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Ignoring the terrain discussion, there's something I can't figure out in the Subjugators sprue:

Part #32, right above the ram. What's that?

That's the heavy concussion ram.

So there's two different ram options?

Because 30A, 30B, and 31 seem to be the one they have shown on the built models but 32 looks almost like that weird laser-ish carbine the basic Enforcers have.

There's the SLHG pattern assault ram ‘sledge hammer’. which is a grenade launcher/door busting ram, and then the heavy version of the concussion carbine, the Heavy Concussion Ram.

Cool, thanks! I wasn't sure if there was some kind of crowd suppression weapon that might be in there.

It's a really cool weapon. A lot of people are passing on it because it doesn't have Blast but S4, 15"/30" range, -1AP and seismic is still pretty good imho. I actually think it not having Blast is a misprint because it seems odd that the light carbine version affects a larger area than the apparently laser-focused "sound blast" of the heavier one.

question of my own: which bits are autopistols and which are stubguns? You'd think I wouldn't have such a hard time with this but all of the pistols look chunky enough to go either way.

Do Enforcers themselves have any options that aren't in the current box, or would I be safe playing around with what's there?

 Arbitrator wrote:

 Elbows wrote:
What I truly don't understand is that...plastic terrain is neat, but we have dozens and dozens of companies who put out attractive MDF style terrain that is easily used for Necromunda, for...1/3 or less the cost of this new plastic stuff. Are people that desperate for GW plastic that money is no option? (I understand the answer is essentially...yes).

Unfortunately, there's a large number of people who just will not touch a product that is not GW. This might be out of genuinely not knowing there's alternatives, but I'm continually amazed by how many do it out of honest brand loyalty.These are the same people who will gladly fork out £20 to buy Citadel(tm) clippers, will only buy from the GW webstore, etc.

In the case of Necromunda however, I think long-term this terrain is more meant for 40k/Kill-Team. They've decided to theme it as a Necromunda release to potentially shift more boxes of that game, but much like the Primaris-inspired designs of Enforcers, I see more people talking about it's potential use for 40k boards than Necromunda. It's audience tends to be a fair bit older and pretty much exclusively in LFGS/homes rather than GW stores, which means those people probably do already buy into MDF terrain or have made their own.

Bingo.

Plus, a base, a dry brush, some detailing and a wash and the plastic stuff looks ... more realistic in the immersive sense.
Same reason playing with unpainted models is a sin.

I love those enforcers for a local requisition and addition to an Inquisitor's amassed forces..

So figure they'll be 6 to a box for $40.

And I'll buy it anyway?

 Kanluwen wrote:
Do Enforcers themselves have any options that aren't in the current box, or would I be safe playing around with what's there?

They're missing the shock stave (I converted one by cutting two shock batons and making a longer double sided one lol) but besides that, and the ONE concussion carbine they have tied to a single arm option the kit is very solid imho. You can make pretty much any non-subjugator patrolman you want.
I had to cut up a shotgun and the concussion carbine to make a patrolman that didn't pose like a leader, though.

Does anyone know the rationale for the $290 US vs £175 UK? xe.com puts that exchange closer to $225 and £175 to the best of my knowledge includes 20% VAT which puts this closer to $180 US after the exchange.

I imagine this is in most other GW products at the moment, but this is the first time in recent years I've taken a look.

 Albertorius wrote:

phillv85 wrote:
Element usually do 20% if you pre-order it. I’m very much on the fence with this. That’s an expensive box!

It is stupidly expensive, and I already have a 3d printer that makes me walls.

Much in the same vein that I don't buy characters because I don't want to encourage GW to see those prices as rational, I won't buy this one either.

EDIT: I mean, hell, it might not be quite as nice, but...

Spoiler:

...well, that I have already.

How much does the plastic cost to print that pictured?

witchdoctor wrote:
Does anyone know the rationale for the $290 US vs £175 UK? xe.com puts that exchange closer to $225 and £175 to the best of my knowledge includes 20% VAT which puts this closer to $180 US after the exchange.

I imagine this is in most other GW products at the moment, but this is the first time in recent years I've taken a look.

