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punisher357 wrote:
I was really hoping for some more point cost decreases. Guess that won't be happening any time soon.

I'm curious how the changes to the CP structure and the limitations on multiple detachments will affect the meta. I think it's a move in the right direction to eliminate unreasonable min-maxing

I would not expect any points cost changes until chapter approved.

Necrons are in a really good spot right now with a good chunk of it's units. After this FAQ several top tier armies got heavily nerfed. I would not be suprised to start seeing us toward the top tables before too long.

I think that the situational use of the deathmark abillity turn 1 isn't going to be a huge deal, other than to claim line breaker if you can live that long.....it just seems like it'll be rare and not consequential.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sasori wrote:

punisher357 wrote:
I was really hoping for some more point cost decreases. Guess that won't be happening any time soon.

I'm curious how the changes to the CP structure and the limitations on multiple detachments will affect the meta. I think it's a move in the right direction to eliminate unreasonable min-maxing

I would not expect any points cost changes until chapter approved.

Necrons are in a really good spot right now with a good chunk of it's units. After this FAQ several top tier armies got heavily nerfed. I would not be suprised to start seeing us toward the top tables before too long.

I think you're right. I don't know about claiming top tables, but it definitely takes us from the bottom tier and elevates us.

Gauss pylon can still deep strike comfortably into our deployment zone turn 1, with infinite range, which is nice.

Only some maps it might not fit in our zone where you might want it (!)

Edit: phone messed up

And yet, if WE get turn one, we can rock up to the opponent's deployment zone with the Deceiver, three Vaults, and a Veil'd in unit of something ridiculous (all five/six units started on the table so don't break the turn-two deep strike restriction).
...
Actually, guys, please don't abuse this or we're going to get the Nerf hammer big time come Chapter Approved

Isn't the deepstrike rule only a beta rule right now? I'm a fan of it for the game overall, but it's terrible for the monolith. 380 + often 200 and above points is way too much to keep off the table for so long, especially with the delayed deployment of the unit within the monolith.

I hope it will come down the road with some monolith changes.

The rest of the FAQ helps us a bunch, I'm a pretty big fan.

 skoffs wrote:
And it looks like spam is dead-

Spoiler:

Shouldn't affect us much, we normally stick to our minimum detachment requirements. But at least we don't need to worry as much about certain builds anymore.

It makes including a brigade even harder for us, instead of 6 x 5 immortals we now need 3 x 5 immortals and 3 x 10 warriors in the minimum brigade list at 2k due to max of 3 datasheets, an extra 105 points to the minimum brigade cost

zacharia wrote:

 skoffs wrote:
And it looks like spam is dead-

Spoiler:

Shouldn't affect us much, we normally stick to our minimum detachment requirements. But at least we don't need to worry as much about certain builds anymore.

It makes including a brigade even harder for us, instead of 6 x 5 immortals we now need 3 x 5 immortals and 3 x 10 warriors in the minimum brigade list at 2k due to max of 3 datasheets, an extra 105 points to the minimum brigade cost

na we good! troops & transports are excluded in that rule

Requizen wrote:

Moosatronic Warrior wrote:
Yeah the Dlords aura is fairly pointless. I think he has a role as HQ to put in a detachment that doesn't match the rest of your list. So if you have a Sautekh battalion and a nephrek outrider the HQ of the outrider can't buff the rest of the army anyway so he might as well be able to operate solo. The Dlord is an alternative to a 76pt lord tax- more expensive but actually does something.


In other news: Reecius posted this in a comments section on frontline gaming:

"OK guys, got an answer for everyone. The units coming out of a Night Scythe or Monolith can indeed move again after being placed on the table as we thought. Now of course, that is not official but I can assure you all that that is the right way to read the rule.

So, carry on!"

Presumably he spoke to someone at GW. Hopefully it will be in the FAQ.

