Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
2018/06/06 17:06:02
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
rvd1ofakind wrote: No. Guard take a trait for their CP and an artifact for their opponent's CP(or vise versa, I can't recall :p). If something works on both - its only on a 6(like admech)
Both grand strategist (trait) and kurovs aquila (relic) gives the guard player 1 CP on a 5+. GS let's him roll for every CP he spends and KA is for every opponent's stratagem. That combo is insane, that's why you see it in pretty much every imperial soup army.
2018/06/06 18:22:50
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Well yeah. That's what I said. He said it a trait works on both you and opponent. I said it was a combo of 2 things.
So the Necron trait isn't worse than their trait. It's the same.
Inevitableq wrote: Tried this list for a few games. It worked very well for me.
Spoiler:
Sautekh battalion
Immotekh
Chronotek ,SoL , veil
2x10 tesla immortal
1x10 gauss immortal
1x6 destroyers
3x DDA
Nephrek aux detachment
1x6 destroyer(in deepstrike)
7-8 cp after deepstrike
Any thoughts or opinions?
I never even thought of doing a Nephrek Aux Detachment, ive been struggling to fill the right balance in that Dynasty and get the HQ and spam scarabs, it might be best to do what you have here. I would drop the gauss immortals, take some scarabs.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
rvd1ofakind wrote: No. Guard take a trait for their CP and an artifact for their opponent's CP(or vise versa, I can't recall :p). If something works on both - its only on a 6(like admech)
Correct, they take GRAND Strategist WL Trait and the Aquila Relic I believe it is. On a 5+ they get a Command point back when spent for their WLT. The relic lets them get a CP every time their opponent uses a Stratagem (its not per CP) so if you use a 3 CP stratagem, they only get 1 roll for a 5+.
But yeah, guard have Crazy high CP farm, mostly because they have the cheapest Battallion in the game.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/06 19:28:57
10000+
10000+
8500+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
rvd1ofakind wrote: "but part of the problem is the ITC guys removing all the value in having a low-drop army, leaving the 20 drop armies with a 40% chance of going first instead of 17%."
The ITC has nothing to do with it. GW changed all their missions to be +1 to go first instead of auto go first in chapter aproved.
Which was a direct result of ITC doing it from day one.
However, this format is much better than the original imbalance where low drop armies always went first.
I wonder what they were thinking with auto go first. Knight army? First almost every game. MSU army with no transports? (admech) sucks to be you. You'll go 1st 1/6th of all games you play!
They were thinking that you get more CP playing the latter and you get to outdeploy your opponent which makes up for going last 5/6 times. Current ITC missions also favour going second, I think if you play ITC missions the game is more fair if the player with the fewest drops goes first assuming one army is spamming and the other is not. It gets really iffy when one player just has one less unit than the other and therefore gets to alpha strike, but making missions that favour going second helps that a lot.
I played another couple of games game with a Nihilakh Monolith and again the Monolith continues to do poorly. Canoptek Spyder was garbage.
First game was against Harlequins I think it was ITC, Monolith gets destroyed turn 2 after doing a couple of wounds, my opponent did sink a lot of haywire into it, but there is basically no way to avoid 24" guns on 20" M models. The problem is that the Monolith is really expensive point per wound-wise.
As for the rest, I got completely outmanouvered and my shooting failed to do anything of any real value, I lost the game big time. Canoptek Spyder did nothing all game.
Second game was against a Numarine Deathwatch army which was good at running and shooting. He went first and just had too much firepower to deal with. He left my Monolith alone and it did nothing all game, I used the +1 Sv strat on it, but he didn't feel like shooting at it regardless because he knew it wasn't worth his firepower.
Lost the game, Transcendent C'tan did 20 or so MWs in two turns which was pretty cool, lot better than Monolith definitely...
I also played with my double Monolith army against a BA/Sisters army in an ITC match, except I didn't take any Monoliths. I lost, but only because of having terrible rolls.
1 Imotekh the Stormlord WL (hyperlogical strategist) 200 200
1 Lord (hyperphase sword + the veil of darkness) 76 76
9 Immortals (tesla carbines) 153 153
9 Immortals (tesla carbines) 153 153
9 Immortals (tesla carbines) 153 153
6 Destroyers (gauss cannons) 300 300
1 Doomsday Ark 193 193
1 Doomsday Ark 193 193
1 Illuminor Szeras 143 143
6 Canoptek Wraiths 330 330
4 Canoptek Scarabs 52 52
4 Canoptek Scarabs 52 52
I moved 18" with my Wraiths and surrounded his flyer full of Death Company. I shot my DDA's main gun (not moved) and its flayer arrays (rapid fire) into his Stormraven and did 2 wounds. Used the Sautekh Strat for +1 to hit. I fired Immotekh's staff, Immotekh's lighting, Szeras, a moving DDA's main weapon and did another 1 wound. I was going to finish it off with the Immortals, but decided to shoot them at some scouts instead, 27 Immortals killed 9 scouts.
