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2018/08/16 04:46:52
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
I mean, it also really depends on what you're taking Tomb Blades for and the role they fill in your list.
I run Nihilakh, so my Tomb Blades gain no additional benefit from being up close. In my more casual list, I have a block of 20 Warriors and Ghost Ark to form my blockers, and I use my TBs as longer range firepower and mobility.
In my more competitive list, my entire army is highly mobile, and so I'm less concerned about screening (since I'll be actively seeking to keep my opponent at arms length, I find the risk of combat too great with TBs against any semi decent assault unit).
The balance of S6 vs S5 also depends on what you require the TBs to target. I find Destroyers fill the S6 department very well with better AP and damage, so I'd rather be using my TBs to bring the volume of fire that my Destroyers lack (since I don't take a lot of Immortals too).
An argument could be had for Particles over Tesla if you need to use the TBs as more objective grabbers than damage dealers as well, where movement and advancing with opportunity firepower is more important than optimal damage output.
Bottom line, regardless of how you equip or use them, I feel TBs are a staple in every Necron list because of their sheer flexibility.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/08/16 04:48:23
I had another 1800 Pt. Game against Dark Eldar today.
My Destroyers (Nepherek) used deepstrike at the end of T2. They were actually quite decent this Time. I could handle to destroy 2 Raiders and cripple a Ravager ( Used my one surviving and mostly destroyed DDA).
But there was still no Chance to win at any time of the match.
My Immortals (2x10) and my Wraiths (6) were completly wipped out by poison and Weapons like the Shredder or Desintegration Cannons.
My Ctan pulled some MW but was focused down by Blasters and Lances.
Still dont see a reliable Way to deal with DE...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/16 19:24:28
2018/08/16 19:56:07
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
I had another 1800 Pt. Game against Dark Eldar today.
My Destroyers (Nepherek) used deepstrike at the end of T2. They were actually quite decent this Time. I could handle to destroy 2 Raiders and cripple a Ravager ( Used my one surviving and mostly destroyed DDA).
But there was still no Chance to win at any time of the match.
My Immortals (2x10) and my Wraiths (6) were completly wipped out by poison and Weapons like the Shredder or Desintegration Cannons.
My Ctan pulled some MW but was focused down by Blasters and Lances.
Still dont see a reliable Way to deal with DE...
I mean, Poison weapons don't have AP...did you use cover? Did you deploy right on the edge of your zone, or farther back. To be that devastating, they had to have been close. Shredders are close range guns. Why not deep strike the destroyers turn 1 in your own deployment zone since they'd be in range?
C'tan really don't seem worthwhile vs DE, probably was wasted points. Too much poison and quality shooting.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/08/16 23:07:22
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Scarabs are also good, even small units of 3 scarabs are a significant threat to most DE (it's usually 5-10 kabalites...)
Would you need something like Anrakyr to make them viable in the eventual CC?
I haven't used anrakyr this edition, he obviously would buff your unit but againts Dark Eldar you usually won't need it.
I tend to run 2 units of 19 warriors( we play ITC format so 19 gives up less points than 20). And an unit of immortals.
19 warriors with MWBD hits with most of their attacks, usually 15-16 hits. Against T3 models that's 10-12 wounds, models with a 5+ save tend to die to that. The 6+++ doesn't really help much, you still end up killing 7-8 kabalite warriors. Even without MWBD an unit of 10 warrior will usually kill 3-4 kabalite warriors in assault, many DE players run units of 5 so this is significant.
Kabalite Warriors return attacks on necron warriors are negligible. If you charge 10 warriors into 10 kabalite warriors and kill 4 (likely result 3-5). The remaining kabalites will likely hit 5 times, wound twice, and you will likely fail one 4+ save. You are checking morale at -1, they are checking at -4.
Warriors are viable on their own in cc againts units that are T3 5+ save a d want to be shooting you.
Ideally you don't want to necessarily wipe out the warriors a lot of the times, because you are going to hurt them more than they hurt you in assault you are somewhat protected if your opponent doesn't fall ack with them.
2018/08/17 17:27:09
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
I've used Anrakyr a lot.
For warrior blob support I suggest the following
Anrakyr
Cryptek w/ Chronometron, Warlord w/ Immortal Pride, Veil of Darkness
Lord
x19 Warriors
x19 Warriors
x10 Tesla Immortals
Run the block high and tight, spaghetti lining in to the core of the army, your 3 HQs. Keep the immortals on top of them to prevent enemy from shooting them.
