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 Mantle wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Emeraldw wrote:
I agree with the concern about the issues with scourges and Incubi.

Not that they should receive traits, but because including them breaks the patrol detachment involved and they lose benefits as a result.

I guess you need to always take an extra patrol for your outsiders guys. Which is just akward.

You couldn't take them in a Patrol for your argument anyways. You would take Vanguard or Outrider Detachments, either of which would give you 3 Command Points each.

I'm about 99% sure at this juncture that it was mentioned they do not count against you for the purposes of your Detachment, it just has to be purely Kabal, Cult, or Covens.

Vanguard and outrider only give you 1CP each.
I imagine that they will have a rule for "free agents" that means they don't effect the trait of their parent detachment as they're hired bodyguards etc.

Thanks for that, I don't know why I went and put 3 each.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/03/30/codex-drukhari-preview-stratagemsgw-homepage-post-3/

And here's the images:
Stratagems:

Incubi related stuff:

As free agents of Commorragh, Incubi are free to fight with who they choose, and while they don’t benefit from Drukhari Obsessions, you’ll also be able to take them in your lists without having to worry about losing yours. We’d recommend combining this Stratagem with Drazhar in particular – after all, he can now fight twice in the turn he charges.

I really like Lightning Fast Reactions. When you know they're about to focus down on something you need to keep alive (or force them to spend even more firepower eliminating).

Good stuff.

Gonna go doublecheck the wording, but I'm pretty sure you can combo Agents of Vect with Labyrinthine Cunning to (attempt to) generate CP and then deny them using their stratagem. MWAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA!

Edit: yep! They spend the CP, you roll for Labyrinthine Cunning, then you play Agents of Vect, then you roll Labyrinthine Cunning AGAIN.

Glad to see that unaligned units explicitly do not block Obsession benefits. I've got plans for my 3x5 Blaster Scourges units, you see...

Agents of Vect is pricey, but I can see that being pretty huge agains't certain stratagems. Crucible is underwhelming though, went from standard issue gear, to one use per army and costing CP while still being hit or miss.

Agent of vect is probably worth it. There are some armies really rely on their big stratagems.

They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

Soul Trap's OK, will depend on any changes they've made to the Archon. At present there isn't a character out there that he can kill.

Lightning Fast Reactions is almost the same as it is for Craftworlders and it's not really much use with them at 2CP. It makes no sense that it doesn't work on Haemonculus Coven vehicles.

Agents of Vect sounds brilliant, expensive but really cool.

Onslaughts a very nice strat for Incubi, Craftworlds have a similar strat that I get good use out of but this one is strictly better since 6's count as 2 hits rather than generating an extra attack.

Nice improvement to Drazhars Murderous Assault ability.

This is the first preview that for me has been entirely a swing and a miss.

Only stratagem I'd ever consider using here on a regular basis is the incubi "fight a little better" one, and it's unfortunate that it doesn't actually combo with Drazar's buff or the turn 3 buff (can't do that, might make Drazar actually have a point!). That's going to be entirely dependent on a buff to Incubi as well to make them more compelling.

Haemonculus Psyker-tickler was weak as a free piece of wargear you could use once per haemonculus per battle. It's even more situational as a 2cp once per battle period stratagem. Other than a way to rub a GK player's nose in it for daring the play GKs, I don't see a ton of utilty in this. Kabal of the Black Heart strat would be good for 2cp, very questionable for 3cp. I can see it being OK for dunking stuff like the Tau/Guard "hit that model a whole bunch" strat, Wrath of Mars, something like that, but there aren't a ton of army lists revolving around one crucial strat that we can counter here.

Ironically, I could see a "Tons of CP" strategy, where you take Black Heart for the Warlord trait, Haemonculus coven with the CP trait, and hopefully there's a CP-related Wych Cult trait, so you grab that as well, and then you take some kind of big centerpiece model....like say...Vect in a Tantalus, and you counter your opponents attempts to use stratagems to bring it down.

So basically, this is where I'd put my big centerpiece named HQ....IF I HAD ONE!!!

-1 to hit stratagem is the exact same one CWE get for 1cp, but ours costs 2. Feelsbadman. I guess its because CWE don't get as many -1 to hit units and traits as dark eldar? Wait..no, that's not right, CWE can stack up to -3 to hit on some units using that stratagem...

People havent you play against BA bombs or poxwalker farms?! That Vect stratagem basically kill those armies! Its a situational stratagem ok but it can absolutely desteoy some lists

 Imateria wrote:
They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

You say "what moron thought this was a good idea?", I say "Christ where can I get one of these to run it up into a bunch of Synapse critters!"

That Vect stratagem is a game changer. Having a chance to block un-blockable stratagems is huge.

CWE strat also costs 2CP, not 1

 Imateria wrote:
They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

It went from a relic that would have never been taken to a stratagem which may occasionally be used.