My 6 Destroyers (with the Stratagem) and the flayer arrays from my moving DDA into his 3++ 6+ FNP Captain did 4 wounds.
On turn two I attacked with my Lord, Szeras and 2 Wraiths and did a total of 1 damage against a unit of BA golden boys.
It wound up being a pretty close game, my opponent rolled about the same as me for the rest of the game, but my lack of damage turn 1 hurt a lot. I got a little too loose with my CP and ended up overspending. When Imotekh killed Celestine once I thought he could repeat it, he couldn't and I had no CP left to revive him.
I also played a game with a couple of Sautekh Tesseract Vaults, a Nihilakh Gauss Pylon and a small Battalion against a Guard Brigade with a side of Celestine and Blood Angels characters. I'm not sure if you're allowed to take Sautekh Tesseract Vaults in a Nihilakh Detachment? I didn't use the Sautekh Strat so it wouldn't have mattered, but it'd be nice to know. I deployed my Pylon before he deployed his tanks and I agreed it was possible to place them so they couldn't be seen, I could see them but didn't want to go back on my word. My opponent grabbed first turn and destroyed a Vault and half of my Pylon. It was a bit greedy to deploy the Pylon for the re-roll 1s, but I did have fewer drops and I thought I needed everything I could get to win even if I went first, but my saying my opponent was out of sight forced my Pylon to shoot at Sentinels. Definitely gotta look at things from your opponent's angle, because from his angle I had clear LOS, but there was just so much gak in the way I couldn't be sure from my side.
I also played a game with my updated Anrakyr/Szeras list and won against a Harlequin list that featured a lot of troupes with fusion pistols but no close combat weapons.
I forgot to fire my MWBD Immortals turn 1, I forgot that you measure from the base of Harlequin vehicles which let his WL and a troupe escape getting crushed by Scarabs. I forgot to use Szeras ability. I forgot to charge with my Scarabs turn 2. So basically I played about as badly as I could have. I lost Szeras and Anrakyr and nothing else. He only had his Solitair with 4 wounds left after turn 3. I rolled pretty poorly and he rolled really well, I'm wondering if he played 1500 pts or something. Triarch Praetorians were amazing, D2, AP 4 and S7 isn't really worth giving up the mobility of Praetorians for I don't think. Anrakyr-buffed Warriors chew through clowns like no tomorrow.
Doctoralex wrote: So I wanted to discuss whether to take 3x min troops + HQ just for the battalion CP, or invest some more into them and make them into a proper part of your army.
Actually, I was *just* experimenting with that idea.
I came up with a double battalion that had six 9x Immortal units with 3x Overlords + Imotekh to be able to MWBD every single one of them via Pharons Will. Considering adding a regular Lord for extra to-wound killiness. Was able to fit some DDAs and Scarabs, too. I don't have that many Immortals on hand so I can't really test it, but if anyone else wants to try-
I posted a 6x Tesla Immortal list earlier, but I played Nephrekh, which turned out to be a huge mistake when I went up against a big blob of Plaguebearer's that were -2 and Magnus that was -1 and which would have gone down a lot easier with Sautekh.
Not taking a Cryptek and a Lord seems like a big mistake. Consider dropping the DDAs in favour of Heavy Destroyers and and some characters. I just don't think it's worth it to do a double Battalion. 27 Immortals will already deal quite well with hordes and after that you still get DDAs that can move and shoot decently if you really need to push forward and deal with hordes. Does Sautekh even need this much CP? You're going to have 19,5 CP on average, you've definitely gone past the point of deminishing returns. The likelihood of having a Sautekh Strat target each turn seems pretty low, even with a re-roll in each of your shooting phases and your opponent's shooting phases and quantum deflection, you're still flush with CP. C'tan and Destroyers are better than DDAs at eating CP, so maybe take those instead? Take a Tesseract Vault and feed it all your CP?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/07 13:19:42
2018/06/07 14:07:10
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Ok peepz next up for me is a whole different ball game from the Space Wolves a full codex RavenGuard not managed to crack these guys yet any advice would be much appreciated I am thinking Sautekh to eliminate the -1 to hit via MWBD loving Imothekh at the moment and some Nephrekh deepstrike goodness and was thinking how to best get Melee in there back lines warsythe Lychguard to take out their tanks they have a lot of +1 to hit fly and that strafing run thing so the flyers must die so not quite sure who’s best to target them as the destroyers will be trying to take out his Hellblasters and potentially his tanks DDA would be an obvious option CTan to dish mortal wounds and engage a flyer in CC along with scarabs they also sometimes run 2 assassins soooo annoying needing some destroy turn 1 tactics for them please any other thoughts would be much appreciated to keep the winning streak on
Dunno about you guys, but I'm starting to think a Vault in a 2000 point list might not be so great after all.
Here's why:
1: Why the Vault does a great deal of mortal wounds, these are all directed towards hordes or MSU's. The vault has no way if doing consistent damage to bigger threats.
