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Hiding that is likely be rare though. Especially tournament/flgs boards

torblind wrote:

 iGuy91 wrote:
I almost missed the whole "Replace Singularity Generators with Synaptic Obliterators and Transdimensional Projectors" part

Things got a solid amount of dakka in either case. Really Really high AP, and solid damage output. Could it be run Nihiliak for the save boosting strategem, paired with "Take Cover Beta Strategem to functionally give it 1+ Armor Save turn 1 to help keep it safe vs anti vehicle fire?

I WANT to run this thing, but that points (and USD) price tag scares me. i want to have a plan for it before i buy.

Nihilakh stratagem is end of turn

Yes, but that's ok because if you were clever about objective placement or got the first turn, you should be able to leave it out in the open, deal some damage with it and then use the stratagem to give it a 2+ / 4++ save against any retaliation.
Nihilakh is actually looking pretty good for it. Those rerolls would help that obliterator nicely.

Mephrit could also be useful, but only for the strat.


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tneva82 wrote:
Hiding that is likely be rare though. Especially tournament/flgs boards

My FLGS actually has quite a few LOS blockers. One terrain piece is this huge trio of silos that's like 12" long and 12" high.
Do Tournaments not have LoS Blockers? No wonder it sounds so screwed up. They're playing 8th ed wrong.

Can you reroll the explosion dice for 1 cp? that could be very useful!

MrPieChee wrote:
Can you reroll the explosion dice for 1 cp? that could be very useful!

Assuming you haven't used that reroll stratagem for something else.

Anyone have a sense of how big it/it's "base" is compared to a knight?

Yeah, reroll 1s with the 3+ BS is a solid idea, however, it also feels a shame to waste that Movement of 16 standing still to get it.... Guess it depends on the opponent because this thing is no slouch in melee either, and taking the 72 inch guns and staying so far away is a waste of the secondary weapons.

Mephrit is a waste on the thing since its AP is stupid good
Sautehk...Advance and shoot...might not be bad...but no charge afterwords...ehhh....
Nephrehk .....guarenteed 22inch movement on an advance? Nice, but still no charge...
Novohk...running this thing into melee with rerolls is mean. and the explosion on it is brutal....not a bad prospect.
Nihiliak - Helps address some of the durability i guess, reroll ones if you stand still...hm.

Ugh..that $$$ price tag just boils my blood.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

torblind wrote:

 iGuy91 wrote:
I almost missed the whole "Replace Singularity Generators with Synaptic Obliterators and Transdimensional Projectors" part

Things got a solid amount of dakka in either case. Really Really high AP, and solid damage output. Could it be run Nihiliak for the save boosting strategem, paired with "Take Cover Beta Strategem to functionally give it 1+ Armor Save turn 1 to help keep it safe vs anti vehicle fire?

I WANT to run this thing, but that points (and USD) price tag scares me. i want to have a plan for it before i buy.

Nihilakh stratagem is end of turn

Yes, but that's ok because if you were clever about objective placement or got the first turn, you should be able to leave it out in the open, deal some damage with it and then use the stratagem to give it a 2+ / 4++ save against any retaliation.
Nihilakh is actually looking pretty good for it. Those rerolls would help that obliterator nicely.

Mephrit could also be useful, but only for the strat.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Hiding that is likely be rare though. Especially tournament/flgs boards

My FLGS actually has quite a few LOS blockers. One terrain piece is this huge trio of silos that's like 12" long and 12" high.
Do Tournaments not have LoS Blockers? No wonder it sounds so screwed up. They're playing 8th ed wrong.

Many don't have 100% solid walls especially size of warmachines. Generally it seems to be gw made terrain which is useless for terrain blocking

Yeah, it looks pretty underwhelming coming in at 625 points.

Could have used the Macro keyword.

EDIT: I misread the first bullet. Lol

How does tabling work in multiplayer games?

ex: If I have 3 units in reserve but only one thing on the table and opponent gets rid of that am I unable to continue and my team has to go on without me?

Or can I then DS / enter the table as normal on later turns cause my ally is still in play?

 iGuy91 wrote:
Yeah, reroll 1s with the 3+ BS is a solid idea, however, it also feels a shame to waste that Movement of 16 standing still to get it.... Guess it depends on the opponent because this thing is no slouch in melee either, and taking the 72 inch guns and staying so far away is a waste of the secondary weapons.

Mephrit is a waste on the thing since its AP is stupid good
Sautehk...Advance and shoot...might not be bad...but no charge afterwords...ehhh....
Nephrehk .....guarenteed 22inch movement on an advance? Nice, but still no charge...
Novohk...running this thing into melee with rerolls is mean. and the explosion on it is brutal....not a bad prospect.
Nihiliak - Helps address some of the durability i guess, reroll ones if you stand still...hm.

Ugh..that $$$ price tag just boils my blood.

