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It was a surprising good survey. I used it as a platform to rant about the butchering of the lore recently, and how that has killed my enthusiasm for the games.

Also reminded them I'm still waiting on that plastic thunderhawk they teased.

I thought it was a good survey as well. I mentioned price as the biggest issue with me, but I was very positive about everything else. They charge quite a bit for these kits of unpainted/unassembled plastic that many of us buy the paint and glue to build them with directly from GW. I had to bug them about bringing back chaos dwarfs in a big way though... so we'll see if that works. Should have asked for plastic sisters as well.

Hi!

I basically stated as often and tactfully as I could.....

"'I want 6mm epic space marine back"....

..and let it at that.

Primarch1

 streetsamurai wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Dr. Mills wrote:
An actual survey that was well thought out for once!

Kind of. The problem with it is online surveys (and the people behind the surveys) don't do well with free text boxes, which I notice is what a lot of people are commenting on.

They're incredibly useful for determining that X system gets Y percentage of attention, while some other system gets much less percentage, and numerical analysis along those lines. So it should come to no one's surprise that when they look at the 'rank our current systems in order' question, 40k will almost certainly come out on top.

But you can't deal with text that way.

At some point some actually has to read it, and deal with all the different opinions, expressed in completely different ways, and then turn that into a meaningful report for a management team to kick up to someone who can actually make a decision based on it.
And that is hard. It's often easier to decide that just asking the questions convinces customers that the company is more involved and cares about their opinions. Then quietly put the results in a box somewhere, and possibly tell people that 'Top Men' are studying it.

There are some pretty strong software for doing text analysis nowadays. I don't know if GW has them, or have people skilled enough to use them, but the days of reading every comments are long gone

You misunderstand me. I know there is software for picking up text. But somewhere, someone along the line has to give a comprehensible report to someone (likely a group or committee) and that group has to have something actionable to take to someone who can actually make a decision, that says 'based on this, we need more units of <product line> and we can lower production of <other product>.' And hopefully delve a bit deeper than that, but I'm summarizing.

Getting 10,000 various statements that range from 'lower prices' to 'age of sigmar suxxx' to 'bring back squats' and everything in between plus a lot of things outside those bounds and frankly probably disturbing and/or incomprehensible. And, of course, a lot of blanks.
Yes you boil it down into groups and themes and discard probably most of it as trash or non-answers, but it still doesn't produce anything like 'XX% of those surveyed buy 40k but not bloodbowl' and other analytic statements along those lines.
At some point the data has to make the transition from what software automation captures to something people can do something with, preferably outside a power point. At that takes actual work, by people, not software automation.

No ‘Hashut’ in favourite Chaos god :(

Filled it out. Asked them to bring back the Old World, but not as the answer to every question.

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
A chance to tell GW to move to paint dripper bottles, or.. well... anything rather than the crappy pots it's in now.

Oh, and the constant renaming of stuff.
I don''t even know what my Ogre Kingdoms or Dark Eldar are called anymore.

The only poorly made question they asked was the one about which social media do you see. If the answer is none, they still forced you to choose, fb, twitter, youtube or twitch anyway.

Gah, Wish I read this before I did the survey! I'm in the same boat, literally no idea what half my armies are called anymore for either system.

Voss wrote:

Earth127 wrote:
To them it is, They sell you a hobby not a game. It's been a their line for ages. Or at least 6 years since that's when I started and they already said it then.

That's about when they started that nonsense.

It's way older than that, they were pushing that narrative back when I worked for them nearly 20 years ago.

I'm suddenly quite worried. (probably irrationally) I have been in the hobby since the 80's but Aos and Shadespire are two of my favourite things GW have everyone done. I can imagine GW looking at the data showing that 40k is overwhelmingly the most popular system and deciding that the systems that I like best will get less support. I think one of the best changes of modern GW is the increased variety of products. I really hope GW learns the right lessons from this survey.

Haha, there's loads more data from everything else(especially sales) showing that 40k is far more popular than Fantasy/AoS. Hasn't stopped them from giving bigger support to all their other games like LotR.

This survey will neither surprise them nor influence that support. This isn't the Kirby era anymore, that Stormcast statue is in front of their building to prove that the system with the actual Warhammer in it isn't getting left behind again.

I asked for mordheim, new styles of mortal humans in AoS, and asked them to do something model wise with rogue traders

Good suggestions.

@Willb2064,

Well for the fantasy armies you should probably get the AoS app. Just flicking through the factions will show you the warscrolls and their visual models to help you learn the changes.

willb2064 wrote:

Voss wrote:

Earth127 wrote:
To them it is, They sell you a hobby not a game. It's been a their line for ages. Or at least 6 years since that's when I started and they already said it then.

That's about when they started that nonsense.

It's way older than that, they were pushing that narrative back when I worked for them nearly 20 years ago.