Go and look up pretty much anything on GW's site and compare the prices, US prices are (as a rule of thumb) about 30% above the VAT price, Australia has it even worse.

witchdoctor wrote:
Does anyone know the rationale for the $290 US vs £175 UK? xe.com puts that exchange closer to $225 and £175 to the best of my knowledge includes 20% VAT which puts this closer to $180 US after the exchange.

I imagine this is in most other GW products at the moment, but this is the first time in recent years I've taken a look.

1t 175, 20% off, makes it 150USd - but maybe not given what I have just read above.
Not so heavy - complete game.

zamerion wrote:
it's hard to know how much each piece of the wall will measure, right?

No, it's incredibly easy. Just measure the walls printed on the Necromunda 2017 card tiles.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

zamerion wrote:
it's hard to know how much each piece of the wall will measure, right?

No, it's incredibly easy. Just measure the walls printed on the Necromunda 2017 card tiles.

The Sisters of terrain ...
I wondered why they didn't make more of that stuff for about a minute.
it was awesome.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

zamerion wrote:
it's hard to know how much each piece of the wall will measure, right?

No, it's incredibly easy. Just measure the walls printed on the Necromunda 2017 card tiles.

true

Thanks

 John Prins wrote:

 Elbows wrote:
So, lazy people? Working with MDF is literally easier than plastic and I've never had any MDF terrain break despite owning...tons of it. I suppose maybe I'm just not a ham-fisted oaf?

I own a decent amount of MDF terrain, and there are some issues with MDF terrain.

The first is it soaks up water easily, so you have to seal it before you can prime it, as most gamers use water based primers and paints. The same problem arises if you try to use PVA glue without sealing it.

The second is that it's more difficult to glue together, as gluing large surfaces together with superglue/gorilla glue is a bit of a trial compared to working with plastics.

The third is that it has less surface detail/contour, which makes the go to fast techniques of shading and drybrushing less useful.

To top it off in that it looks very plain compared to most plastic and resin terrain, so to many gamers it can look quite 'cheap'. In many cases you could build similar terrain to MDF out of foamcore for a fraction of MDF's cost, so 'bargain' DIY terrain is just as good as MDF in many cases.

Overall, plastic terrain looks better, is more detailed and usually easier to put together and paint, so it's no surprise a lot of people prefer it. I've got resin, plastic, MDF and commercial modular foam core terrain and I prefer plastics overall.

And I appreciate that you feel that way. As someone who owns numerous tables worth of MDF from a variety of manufacturers (only decent ones, I don't bother with the cheap stuff) I simply disagree.

I've never had a single instance where I struggled to glue MDF together (not sure how that's possible). Also not sure why people have an issue priming it - never had an issue myself. The only time I can see spraying being an issue is if you're using an airbrush and not wanting to prime. Surface detail depends entirely on the kit, and in some instances I'd agree with you - but extra surface detail isn't worth the cost of plastic terrain. All I'm seeing here are vague (and inaccurate) arguments trying to justify spending an obscene amount on plastic - that, let's be honest, will be poorly cut out, glued and rarely painted on 60% of the tables it'll feature on.

People seem to act like this plastic sprue stuff is the second coming of Christ and I'm just not seeing it...particularly for the cost.

MDF is flat and featureless. It looks like cardboard yet costs significantly more.

Well, seeing the amount of sprues in this thing, I can see GW charging 290 USD for it. Though if they do charge that I feel that it's more along the lines of one of their "get everything from this new release bundles" they have on their online store which offer no savings as opposed to a proper starter set.

As cool as the models and terrain are, I doubt I'll get this to table very often and at 290 USD I'm giving this a solid pass. More money for Slaves to Darkness I guess.

 Elbows wrote:


I've never had a single instance where I struggled to glue MDF together (not sure how that's possible).

I guess it depends on what kits you're buying.

 Elbows wrote:
All I'm seeing here are vague (and inaccurate) arguments trying to justify spending an obscene amount on plastic

Kinda weird that you'd say that. I think the GW plastic looks vastly superior to the MDF stuff, and I barely own any (a couple of the Knight Renegade sets). What's vague about that exactly?

witchdoctor wrote:
Does anyone know the rationale for the $290 US vs £175 UK? xe.com puts that exchange closer to $225

You know the current exchange is an anomaly, right? Pound used to be worth ~2$, only with Brexgak idiocy it had fallen to 1.3$ and GW tends to stick to course it had over longer period, not what it is right now, to avoid risks. Otherwise kits from a month ago would have been super cheap as the clowns in charge of UK crashed pound to record lows.