2: Probably the biggest reason; it will soak up ALL the enemy's anti-tank. Since there are no other ideal targets for them (DDA's have QS, Destroyers are probably dead to small arms/special weapons fire or waiting in reserve. (same for Wraiths). While the Vault can tank a punch, if there are no other armoured threats he will go down easily. Especially since he needs to get close in order to do his thing.
Another important aspect of NOT having a Vault, is that there aren't any juicy targets for the opponents anti-tank. I've had plenty of matches were, after dealing with the Destroyers, the enemy almost didn't bother to fire it's Lascannons. There simply weren't any targets left for them.
3: Just... just look at what you can do with that many points!
- 2DDA's and 120 points to spare.
-10 Destroyers
-9 Wraiths
-16! Tomb Blades (no upgrades though)
Doesn't that just sound so much more powerful than the Vault to you?
2018/06/07 18:55:12
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Agree. I played against a triple vault list using ITC and won, only killed 2 of them. They give up crazy secondaries with Titan slayer, and I was playing horde nids. He did have some nasty mortal wounds T1, but After that they strated degrading and he started failing to cast his powers. You also don't have a lot of board control, few CP's, and none of the Dynasties really benefit the Vaults, MAYBE Mephrit with its guns, but you really are using Mortal wound spam more than anything.
Transcendent Ctan though, might be a different story, those guys look pretty good for CC. Supported with Lychguard, flayed ones scarabs or wraiths could go all CC
10000+
10000+
8500+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
Dynas wrote: Agree. I played against a triple vault list using ITC and won, only killed 2 of them. They give up crazy secondaries with Titan slayer, and I was playing horde nids. He did have some nasty mortal wounds T1, but After that they strated degrading and he started failing to cast his powers. You also don't have a lot of board control, few CP's, and none of the Dynasties really benefit the Vaults, MAYBE Mephrit with its guns, but you really are using Mortal wound spam more than anything.
Transcendent Ctan though, might be a different story, those guys look pretty good for CC. Supported with Lychguard, flayed ones scarabs or wraiths could go all CC
Well there is the argument that they have the C'Tan Shards keyword and thus wouldn't get the -1 for their teslas. (as CTan Shards are not friends with benefits when it comes to dynasties)
2018/06/07 20:41:19
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Dynas wrote: Agree. I played against a triple vault list using ITC and won, only killed 2 of them. They give up crazy secondaries with Titan slayer, and I was playing horde nids. He did have some nasty mortal wounds T1, but After that they strated degrading and he started failing to cast his powers. You also don't have a lot of board control, few CP's, and none of the Dynasties really benefit the Vaults, MAYBE Mephrit with its guns, but you really are using Mortal wound spam more than anything.
Transcendent Ctan though, might be a different story, those guys look pretty good for CC. Supported with Lychguard, flayed ones scarabs or wraiths could go all CC
Well there is the argument that they have the C'Tan Shards keyword and thus wouldn't get the -1 for their teslas. (as CTan Shards are not friends with benefits when it comes to dynasties)
The Vault definitely has the Dynasty key along with Necron key word so I am sure that they do benefit from the rules, the actual Shards DONT have Dynasty key words so don’t benefit from the Dynasty goodness
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/07 20:54:08
2018/06/07 20:43:35
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Dynas wrote: Agree. I played against a triple vault list using ITC and won, only killed 2 of them. They give up crazy secondaries with Titan slayer, and I was playing horde nids. He did have some nasty mortal wounds T1, but After that they strated degrading and he started failing to cast his powers. You also don't have a lot of board control, few CP's, and none of the Dynasties really benefit the Vaults, MAYBE Mephrit with its guns, but you really are using Mortal wound spam more than anything.
Transcendent Ctan though, might be a different story, those guys look pretty good for CC. Supported with Lychguard, flayed ones scarabs or wraiths could go all CC
Well there is the argument that they have the C'Tan Shards keyword and thus wouldn't get the -1 for their teslas. (as CTan Shards are not friends with benefits when it comes to dynasties)
The Vault definitely has the Dynasty key along with Necron key word so I am sure that they do benefit from the rules
The Dynastic Code section state the C'Tan Shards never benefit from Dynastic Codes, doesn't it? Don't have my book with me right now.
2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress 2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
2018/06/07 21:21:54
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
The vault has both CTAN SHARDS and DYNASTY. This means you dont get the dynasty benefits, but you can use their stratagems. Want to make your vault (almost) unkillable ? Make it nihilakh, place it within 3" of an objective marker, or dont move it, and play the nihilakh strat where you get +1 to sv rolls. And because the strat is used outside of a phase, at the end of your turn, you can play it as many times as you want. Play it twice and your vault gets a 2++ invuln sv. That will cost you 4 CP, though.