The block is fearless, +1 attack, rerolling 1s to wound. And, Anrakyr can give out 2 MWBD using Phaeron's will. If a block of warriors gets caught in CC with Wyches...use the VoD to just *poof* teleport them out of combat, leaving the wyches open to sustained shooting. Position the warrior brick on the other side of the first warrior brick to keep your fearless bubble intact.
That being said, I have moved away from Anrakyr recently, and run this build from time to time, just using a normal OL now to save points.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/08/18 22:27:10
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
I was at the warhammer fest in Düsseldorf and talked to the FW guys about the big spyder thing. No rules yet, release date before the end of the year, so you will be able to give yourself a christmas gift. I made some pictures, but nothing new to see. One is with a vehicle which is little smaller than a rhino.
2018/08/18 22:49:41
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
p5freak wrote: I was at the warhammer fest in Düsseldorf and talked to the FW guys about the big spyder thing. No rules yet, release date before the end of the year, so you will be able to give yourself a christmas gift. I made some pictures, but nothing new to see. One is with a vehicle which is little smaller than a rhino.
Cool, thanks!
Just.. can't really make up my mind what to think of it (which could be good).
Weird thing.
2018/08/18 23:27:55
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
p5freak wrote: I was at the warhammer fest in Düsseldorf and talked to the FW guys about the big spyder thing. No rules yet, release date before the end of the year, so you will be able to give yourself a christmas gift. I made some pictures, but nothing new to see. One is with a vehicle which is little smaller than a rhino.
I'm actually suprised by it's size. I thought it would be Titan-sized. But this looks like a regular super-heavy unit, which means he will probably be around 500 points and can at least be an option in a 2000 point army.
2018/08/19 00:12:58
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
p5freak wrote: I was at the warhammer fest in Düsseldorf and talked to the FW guys about the big spyder thing. No rules yet, release date before the end of the year, so you will be able to give yourself a christmas gift. I made some pictures, but nothing new to see. One is with a vehicle which is little smaller than a rhino.
Its meant to be a titanic unit like knights, so its probably gonna be the same points range, around 400-500 pts., i guess. It has two different main guns, which are interchangeable without magnets. Here are more pics.
2018/08/19 08:37:19
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
The plan is to split the list into thirds, 2 Sentry Pylons with a repair Spyder in the middle, with warriors in from and Scarabs screening them, so mirror this on either side of the board, and use the D Lord, big Scarab squad and Wraiths as a fast ball up the middle.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/19 08:39:37
213PL 60PL 12PL 9-17PL (she/her)
2018/08/19 09:56:53
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
3 wraith arent enough. You will probably lose 1 or 2 until they get into CC. Once the unit is killed you cant reanimate them. Novokh wraith are really good in melee. More wraith are harder to wipe out, and you can roll more reanimation dice. Sentry pylons with heat cannons arent competitive. They are expensive and die pretty easy. If one gets destroyed your spyder can do nothing. You should add a teleportation matrix to protect them turn 1, in case you dont get first turn. Novokh isnt a good dynasty for them, they should be sautekh, or nihilakh. Use gloom prisms on your spyders to be able to deny the witch.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/08/19 09:59:49
2018/08/19 10:10:43
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
p5freak wrote: 3 wraith arent enough. You will probably lose 1 or 2 until they get into CC. Once the unit is killed you cant reanimate them. Novokh wraith are really good in melee. More wraith are harder to wipe out, and you can roll more reanimation dice. Sentry pylons with heat cannons arent competitive. They are expensive and die pretty easy. If one gets destroyed your spyder can do nothing. You should add a teleportation matrix to protect them turn 1, in case you dont get first turn. Novokh isnt a good dynasty for them, they should be sautekh, or nihilakh. Use gloom prisms on your spyders to be able to deny the witch.
Yeah, what he said, DDAs are probably better bang for the buck, and more versatile. If you own them. 3 DDAs should have the same DMG output. Might afford you those extra wraiths too.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
p5freak wrote: Its meant to be a titanic unit like knights, so its probably gonna be the same points range, around 400-500 pts., i guess. It has two different main guns, which are interchangeable without magnets. Here are more pics.