FINALLY. Honestly would become worth using NScythes (Monos still too expensive). People were arguing that it worked that way currently, but the wording is pretty clear in the Codex. I'd love an official FAQ tho.

What's new? We always played that way here. Was pretty clear. Beam up at the START of the movement phase, so the monolith AND the unit can move afterwards. Only way to make sure teleport+charge.

punisher357 wrote:

 Odrankt wrote:
So, with deepstriking now confined to your deployment zone until turn 2. How does it affect Deathmarks and how they intercept DS. Do we still get to intercept and therefore, allowed to DS into our opponents deployment zone? If so then Deathmarks are now way more usable and "spammy"

RAW it seems that's how it is....RAI I don't think that's how it's meant to be. I wouldn't be surprised to see a separate FAQ for this, but I wouldn't be that surprised to see it stay either. Deathmarks are pretty expensive and not hugely effective....it would be nice for harassment for sure

Can I just point out fair enough deathmarks can't intercept units turn 1, but your opponet can't DS in your zone turn 1 anyway they have to wait till turn 2 and then you can deepstrike so the deathmarks haven't really been affected by this as you wouldn't want to counter deepstrike in your opponents table edge turn 1 (due to new limitations) and get smashed

Edit: also rules with specific exceptions are still allowed and ethereal interception states you can't be more then 12inchs away from the enemy unit deployed

So... weird thought, but I feel the CP changes actually devalue tomb blades a bit. We're in kind of a weird spot where Immortals and Tomb Blades fill almost the same exact role, and now that Immortals give a pretty large amount of CP I'm having a hard time fitting tomb blades into a list without giving up on other necessary answers.

Da W wrote:

Requizen wrote:

Moosatronic Warrior wrote:
Yeah the Dlords aura is fairly pointless. I think he has a role as HQ to put in a detachment that doesn't match the rest of your list. So if you have a Sautekh battalion and a nephrek outrider the HQ of the outrider can't buff the rest of the army anyway so he might as well be able to operate solo. The Dlord is an alternative to a 76pt lord tax- more expensive but actually does something.


In other news: Reecius posted this in a comments section on frontline gaming:

"OK guys, got an answer for everyone. The units coming out of a Night Scythe or Monolith can indeed move again after being placed on the table as we thought. Now of course, that is not official but I can assure you all that that is the right way to read the rule.

So, carry on!"

Presumably he spoke to someone at GW. Hopefully it will be in the FAQ.

FINALLY. Honestly would become worth using NScythes (Monos still too expensive). People were arguing that it worked that way currently, but the wording is pretty clear in the Codex. I'd love an official FAQ tho.

What's new? We always played that way here. Was pretty clear. Beam up at the START of the movement phase, so the monolith AND the unit can move afterwards. Only way to make sure teleport+charge.

Because technically the wording is not that they're disembarking, but rather Tomb World deployment is the same as Reserves, which specifically state that you can not move after you set up from Reserves. But in the long run, it should be played that you can move after coming out, so who knows without an official ruling.

punisher357 wrote:
I think that the situational use of the deathmark abillity turn 1 isn't going to be a huge deal, other than to claim line breaker if you can live that long.....it just seems like it'll be rare and not consequential.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sasori wrote:

punisher357 wrote:
I was really hoping for some more point cost decreases. Guess that won't be happening any time soon.

I'm curious how the changes to the CP structure and the limitations on multiple detachments will affect the meta. I think it's a move in the right direction to eliminate unreasonable min-maxing

I would not expect any points cost changes until chapter approved.

Necrons are in a really good spot right now with a good chunk of it's units. After this FAQ several top tier armies got heavily nerfed. I would not be suprised to start seeing us toward the top tables before too long.

I think you're right. I don't know about claiming top tables, but it definitely takes us from the bottom tier and elevates us.