2018/06/08 00:20:38
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Dynas wrote: Agree. I played against a triple vault list using ITC and won, only killed 2 of them. They give up crazy secondaries with Titan slayer, and I was playing horde nids. He did have some nasty mortal wounds T1, but After that they strated degrading and he started failing to cast his powers. You also don't have a lot of board control, few CP's, and none of the Dynasties really benefit the Vaults, MAYBE Mephrit with its guns, but you really are using Mortal wound spam more than anything.
Transcendent Ctan though, might be a different story, those guys look pretty good for CC. Supported with Lychguard, flayed ones scarabs or wraiths could go all CC
Well there is the argument that they have the C'Tan Shards keyword and thus wouldn't get the -1 for their teslas. (as CTan Shards are not friends with benefits when it comes to dynasties)
The Vault definitely has the Dynasty key along with Necron key word so I am sure that they do benefit from the rules, the actual Shards DONT have Dynasty key words so don’t benefit from the Dynasty goodness
There isnt a debate here though, the codex states clearly that any C'tan shards do not benefit from codes. There isnt an exception for it just because it also has <dynasty>. Vaults do not get codes, period. The <dynasty> just allows them to use strategems.
The list mentioned above with 2 sautekh vaults and a nihilakh pylon, the list is legal but the pylon wont get to use the nihilakh reroll. In order to get codes the whole detatchment needs to be nihilakh.
2018/06/08 01:41:06
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
There isnt a debate here though, the codex states clearly that any C'tan shards do not benefit from codes. There isnt an exception for it just because it also has <dynasty>. Vaults do not get codes, period. The <dynasty> just allows them to use strategems.
The list mentioned above with 2 sautekh vaults and a nihilakh pylon, the list is legal but the pylon wont get to use the nihilakh reroll. In order to get codes the whole detatchment needs to be nihilakh.
This bit is correct. It's in the "code of war" section (p. 108) in the back that describes the codes and how they work. Just looked it up. Even with the dynasty keyword it gains no benefit.
2018/06/08 06:41:17
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Curious79 wrote: Ok peepz next up for me is a whole different ball game from the Space Wolves a full codex RavenGuard not managed to crack these guys yet any advice would be much appreciated I am thinking Sautekh to eliminate the -1 to hit via MWBD loving Imothekh at the moment and some Nephrekh deepstrike goodness and was thinking how to best get Melee in there back lines warsythe Lychguard to take out their tanks they have a lot of +1 to hit fly and that strafing run thing so the flyers must die so not quite sure who’s best to target them as the destroyers will be trying to take out his Hellblasters and potentially his tanks DDA would be an obvious option CTan to dish mortal wounds and engage a flyer in CC along with scarabs they also sometimes run 2 assassins soooo annoying needing some destroy turn 1 tactics for them please any other thoughts would be much appreciated to keep the winning streak on
This is kind of what I was thinking would really want more mortal wounds output Take tomb blades out for a CTan?
Make your entire army Mephrit. Take a Monolith and use the Deceiver to bring it up the table, that allows you to get within 12" on turn 1 with your Monolith and one of your units on the table so you get AP -1 but also ignore the -1 to hit modifier. Use Veil of Darkness to bring another unit up.
Your opponent doesn't own scouts does he? Yeah, Monoliths suck. C'tan are going to be pretty good I imagine, even killing scouts is somewhat worth it and once you've blown through those you can really start to do some damage. Melee units can ignore the -1 to hit altogether as well, making them another solid choice. Tesla won't work because of Marine saves. Marines in my experience also lack units that are tough enough to warrant the +1 to hit. If you don't have other models I think Mephrit would work out better for your tesla Immortals, Sautekh Immortals are going to be useless if you're playing on a crowded board, you'll be paying to ignore cover every single turn.
The list mentioned above with 2 sautekh vaults and a nihilakh pylon, the list is legal but the pylon wont get to use the nihilakh reroll. In order to get codes the whole detatchment needs to be nihilakh.
What about "so long as every other unit in their Detachment is from the same dynasty (with the exception of those listed below)" (Tesseract Vault is listed below).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/08 06:47:08
2018/06/08 11:54:53
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Last three games in a row (at my LFGS or on Tabletop Simulator) I got absolutely destroyed ;(
Someone please just... toss me an army list that works.....
Nephrek Batallion
Cryptek w/ Chrono
Overlord with WS/ VoD, Warlord
3x5 Immortals w/ Tesla
2x6 Destroyers
x8 TB with Gauss, Shieldvanes, x2 Shadowloom
Sautekh Spearhead
Cryptek with Cloak
x3 DDA
Should come out to 1999 points. Its got great firepower. No assault elements however, and weaker scoring elements, so expect the destroyers and TB to be pulling double duty on objectives and killing to back the minimal immortal squads up.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/06/08 12:34:41
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Curious79 wrote: Ok peepz next up for me is a whole different ball game from the Space Wolves a full codex RavenGuard not managed to crack these guys yet any advice would be much appreciated I am thinking Sautekh to eliminate the -1 to hit via MWBD loving Imothekh at the moment and some Nephrekh deepstrike goodness and was thinking how to best get Melee in there back lines warsythe Lychguard to take out their tanks they have a lot of +1 to hit fly and that strafing run thing so the flyers must die so not quite sure who’s best to target them as the destroyers will be trying to take out his Hellblasters and potentially his tanks DDA would be an obvious option CTan to dish mortal wounds and engage a flyer in CC along with scarabs they also sometimes run 2 assassins soooo annoying needing some destroy turn 1 tactics for them please any other thoughts would be much appreciated to keep the winning streak on
This is kind of what I was thinking would really want more mortal wounds output Take tomb blades out for a CTan?