Did he say anything what those weapons would be like?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/19 10:48:14
2018/08/19 11:24:45
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
torblind wrote: [
Did he say anything what those weapons would be like?
No, he didnt. No rules yet, with a smile There is probably some game testing already going on.
Hnnggg I want it so bad
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/08/19 18:35:24
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
The plan is to split the list into thirds, 2 Sentry Pylons with a repair Spyder in the middle, with warriors in from and Scarabs screening them, so mirror this on either side of the board, and use the D Lord, big Scarab squad and Wraiths as a fast ball up the middle.
Giving your Destroyers Lord that WL trait just for some Scarabs and a unit of 3 Wraiths is a waste, you'd be better off giving the Lord the 6" Fearless bubble, he's less likely to die against anything other than snipers as well, so that's another plus. Giving the Blood Scythe to a Lord is a waste, he's hitting on 3s and dies to a stiff breeze. Planning on splitting your forces is planning to be outmanoeuvred, you want your opponent to go through all your chaff before getting to the juicy bits of your army instead of only having to go through half. Create two layers of chaff instead of one on each side of the board.
Your list is not competetive at all for several reasons, that's not a problem if that is the intention, I love playing fun lists, but your list is terrible for any level of competetiveness other than super casual. One thing you don't have to worry about is small units of Wraiths, you're not going to give them Reanimation or attack twice with your list anyways, making them bigger just makes them bigger targets for Stratagems and psychic powers, the only reason to take big squads is if you're bringing a Cryptek and plan on reviving them, if you have enough CP to burn to make them attack twice or if you want more than 9 Wraiths in your list.
You don't have any OP units and you have several bad units. Spyders of any kind are bad, taking more than one is terrible. Sentry Pylons are meh at best and they're bad when in a Novokh Detachment, you did pick the right weapon at least. Warriors are bad if they're not in a Sautekh Batallion or Mephrit Batallion, or in a Novokh Batallion backed by Anrakyr.
Easiest way to improve your list is to get rid of the Warriors, they're not doing anything for your list. Next is cutting out a Spyder from your list and making the Sentry Pylons into a Dynasty that's more worthwhile.
A Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic, however many Sentry Pylons (with heat cannons and the Deep Strike wargear) you feel like and a single Spyder with a fab claw.
A Novokh Outrider with a Cryptek with a Canoptek Cloak and depending on terrain and opponent the Veil of Darkness Relic (if there's a spot far back where your Destroyers can hide against an opponent with fewer drops than you, a unit of 6 Wraiths, a unit of 6 Destroyers, 3 units of Scarabs, as few 3x3 and as many as 3x7.
You could also do a Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic and a Spyder with a fab claw and however many Sentry Pylons you feel like and a Novokh Batallion with a Cryptek of some kind, Lord, 3x10 Warriors and as many Scarabs and Wraiths you can fit.
Lastly you could get Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic and a Spyder with a fab claw and however many Sentry Pylons you feel like and a Novokh Batallion with Anrakyr, a Cryptek, a Lord and a Ghost Ark and then either 10 Tesla Immortals or 20 more Warriors for a Battalion.
None of these lists are tournament competetive, if anyone tells you they are you have my permission to kick out a couple of their teeth while educating them (teeth are for teaching fees).
Spoiler:
I forfeited a game against a grog who claimed I was a munchkin because I was spamming Destroyers in a casual game because I brough two units of 1 Heavy Destroyer to bring out from one of the two Night Scythes I was bringing (in my apparently competetive list), one unit of 3 Heavy Destroyers and then finally a single unit of 6 regular Destroyers. My opponent was bringing two Land Raiders, but I don't think any list with three Necron flyers could be called competetive just because I'm bringing a single squad of 6 Destroyers, at least not if you're playing BA and you're using a smash captain and Mephiston and that doesn't make your list competetive. I always ask after every game I play if there was anything I could do to make our games in the future more fun, but if you're going to accuse me of being a munchkin because you're ill informed and rude then I guess I don't want you to have fun either. If you think your opponent is bringing a too competetive list maybe talk with them after the game, or before the game, but don't bring it up in the game.