And really, cherry-picking exchange rates when pound is down is favourite tool of various GW bashing trolls who pick say 1.21$ it had a month ago, ignoring that price lasted an hour or two, and whine loudly GW doesn't instantly convert all prices to this (with shipping and taxes being provided by magical fairies, I suppose). When you see anyone starting argument with this, especially certain really dumb youtube gakposter, you know whatever follows is not really worth listening to and can be safely instantly discarded...

It could have twice as much in the box for the same price and you'd still have a similar reaction to it being that price. The problem is less relative value and just absolute price. I think the problem with the price point is its running up against and going beyond peoples "well if I don't eat I can" limit. At some point its just too much to justify no matter what's in the set. Even with 20% off its in a similar territory.

I'm going to skip this one, not because I can't afford it but because I'd rather see GW focus its effort making more accessible sets.

frankr wrote:

witchdoctor wrote:
Does anyone know the rationale for the $290 US vs £175 UK? xe.com puts that exchange closer to $225 and £175 to the best of my knowledge includes 20% VAT which puts this closer to $180 US after the exchange.

I imagine this is in most other GW products at the moment, but this is the first time in recent years I've taken a look.

Go and look up pretty much anything on GW's site and compare the prices, US prices are (as a rule of thumb) about 30% above the VAT price, Australia has it even worse.

GW has always charged an American tax and a Aussie tax. They didn't on Forgeworld up until when the pound plummited then they went fishing there. GW makes their own exchange rate and USA always pays almost a 30% tax.

This plus the fact that they raised the base price for box sets like Feast of Bones from 160 to 195... and on a box set like Warcryish like this set going from $170 to $290. I can no longer justify the price rediculousness that is GW.

I was known for impulse buys, but luckily Blood of Phoenix, and Feast of Bones changed that, I justified not getting Feast of bones as I was going to get this set, but at $290, the boycott continues. Maybe it will get to the same extent for me like it was for 6th and 7th edition where I just switched gaming entirely and stopped buying GW. 8th and AoS brougtht me back, but the prices might just push me out entirely.

The Pound hasn't been worth $2 US in more than a decade, and it's been just under 5 years since it was last above $1.5 US. It will be interesting to see what GW do if the Pound really crashes, it would get harder and harder to enforce their max discount and no-export policies.

 aka_mythos wrote:
It could have twice as much in the box for the same price and you'd still have a similar reaction to it being that price. The problem is less relative value and just absolute price. I think the problem with the price point is its running up against and going beyond peoples "well if I don't eat I can" limit. At some point its just too much to justify no matter what's in the set. Even with 20% off its in a similar territory.

At that price, it is no longer being compared to other GW products. You aren't going "well, it's only $10 more than a Start Collecting". You are going "It's $10 less than a Switch or an iPad". The value leaves the GW bubble, and leaves the hobby market bubble, and goes straight into the consumer electronics market - which isn't measured in "well, if I skip a few lunches" and instead is measured in "well, that might be my big purchase for the month" or "this will be my Christmas present to myself"... But there's only so many months and Christmases...

I think the contents of this box would do much better when sold separately, even if it ends up being more than $290 as a whole. People will be able to break the purchases up into multiple ones, spread out over weeks, and they won't have to pay for things they don't need or want (some just want the terrain, some just want the gangs). I mean, I'm considering getting the Book of Ruin, but not this. As a bundle this expensive, it really doesn't make sense. It's strange that these bundles, which are supposed to save you money, are so expensive that the savings are less important than buying it piecemeal.

But how much would GW charge for ‘just’ the terrain here?

I was thinking about picking this up, but not at this price.

I agree that GW seems to be testing the market here. And I don’t think they’ll like the results?

At least, I hope they don’t end up liking the results.

I still compare it to other hobby items, just at this price I'm now comparing it to Kingdom Death.

No One Important wrote:
I still compare it to other hobby items, just at this price I'm now comparing it to Kingdom Death.

I guess Kingdom Death did okay for itself, costing what it did. Maybe GW isn't crazy to think that people might pay such a cost?