Make your entire army Mephrit. Take a Monolith and use the Deceiver to bring it up the table, that allows you to get within 12" on turn 1 with your Monolith and one of your units on the table so you get AP -1 but also ignore the -1 to hit modifier. Use Veil of Darkness to bring another unit up.
Your opponent doesn't own scouts does he? Yeah, Monoliths suck. C'tan are going to be pretty good I imagine, even killing scouts is somewhat worth it and once you've blown through those you can really start to do some damage. Melee units can ignore the -1 to hit altogether as well, making them another solid choice. Tesla won't work because of Marine saves. Marines in my experience also lack units that are tough enough to warrant the +1 to hit. If you don't have other models I think Mephrit would work out better for your tesla Immortals, Sautekh Immortals are going to be useless if you're playing on a crowded board, you'll be paying to ignore cover every single turn.
The list mentioned above with 2 sautekh vaults and a nihilakh pylon, the list is legal but the pylon wont get to use the nihilakh reroll. In order to get codes the whole detatchment needs to be nihilakh.
What about "so long as every other unit in their Detachment is from the same dynasty (with the exception of those listed below)" (Tesseract Vault is listed below).
My thinking would be that Mephrit would be the worse to choose as your then instantly in Rapid Fire Plasma range BOOM goes Monolith first turn and bye bye 368pts that’s done nothing worth its pionts I love the potential of the Monolith and all its rules it just needs an invulnerable and I would be happy
Automatically Appended Next Post:
p5freak wrote: The vault has both CTAN SHARDS and DYNASTY. This means you dont get the dynasty benefits, but you can use their stratagems. Want to make your vault (almost) unkillable ? Make it nihilakh, place it within 3" of an objective marker, or dont move it, and play the nihilakh strat where you get +1 to sv rolls. And because the strat is used outside of a phase, at the end of your turn, you can play it as many times as you want. Play it twice and your vault gets a 2++ invuln sv. That will cost you 4 CP, though.
Fantastic!!! So how does that 2++ work where in the rules so I can show my opponents
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/08 12:36:58
2018/06/08 12:41:49
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
There isnt a debate here though, the codex states clearly that any C'tan shards do not benefit from codes. There isnt an exception for it just because it also has <dynasty>. Vaults do not get codes, period. The <dynasty> just allows them to use strategems.
The list mentioned above with 2 sautekh vaults and a nihilakh pylon, the list is legal but the pylon wont get to use the nihilakh reroll. In order to get codes the whole detatchment needs to be nihilakh.
This bit is correct. It's in the "code of war" section (p. 108) in the back that describes the codes and how they work. Just looked it up. Even with the dynasty keyword it gains no benefit.
This is what i was looking for. Sorry for all the ruckus. I know Ctan shards didnt but the Vault Dynasty thing threw mew off.
Basically, any C'tan (Nightbring, Deceiever, Vaults, Transcendents) don't get dynasty codes at all. Correct?
Curious79 wrote: Ok peepz next up for me is a whole different ball game from the Space Wolves a full codex RavenGuard not managed to crack these guys yet any advice would be much appreciated I am thinking Sautekh to eliminate the -1 to hit via MWBD loving Imothekh at the moment and some Nephrekh deepstrike goodness and was thinking how to best get Melee in there back lines warsythe Lychguard to take out their tanks they have a lot of +1 to hit fly and that strafing run thing so the flyers must die so not quite sure who’s best to target them as the destroyers will be trying to take out his Hellblasters and potentially his tanks DDA would be an obvious option CTan to dish mortal wounds and engage a flyer in CC along with scarabs they also sometimes run 2 assassins soooo annoying needing some destroy turn 1 tactics for them please any other thoughts would be much appreciated to keep the winning streak on
This is kind of what I was thinking would really want more mortal wounds output Take tomb blades out for a CTan?
Make your entire army Mephrit. Take a Monolith and use the Deceiver to bring it up the table, that allows you to get within 12" on turn 1 with your Monolith and one of your units on the table so you get AP -1 but also ignore the -1 to hit modifier. Use Veil of Darkness to bring another unit up.