Necrons haven't been bottom tier since the Codex. We were very solid in the Mid Tier, with a Necron list even winning a GT (According to someone in the thread)

 Sasori wrote:

punisher357 wrote:
I think that the situational use of the deathmark abillity turn 1 isn't going to be a huge deal, other than to claim line breaker if you can live that long.....it just seems like it'll be rare and not consequential.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sasori wrote:

punisher357 wrote:
I was really hoping for some more point cost decreases. Guess that won't be happening any time soon.

I'm curious how the changes to the CP structure and the limitations on multiple detachments will affect the meta. I think it's a move in the right direction to eliminate unreasonable min-maxing

I would not expect any points cost changes until chapter approved.

Necrons are in a really good spot right now with a good chunk of it's units. After this FAQ several top tier armies got heavily nerfed. I would not be suprised to start seeing us toward the top tables before too long.

I think you're right. I don't know about claiming top tables, but it definitely takes us from the bottom tier and elevates us.

Necrons haven't been bottom tier since the Codex. We were very solid in the Mid Tier, with a Necron list even winning a GT (According to someone in the thread)

Dunno how far I'd take that GT win. It was a fairly small 5 rounder with no big names right after the book came out, winner used a Vault and I don't think people were prepared for it. Still, 5-0 is impressive so I think it's at least somewhat telling. We're up there, especially since we were not relying on anything that got nerfed in the FAQ.

Monolith can beam a unit already on the table, so would circumvent the alpha drop BETA rule.

By the way only rule in effect are 5CP 12CP.
All the rest are beta, anti-spam is a suggestion for TO (would keep troops out of it though, how can we do a brigade with 6 troop type if we are restreined in 2 units of warriors and immortals?)

Da W wrote:
Monolith can beam a unit already on the table, so would circumvent the alpha drop BETA rule.

Actually no:

Q: If a unit uses a rule that removes them from the battlefield and then sets them up again, such as the Teleport Homer ability or the Gate of Infinity psychic power, does that unit count as having moved for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons?
A: Yes. Treat such units as if they are arriving on the battlefield as reinforcements.

Since it's "as reinforcements", if it's T1 it has to be in your DZ. Also breaks Veil Alphas.

Da W wrote:
By the way only rule in effect are 5CP 12CP.
All the rest are beta, anti-spam is a suggestion for TO (would keep troops out of it though, how can we do a brigade with 6 troop type if we are restreined in 2 units of warriors and immortals?)

"Recommended Beta Rules" basically reads the same as "Everyone who cares about events will play with these since every event will use them".

 Arachnofiend wrote:
So... weird thought, but I feel the CP changes actually devalue tomb blades a bit. We're in kind of a weird spot where Immortals and Tomb Blades fill almost the same exact role, and now that Immortals give a pretty large amount of CP I'm having a hard time fitting tomb blades into a list without giving up on other necessary answers.

Agreed.

The additional CP generated from a battalion and Szeras warlord changes are making me lean towards a mixed infantry heavy list. Give them Sautekh(Warriors/G. Immortals) or Nephrekh(T. Immortals) to overcome the movement issues with advance, and you have a decent base to build around.

Also, with the changes to DS, I think a build around the Deceiver is even more attractive for us.

And there goes the mephrit outrider spam....


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:

Da W wrote:
By the way only rule in effect are 5CP 12CP.
All the rest are beta, anti-spam is a suggestion for TO (would keep troops out of it though, how can we do a brigade with 6 troop type if we are restreined in 2 units of warriors and immortals?)

"Recommended Beta Rules" basically reads the same as "Everyone who cares about events will play with these since every event will use them".

We must not live on the same part of the planet. Sad for you if TO enforce BETA rules.