Ah, well. No idea what they told the store staffers to say to people. The only time I had stores around me was the very first wave in the States, and those largely failed and closed.
But the game didn't present that, nor did WD really. At least not in the old days when it was worthwhile.

"What would you say is the biggest change we need to make to our web site?"

How about putting the factions in alphabetical order - is that so freaking hard to do?

Baron Klatz wrote:

so AoS players who really really love the fact that their setting is built on the carcass of WHF

Thank you, I shall.

We were thinking of ways to connect the settings and make crossovers, the salt wasn't needed.

It was meant as a good-natured poke, but whatever. The point was your objection only applies and your solution to it only becomes necessary if we preserve the present "WHF happened, the End Times happened, then AoS happens" linear sequence of events as being the single and only "reality" - shift AoS off into its own thing and restore WHF as it was in the time of Karl Franz with rumours of the dark powers rising again in the north yadda yadda etc and almost everyone gets what they want. Heck I've seen you extolling the virtues of having a more "open" setting to come up with stuff for, if the Warhammer World that AoS grows out of stops being the "proper" one then AoS fans can reimagine bits of that as well if they like.

Doing a "crossover" between the two settings defeats the entire point of bringing WHF back for my money - the reason I would want WHF to return is I don't find AoS appealing, and I'd find it even less appealing if I wander down the club for a game in the setting I like and someone plonks down a bunch of Stormcast who've come through the Plotdevicia Gateway.

Anyway, I don't actually expect GW to bring back WHF for decades if ever, they've evidently committed to making AoS a success in the way they refused to for WHF a few years back so that's that.

Okay but that's what we were discussing, a connected universe that can have AoS coming into the Old World.

Neither me nor Wildcard were considering you nor the other Old World purists at all and were spitballing ideas more for the pro/neutral AoS crowd. You kinda just butted in there.

(Mine was meant for a good natured poke as well, mind. )

Baron Klatz wrote:
Okay but that's what we were discussing, a connected universe that can have AoS coming into the Old World.

Neither me nor Wildcard were considering you nor the other Old World purists at all and were spitballing ideas more for the pro/neutral AoS crowd. You kinda just butted in there.

Aye, "butted in" on an open discussion topic

Anyway, I won't drag things OT any more, spitball away.

Haha, indeed.

Edit: You're a credit to the hobby, sir. Sorry for taking this off-topic as well.

Asked for plastic sisters, that and 1 more Sigmar faction I like are really the only things i still feel like I'm missing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Nogil wrote:
Done and done!
I was suprised by GWs survey, very well done!

Long story short:

Spoiler:

- Remove the paywall from their twitch, it would increase the amount of viewers as well as creating a better image of the company as a whole (instead of their pay to ask us a question about your new codex or w/e book it is) considering they have roughly 100-300 viewers
- Discount system and/or more boundles
- More multikits (like the swarmlord/hive tyrant HQ kit, but for other factions aswell, a lot of HQs would be able to build with multikits)
- Entire range in plastic
- Direct email and/or Q/A page to get anwsers more quickly from the rules team (as far as I know, you just email GW and they will forward it to the rules team, why not just directly to the rules team?)
- Remove comments blocking from their youtube (are they afraid of negative comments?)
- More Q/A with the game designers (now its like 5min on twitch, make it 30min-1hour)
- Even more surveys and / or community engagement, in that sense that they let the community ask them questions and / or more input from the community. Their 15player playtesting team cant do everything theirselves, also considering the backlash from CA.

In response to one of the questions in the spoiler, they don't have a direct email because they'd get 600 emails and hour and of those 470ish would be split into variations of either 'I didn't wanna read the rules all the way through, can you just tell me how everything works?' Or 'Can I do this thing I clearly am not allowed to because I want to?'


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Maniac_nmt wrote:
This sums up what I tended to badger them on:

10-man marine squad, 35 quid
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Space-Marines-Primaris-Reivers-2017

48-man, 25 quid
https://www.victrixlimited.com/collections/greek-ancients/products/athenian-armoured-hoplites-5th-to-3rd-century-bce-1

30-man squad, ~30 quid
https://us-store.warlordgames.com/collections/box-sets/products/british-airborne-1

24-man squad, ~24 quid
http://www.fireforge-games.com/webstore/middle-age/middle-age-1/templar-order/templar-infantry-details

Victrix sculpts are better then GW, sprues come with tons of options, and almost 5 times the amount of figs for less money. Bolt Action, get enough to play a small game in one box, lots of options, equivalent or better sculpts, and still cheaper. Fireforge has equivalent sculpts, comes with options, could build a saga force out of a single infantry box, and cheaper. There is 0 reason for the prices GW charges other than because they can.

The only way the stuff about sculpts in that last paragraph is true is if you linked to the wrong websites.

Let's see... void in what parts of the world.

Oh. New South Wales. Right where I live. How nice.