Your opponent doesn't own scouts does he? Yeah, Monoliths suck. C'tan are going to be pretty good I imagine, even killing scouts is somewhat worth it and once you've blown through those you can really start to do some damage. Melee units can ignore the -1 to hit altogether as well, making them another solid choice. Tesla won't work because of Marine saves. Marines in my experience also lack units that are tough enough to warrant the +1 to hit. If you don't have other models I think Mephrit would work out better for your tesla Immortals, Sautekh Immortals are going to be useless if you're playing on a crowded board, you'll be paying to ignore cover every single turn.
What about "so long as every other unit in their Detachment is from the same dynasty (with the exception of those listed below)" (Tesseract Vault is listed below).
Isnt Imotekh tied to Sautekh, how would he rearrange his detachments to get mephrit?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/08 12:46:06
10000+
10000+
8500+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
Last three games in a row (at my LFGS or on Tabletop Simulator) I got absolutely destroyed ;(
Someone please just... toss me an army list that works.....
Nephrek Batallion
Cryptek w/ Chrono
Overlord with WS/ VoD, Warlord
3x5 Immortals w/ Tesla
2x6 Destroyers
x8 TB with Gauss, Shieldvanes, x2 Shadowloom
Sautekh Spearhead
Cryptek with Cloak
x3 DDA
Should come out to 1999 points. Its got great firepower. No assault elements however, and weaker scoring elements, so expect the destroyers and TB to be pulling double duty on objectives and killing to back the minimal immortal squads up.
Maybe you have enough to shoot yourself out of any CC threat. Could sacrifice some tomb blades for some wariths to not go completely naked though.
Might want to have tesla on thos blades, as there is enough AP shooting in your army anyway (both destroyers and DDAs)
2018/06/08 14:07:46
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
-Sentinel- wrote: Also i don't get why people love gauss immortals. Warriors blob seems better as a rapid fire unit which you going to veil.
I prefer Tesla Immortals myself, but Gauss Immortals (especially Mephrit) can really pack a punch, and if you're just looking for a cheap troops choice to unlock some CP, five Immortals are cheaper than 10 Warriors.
2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress 2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
2018/06/08 18:11:31
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Last three games in a row (at my LFGS or on Tabletop Simulator) I got absolutely destroyed ;(
Someone please just... toss me an army list that works.....
My all-comers list. It have all good stuff we have, from that point you can decide where you want to go:
Nice I like this list I am interested to hear your tactics with it as I am surprised about how little scarabs you have I would maybe reduce the warriors to 15 to get more scarabs or beaf up your warlord or just go All immortals that might allow allow you to change the trait in saying that you get the deny a psychic power with that as well don’t you?
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2018/06/08 18:20:23
2018/06/08 20:29:20
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Last three games in a row (at my LFGS or on Tabletop Simulator) I got absolutely destroyed ;(
Someone please just... toss me an army list that works.....
Have you tried including a Tesseract Vault? ^^
I can tell you what not to include, so far I'd say you should stay away from Monoliths, Obelisks and Kutlakh for sure. I'm also pretty sure Flayed Ones are too risky and that you'll rarely get your pts back with a Spyder. I don't think you'll find a list that will win you every game, losing streaks are bound to occur (about 1 losing streak every 20-40 games is about average). Meanwhile you can review why you lost, sometimes you might discard a brilliant list because you failed a 4" charge, which isn't rational, other times you'll make a mistake you won't catch until you think about what you could have done better post-game, making less obviously stupid mistakes is a good way to get better. You'll be back.
2018/06/09 03:37:04
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Last three games in a row (at my LFGS or on Tabletop Simulator) I got absolutely destroyed ;(
Someone please just... toss me an army list that works.....
Have you tried including a Tesseract Vault? ^^
I can tell you what not to include, so far I'd say you should stay away from Monoliths, Obelisks and Kutlakh for sure. I'm also pretty sure Flayed Ones are too risky and that you'll rarely get your pts back with a Spyder. I don't think you'll find a list that will win you every game, losing streaks are bound to occur (about 1 losing streak every 20-40 games is about average). Meanwhile you can review why you lost, sometimes you might discard a brilliant list because you failed a 4" charge, which isn't rational, other times you'll make a mistake you won't catch until you think about what you could have done better post-game, making less obviously stupid mistakes is a good way to get better. You'll be back.
You always learn more from your losses than your wins!!
2018/06/10 00:31:58
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Just played a game vs tyranid, won pretty solidly.
My list.