 Aza'Gorod wrote:

punisher357 wrote:

 Odrankt wrote:
So, with deepstriking now confined to your deployment zone until turn 2. How does it affect Deathmarks and how they intercept DS. Do we still get to intercept and therefore, allowed to DS into our opponents deployment zone? If so then Deathmarks are now way more usable and "spammy"

RAW it seems that's how it is....RAI I don't think that's how it's meant to be. I wouldn't be surprised to see a separate FAQ for this, but I wouldn't be that surprised to see it stay either. Deathmarks are pretty expensive and not hugely effective....it would be nice for harassment for sure

Can I just point out fair enough deathmarks can't intercept units turn 1, but your opponet can't DS in your zone turn 1 anyway they have to wait till turn 2 and then you can deepstrike so the deathmarks haven't really been affected by this as you wouldn't want to counter deepstrike in your opponents table edge turn 1 (due to new limitations) and get smashed

Edit: also rules with specific exceptions are still allowed and ethereal interception states you can't be more then 12inchs away from the enemy unit deployed

Good catch....this basically eliminates any wondering.....they can function exactly as normal and chances are you'll never be able to intercept something that deepstrikes into the enemy deployment zone first turn anyway

Requizen wrote:

Da W wrote:
Monolith can beam a unit already on the table, so would circumvent the alpha drop BETA rule.

Actually no:

Q: If a unit uses a rule that removes them from the battlefield and then sets them up again, such as the Teleport Homer ability or the Gate of Infinity psychic power, does that unit count as having moved for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons?
A: Yes. Treat such units as if they are arriving on the battlefield as reinforcements.

Since it's "as reinforcements", if it's T1 it has to be in your DZ. Also breaks Veil Alphas.

for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons
So far i consider the monolith stratagem not being faqed

Requizen wrote:

Da W wrote:
Monolith can beam a unit already on the table, so would circumvent the alpha drop BETA rule.

Actually no:

Q: If a unit uses a rule that removes them from the battlefield and then sets them up again, such as the Teleport Homer ability or the Gate of Infinity psychic power, does that unit count as having moved for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons?
A: Yes. Treat such units as if they are arriving on the battlefield as reinforcements.

Since it's "as reinforcements", if it's T1 it has to be in your DZ. Also breaks Veil Alphas.

Dimensional corridor still works. Its considered dismbarking from a transport. So, deceiver -> monolith -> TDC Alpha could work.

Da W wrote:And there goes the mephrit outrider spam....


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:

Da W wrote:
By the way only rule in effect are 5CP 12CP.
All the rest are beta, anti-spam is a suggestion for TO (would keep troops out of it though, how can we do a brigade with 6 troop type if we are restreined in 2 units of warriors and immortals?)

"Recommended Beta Rules" basically reads the same as "Everyone who cares about events will play with these since every event will use them".

We must not live on the same part of the planet. Sad for you if TO enforce BETA rules.

GW: Please test these rules in a tournament format, since they will likely become real rules much like the Smite rule and the Character Targeting rule.
TO: Hahaha why would we ever do that?

????

Of course TOs are going to use these. Every tournament used the previous Beta rules the second they were announced.

Da W wrote:

Requizen wrote:

Da W wrote:
Monolith can beam a unit already on the table, so would circumvent the alpha drop BETA rule.

Actually no:

Q: If a unit uses a rule that removes them from the battlefield and then sets them up again, such as the Teleport Homer ability or the Gate of Infinity psychic power, does that unit count as having moved for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons?
A: Yes. Treat such units as if they are arriving on the battlefield as reinforcements.

Since it's "as reinforcements", if it's T1 it has to be in your DZ. Also breaks Veil Alphas.

for the purposes of moving and firing Heavy weapons
So far i consider the monolith stratagem not being faqed

What is confusing about "Treat such units as if they are arriving on the battlefield as reinforcements."? If they're arriving as if reinforcements, and it's Turn 1, and the new rule states that you can't Reserve outside your DZ on Turn 1....
...?

So far in think the FAQ hasn't nerfed us. The things it's affected we weren't using (besides the VOD alpha strike which I personally never used) so I think the FAQ is a boon for us, although I would've liked them to give the TV the hover rule...