Anyway, I told them to keep making cool terrain, put the rules first, hire some actual fething proofreaders, and to cut the gak with the 2x prices in places outside of the UK and US.

I wasted my anything else on saying 'Magnus did nothing wrong', and now I regret wasting the opportunity.

I asked for Print on Demand legacy rule books.

They've sort of done it with Rogue Trader (WW and Event Exclusive), why not the Orky books etc?

I'd buy them for the background alone, me.

 Maniac_nmt wrote:
This sums up what I tended to badger them on:

10-man marine squad, 35 quid
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Space-Marines-Primaris-Reivers-2017

48-man, 25 quid
https://www.victrixlimited.com/collections/greek-ancients/products/athenian-armoured-hoplites-5th-to-3rd-century-bce-1

30-man squad, ~30 quid
https://us-store.warlordgames.com/collections/box-sets/products/british-airborne-1

24-man squad, ~24 quid
http://www.fireforge-games.com/webstore/middle-age/middle-age-1/templar-order/templar-infantry-details

Victrix sculpts are better then GW, sprues come with tons of options, and almost 5 times the amount of figs for less money. Bolt Action, get enough to play a small game in one box, lots of options, equivalent or better sculpts, and still cheaper. Fireforge has equivalent sculpts, comes with options, could build a saga force out of a single infantry box, and cheaper. There is 0 reason for the prices GW charges other than because they can.

100-man ~10 quid
https://www.amazon.com/TimMee-PLASTIC-ARMY-MEN-Soldier/dp/B005LDBCC6
By TimMee. AND they are pre-painted!!!
Sculpts better/equivalent to GW, made in USA, not from a cheap Chinese factory, enough minis for a game, many unique dynamic poses, rulebook is free. Sheesh, GW, why are you so expensive.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I asked for Print on Demand legacy rule books.

So did I - and reminded them that Gorkamorka, Mighty Empires, Dark Future and the Battle for Armageddon board game used to be available as free PDFs.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I asked for Print on Demand legacy rule books.

They've sort of done it with Rogue Trader (WW and Event Exclusive), why not the Orky books etc?

I'd buy them for the background alone, me.

Good idea! Waaagh! Orks would be an instant buy from me.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I asked for Print on Demand legacy rule books.

So did I - and reminded them that Gorkamorka, Mighty Empires, Dark Future and the Battle for Armageddon board game used to be available as free PDFs.

I don't mind Gorkamorka etc not being done, as there's still a decent chance it'll be folded into Necromunda anyway with vehicle rules in the Ash Wastes (as Necromunda is part of the Heresy Weekender, I'd say the game is very much here to stay). So saving it until then makes sense.

But for previous editions of 40k and Warhams? Not really competing with anything, other than a pricey 2nd Hand market.

... We could combine two of your requests, in a way - could we have the tiles from Advanced Heroquest and the 90s Warhammer Quest re-done astile packs for the new Warhammer Quest?

90's Quest? Absolutely! But, if memory serves, they managed to lose the floor plan masters when they moved from Chewton Treetops to Warhammer World?

I'd love to see it done. Not sure how print-on-demand floor tiles work though - may not be practical? But hey, that's GW's worry. Let's just keep telling them what we want to see, and they can sort out the feasibility and logistics.

They asked us how much we buy from them annually. I'd be astonished if they paid any attention to those who fell outside the two highest options.

I tried not to rant and to pay compliments where they were due (ie the last 18 months has seen a great turn around in interaction with the customer-base, previews, re-introduction of specialist games), but also point out that the new 40k lore is really unimpressive and that if regular marines are done away with then I'm finished and other companies like Wyrd start taking all my hobby cash. Updating ancient/finecast models is preferable to new factions, please don't have questions like the one which demands you pick a social media outlet and provides no 'I don't use your social media platforms' option, it'll distort your data.

 zedmeister wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
I'm sure we'll get new Squats real soon.

Feck, I forgot to ask for more Squats!

Don't worry, I didn't (nor did a whole load of folk I'd suspect...)!

Wish I'd asked for Thrud back in WD tho!

 Archroy wrote:

 zedmeister wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
I'm sure we'll get new Squats real soon.

Feck, I forgot to ask for more Squats!

Don't worry, I didn't (nor did a whole load of folk I'd suspect...)!

Wish I'd asked for Thrud back in WD tho!

So many forgotten things, so little time!

I do regret not asking for more Warhammer Quest. Hopefully it's not too much of a problem because it's still an active product and they'll have sales numbers to derive popularity from.

 Stormonu wrote:
"What would you say is the biggest change we need to make to our web site?"

How about putting the factions in alphabetical order - is that so freaking hard to do?

As they game armies silly names, alphabetical lists would be worse than what they have now. At least they're grouped with other armies you might know the names of.

Didn't they do a survey not long after the website relaunched? This was around the time of the CHS legal battle, and before the website looked like it does now.