Spoiler:
Dynasty Choice: Dynasty: Nihilakh
. . Categories: No Force Org Slot
+ HQ +
Catacomb Command Barge: Artefact: Lightning Field, Tesla Cannon, Warscythe
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Catacomb Command Barge, Fly, Overlord, Vehicle, Character, HQ . . Rules: Living Metal
. . Warlord: Warlord Trait (Codex 1): Enduring Will
Destroyer Lord: Artefact: The Nanoscarab Casket, Phylactery, Warscythe
. . Categories: Character, Destroyer Lord, Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Fly, Infantry, HQ . . Rules: Living Metal
+ Elites +
C'tan Shard of the Deceiver: Power of the C'tan: Seismic Assault, Power of the C'tan: Transdimensional Thunderbolt
. . Categories: Faction: C'tan Shards, Faction: Necrons, C'tan Shard of the Deceiver, Character, Fly, Monster, Elites
. . Rules: Powers of the C'tan (Instructions)
Doomsday Ark
. . Categories: Faction: Necrons, Faction: (Dynasty), Fly, Vehicle, Doomsday Ark, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Living Metal
Doomsday Ark
. . Categories: Faction: Necrons, Faction: (Dynasty), Fly, Vehicle, Doomsday Ark, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Living Metal
Heavy Destroyers
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Fly, Heavy Destroyers, Infantry, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Reanimation Protocols
. . 3x Heavy Destroyer: 3x Heavy Gauss Cannon
+ Lord of War +
Tesseract Vault: Power of the C'tan: Antimatter Meteor, Power of the C'tan: Cosmic Fire, Power of the C'tan: Sky of Falling Stars, Power of the C'tan: Time's Arrow
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: C'tan Shards, Faction: Necrons, Fly, Tesseract Vault, Titanic, Vehicle, Lord of War
. . Rules: Powers of the C'tan (Instructions)
He showed up with a Godzilla style list, with some really big forgeworld guy with 24 wounds and 12 shots with a pretty nasty gun that did d3 damage, perfect for fighting quantum shielding. Didn't get a single quantum shield roll off all game. He also had 3 carnifex units with close combat loadouts, old one eye, swarmlord, and malenthrope.
It was a back and forth fight but in the end necron shooting was stronger than tyranids speed and close combat ability. Things I learned.
Command barges can not take on a swarmlord in close combat.... but scarabs can slow it down.
Doomsday arks love to see anything big, and carnifexes can't survive getting looked at.
Deceiver can't fight swarmlord in close combat.
Destroyer lords can't fight swarmlord in close combat (see a pattern).
Heavy destroyers actually do a decent job of finishing off things the dda doesn't. Not sure if it's not better to just take an additional dda though.
Tesseract vault, first time I ever used one, it did dish out a decent amount of mortal wounds but it wasn't really that strong as a damage dealer for some reason. It did do an excellent job contesting an important objective for 3 turns, it was almost killed in the game (down to 7 wounds) but it just would not die and held the enemy force up on its own for 2 turns giving the dda units a change to reposition then blast away at the big guys.
I do like this list but it needs more command points. 5 isn't enough to do much. Also not sold on the dynasty. Dda rerolling 1's was nice. But was there a better option?
2018/06/10 00:52:34
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
So I attended a tournament yesterday, I had to write up a list the night before as I was the ringer to even out numbers. I threw a list together and got models from the TO and inadvertently found a very strong list. I went 2/1 on the day, and placed 5th overall against a very tough field.
5 tesla immortals
5 tesla immortals
9 gauss immortals
Nightbringer.
Sautekh outrider
Lord with HPS, Res orb
5 wraiths
5 destroyers
5 destroyers
5 destroyers
I wanted to try sautekh, as I usually run neprekh for the DS option and the 6" move on wraiths. I think now that sautekh is much better, here is my reasoning:
the dynasty trait is good, I know destroyers already ignore the heavy penalty but they still can take advantage of the assault portion of the rule to great effect, considering they are only 24" range with a 10" move.
This list is very CP heavy, your blowing 3CP per turn minimum to buff the destroyers (more on that in a minute) and if you need to get your warlord back up/change a c'tan power/ignore cover etc you start burning them very fast. With the warlord trait I was spending about 12 CP per game and still had a few left over at the end of the game. Granted one game I didn't get a single back, probably made up for the other two games
The sautekh stratagem Methodical Destruction works absolute wonders with the destroyers. It takes a bit of finesse to get it working optimally but here was my usual strat: Veil up the gauss immortals into range of as many units as possible. This had a dual purpose of ensuring I didn't waste destroyers trying to proc the stratagem, while also ensuring I had a cryptek up forward to keep the bonus to RP on my wraiths (I was ressing htem every game, they are a crucial element to the list as they take a heap of pressure off the destroyers). From here you choose the target you need to kill, blast them with -2 gauss blasters, strip a wound (usually) and pop MD. Now you have 15 destroyers hitting on 2's, rerolling 1's to hit, wounding on x, rerolling 1's from the lord.
From here, I think I would drop down the immortal squad and squeeze in a D/Lord, and make him the warlord. The cryptek does so much work as it is, he becomes a huge target, and he is very necessary to keeping the destroyers kicking. The chronometron is necessary to keep the destroyers up, as they see all the nasty firepower once the wraiths go down. A res orb is very handy on a list like this, keeping it near wraiths T1, or next to destroyers after that ensures that it pays for itself if a single model gets back up, in all my games yesterday it made over double its points back, and was very clutch for me (one round i didn't res any destroyers from the roll, then got 3 back from the orb).