Won a 1500 pt game with a Nihilakh list featuring 20 Flayed Ones against a CSM Iron Warriors list with a Land Raider. My opponent split his forces and I focussed down one half of his forces while his heavy weapons were advancing towards me, unable to fire. Flayed Ones failed their charge and took some heavy casualties, but thankfully survived. Things slowed down and after my opponent lost half his army without doing any real damage he surrendered.
Lost a 1000 pt intro game with a Novokh Lychguard spam list with four characters and two res-orbs against a Nid list with 40 Genestealers. One unit of 20 Genestealers destroyed 500 pts worth of Lychguard in a single turn, I never got the chance to use my res orbs and I was wiped out turn 3. My opponent had a lot of fun, but thinking back I'm not sure if the list was great for introductory game, it's weak but it also has a chance of never suffering a single loss, an MSU list with both shooting and melee would probably be the safest bet for making a good introductory game. I think I would have had a chance if I didn't help my opponent pilot his force, but I think he learned a lot, he was definitely surprised when what he thought was a what was going to be a tough fight basically ended turn 2. I also learned I need to fear Genestealers more, I'm not sure why they did so little damage in my previous games against them, perhabs it's more important to soften them up with shooting than I thought. One thing I definitely should have done is make it so my opponent could not charge both my units of Lychguard turn 2, because if they were further apart the second unit would not have been destroyed by the Nid fight twice Stratagem or if I had perhabs mixed them inbetween eachother the second unit could have made a counter-attack instead of just being obliterated.
2018/08/19 21:09:27
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
The plan is to split the list into thirds, 2 Sentry Pylons with a repair Spyder in the middle, with warriors in from and Scarabs screening them, so mirror this on either side of the board, and use the D Lord, big Scarab squad and Wraiths as a fast ball up the middle.
Giving your Destroyers Lord that WL trait just for some Scarabs and a unit of 3 Wraiths is a waste, you'd be better off giving the Lord the 6" Fearless bubble, he's less likely to die against anything other than snipers as well, so that's another plus. Giving the Blood Scythe to a Lord is a waste, he's hitting on 3s and dies to a stiff breeze. Planning on splitting your forces is planning to be outmanoeuvred, you want your opponent to go through all your chaff before getting to the juicy bits of your army instead of only having to go through half. Create two layers of chaff instead of one on each side of the board.
Your list is not competetive at all for several reasons, that's not a problem if that is the intention, I love playing fun lists, but your list is terrible for any level of competetiveness other than super casual. One thing you don't have to worry about is small units of Wraiths, you're not going to give them Reanimation or attack twice with your list anyways, making them bigger just makes them bigger targets for Stratagems and psychic powers, the only reason to take big squads is if you're bringing a Cryptek and plan on reviving them, if you have enough CP to burn to make them attack twice or if you want more than 9 Wraiths in your list.
You don't have any OP units and you have several bad units. Spyders of any kind are bad, taking more than one is terrible. Sentry Pylons are meh at best and they're bad when in a Novokh Detachment, you did pick the right weapon at least. Warriors are bad if they're not in a Sautekh Batallion or Mephrit Batallion, or in a Novokh Batallion backed by Anrakyr.
Easiest way to improve your list is to get rid of the Warriors, they're not doing anything for your list. Next is cutting out a Spyder from your list and making the Sentry Pylons into a Dynasty that's more worthwhile.
A Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic, however many Sentry Pylons (with heat cannons and the Deep Strike wargear) you feel like and a single Spyder with a fab claw.
A Novokh Outrider with a Cryptek with a Canoptek Cloak and depending on terrain and opponent the Veil of Darkness Relic (if there's a spot far back where your Destroyers can hide against an opponent with fewer drops than you, a unit of 6 Wraiths, a unit of 6 Destroyers, 3 units of Scarabs, as few 3x3 and as many as 3x7.
You could also do a Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic and a Spyder with a fab claw and however many Sentry Pylons you feel like and a Novokh Batallion with a Cryptek of some kind, Lord, 3x10 Warriors and as many Scarabs and Wraiths you can fit.
Lastly you could get Sautekh Spearhead with your D-Lord with Hyperlogical Strategist WL-trait and a Relic and a Spyder with a fab claw and however many Sentry Pylons you feel like and a Novokh Batallion with Anrakyr, a Cryptek, a Lord and a Ghost Ark and then either 10 Tesla Immortals or 20 more Warriors for a Battalion.