Just think of the movement 16 as adding to its kiting potential, so that if something does get close it can just run away and shoot them.
Novokh would be pretty hilarious on it, and it would get those transdimensional weapons to use. But it would also expose it to enemy fire.

What I like about it is that it has high offense but relatively weak defense, which means you actually have to think carefully what to do with it and watch out for threats.
To me that's good design.


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Necronplayer wrote:
Yeah, it looks pretty underwhelming coming in at 625 points.

Could have used the Macro keyword.

EDIT: I misread the first bullet. Lol

It has 2 Heavy D3 S16 guns, each with flat 6 damage. Its already wounding most things on 2+ and everything else on 3+.
Macro would be excessive. If you want a dedicated titan-killer use pylons. This can be used for titan killing, But its more effective against medium to heavy vehicles, an unit type that necrons have problems against atm.
Against light Lord of War units (such as knights equivalent) it does do a good job (just needs 4 unsaved ones to kill a knight, and you are probably going to wound with every hit), and anything less than that isn't going to last a turn.

2heavy d3 gun or i'm looking diffrent sheet. Heavy d6 are the s6 ones. Not s16

tneva82 wrote:
2heavy d3 gun or i'm looking diffrent sheet. Heavy d6 are the s6 ones. Not s16

Bah sorry, typo. They are indeed D3.
2 D6 would make them even better, but I understand why they aren't.
Speaking of the D6 guns, they aren't too bad either. They deal D3 damage each and have a chance of generating a mortal wound. The range is a bit short, but as a supporting weapon for the main gun they aren't too bad.
Obviously more heavy infantry focused though.

I'm not quite sure what targets the Singularity Generator is supposed to be used against.
The Obliterator is already good against vehicles and it comes with an anti-infantry weapon.
The Generator has higher potential max damage (108 opposed to 36), but the chances of actually getting that is extremely slim, and the obliterator seems to have a more reliable damage output overall.

Anyone want math on the Seraptek? I can math!

Also, thoughts on it...

Around the same price as a Knight Castellan, not as good. On the bright side, Castellans are PROBABLY getting nerfed in CA, so maybe it'll wind up comparable!

 JNAProductions wrote:
Anyone want math on the Seraptek? I can math!

Also, thoughts on it...

Around the same price as a Knight Castellan, not as good. On the bright side, Castellans are PROBABLY getting nerfed in CA, so maybe it'll wind up comparable!

You are most likely correct. I for one would like some maths.

Some mathhammer calculating the damage done to a T8 target:



The output is nice at that range it has, but I don't see it living past first turn in knight meta. A couple of DDAs are more likely to survive first turn with QS too. I.e. I wouldn't plan on using this for AV unless you intend to move and use the melee profile as well, but I don't think it will last past turn 1.

Wait, how can the 72" weapon deal 4 damage when every unsaved wound deals 6 flat damage?

Expanded mathhammer, hopefully getting the same results as Necronplayer.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Wait, how can the 72" weapon deal 4 damage when every unsaved wound deals 6 flat damage?

It's average damage. So, to put it in practical terms, it would deal 12 damage over 3 turns, most likely, or do one unsaved wound two out of every three turns.

Interesting, so that means that the obliterator is more effective against things without an invul, and slightly less effective against things with an invul, provided no mortal wounds are inflicted. That would explain the Generator's purpose then.
What about the transdimensional weapon? That's packaged with the obliterator, and can also generate mortal wounds.

You get your damage up front though. That flat 6 damage seems to be more useful in practice than on paper.
On paper, destroyers with EP can kill tanks. In practice, I found them underwhelming.
Since they do perform similarly, that would explain why they didn't make different points costs though. I guess in the end it depends on if you love mortal wounds or you love long range artillery and S16.

How about reporting most likely damage output as well? IE Without FNP for flat 6 weapon it should be 0, 6 or 12 etc.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Anyone want math on the Seraptek? I can math!

Also, thoughts on it...

Around the same price as a Knight Castellan, not as good. On the bright side, Castellans are PROBABLY getting nerfed in CA, so maybe it'll wind up comparable!

You think? My thoughts were it's actually better than a Castellan minus Cawl's Wrath and 4++ Warlord Trait. Can we get comparison numbers on both against a T7 3+/5++ target and a T8 3+/5++ target or is that too much mathing to ask?

EDIT: You guys post fast, maths for this thing are up.

The real $ is killing me. I was hoping for a 195$ kit at most. For a kit with a whopping TWO choices in load out it is a little ridiculous and the thing is just knight size so not really that big.

Pyrothem wrote:
The real $ is killing me. I was hoping for a 195$ kit at most. For a kit with a whopping TWO choices in load out it is a little ridiculous and the thing is just knight size so not really that big.

What's shocking are the weapons.

It's 244 for the model + 1 weapon option.
If you want the other weapon option that's 44
So if you want the complete model with both weapon options for variety, that's 288.