 Aza'Gorod wrote:
So far in think the FAQ hasn't nerfed us. The things it's affected we weren't using (besides the VOD alpha strike which I personally never used) so I think the FAQ is a boon for us, although I would've liked them to give the TV the hover rule...

Oh 100% agree. Our strong stuff didn't get touched, the crazy lists we were losing against got ripped apart. I think we're in a great spot.

Q: If you use a Stratagem to remove a model from the battlefield
and set it up again, does the model retain any persistent effects
(for example, a bonus to one of its characteristics as a result of
an ability)?
A: No.

This almost hurt MWBD +Veil, but it's an artifact, so we're good.

 Aza'Gorod wrote:
So far in think the FAQ hasn't nerfed us. The things it's affected we weren't using (besides the VOD alpha strike which I personally never used) so I think the FAQ is a boon for us, although I would've liked them to give the TV the hover rule...

Nephrekh Destroyers got nerfed, but I'd happily trade that for not having to worry about getting immediately boxed into my deployment zone by enemy deep strikers.

Q: Certain abilities and Stratagems are used ‘before the battle’.
When specifically is this?
A: The game begins when players start the Deployment
step of a mission – all abilities and Stratagems that are
used ‘before the battle’ must be used before then.

You can wait till start of deployment before deciding CTan powers. Eg consider your enemy and the mission.

Necronplayer wrote:
Szeras and Anrakyr just got a really good buff from the FAQ.

Immortal Pride and Implacable Conquered can be applied to all NECRON units instead of only <Dynasty> units, if one of them are taken as your warlord.

Good catch! This means that Anarakyr can buff C'tan Shards to give them re-roll failed charges.

Okay, so I had a crazy idea and I haven't found anything that says that this isn't possible, so correct me if I am wrong.

It says in our Codex "If your army is Battle-forged, units with the appropriate keyword will receive the corresponding Dynastic Code, detailed opposite, so long as every other unit in their Detachment is from the same dynasty", so this gives us the option to opt out of any Dynastic Codes to include multiple Dynasties in one Detachment. Normally this would be a horrible idea, but if we consider the Brigade Detachment list from earlier and the Sautekh's lackluster Dynastic Code, things get a bit interesting.

Stratagems only say that our armies have to be Battle-Forged to use them, and the restrictions for Dynasty specific Stratagems are only for the unit to have the corresponding Dynasty Keyword, not for the Dynastic Code to be active. Theoretically, if we give up the Sautekh Dynastic Code, we could include a unit of Nephrekh Destroyers in our Brigade and still be able to use the Sautekh Methodical Destruction as well as the Nephrekh Translocation Crypt to DS the Destroyers. This also gives us the option of making any of our Gauss Blaster Immortal and Canoptek Scarabs units Nephrekh as well, allowing them to DS directly onto objectives, and advantageous shooting positions respective to Immortals.

If this is possible, the ultimate decision would be if giving up the Sautekh Dynastic Code would be worth the ability to DS the Destroyers and other units, which I think could very well be.

Found this hidden gem in the CA FAQ:

Q: I choose my Overlord on a Catacomb Command Barge to be
my Warlord, and give him the Enduring Will trait. He then gets
shot by a lascannon that hits, wounds, isn’t saved and causes
4 points of damage. How do I apply Quantum Shielding and
Enduring Will?
A: Resolve the Quantum Shielding ability first. If any
damage is suffered, the Enduring Will trait then applies.

Nice!

 Aza'Gorod wrote:
So far in think the FAQ hasn't nerfed us. The things it's affected we weren't using (besides the VOD alpha strike which I personally never used) so I think the FAQ is a boon for us, although I would've liked them to give the TV the hover rule...

VOD isn't affected by the new deepstrike rules. It happens at the end of the movement phase of the first turn and involves units already on the board. The new deepstrike rules just specify that any unit that ARRIVES on the board during your first turn must be "wholly" within the controlling player's deployment zone.