I know sautekh makes vehicles very good, but i feel it is also good for the rest of the army. MD ensures you can get tesla proccing on 5's even without MWBD....
One last thing, for anyone having problems with Drukhari, look at spamming destroyers and wraiths. All our weaponry wounds their vehicles on 4's with multi damage, while we are just as fast as them, and exceptionally durable vsing them (dis cannons wound destroyers and wraiths on 5's).
I 20-0 a very tough drukhari list, had index trueborn with blasters in 3 venoms, 2 blaster archons in another venom, 3 ravagers, scourges with blasters, and lots of poison. I tabled him, and I lost 1 squad of immortals, my warlord, my wraiths, one squad of destroyers and the nightbringer.
Sautekh FTW
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Azuza001 wrote: Just played a game vs tyranid, won pretty solidly.
My list.
Spoiler:
Dynasty Choice: Dynasty: Nihilakh
. . Categories: No Force Org Slot
+ HQ +
Catacomb Command Barge: Artefact: Lightning Field, Tesla Cannon, Warscythe
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Catacomb Command Barge, Fly, Overlord, Vehicle, Character, HQ . . Rules: Living Metal
. . Warlord: Warlord Trait (Codex 1): Enduring Will
Destroyer Lord: Artefact: The Nanoscarab Casket, Phylactery, Warscythe
. . Categories: Character, Destroyer Lord, Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Fly, Infantry, HQ . . Rules: Living Metal
+ Elites +
C'tan Shard of the Deceiver: Power of the C'tan: Seismic Assault, Power of the C'tan: Transdimensional Thunderbolt
. . Categories: Faction: C'tan Shards, Faction: Necrons, C'tan Shard of the Deceiver, Character, Fly, Monster, Elites
. . Rules: Powers of the C'tan (Instructions)
Doomsday Ark
. . Categories: Faction: Necrons, Faction: (Dynasty), Fly, Vehicle, Doomsday Ark, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Living Metal
Doomsday Ark
. . Categories: Faction: Necrons, Faction: (Dynasty), Fly, Vehicle, Doomsday Ark, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Living Metal
Heavy Destroyers
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: Necrons, Fly, Heavy Destroyers, Infantry, Heavy Support
. . Rules: Reanimation Protocols
. . 3x Heavy Destroyer: 3x Heavy Gauss Cannon
+ Lord of War +
Tesseract Vault: Power of the C'tan: Antimatter Meteor, Power of the C'tan: Cosmic Fire, Power of the C'tan: Sky of Falling Stars, Power of the C'tan: Time's Arrow
. . Categories: Faction: (Dynasty), Faction: C'tan Shards, Faction: Necrons, Fly, Tesseract Vault, Titanic, Vehicle, Lord of War
. . Rules: Powers of the C'tan (Instructions)
He showed up with a Godzilla style list, with some really big forgeworld guy with 24 wounds and 12 shots with a pretty nasty gun that did d3 damage, perfect for fighting quantum shielding. Didn't get a single quantum shield roll off all game. He also had 3 carnifex units with close combat loadouts, old one eye, swarmlord, and malenthrope.
It was a back and forth fight but in the end necron shooting was stronger than tyranids speed and close combat ability. Things I learned.
Command barges can not take on a swarmlord in close combat.... but scarabs can slow it down.
Doomsday arks love to see anything big, and carnifexes can't survive getting looked at.
Deceiver can't fight swarmlord in close combat.
Destroyer lords can't fight swarmlord in close combat (see a pattern).
Heavy destroyers actually do a decent job of finishing off things the dda doesn't. Not sure if it's not better to just take an additional dda though.
Tesseract vault, first time I ever used one, it did dish out a decent amount of mortal wounds but it wasn't really that strong as a damage dealer for some reason. It did do an excellent job contesting an important objective for 3 turns, it was almost killed in the game (down to 7 wounds) but it just would not die and held the enemy force up on its own for 2 turns giving the dda units a change to reposition then blast away at the big guys.
I do like this list but it needs more command points. 5 isn't enough to do much. Also not sold on the dynasty. Dda rerolling 1's was nice. But was there a better option?
The nightbringer can fight the swarmlord in combat, for a number of reasons.
His shooting attack that hits and wounds on 2+ and forces him on his invo should strip wounds before you get there, along with the mortal wounds from the C'tan powers youll be popping off. Once in combat it comes down to who can make more 4+ invuls, but if you can manage to get the first swing in combat, entropic strike with your fist hit you can usually swing the fight in your favour. He is not as easy as just running at and killing, you need to weaken him and fight on your terms but it is possible to kill him.
Hell ive killed him with a squad of wraiths before. 3++ is way better than 4++, and when each strike is doing 2d to him, it can do it. It took me about 6 rounds of combat to finally down him with the wraiths but they got the job done.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/06/10 00:59:33
10000+
10000+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
4000 pts