Just a note for the people whining about the cost IRL, this thing with both weapon options is still cheaper than a Warhound body alone...

and albeit it's not much bigger than a Knight, but the Castellan/Valiant Kits are 100 a pop in GBP, so 200 for this thing made of Resin instead of plastic isnt actually that bad.


Plus, I cant rememebr who posted it, but I could see the other canoptek units we have getting a similar rule to the "unstoppable colossus" rule it has once CA drops.

I personally welcome it, and look forward to bringing it into my currently gunline-centric local meta.

EDIT: got the named rule wrong, fixed it.

Pyrothem wrote:
The real $ is killing me. I was hoping for a 195$ kit at most. For a kit with a whopping TWO choices in load out it is a little ridiculous and the thing is just knight size so not really that big.

you can get the extra weapon set separate

Edit: And you already had that answered, nm me.

310$ for this thing with ONE gun option. But a the bigger and arguably more powerful Pylon is is 170$. That is just not right.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
2heavy d3 gun or i'm looking diffrent sheet. Heavy d6 are the s6 ones. Not s16

Bah sorry, typo. They are indeed D3.
2 D6 would make them even better, but I understand why they aren't.
Speaking of the D6 guns, they aren't too bad either. They deal D3 damage each and have a chance of generating a mortal wound. The range is a bit short, but as a supporting weapon for the main gun they aren't too bad.
Obviously more heavy infantry focused though.

I'm not quite sure what targets the Singularity Generator is supposed to be used against.
The Obliterator is already good against vehicles and it comes with an anti-infantry weapon.
The Generator has higher potential max damage (108 opposed to 36), but the chances of actually getting that is extremely slim, and the obliterator seems to have a more reliable damage output overall.

Yeah singularity is bit weak option though the one good thing about it is that damage output isn't as on/off. It's about comparable IIRC vs T8 5++ target with the other option but probably bit less swingy due to more shots. But yeah that's likely the worse option and good candinate for errata in future.

I do like the weapons of it...they really feel like FW Necrons...high AP, nice effects...they even addressed the random dmg and gave it STRAIGHT 6 for the one weapon...
Its just its defensive stats in addition to its cost that brakes it for me...8th edition got more lethal with every codex climaxing in the knights codex...even Orks have high profile shots (only at bad BS) with their new codex...in this meta and espacially in 8th edition I dont see this thing surviving past turn 2 if you go second...

tneva82 wrote:

 p5freak wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

With T8, 28w, regen and you have other units that can repair it. As well as some nice weapons.
It doesn't look that bad.

A knight has T8, W24 and can get 2+/3++, for less than 500 pts. Without ranged weapons the gallant can get 2+/3++ for less than 400 pts.

But ony 1 knight. Strategems etc aren't part of prices. Knight is same with less wounds.

(And nevermind stompa that is softer, shoot less and costs 50% more. Oh and slower


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 p5freak wrote:
You wont get far with the stupid movement rules of 40k. Even the tiniest piece of terrain will cost you movement. A piece of terrain that is both 1" tall and wide will cost you 3" to move over it. If you hide inside a ruin your 16" move will barely get you out of it.

Well 2" less. You don't need to cover it at once. 1" up, 1" down. 1" wide you would be going forward anyway

Dude the Ork codex isn't even out yet. Quit your whining.

You don't need codex to come out before knowing rules. Heard the term leaks? We know price of stompa. We know it's rules. GW even was kind enough to provide the weapons. It got boosted up weapons which is nice but with BS5+ still even close to comparable to this one. Fact. It got extra attacks in h2h but nerfed degration table negates that advantage. Another fact. We know the price which got only insignificant drop. There's no inv save in it. It got nothing major and still costs more than twice the knights that out-tough it, out-shoots it and ties with h2h.

But yeah guess you are the kind of person that needs to jump to lava to know it's bad idea. Eventhough facts are already known.

I wish there was a cheaper option to run it as pure CC, since they offer the model that way, I'm forced to wonder why?

To me, the guns are nice, but I see this as a CC critter. I just wish it had the Canoptek keyword. The guns just give it usefulness before it gets in close.

tneva82 wrote:
You don't need codex to come out before knowing rules. Heard the term leaks? We know price of stompa. We know it's rules. GW even was kind enough to provide the weapons. It got boosted up weapons which is nice but with BS5+ still even close to comparable to this one. Fact. It got extra attacks in h2h but nerfed degration table negates that advantage. Another fact. We know the price which got only insignificant drop. There's no inv save in it. It got nothing major and still costs more than twice the knights that out-tough it, out-shoots it and ties with h2h.

But yeah guess you are the kind of person that needs to jump to lava to know it's bad idea. Eventhough facts are already known.

You're the person that cries the sky is falling at the drop of a hat. You're the last Ork player I would listen to.