 Galas wrote:
People havent you play against BA bombs or poxwalker farms?! That Vect stratagem basically kill those armies! Its a situational stratagem ok but it can absolutely desteoy some lists

this.

 Galas wrote:
People havent you play against BA bombs or poxwalker farms?! That Vect stratagem basically kill those armies! Its a situational stratagem ok but it can absolutely desteoy some lists

^This guy gets it.

Plus with labrynthine cunning it's usually going to cost less.


Also, strange folks don't think LF Reflexes strong. Having -2 to hit mandrakes or razorwing JF, or a bomb of hellions seems very good to me. If it was only 1 CP it would be beyond busted, auto use ever phase until your broke.


I think this preview made the critical error of putting the worst stratagem we have seen yet front and center, and them saying they chose it because it's their favorite None of the others are bad and some are meta shifting.

 bullyboy wrote:
CWE strat also costs 2CP, not 1

Ah, buddy of mine making me look like a dummy, you're right. He read the preview and said "CWE get that for 1".

the_scotsman wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
CWE strat also costs 2CP, not 1

Ah, buddy of mine making me look like a dummy, you're right. He read the preview and said "CWE get that for 1".

Nah it's definitely 2, it's very strong on key units during the first few turns as well.

Yes, Agents of Vect is the most trolltastic Strategem I've seen. Love it.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Imateria wrote:
They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

You say "what moron thought this was a good idea?", I say "Christ where can I get one of these to run it up into a bunch of Synapse critters!"

Not all Synapse Creatures are Psykers, and having used the Crucible against Thousand Sons, Tzeentch Daemons and Grey Knights a few times I know for a fact it doesn't do much, but at least it used to be free before.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ghaz wrote:

 Imateria wrote:
They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

It went from a relic that would have never been taken to a stratagem which may occasionally be used.

No, it went from a free piece of wargear that would occasionally get used for disappointing results to a 2CP stratagem that will never, ever be used.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Agents of Vect is pricey, but I can see that being pretty huge agains't certain stratagems. Crucible is underwhelming though, went from standard issue gear, to one use per army and costing CP while still being hit or miss.

Actually I think it's much better as a strategem as you won't be taking useless gear against armies that don't have psychers.
Whether or not it gets used at all is a different story though, might be useful in a pinch of you have a couple of spare Cp.

 Imateria wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 Imateria wrote:
They've succeded in making the horribly mediocre Crucible of Malediction even worse. It's gone from a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game to a short range, 50/50 chance to hurt Psykers once per game for 2CP. What moron thought this was a good idea?

It went from a relic that would have never been taken to a stratagem which may occasionally be used.

No, it went from a free piece of wargear that would occasionally get used for disappointing results to a 2CP stratagem that will never, ever be used.

Depends on what it could have been in the codex, be it a relic or a standard piece of gear (free or not). Regardless it is an option and not just gone altogether.

Agents of vect is potentially a game changing strategem. Anything from chaos marines cacophony, to blood angels assult, to untargetable poxwalkers, to eldar seer council can just be shut down. Boom. End of story.

Strategem combos are what make top tier lists and even the prospect of having to fact this makes any strategy unreliable and thus meta shifting.

Yeah, the art direction is great! Exactly what I want my evil, gritty, Space elves to look like.

Another thing that potentially offsets the high CP costs of some of these stratagems is that not only do you get the ONE really solid CP regenerating warlord trait from Black Heart, you can potentially have THREE cp spamming traits (assuming the Wych Cults get a command-based trait of some sort)

If you combine Labyrinthine Cunning (Your Command Points+Opponent's Command Points)/6 with the Soothsayer trait from the most competitive Haemonculus Coven (+D3 at the start of the battle) you're going to see a lot of extra points.

Anticipating roughly 3 points from LC in a game, you can get 5 extra from these 2 traits on average plus any Wych CP trait.

Which essentially amounts to canceling their best strat once for free. Which is why it's so incredibly auto take IMO. I think a lot of folks are underestimating Black Heart, sure kabalite gun boats are fun, but these two elements plus vehicles shrugging wounds on a 6 are all super strong. Just use cult or coven to clear hordes.

This codex looks exceptional. Possibly the best designed codex we've seen, at least in terms of everything fitting together. Point values may or may not be an issue but black heart alone could change tournament meta with agents of vect, making eldar soup even scarier.

I'm honestly curious how good this will be. I don't really play against dark eldar very often, but they certainly look strong from these previews.

SilverAlien wrote:
This codex looks exceptional. Possibly the best designed codex we've seen, at least in terms of everything fitting together. Point values may or may not be an issue but black heart alone could change tournament meta with agents of vect, making eldar soup even scarier.

I'm honestly curious how good this will be. I don't really play against dark eldar very often, but they certainly look strong from these previews.

Couldn't agree more. The faction and stratagem synergy looks fantastic. We'll see what kind of buffs/nerfs the individual units get when we get the codex in hand.

Can you reroll a '1' from the Vect stratagem by using the reroll stratagem?