reasons, and then criticise the film for putting in an explanation we chose to ignore?
When it's a throwaway line that is easy enough to miss that multiple people in this thread missed it, and consists of little more than "the plot requires us to see them now, do the technobabble thing", yeah, we shouldn't give the film credit for the "explanation".
Or people could, y'know. Pay attention. And it's clearly not a throwaway line if it's of import to the plot?
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Yeah last we heard of her she used escape pod/Vessel. Next she's on falcon.
And who said she'd used Snoke's vessel? Kylo. Who had presumably been out cold since the explosion. How did he know what had happened?
Having said that, Hux was largely brilliant throughout and his stealthy 'no,wasn't going for my blaster at all' moment in that scene was priceless.
“Good people are quick to help others in need, without hesitation or requiring proof the need is genuine. The wicked will believe they are fighting for good, but when others are in need they’ll be reluctant to help, withholding compassion until they see proof of that need. And yet Evil is quick to condemn, vilify and attack. For Evil, proof isn’t needed to bring harm, only hatred and a belief in the cause.”
2017/12/15 10:00:33
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: So what you're saying is we should be able to ignore any dialogue because reasons, and then criticise the film for putting in an explanation we chose to ignore?
When it's a throwaway line that is easy enough to miss that multiple people in this thread missed it, and consists of little more than "the plot requires us to see them now, do the technobabble thing", yeah, we shouldn't give the film credit for the "explanation".
Or people could, y'know. Pay attention. And it's clearly not a throwaway line if it's of import to the plot?
Line that conveniently ignores previously set capabilities of ships in SW universum.
The ships have been shown to have ability FAR beyond this. Tracking big ships AND x-wings at the same time. Total lack of internal logic or total collapse of Empire's technology(at which point there needs to be some explanation how the star destroyers have become so lousy old tech in the meanwhile)
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/15 10:35:48
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Or cloaking tech has been improved. Because that's how technology often works - such as Radar being ace up until Stealth technology, and Stealth Technology being ace up until an improvement in detecting technology etc etc.
Spoiler:
Plus, it's established that Crait was a secret Rebel base that nobody knew about. So as far as The First Order knew (and this is an important part of this plan), the Resistance had nowhere to run to that wouldn't make their predicament a whole lot worse. So they had no reason to be looking for sub-light only shuttles trying to do a runner.
Seriously, it's all there in the movie.
For clarity - I don't especially care if you like how the movie explains stuff. That's up to you. But to claim there is no explanation when there in fact is, is a problem.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/15 10:38:46
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Or cloaking tech has been improved. Because that's how technology often works - such as Radar being ace up until Stealth technology, and Stealth Technology being ace up until an improvement in detecting technology etc etc.
Except the cloaking tech does nothing once someone (who doesn't even know about the escape plan!) says "HAY GUYS THERE MIGHT BE A SHIP THERE". That inconsistency is the problem. It's 100% effective when the plot requires it, then 0% effective once the plot requires it.
Plus, it's established that Crait was a secret Rebel base that nobody knew about. So as far as The First Order knew (and this is an important part of this plan), the Resistance had nowhere to run to that wouldn't make their predicament a whole lot worse. So they had no reason to be looking for sub-light only shuttles trying to do a runner.
That doesn't make sense because any habitable planet is better than being destroyed aboard the ship, and the rebels had already abandoned their other ships without a fight once they ran out of fuel. Any sensible enemy would be watching for transports/escape pods/etc attempting to flee inevitable death. And their best fire control sensors would already be focused on the area to guide shots on the big ship, it's not like the shuttles appeared in the middle of nowhere where nobody was looking.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
And did the “Empire” forget again that they have intereictors? I’ll bet they did!
40IK - PP Conversion Project Files