None of these lists are tournament competetive, if anyone tells you they are you have my permission to kick out a couple of their teeth while educating them (teeth are for teaching fees).
Spoiler:
I forfeited a game against a grog who claimed I was a munchkin because I was spamming Destroyers in a casual game because I brough two units of 1 Heavy Destroyer to bring out from one of the two Night Scythes I was bringing (in my apparently competetive list), one unit of 3 Heavy Destroyers and then finally a single unit of 6 regular Destroyers. My opponent was bringing two Land Raiders, but I don't think any list with three Necron flyers could be called competetive just because I'm bringing a single squad of 6 Destroyers, at least not if you're playing BA and you're using a smash captain and Mephiston and that doesn't make your list competetive. I always ask after every game I play if there was anything I could do to make our games in the future more fun, but if you're going to accuse me of being a munchkin because you're ill informed and rude then I guess I don't want you to have fun either. If you think your opponent is bringing a too competetive list maybe talk with them after the game, or before the game, but don't bring it up in the game.
Won a 1500 pt game with a Nihilakh list featuring 20 Flayed Ones against a CSM Iron Warriors list with a Land Raider. My opponent split his forces and I focussed down one half of his forces while his heavy weapons were advancing towards me, unable to fire. Flayed Ones failed their charge and took some heavy casualties, but thankfully survived. Things slowed down and after my opponent lost half his army without doing any real damage he surrendered.
Lost a 1000 pt intro game with a Novokh Lychguard spam list with four characters and two res-orbs against a Nid list with 40 Genestealers. One unit of 20 Genestealers destroyed 500 pts worth of Lychguard in a single turn, I never got the chance to use my res orbs and I was wiped out turn 3. My opponent had a lot of fun, but thinking back I'm not sure if the list was great for introductory game, it's weak but it also has a chance of never suffering a single loss, an MSU list with both shooting and melee would probably be the safest bet for making a good introductory game. I think I would have had a chance if I didn't help my opponent pilot his force, but I think he learned a lot, he was definitely surprised when what he thought was a what was going to be a tough fight basically ended turn 2. I also learned I need to fear Genestealers more, I'm not sure why they did so little damage in my previous games against them, perhabs it's more important to soften them up with shooting than I thought. One thing I definitely should have done is make it so my opponent could not charge both my units of Lychguard turn 2, because if they were further apart the second unit would not have been destroyed by the Nid fight twice Stratagem or if I had perhabs mixed them inbetween eachother the second unit could have made a counter-attack instead of just being obliterated.
While I want to be competitive, I also can't afford anything new, so I have to work with what I have:
Spoiler:
models I have:
2x Destroyer Lords.
1x lord, with orb
1x cryptek on foot, kitbashed
54x Warriors
34x Scarabs
1x Destroyer
6x Wraiths, old metal, so basic.
2x Spyders, one with a Beamer, the other all CC.
6x Sentry Pylons with Heat Cannon.
213PL 60PL 12PL 9-17PL (she/her)
2018/08/20 08:33:40
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Lychguard with Shield works quite well against Incubi as i found out yesterday
But another question occurred is there anything in World we can do against talos engines (T6 3+/4++)? No weapon seems to deal enough dmg to take atleast 2 out.
Played against 9 of them so i am quite traumatized
2018/08/20 09:31:11
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Pretty sure the answer to pain engines is the same answer we use for every high toughness multiple wound model, destroyers. Not quite as much AP to waste as the doomsday ark and with less damage per shot you're less likely to overkill a model by a large amount so you have a better shot at clearing out the unit.
2018/08/20 09:56:48
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Manous wrote: well Taloi have a 4++ inv and 7T sooooo.... What to do?
Shoot them? Destroyers are pretty good against them due to their RoF and multiple damage shots. It takes at least 3 unsaved wounds to kill one. You haven't been trying to use warrior spam against them, have you? Because those are really inefficient against high-T multiwound models.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/08/20 09:58:16
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2018/08/20 10:01:49
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]
Wait, are they really that cheap? That's...dumb. Really dumb. Like, an annihilation barge is only one more wound, has weaker armor and an unreliable defensive rule, and its more expensive than 100.
How are they 4+ invul? Apparently they are supposed to have 5+ invuls?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/20 10:07:44
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
10000 pts
4000 pts
12PL 
There is probably some game testing already going on.
~1660